Will the show be good? Our hopes and concerns

[Deadsy]

2 hours ago, Elgee said:

 

I'm with you on those two things. I'm still extremely exited to see the show, but I'm 50/50 on whether or not it's going to be awesome or make me mad. Changing things to make it better for screen I'm all for, but not because of other reasons (I can't begin to understand why "hollywood" does what it does, sometimes).

 

One more thing that's bothering me, is the soundtrack. So far everything I hear seems to be in the Old Tongue? Why? It doesn't mean anything to new viewers, they won't understand it, and quite frankly neither will most of the reader fandom. I hope further songs we here will be in English at least.

 

 

I don't think songs with English would have been a good idea. I think with a fantasy adaptation you either go all instrumental or you have a language very few people understand so it sounds like background noise that blends with the instruments. I like the music so far.

[JaimAybara]

23 minutes ago, Deadsy said:

 

 

I don't think songs with English would have been a good idea. I think with a fantasy adaptation you either go all instrumental or you have a language very few people understand so it sounds like background noise that blends with the instruments. I like the music so far.

I for one better hear different styles of understandable tavern songs and court songs. And don’t even get me started if the Band of the Red Hand doesn’t sing… I will riot haha.  
 

*If we are specifically just talking about background music etc. I think Old Tongue is a nice touch, but in world stuff not many people speak it anymore. 

Edited November 7, 2021 by JaimAybara

[Pandemonium]

 how will treat saidin and saidar.  are they going to play into the nonbinary argument that someone chooses what they channel, or is it inherently attached to the soul?  if someone identifies with a different gender in their soul then they channel a different power?  but if someone doesn't identify with a gender then what will they channel?  you know this stuff is in their agenda so it will be interesting to see how they approach it.  hopefully it just minor points passingly discussed rather than long soapbox monologues that derail RJs original work too far.  

[Harldin]

3 hours ago, Elgee said:

 

I'm with you on those two things. I'm still extremely exited to see the show, but I'm 50/50 on whether or not it's going to be awesome or make me mad. Changing things to make it better for screen I'm all for, but not because of other reasons (I can't begin to understand why "hollywood" does what it does, sometimes).

 

One more thing that's bothering me, is the soundtrack. So far everything I hear seems to be in the Old Tongue? Why? It doesn't mean anything to new viewers, they won't understand it, and quite frankly neither will most of the reader fandom. I hope further songs we here will be in English at least.

Jak of the Shadow better be in English or there will be a riot.

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Harldin

[Ryan al'Thor]

Ha just saw the trailer on an NFL game! It made me check myself a bit on my complaining, a reality check in a sense. Going to try to just enjoy it and not over think it. I want to see Rand wreck forsaken. I want to see nyn and mog battle. Want to see Rahvin bale fired. Mat showing off his badassery. That kind of stuff. Keep the story aligned enough so we see the major events. I’m pumped again.

[Lurker_Fan]

15 minutes ago, Pandemonium said:

you are saying it is horse shit that they aren't going to address transgender issues and channeling? this is a post asking how they are going to address saidin and saidar and the connection to gender.  The post started as a question so clearly it just speculative.  But this show is going to be LGBTQ friendly so it is highly likely they will touch on the element of non binary souls/transgender souls and their connection to the One Power.  I have no idea how they will approach but I don't know why you are so offended that the show would try to address this.  It is already changing the gender norms so none of this should be news.

 

The only question is how they will do it and hopefully not so such a direct soapbox way to the current politics of this day and age. b

Hmm, one concept is Eggy discovering a new weave. It requires 69 sisters to link. It will switch the target’s gender and switch to the other half of the power. Brilliant right?

[Deadsy]

1 hour ago, Pandemonium said:

you are saying it is horse shit that they aren't going to address transgender issues and channeling? this is a post asking how they are going to address saidin and saidar and the connection to gender.  The post started as a question so clearly it just speculative.  But this show is going to be LGBTQ friendly so it is highly likely they will touch on the element of non binary souls/transgender souls and their connection to the One Power.  I have no idea how they will approach but I don't know why you are so offended that the show would try to address this.  It is already changing the gender norms so none of this should be news.

