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DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY
Luckers

Prologue Through to the End of the Epilogue--Full Book Discussion.

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I'll admit it, I kind of wanted Bela to come out of the Mists with the other heroes. We have Wolf Heroes bound to the Horn, why not a Pony?

 

New insane/idiot theory. Bela was from Equestria and using magic to hide her horn, hence all her uberness and constantly appearing everywhere.

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Don't forget that Rand as Moridin is slightly recognizable: He's got a big ass saa in his eye in the shape of the Dragon's Fang that is easily seen. Who knows if someone checked his eyes before he woke up, but if they're aware of this identifying feature he's not going to be able to hide.... unless he wills himself into another form. 

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Eh, as others have said, very few people know what Moridin looks like and who he is or was. All of which are either not in a position to matter (living Forsaken) or could be calmed by Elayne/Aviendha/Min. Also, Rand could just adopt an eyepatch.

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If random Asha'man know who Moridin is and that he is a Forsaken, likely through word of mouth, then a whole lot of people know. Remember there was a huge crowd in the tent while Rand was dying paying their respects and being all sad, and Moridin was right next door. 

 

It really is bad plotting to imagine that there wouldn't be an immediate and drastic manhunt for Moridin. Whether or not he could still channel is irrelevant - Darkfriend channelers were normally stilled and then executed, which was likely to be Moghedien's fate if she had been revealed to the Salidar Aes Sedai during her captivity, and I imagine will likely be Graendal/Hessalam's fate as well. 

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I think I've gotten ahead of myself... Pretty much done with aMoL and I haven't read a Moiraine/Siuan encounter. Did I miss it? Shouldn't there be a mention in the tent? I was so looking forward to their reunion.

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Speaking of Heroes of the Horn, I think one of the best scenes in the book is Noal/Jain Farstrider appearing and saving Olver.  I about lost it myself.  Such a touching scene.

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Would like to throw this out there, in regards to people wondering if Rand just plans to wander the world for the rest of his life. At the end he is contemplating the gold that Alivia gave him, and he finds out that it's a large amount; enough to buy a farm in the Two Rivers. Now, if he was surprised to see this, then he was only expecting a small portion of gold to travel with and was not planning on settling down off of the money, which means that he was probably only going to travel for a little while before heading back to society.

 

On top of this, do you really think Cadsuane would let him wander too long without questioning him on certain matters? She might be kind enough to let him go for a little while, but from what we've seen of her character, she is going to want to talk extensively with him.

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Any speculation or previous references to the "new version" of Padan Fain that shows up at the end? It called itself "Shaisam", which seemed to tickle my memory but I can't seem to find anything on it. 

 

Shai'tan... Shaisam. Hmmmm.....

Here's a thought: if Rand had killed the Dark One, Shaisam would have eventually become a replacement Dark One.

 

 

So, I've been thinking, about how the Dark One manages to be beaten over and over again. Now, this is wild speculation, but maybe the Dark One is incapable of learning? Like, it has awareness, but being outside time it has no real awareness of the past. A human, a creature of creation, remembers the past, lives in the present, and can only make guesses about the future. The Dark One, the antithesis of creation, cannot be aware except in the most vague sense of events past. I'm not sure if that theory is worth developing, but it's the best I can think of offhand for the Dark One not warning Moridin to just don't bother with the damn sword.

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On top of this, do you really think Cadsuane would let him wander too long without questioning him on certain matters? She might be kind enough to let him go for a little while, but from what we've seen of her character, she is going to want to talk extensively with him.

 

Unless Cadsuane gets herself released from the Oath Rod real soon now, she's not going to have time to question Rand on anything. In New Spring (set about 22 years before the last battle), she says "I could live another 30 years, or another 3." She's really in danger of dying at any moment. She's got a ton of information and a ton of skill; it would only make sense that they'd remove her from the oath rod so she can live longer, Then, of course, she could no longer be Amyrlin.

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It is weird that we never actually see a reunion between Moiraine and Siuane.

