Cleanse the Tower - Black Tower Mafia Day 2

[Niniel]

Ninja´d by Yates. How does a CPR doc work? Like a babysitter?

[Niniel]

Checked mafiascum. 

 

 

• CPR Doctor (also a Quack variant): If the patient is NOT saved from death that Night, this doctor kills its patient.

 

 

So the mafia might have a redirection action? In that case it should be clear that Dice is mafia. Well, I´ll let you think about it while I go to sleep.

[Yates]

No. If the person the CPR Doc "protects" isn't targeted that night? The person that Doc was "protecting" dies.

 

So if Kivam was protecting Tommy but scum didn't target Tommy last night? Tommy is killed by Kivam.

We know this is the case because Kivam is dead. Kivam is dead because scum targeted HIM instead of Tommy.

 

That's how we got our two deaths. Darthe gifted us with AJ. So I think there's only 1 scum left. And it's probably RTE.

[Yates]

This is a better description of CPR Doc, btw.

[Yates]

Hang on a tick. Let me see why Tommy cleared RTE.

 

 

1 Eternal Phoenix - Norley, Vanilla Town Lynched Day One

 

 

2 Tina

3 RTE

4 Dice

5 Thane - Algarin Pendaloan, Vanilla Town Lynched Day Two

6 Len - Mafia Goon

7 Turin

8 Ithi - Trost, Vanilla Town Killed Night Two

9 Tommy (reserve)

10 Laya

11 WOT - Antail, Town Babysitter Killed Night One

12 Ley

13 Kivam

14 Locke

15 AJ

16 Yates

 

All the scum are in Tina/Dice/Pral/Kivam/AJ (who is gonna get MK'd anyway)

 

I think the most obvious team in terms of "pushing Tina" is Kivam/Pral/Dice

 

We'll see what happens tonight

 

Kivam, you better hit scum tonight. I'd suggest resolving one of Dice or Tina.

[Clovdyx]

Erm Darthe, didn't we get those hours back since we lynched a mafioso yesterday?

 

I'll need to confirm with Darthe, but unless I'm overlooking something, yes - you get the wagered hours (48) back and an additional 12 hours as a reward.

[Turin Turambar]

No. If the person the CPR Doc "protects" isn't targeted that night? The person that Doc was "protecting" dies.

 

So if Kivam was protecting Tommy but scum didn't target Tommy last night? Tommy is killed by Kivam.

We know this is the case because Kivam is dead. Kivam is dead because scum targeted HIM instead of Tommy.

 

That's how we got our two deaths. Darthe gifted us with AJ. So I think there's only 1 scum left. And it's probably RTE.

Bold: how would you KNOW that? there are other possibilities. A switcher is an obvious one. Kivam's CPR get sent to Tommy or even back to Kiv, because Kiv called his shot. Then mafia target the other.   Dice could be a mirror in which that happens automatically. then mafia target Tommy as the cop. 

 

Why only one left? only two mafia down in a game of 16 there should be 4.

[Yates]

Bold: how would you KNOW that? there are other possibilities.

It's just the simplest answer and the one that seems most likely.

 

Why only one left? only two mafia down in a game of 16 there should be 4.

Yup. You're probably right. Just gives us a better chance at hitting scum.

 

I found why Tommy was thinking RTE Town. Here it is...

 

]

 

First *mod of BT Mafia hat on*

 

Ley and Tommy please do not make anything personal. At this point both of you have and it is unacceptable. I invite you to review our CoC here at the BT and if a transgression happens again I will make sure you review it. It is not acceptable, especially from two Mafia veterans. You know better. You're adults. Act like it.

 

*mod of BT mafia hat off*

 

Ok, [v] Lenlo [/v]

 

This is by far the most informative lynch possible given Tommy's supposed results, bar none. 

 

Town read on Locke, Ley, Tina.  Unsure about Kivam now. No read on Dice, Pral, AJ (evidently) and more or less everyone else. Would be nice to be around when people are active and I will be here for the next few hours so hopefully can engage more/better.

