Perrin's Arc

[Sharaman]

Hey! The wolves are the Unseen Eyes of T'A'R!

 

What say you?

More like the un-smelled noses

[FarShainMael]

Hey! The wolves are the Unseen Eyes of T'A'R!

 

What say you?

More like the un-smelled noses

 

[nophone]

perrins hammer is saweet!

[smileyman]

I don't think Perrin is necessarily stronger in T'A'R than Egwene or the Dreamwalkers, but he does have a different way of thinking about T'A'R (which may be an asset).

 

When it comes to T'A'R this is more important than strength. This is why Perrin was able to stop the balefire--he was operating outside the so-called rules. Once Egwene realized this she was able to win her battle. I'd be interested in seeing a confrontation now between Egwene and Perrin. I still think Perrin would win but I think it'd be a tougher fight.

 

According to Verin, T'A'R is one constant linking all the Portal Stone worlds. The DO is another.

 

I've described a theory before that the ghosts, bubbles of evil and shifting reality is a kind of 'leaking' of the fluidity of T'A'R into the real world (the bubbles being like nightmares).

 

The description of the apples returning had a distinct T'A'R feel to it. Indeed, all the decay has the feel of malleable reality. Is the Blight even real, or is it a kind of twisted nightmare overlaid on top of the landscape?

 

Huh. I hadn't thought of it this way but it has a certain ring of plausibility to it. The way Rand fixed the apple orchard was definitely T'A'Rish, what with the magically budding and growing in seconds. Definitely not a natural process, even one that's sped up.

 

I wonder if T'A'R doesn't exist over the D.O. because he's strong enough to completely block it (the way that WOs and AS can shield their dreams), or if it dissipates when it comes in contact with him. If it's the latter that might be a clue as to the best way to defeat him.

[dwn]

According to Verin, T'A'R is one constant linking all the Portal Stone worlds. The DO is another.

 

I've described a theory before that the ghosts, bubbles of evil and shifting reality is a kind of 'leaking' of the fluidity of T'A'R into the real world (the bubbles being like nightmares).

 

The description of the apples returning had a distinct T'A'R feel to it. Indeed, all the decay has the feel of malleable reality. Is the Blight even real, or is it a kind of twisted nightmare overlaid on top of the landscape?

 

Huh. I hadn't thought of it this way but it has a certain ring of plausibility to it. The way Rand fixed the apple orchard was definitely T'A'Rish, what with the magically budding and growing in seconds. Definitely not a natural process, even one that's sped up.

 

I wonder if T'A'R doesn't exist over the D.O. because he's strong enough to completely block it (the way that WOs and AS can shield their dreams), or if it dissipates when it comes in contact with him. If it's the latter that might be a clue as to the best way to defeat him.

 

I meant to put this in the above post, but here's a link to the original thread on this theory: Bubbles of Evil. Just don't post any spoilers to it because it's in the General Discussion section. (Obivously, the bit on wildlife not having at T'A'R reflection was incorrect. Only domesticated animals don't seem to have reflections.)

 

-- dwn

[Guest guitarcrazy]

Hi-

Old lurker back in the old usenet days-kept up with the books, but not the various sites until a few weeks ago. My hats off to the Dragonmount crew and everyone's great discussions.

I've looked in Perrin's arc regarding Jaret Byar but maybe skipped over where someone may have addressed this already. It seemed to me that Byar was a darkfriend, and was Graendel's final try at Perrin, or did I read this wrong?

thanks!

[dwn]

Hi-

Old lurker back in the old usenet days-kept up with the books, but not the various sites until a few weeks ago. My hats off to the Dragonmount crew and everyone's great discussions.

I've looked in Perrin's arc regarding Jaret Byar but maybe skipped over where someone may have addressed this already. It seemed to me that Byar was a darkfriend, and was Graendel's final try at Perrin, or did I read this wrong?

thanks!

 

I think Byar was definitely her final try at Perrin, but I don't think he was a DF; just a zealot twisted by Compulsion.