 

The only question is how they will do it and hopefully not so such a direct soapbox way to the current politics of this day and age. b

 

 

You have no idea whether addressing these things is an agenda they have. Of course I'm not offended that they would address it. I think you have no idea that it's their agenda. There is source material directly in the books that addresses some of it. For example there are gay characters and it's not a big deal. But what you're focusing on is transgender. What you are suggesting with letting people choose saidar or saidin is a crazy huge leap. For one thing, they don't have modern medicine to change genders physically. That being the case, why would they have the ability to change between saidin and saidar? If that were the case all men would change to saidar so they don't go mad and it would mess up the entire story.

[Deadsy]

8 minutes ago, Lurker_Fan said:

Hmm, one concept is Eggy discovering a new weave. It requires 69 sisters to link. It will switch the target’s gender and switch to the other half of the power. Brilliant right?

 

Yes

[Pandemonium]

46 minutes ago, Deadsy said:

 

 

You have no idea whether addressing these things is an agenda they have. Of course I'm not offended that they would address it. I think you have no idea that it's their agenda. There is source material directly in the books that addresses some of it. For example there are gay characters and it's not a big deal. But what you're focusing on is transgender. What you are suggesting with letting people choose saidar or saidin is a crazy huge leap. For one thing, they don't have modern medicine to change genders physically. That being the case, why would they have the ability to change between saidin and saidar? If that were the case all men would change to saidar so they don't go mad and it would f*** up the entire story.

It really could get wild if they go in that direction that's why  I am somewhat concerned about it.  Halima was one thing, but this could get real crazy real fast if they going down that road

[SinisterDeath]

*REMINDER*
Again, Language.

Hiding the F-bomb behind ****s is still using the bloody f-bomb. You have a plethora of wheel of time curses at your disposal, and all of them are encouraged.

[DaddyFinn]

9 hours ago, Elgee said:

One more thing that's bothering me, is the soundtrack. So far everything I hear seems to be in the Old Tongue? Why? It doesn't mean anything to new viewers, they won't understand it, and quite frankly neither will most of the reader fandom. I hope further songs we here will be in English at least.

I like it a lot. The words are not so distracting because I don't understand them and they fit the world. Lorne Balfe has said that the soundtrack for season 1 is in Old Tongue.

[Deadsy]

1 hour ago, Pandemonium said:

It really could get wild if they go in that direction that's why  I am somewhat concerned about it.  Halima was one thing, but this could get real crazy real fast if they going down that road

 

 

There's no evidence that the things you're concerned about it (e.g. choosing between saidar/saidin) have more than a 0.1% chance of happening.

[Deadsy]

delete

Edited November 8, 2021 by Deadsy

[Harldin]

7 hours ago, Deadsy said:

 

 

I don't think songs with English would have been a good idea. I think with a fantasy adaptation you either go all instrumental or you have a language very few people understand so it sounds like background noise that blends with the instruments. I like the music so far.

There are Songs that are in the show that need to be done in English and I think when we start seeing Thom and other Gleeman in Taverns, most of it will be in English but we may also get some of the stuff we have heard so far in the Old Tongue as well. The Aiel battle chant needs to be in English and of course Jak of the Shadows.  

[Deadsy]

13 minutes ago, Harldin said:

There are Songs that are in the show that need to be done in English and I think when we start seeing Thom and other Gleeman in Taverns, most of it will be in English but we may also get some of the stuff we have heard so far in the Old Tongue as well. The Aiel battle chant needs to be in English and of course Jak of the Shadows.  

 

 

Yes I agree that in book songs should be in English. 

[DaddyFinn]

Wash the spears. Can't wait

[NinjaPowers975]

I've been watching every content drop and digging into every leak I could find since the first teaser trailer hit. Over time I've developed certain expectations, some of which are very different than I imagined over the years when I tried to picture what a screen adaptation would be like.