 

K cool this is good. Scum doesn't say stuff like this after there was easy opportunity to push a different wagon; I had unclaimed my wolf peek on Len at this point.

 

RTE is town.

 

 

So, okay, I feel better about RTE. I agree that would have been an easy place to shift gears.

[Turin Turambar]

@Yates, I would concede it is the only explanation that doesn't require a previously undocumented NA, but it is not the only explanation. The phrase "we know" sends off alarms for me. 

 

In honor of Dathe I will use one of his darthisms and name Tina and Pral as the remaining mafia due to his equal distribution of mafia theory.(basically look at the player roster and put 1 mafia in each group of 4)

[Turin Turambar]

Starring:

 

1 Eternal Phoenix - Norley, Vanilla Town Lynched Day One

2 Tina

3 RTE

4 Dice

5 Thane - Algarin Pendaloan, Vanilla Town Lynched Day Two

6 Len - funny guy - Mafia Goon. Lynched D3

7 Turin

8 Ithi - Trost, Vanilla Town Killed Night Two

9 Tommy - forgot - VT Killed N3

10 Laya

11 WOT - Antail, Town Babysitter Killed Night One

12 Ley

13 Kivam - Einar - TOWN CPR Doc. Killed N3

14 Locke

15 AJ - Mafia Goon. MK N3

16 Yates

for reference

[Turin Turambar]

For some reason, I totally missed this role PM !

Maybe this is the reason for no mafia NK N1?

 

 

A few more clues:

 

 "Kiv quotes for opening scene"

Also note that the PMs had no win condition

 

More likely it is a recruitment game. Especially with the theme that the taint is turning people. 

 

Also, no lynch is bad for us. Especially since after 192 hours, mafia might start getting 2 NKs a night ... so we have to us all the time we have before then.

 

 This smacks of fearmongering and an attempt to distract from finding the mafia. The double kill talk goes into the same category to me.

 

 

Oh bugger.

 

Sorry EP.

 

Time to cast the net a little wider. Starting with the two posters who just posted and didn't want to be seen saying anything about EP being Town.

 

This post by Ithi sounds wrong. Not just telling oh-sad-we-mislynched but also nudging those who didn't. 

 

Even her vote on EP was bad. Just when he was starting to get heat and she puts her vote on his train. 

 

 

EP's tone is becoming increasingly posturing.

 

[unvote]

 

[v]## EP[/v]

 

Also - do we need to do hashes or is that just some fashion?

 

 

[v]##Ithi[/v]

 

 Ithi called out EP from the beginning she just elected to push Time more initially. So this is bad logic. More likely an agenda tho.

 

 

ok - bear with me, I'm multiquoting so you should first just take a minute to commemorate that as it hardly ever happens.

 

This is all to do with Followers. Followers who like to follow a strong Town lead because they think no-one will remember they were there too. In this instance the Town is me and the Followers are Thane and Len.

 

Let's watch the Day 1 play.

 

Here I go

Interesting observation here. If Len is scum, she was on the right track but went with the wrong person.

 

The other interesting thing is that Turin immediately does this right after Ithi's post.

 

 

i've looked through the opening post, and i can't find anything about win conditions indeed...

 

Now, just so i understand hings right: Should we achieve a no lynch by voting 'no lynch', will the wolves get a double kill or not?

This is what Thane says. He only mentioned the OP from Darthe. Fishy.

 

[v] ## Thane

 

If Ithi can read Turin well, would a scum Turin do the exact thing that made Ithi suspicious of Lenlo? I doubt so. Turin is town here

 

 More bad logic. As I had an additional reason for finding Thane suspect. I know that when Kiv mentioned the lack of win con in PMs I just went and looked at my own PM. Easier to do than mess about with going back to page 1 of the game. I also asked Darthe specifically for clarification and got it after some delay. He elected to post it in the thread as I guess others were asking him the same questions. 