 

-- dwn

[Durinax]

wow this book was awesome, it felt a way different from the early books in the series (I quit a reread just to do this book).

 

Perrin was awesome, I liked his selfrealization. and how he just isnt going to follow egwenes plan, that it makes sense for rand to destroy the seals. I was praying to see that work out

 

and I never thought perrin was going to die. I thought egwene was going to die, and I was so happy for it that I danced a jig

[waffle]

Why didn´t morgase flip out when Perrin gatewayed back to the Witecloaks? By my reasoning she should of assumed the same as Berelain.

[Sharaman]

Morgause trusts Perrin more? She's a better judge of people.

[Gadunga]

Regarding the dreamspike, an interesting question could be posed. Does the dreamspike have an effect on portal stones/way gates?

[AnthonyJamesEnglish]

About the hypothetical who would win in TAR between Perrin and Ewgene i would bet everything on Perrin. Why?

 

Because of his nature. He's described as like a wolf, once he gets an idea in his head he wont let go till it's complete.

 

The battle would be one sided because he KNOWS that things she would throw at him were not real so they wouldn't form. and i don't think she has the mental will to contest with Perrin.

 

Remember it is possible to change things about someone else in TAR but it depends on the persons will. i cant see Perrin bending to Egwene in TAR at all.

[didymos]

 

I think Byar was definitely her final try at Perrin, but I don't think he was a DF; just a zealot twisted by Compulsion.

 

-- dwn

He already wanted to kill Perrin. He has since tEotW. All he needed was an opportunity. No Compulsion required. Besides, when did this encounter with Graendal happen? Why is there zero evidence to support it?

[Duskfire]

 

I think Byar was definitely her final try at Perrin, but I don't think he was a DF; just a zealot twisted by Compulsion.

 

-- dwn

He already wanted to kill Perrin. He has since tEotW. All he needed was an opportunity. No Compulsion required. Besides, when did this encounter with Graendal happen? Why is there zero evidence to support it?

 

Graendal refers to a Whitecloak; since no other Whitecloak tried to undermine and kill Perrin, we can only assume it was Byar. Not to mention, Byar may have wanted to kill Perrin, but he never went against orders from a superior previously. Epsecially someone like Galad, who he had just risked his life to save from the hands of Questioners. Thats why I think he was compulsed - the compulsion was subtle, but it was enough to override any previous loyalty to his Lord Captain Commander when it involved Perrin.

[capuga]

 

I think Byar was definitely her final try at Perrin, but I don't think he was a DF; just a zealot twisted by Compulsion.

 

-- dwn

He already wanted to kill Perrin. He has since tEotW. All he needed was an opportunity. No Compulsion required. Besides, when did this encounter with Graendal happen? Why is there zero evidence to support it?

 

Didn't she express her disgust at Slayer and the Whitecloak failing her in the epilogure just before SH shows up? Maybe I'm remembering wrong but I thought Byar was being used by her. My gut feeling when reading was that he was a DF but Compulsion is certainly a possibility. I thought him being a DF put a different perspective on his hatred for Perrin and his constant insistance that Perrin needed to die.

[WhiskyJack]

 

I think Byar was definitely her final try at Perrin, but I don't think he was a DF; just a zealot twisted by Compulsion.

 

-- dwn

He already wanted to kill Perrin. He has since tEotW. All he needed was an opportunity. No Compulsion required. Besides, when did this encounter with Graendal happen? Why is there zero evidence to support it?

 

 

That we don't know for sure but she did mention a fool whitecloak who failed to do his job. May be Grandeal was haunting Byar's dream or something but she must have been doing something. She couldn't just leave it to the chance.

[Jillain Sanche]

The chapter of Perrin forging the Hammer with the aid of the power was one of the best ever! It makes me want to go and read more about Thor to understand the inspiration and relevance better; it's been ages since I read any Norse mythology.