 

• I think we're going to get a popcorn summer-movie version of wheel of time - more like Mandalorian than Game of Thrones.
• I think it will be a fun show - fun in the same way that MCU movies are fun. Comic-book-style heroics and drama in a fantasy setting.
• I think all the lore and magic will be massively simplified for a very easy learning curve. Eventually they'll probably delve a little more into the complexity, but the first season will be geared for the widest audience possible. They'll want to minimize exposition and focus on action/adventure and character drama.
• I think everything will be larger than life. Big scenes, stark contrasts, characters exaggerated compared to their book counterparts. Everything will be compressed and move way faster than we imagined while reading the books.
• I think it will be absolutely drenched in easter eggs for fans of the book series. There will be a whole other layer of the show with foreshadowing and hints at the depth of the lore that will only become apparent when going through the episodes shot by shot. This is the cookie for book fans to make up for some of the changes. There'll be a dozen Youtube channels devoted to dissecting everything and finding hidden stuff.
• I think we'll get most of Eye of The World, or at least the broad strokes of it, but it will be laid out in such a disjointed/scrambled way that even book fans won't be able to guess what's coming next.   
• I think it will, in its own mass market, streamlined way, capture the spirit  of the story. We'll recognize it as a version  of the story we love, but it will be different enough right out of the gate that most will quickly revise their expectations for faithful adherence to the books. There's going to be tons of totally new invented content that will lead into big scenes from the books in ways we never imagined. 
• I think the first episode will be a little clunky and awkward. Everything I've seen makes me think a combination of factors, probably including studio interference, have sabotaged the pilot a little bit. It'll probably still be decent, but I don't think it will be anything close to a homerun. 
• I think the season will get progressively better with each episode, and finish strong.
• I think the cast will be great, but they'll take a while to settle into their roles. There might be some rough acting early in the season.
• I think it will be considerably better than the first season of The Witcher, but it will take a few episodes for that to become apparent.
• I don't think it will be as good as the first season of Game of Thrones.
• I think Mat will get lost in The Ways and won't be in the final two episodes. I'm almost positive I haven't seen him in any of the Fal Dara footage, and the actor sort of disappeared from view while those episodes were filmed. They might use whatever happens to him as a bridge to the recast. Maybe there'll be an in-universe explanation.
• I think Tam will tell Rand about his birth after the Trolloc attack, but I don't think we'll see it in the first episode. It will happen later with a flashback right before Rand's identity is revealed. We'll find out that Rand has secretly known this for the entire season, and it's been eating at him.

Overall I'm excited, and I think it will be a good (maybe even great) show, but I don't think it will be as faithful as some are hoping.

 

The TV universe will be established as a totally different animal from the book universe. Those who can accept that will enjoy it, Those that can't will either hate-watch or drop out very early.

 

Personally I'm more interested in seeing a really good/fun show with a lot of mainstream appeal than a super faithful rendition. I want this to work for my friends and family who aren't fantasy fans so I can have a way to share WOT with them, and I want it to succeed so we can get all the way to the end of the story.

 

 

Edited November 8, 2021 by NinjaPowers975

[Ralph]

9 hours ago, Deadsy said:

 what you're focusing on is transgender. What you are suggesting with letting people choose saidar or saidin is a crazy huge leap. For one thing, they don't have modern medicine to change genders physically. That being the case, why would they have the ability to change between saidin and saidar? If that were the case all men would change to saidar so they don't go mad and it would mess up the entire story.

 

Sorry, I have no interest in this becoming a topic of discussion (argument) on this forum, but you are assuming saidar/in would depend on physical external manifestations of sex, not on gender identity, which I don't think is what anyone else has been assuming. 

 

 

[Rose]

1 hour ago, NinjaPowers975 said:

• I think Mat will get lost in The Ways and won't be in the final two episodes. I'm almost positive I haven't seen him in any of the Fal Dara footage, and the actor sort of disappeared from view while those episodes were filmed. They might use whatever happens to him as a bridge to the recast. Maybe there'll be an in-universe explanation.

 

Okay wow I want to talk about this but I'll take it to a different thread because this is more about how we feel about the show rather than predictions about specific plot elements.

 

I really appreciate all your points, thank you for laying them out.

 

37 minutes ago, Ralph said:

 

Sorry, I have no interest in this becoming a topic of discussion (argument) on this forum, but you are assuming saidar/in would depend on physical external manifestations of sex, not on gender identity, which I don't think is what anyone else has been assuming. 

 

 

 

Yes, please take this to a different thread. I asked at the beginning that we don't dismiss or argue against other people's concerns here. 

[Elder_Haman]

Level of anticipation - 10/10. I'll watch the minute I am able to and definitely will binge the first three episodes. I'm guessing I'll end up watching them twice. I haven't invested the nearly the last three years following the show to not.