 

Drawing the Turin is Town conclusion sounds a bit like a continuation of Lenlo attempting to pocket me. 

 

 

Pral, I need your help solving this game.

 

I haven't lock cleared Turin or anything. He's got a connection to Len.

Well, I thought Ithi was scum.

So yeah, need to read this again. Good that it is a short game so far.

 

I would clear Kivam due to the claim because a mafia kill on babysitter would have meant one more kill, right? (unless she was RB or she self-protected). Bit, nobody else other than that.

 

 If time self protected she wouldn't have died at all as far as I know. Her protection should block the kill. Unless Darthe went some sort of #FULLDARTHE in how he resolved NAs. So She would have had to be RB'ed to have died in that fashion. 

 

 

So you're saying the dead babysitter did not sit anyone or was RB'd that night? That suggests a scum role cop to form that plan

 

Which I know Darthe is a fan of

 

Possible Kiv is the RB and was feeling around for a tracker

Nope, if scum knew she was a babysitter, she wouldn't have been blocked. She would likely protect a town and killing her means two town kills a night.

 

Likely that she self protected.Don't know if that is allowed

 

 Again with the spin that she would self protect and that is the reason she and she alone died. More likely is that she was RB'ed by accident by the mafia because of her possible cop hint on D1 about Kivam. (Note: this scenario requires either mafia failed to submit a kill or they can only RB or kill on a given night) 

 

Also, would mostly clear you and Locke once Len flips scum

Really don't like this post with Len flipping mafia and Tommy flipping VT. Looks like both an attempt to pocket Tommy and possibly an attempt to get Locke Cleared via Tommy faking a peek on him. 

 

I'm gonna be on the road for this week so will be somewhat scarce starting tomorrow. I think Pral is the most likely mafia.

 

Vote: ## Pralaya

[Yates]

 

For some reason, I totally missed this role PM !

Maybe this is the reason for no mafia NK N1?

 

I wont have time to do any work on this game until tomorrow but it's worth bearing in mind.

 

We know AJ wasn't around.

Have to check on Len.

Basically, we can just look at the slots we are most concerned with and see who wasn't around. Lynch in that pool.

[Kivam]

Good game, good luck

[Yates]

When does day 2 start? (You can say in x hours so I don´t have to check up timezones.)

A little fishy given our current discussion.

 

12.30 pm? I´m not sure if that is the right way to write it in Englsih.

Tina's last post.

 

I see that you're all having a lot of trouble with the taint of time.  

 

Probably shouldn't say it like that.  Anyhow, don't forget to submit your actions!  You have just under two hours left to do so if you haven't already.

These are the people that were at least around to vote on a time.

20 Hours (3): Kiv, Yates, Dice

24 Hours (2): Thane, Lenlo

27 Hours (2): Tina, Locke

36 Hours (2): Ley, Ithi

40 Hours (1): Turin

 

 

20 hours it is

RTE, Pral, and AJ never voted.

 

20 hours has been selected.  

 

Scene incoming.  Please note that it is day once the scene begins so the time between 12 and then is limbo which does not detract from the total time left.

So I'm worried about Pral and Tina at this point.

 

[v]Pral[/v]

[Locke]

Pral, Turin, Dice, Tina, Laya. 
Looking at those 5 today. 

[Locke]

Oh, gosh, just realized Laya = Pral; That alleviates the mild confusion I was experiencing. 

[dicetosser1]

Erm Darthe, didn't we get those hours back since we lynched a mafioso yesterday?

 

Nice job Tommy. 

 

Dice, why do you think you're alive? 

 

Yates, What do you think about Dice being alive?

 

only thing i can think of is mafia view me as a mislynch waiting to happen.

 

As far as kivam goes??  No idea  i thought he'd kill me the same way he did Time.

[dicetosser1]

in regards to Tina  I have her as LockTown. have for most of the game. She went after me D1 when i wasn't on anyones mind and hasnt let go since. thats town tina in a nutshell for me.