 

I agree with those who think the Broken Wolf is the Luc side of Slayer, who told Perrin how Luc hates him so much. Why? If Luc was a wolf brother who never came to terms with it, he would hate what a balanced wolf brother, who is also walking in the Light, represents. Also, as the Isam-joined dark creation "Slayer" that is someone whom death or the Dark One has known.

 

And of course the second occasion of Perrin's need to be near Rand from Min's viewing has yet to come, either at the Field of Merrilor or at Shayol Gul. As has been noted, Perrin understands Rand's need to "clear the rubble" by breaking the remaining seals before forging new seals. But I don't think we have enough evidence to know more than that just yet. Jordan does have a marvelous way of surprising us sometimes! Might it hinge on his being a blacksmith? Maybe.

 

I am happy that more of you now like Faille better! It made me wonder often how many of the Faille-haters had not yet known a mature love themselves in life due to a more tender age. No offense but it comes off that way to those of us who are a bit older.

[WhiskyJack]

Only problem with Luc being Broken wolf is this line:

 

"And his destruction shall bring fear and sorrow to the hearts of men, and shall shake their very will itself".

 

Luc?

[Jillain Sanche]

I see your point. It would only work if it represents the fact that Luc was destroyed already, as a human man. Fear and sorrow to the hearts of his kin, at least. will think on this issue longer

[Tenesmus]

I can't believe no one else has mentioned this. Did Perrin remind anyone else of Neo during his time in TAR? Those sequences felt very much like the first Matrix movie.

 

No, to be honest it reminded me of Mistborn and the ridiculous jumping around with super powers the characters there did all the time. Felt like a comic book.

 

No. It did remind of what the movie Inception could have been. I just knew that there would be a fight sequence like that, to include a fight above the sleepers (Gawyn over Egwene) Just suprised they didn't add another fight over Perrin's sleeping body, ie; Trollocs, White Cloaks or Darkhounds

[WhiskyJack]

Whoever Broken Wolf is, his death will have large impact. He simply cannot be some random guy or a wolf only few people know about.

[FanoLan]

Only problem with Luc being Broken wolf is this line:

 

"And his destruction shall bring fear and sorrow to the hearts of men, and shall shake their very will itself".

 

Luc?

 

Could be the destruction he wreaks, not the destruction of him. Also, it doesn't seem certain that the destruction line necessarily pertains to the Broken Wolf - it could refer back to "Him who will Destroy" at the beginning of the paragraph. Those pesky prophecies/foretellings, all sorts of linguistic/interpretation/translation issues that could impede even the readers' understanding.

 

Definitely unsure on the Broken Wolf identity, and am not willing to write off any of the proffered suspects at this point, except Hopper and Perrin.

[didymos]

I think Byar was definitely her final try at Perrin, but I don't think he was a DF; just a zealot twisted by Compulsion.

 

-- dwn

He already wanted to kill Perrin. He has since tEotW. All he needed was an opportunity. No Compulsion required. Besides, when did this encounter with Graendal happen? Why is there zero evidence to support it?

 

 

That we don't know for sure but she did mention a fool whitecloak who failed to do his job. May be Grandeal was haunting Byar's dream or something but she must have been doing something. She couldn't just leave it to the chance.

 

Yeah, I've actually changed my mind on this: there was line in her POV I'd forgotten about how she still had one final, carefully placed tool and if she could get Perrin into a "danger all 'round" situation, it might be enough to counteract the ta'veren effect.

[Crossroad]

Wow, its so long since I read anything good about Perrin.

 

I suspect maybe the three become one is Rand, Perrin & Matt join together some how to finally lock the DO out.

 

Rand = Callandor

Perrin = Mah'alleiner

Matt = Ashandarei

 

can't wait

[Fryn]

Byar has always had that DF feel. And it could easily go all the way back to the meeting with various DFs and Ishy. There was at least a couple whitecloaks, and killing Mat and Perrin can easily be tasks sent to them. There have been a few times Byar has tried to kill Perrin either directly or indirectly.