 

Confidence in the quality - 8/10. This is not going to be Shannara Chronicles or Legend of the Seeker type dreck. At worst, it will be on par with Shadow & Bone or His Dark Materials. Breaking it down further based on the trailers, clips and other promotional materials:

• Cinematography: 10/10
• Costumes/design: 9/10
• VFX: 8/10 [love the monsters, mostly like the weaves]
• Acting: ?
• Writing: ?
• Editing: ?

Obviously, the last three components are really important to making a good show. And we have scant evidence upon which to base judgments. Thus far, the castings seem great. I've had no problem adjusting my head canon to match the main 7 people.

• Rosamund Pike: I love her as Moiraine already. She has the steely determination, the charm, the ruthlessness, the imperiousness and the presence. I don't care at all about her height.
• Daniel Henney: Too early to say. I don't hate him, but I haven't seen enough to know whether I'll like him as Lan. I need a larger sample his physicality and to see how he interacts with the kids before I can make a judgment.
• Josha Stradowski: Physically, they nailed this casting. Everything I've seen from him makes me think he understands the character. He's a capable actor from what I've seen, and from the little we've seen he seems to have a good amount of subtlety.
• Madeleine Madden: Love her. She really seems to have the perfect temperament. And she's beautiful.
• Zoe Robbins: When castings were announced, she was the one that I disliked the most. Having seen her in action, I've done a total 180. She looks fierce and she hit all the right notes in the cast interviews.
• Marcus Rutherford: I like what I've seen so far. He's got a cautious, steady cadence that absolutely seems to match Perrin. 
• Barney Harris: No idea. Have seen very little. It's a bit of a red flag that he was replaced after only one season.

It will really all come down to the writing and the editing. Having seen neither, I can't really offer a judgment.

 

I will say that I am concerned about a couple of things:

• The potential for degendering the One Power. I hate it. It would be lore breaking to the extent that it would not be the Wheel of Time. Saidar and saidin and the resulting gender essentialism is really the key feature of the magic system. If it is actually removed, I would consider bailing completely. That being said, I'm very confident that they will not do that.
• I don't love Perrin being married and really do not like the idea of Perrin killing his wife. This is one of those changes that could work, but will have to be executed perfectly. How this is handled will give me a really good idea of the quality of writing to be expected. 
• I don't like the idea of the Cauthons being written as ne'er do wells. Like Perrin's wife, I can see ways to make this work, but it will be difficult to pull off correctly.  
• I do not want them to make Min into a trans character. That would be a jarring change of her character for me. 

  

[Katherine]

14 minutes ago, Elder_Haman said:

o not want them to make Min into a trans character. That would be a jarring change of her character for me. 

This is the first I have heard of this!!!!

 

Can you tell me where that "rumor" is coming from from?

[Elder_Haman]

13 minutes ago, Katherine said:

This is the first I have heard of this!!!!

 

Can you tell me where that "rumor" is coming from from?

Mostly from people who are anti-show. I don't think it is a particularly well-founded rumor, but there have been a few commenters on various places that hypothesize this change based on Min's preference for dressing "like a boy" and Rafe's comments.

[Rose]

1 minute ago, Elder_Haman said:

Mostly from people who are anti-show. I don't think it is a particularly well-founded rumor, but there have been a few commenters on various places that hypothesize this change based on Min's preference for dressing "like a boy" and Rafe's comments.

 

I think also because Kae Alexander is non-binary so some people speculated they might make Min non-binary as well. But I haven't seen any indication that they actually are doing it besides people's speculations.

[Katherine]

1 minute ago, Elder_Haman said:

Mostly from people who are anti-show. I don't think it is a particularly well-founded rumor, but there have been a few commenters on various places that hypothesize this change based on Min's preference for dressing "like a boy" and Rafe's comments.

Gotcha. 

 

Yeah I would not be a fan of that at all. 

 

 

[Katherine]

3 minutes ago, Rose said:

 

I think also because Kae Alexander is non-binary so some people speculated they might make Min non-binary as well. But I haven't seen any indication that they actually are doing it besides people's speculations.

 

Interesting. 

 

Well....... 

 

Don't know anything about her as an actress, but I think she looks AMAZING as Min, and I can't wait to see her on screen. 

 

I am also interested to see how they will show her ability to see people's auras.

Edited November 8, 2021 by Katherine