 

with RTE   is one line enough to clear someone? I can see the argument but im not sure its been supported by RTE's actions. Will need to iso him.

 

Pral i need to read. 

 

and ive been leaning town on turin but it hasnt been super solid.

[Locke]

Pral, what are your thoughts on Dice, Turin, and Tina? 
Is there anyone else you think warrants consideration?

[Leyrann]

I think Turin pointed out some interesting things about Pral.

 

About Tina, who seems to be the second main suspect, I'm less sure. I still think it'd be a better idea to have a better look at Dice or Yates.

 

Also, I think now, or maybe tonight, would be the perfect time for a cop reveal. We could get up to four alignments that way, with only (likely) caveat a godfather. Anyway, I'd say the chance of randomly getting nk'ed would become pretty big by now, not in the least considering three people died last night, one way or the other, and it could also save us from a mislynch.

[Pralaya]

Maybe this is the reason for no mafia NK N1?

Really? Don't you think you are reaching here, arguing that a NK was not made because couple of scum were not available?

 

Ithi called out EP from the beginning she just elected to push Time more initially. So this is bad logic. More likely an agenda tho.

As mentioned in the quote, I felt she was scum mainly because of her response to EPs death. Yes, she did push Time, but did not vote EP until he got a couple of votes on him. At the time, it looked scummy.

 

More bad logic. As I had an additional reason for finding Thane suspect. I know that when Kiv mentioned the lack of win con in PMs I just went and looked at my own PM. Easier to do than mess about with going back to page 1 of the game. I also asked Darthe specifically for clarification and got it after some delay. He elected to post it in the thread as I guess others were asking him the same questions. 

 

Drawing the Turin is Town conclusion sounds a bit like a continuation of Lenlo attempting to pocket me.

Which is exactly what I am hinting at the post, saying that what you were doing is a townie scumhunting and not scum trying to do the very thing that would make Ithi suspicious of you. I don't see your point here, frankly.

 

Again with the spin that she would self protect and that is the reason she and she alone died. More likely is that she was RB'ed by accident by the mafia because of her possible cop hint on D1 about Kivam. (Note: this scenario requires either mafia failed to submit a kill or they can only RB or kill on a given night)

Yeah, well, I may be wrong in understanding the mechanics of babysitter. In any case, what are you suggesting here? That I am preventing people from thinking she was RB'ed when I was the person to have brought up the RB idea in the first place?

 

Really don't like this post with Len flipping mafia and Tommy flipping VT. Looks like both an attempt to pocket Tommy and possibly an attempt to get Locke Cleared via Tommy faking a peek on him. 

 

I'm gonna be on the road for this week so will be somewhat scarce starting tomorrow. I think Pral is the most likely mafia.

 

Vote: ## Pralaya

This was just in response to Tommy asking me my reads. As simple as that.

 

This is just a classic case of tinfoiling. You are just misinterpreting things based on how you want to see. Things like saying that I have an agenda or me pocketing people or me trying to confuse people etc. None of these are in anyway true of what I was actually doing.

[Pralaya]

I think Turin pointed out some interesting things about Pral.

 

About Tina, who seems to be the second main suspect, I'm less sure. I still think it'd be a better idea to have a better look at Dice or Yates.

 

Also, I think now, or maybe tonight, would be the perfect time for a cop reveal. We could get up to four alignments that way, with only (likely) caveat a godfather. Anyway, I'd say the chance of randomly getting nk'ed would become pretty big by now, not in the least considering three people died last night, one way or the other, and it could also save us from a mislynch.

This post by Ley looks bad. Really bad.

 

First, he likes the Turin's case on me and yet he is hesitating to vote me.

Second, he tries to put the focus away from Tina and nudge the case towards dice and yates.

Third, he is blatantly role fishing. Even if the cop would get nk'ed accidentally, he would have put some hints in the game.