 

Then again, events are moving so fast that we don't really have a chance to see her reunite with everyone. Her reunion with Lan for instance takes place off screen and is only mentioned in passing by Rand.

 

If you stop to think about it, what is there really to write? The emotions of shock, gladness, and a bit of awkwardness would be pretty identical you'd think for all involved. And do we really need to see her explain about the Aelfinn and Eelfinn again and again type of thing?

 

I do think a paragraph or two between Siuane and Moiraine would have been nice since the two of them started all of this in a way back in New Spring and Siuane bites it in the end but overall I was okay with skipping most of them.

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It is weird that we never actually see a reunion between Moiraine and Siuane.

 

Then again, events are moving so fast that we don't really have a chance to see her reunite with everyone. Her reunion with Lan for instance takes place off screen and is only mentioned in passing by Rand.

 

If you stop to think about it, what is there really to write? The emotions of shock, gladness, and a bit of awkwardness would be pretty identical you'd think for all involved. And do we really need to see her explain about the Aelfinn and Eelfinn again and again type of thing?

 

I do think a paragraph or two between Siuane and Moiraine would have been nice since the two of them started all of this in a way back in New Spring and Siuane bites it in the end but overall I was okay with skipping most of them.

 

I actually have to say that the whole "last goodbyes" series of scenes they did in the early goings kind of had my rolling my eyes. Yes, I understand the need for it, but having a few pages of Rand talk to Cadsuane; Egwene talk to the Aiel dreamwalkers; Rand talk to Elayne; Mat talk to Rand; etc. etc. seemed a bit... hokey. Good for narrative convenience purposes and fans not to scream, but blatantly obvious in what they were.

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Barring a very dissapoiting Demandred (his blood on the rocks??....did he not know where Rand would be???) and a truly moronic Galad (why oh why did I expect more??)

 

I LOVED THE BOOK.....there were some seriously emotional heart string tugging moments and I found the ending to be enough to fulfill my expectations. I'm appy there were unanswered questions.

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Would like to throw this out there, in regards to people wondering if Rand just plans to wander the world for the rest of his life. At the end he is contemplating the gold that Alivia gave him, and he finds out that it's a large amount; enough to buy a farm in the Two Rivers. Now, if he was surprised to see this, then he was only expecting a small portion of gold to travel with and was not planning on settling down off of the money, which means that he was probably only going to travel for a little while before heading back to society.

 

On top of this, do you really think Cadsuane would let him wander too long without questioning him on certain matters? She might be kind enough to let him go for a little while, but from what we've seen of her character, she is going to want to talk extensively with him.

 

Really doubt Cadusane has the authority to question him.If she does not behave herself Rand might just will her into a toad!!

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Well I guess I was pretty disappointed with the Moiraine/Siuan developments as a whole. Now I might be a tiny bit biased as Moiraine is hands down my favourite character but let's not forget that these two set in motion the story most of us have been following for 14 books, making them pretty central characters. This is especially true where Moiraine is concerned. Poor Siuan seems to have gotten the short spiky end of the stick. In light of Siuan's death un-scene, I think a reunion scene would have been a great way of ensuring a lasting elegance and poignancy, even irony to her story. Let's not forget that they ostensibly had no relationship after gaining the shawl as their future had become set in stone and their failure would mean disaster. They set aside their own friendship to save the world and Siuan didn't even get a death scene. Burn me.

 

Another giant kick in the balls was how little we really get to see Moiraine in aMoL. I mean... She's essentially dead for 7 books. Trouble has been taken to rescue her for the last book but she mostly sits around twiddling her thumbs. We don't get to see her re-united with Lan or Siuan. Well... At least she gets a massive hug from Nynaeve. Ah, how far the wisdom has come.

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OK, here's a question: Rand gave gifts to several his closest friends, as Cadsuane pointed out. He made a point of visiting Elayne and giving her the seed, he made crowns for Nynaeve and Lan, he took time to visit Egwene, etc. Cadsuane asked Rand what he was giving Min, but I don't recall seeing mention of what he gave her, if anything.