 

[v]Ley[/v]

[Pralaya]

Pral, what are your thoughts on Dice, Turin, and Tina? 

Is there anyone else you think warrants consideration?

As I have already mentioned, have townread on Dice and Turin .

 

I have a scum read on Tina. And, based on the above post, I think Ley is also scum.

[Leyrann]

 

I think Turin pointed out some interesting things about Pral.

 

About Tina, who seems to be the second main suspect, I'm less sure. I still think it'd be a better idea to have a better look at Dice or Yates.

 

Also, I think now, or maybe tonight, would be the perfect time for a cop reveal. We could get up to four alignments that way, with only (likely) caveat a godfather. Anyway, I'd say the chance of randomly getting nk'ed would become pretty big by now, not in the least considering three people died last night, one way or the other, and it could also save us from a mislynch.

This post by Ley looks bad. Really bad.

 

First, he likes the Turin's case on me and yet he is hesitating to vote me.

Second, he tries to put the focus away from Tina and nudge the case towards dice and yates.

Third, he is blatantly role fishing. Even if the cop would get nk'ed accidentally, he would have put some hints in the game.

 

[v]Ley[/v]

 

 

Okay, some additional explanation:

 

1. If I would have voted, I'd have been called out for following. On top of that, I didn't want to vote without having iso'd several people. I can't iso on the phone (and don't have the time for it right now).

2. I'm not trying to put the focus away from Tina, I'm giving my own opinion about her. I'm not forcing you to do anything.

3. I'm not role fishing. I just want to know the alignment of half the game (the cop and three other people). With my own alignment, I could know five people, if I'm not viewed. Those not viewed would know the role of 5/8 people alive (okay, it's a best case, in which the cop targets are still alive), and those viewed would still know it of 4/8. That's a HUGE amount of information at this point, and there's a chance of 20% tonight the cop's getting shot RANDOMLY, let alone if remaining mafia members have any clue who it is, like you said about leaving behind hints (which, by the way, would not be something I could do if I were the cop, and I don't know if everyone else here would be able to do that). The cop could reveal tonight too, but if I were the cop, I wouldn't risk it anymore this far in the game.

 

 

Pral, what are your thoughts on Dice, Turin, and Tina? 

Is there anyone else you think warrants consideration?

As I have already mentioned, have townread on Dice and Turin .

 

I have a scum read on Tina. And, based on the above post, I think Ley is also scum.

 

 

Can I ask you how you managed to read Dice as town?

 

Also, 45 pages. You vote me over a single post. That single post is more scummy to you than all Dice's posts together?

[Pralaya]

Okay, some additional explanation:

 

1. If I would have voted, I'd have been called out for following. On top of that, I didn't want to vote without having iso'd several people. I can't iso on the phone (and don't have the time for it right now).

2. I'm not trying to put the focus away from Tina, I'm giving my own opinion about her. I'm not forcing you to do anything.

3. I'm not role fishing. I just want to know the alignment of half the game (the cop and three other people). With my own alignment, I could know five people, if I'm not viewed. Those not viewed would know the role of 5/8 people alive (okay, it's a best case, in which the cop targets are still alive), and those viewed would still know it of 4/8. That's a HUGE amount of information at this point, and there's a chance of 20% tonight the cop's getting shot RANDOMLY, let alone if remaining mafia members have any clue who it is, like you said about leaving behind hints (which, by the way, would not be something I could do if I were the cop, and I don't know if everyone else here would be able to do that). The cop could reveal tonight too, but if I were the cop, I wouldn't risk it anymore this far in the game.

Bold: That is not something a town should be worried about. Commenting on a case and leaving it is just plain nudging.

 

As to the tole fishing, leaving breadcrumbs is a standard practice. Don't see a problem why it is so hard. If someone is getting lynched who is a town peek, then probably, the cop can get involved. But, it is his prerogative and I don't see a strong reason why he should reveal tonight.