 

I mean, it'd be hilarious if he left a will behind that named her his heir, to his fortune and to his crown. But I doubt that he'd do that.

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Is it just me or is pretty clear that Nakomi is Verin returned as a Hero of the Horn. She was behind enemy lines for decades and killed herself to help everyone in the world. No other character died then received such overwhelming praise: Egwene's tearful send off, "your soul is pure light" etc. She then pops over to Avi in TAR and shows up to tell Rand nice job at the end. Nakomi = Verin

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Whew! Just read this thread from one end to the other whilst waiting beside the mailbox for my copy!

 

Whilst I understand that so many are dissatisfied on some level with the denouement of what's been nearly a quarter-century saga, my own thoughts tend towards the line that RJ had warned that anybody expecting a "happily ever after" would likely be disappointed.  And, 21 years on, the end of something that has become so important to so many was always going to be an event of sadness and regret.

 

Anybody who has known war and battle first- or second-hand would likely comment that it's something lacking largely in sense, especially when considering who lives and who dies, and I would have been disappointed if WOT-world was any different in the end.  After all, RJ had seen it first-hand.

 

I'll reserve final judgement until I've at least sighted my copy, but I expect to see the story arc completed in a manner which satisfies the premise of a series which was, if I understand correctly, going to last three novels initially, then six, then ten, and has now spanned the lifetime of many of its younger readers, and at least the better half of the lives of many of the rest of us.

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Frakk, I think it just hit me that WoT is over...damn man.

 

And I'll say that there were some things I didn't like, but there are some things I didn't like about every book. On the whole, this was a great book for me and a fitting ending to WoT.

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Is it just me or is pretty clear that Nakomi is Verin returned as a Hero of the Horn. She was behind enemy lines for decades and killed herself to help everyone in the world. No other character died then received such overwhelming praise: Egwene's tearful send off, "your soul is pure light" etc. She then pops over to Avi in TAR and shows up to tell Rand nice job at the end. Nakomi = Verin

 

not a bad idea. i would love to see verin again. but why would she hide her identity?

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Is it just me or is pretty clear that Nakomi is Verin returned as a Hero of the Horn. She was behind enemy lines for decades and killed herself to help everyone in the world. No other character died then received such overwhelming praise: Egwene's tearful send off, "your soul is pure light" etc. She then pops over to Avi in TAR and shows up to tell Rand nice job at the end. Nakomi = Verin

 

not a bad idea. i would love to see verin again. but why would she hide her identity from Rand? 

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My only real disappointment was how lackluster Rand vs DO was. 4 daydreams and then an effortless sealing. Would much rather have gotten rid of the Perrin stuff and had a bit more of a struggle there.

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If not for Demandred, the entire Shadow forces and Shai'tan proved to be very impotent. 

 

If Shai'tan angers the DR enough, in one of the turnings, DR could annihilate it.

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Favorite line so far: "Tam Al'Thor became the void. He brought it to the Trollocs, showed it to them and sent them into its depths."

 

Freakin' sweet. 

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The book was a major letdown. The ending was simply terrible. Major plot points, such as Rand's "Rebirth" were a joke. The Horn of Valere didn't even make sense. Logain's "Glory" is accidental. Gawyn, with his Ter'angreal, should have come last and beaten Damodred. Not Lan. I really don't care who's writing was who's, but the book simply wasn't a good ending. It is hard to say the same author who wrote Eye of the World had a hand in a Memory of Light. Disappointing all the way around.

 

  However, since I spent a large portion of my life reading the series, I did finish the book and will reread AMoL to see if it improves with a 2nd pass. I think it unlikely.

Edited by Venaliter

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finished the book

 

verdict: what a disappointing pointless book. a warder besting a forsaken. logain's useless glory. effortless sealing and a thousand different crap.

 

well atleast it's over.

 

and i called the rand retirement plan long ago. disappearing from the view. I was not suprised to see him run away. It was so obvious at this point

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