Interest in Aes Sedai shawls?

[Mashiara Sedai]

My sister, Mavin, and I were thinking of starting an Etsy store to sell hand-made Aes Sedai shawls.  I'm working on the prototypes currently--I'm on fall break, so I have the whole week off of work! 

 

But I wanted to see if anyone in the SG would be interested in buying them eventually.  We're also talking about other WoT related items--which I can say more about once a certain someone (*cough*Nynaeve*cough*) gets her Cultural Exchange present from me.  I don't want to ruin the surprise!

 

Here's an example of the shawl I made for myself, one I made of Misheru, and one Mavin made for herself.

 

 

 

 

So, is there any interest?

[Hallia]

I love you girls' work!  I would love to see about ordering a Yellow one

[Leala]

I'll definitely need a white one for JCon.  <3  How much are you thinking about charging?

[Mashiara Sedai]

The price would vary, depending on the materials. Probably $40 to $50 would be average. However, I could make it more or less, depending on your needs.

 

The current ones we've made, have been of a thick upholstery fabric which is durable and pretty. The cost is decent too! But we could do plain cotton, which would cut the price down, or we could do velvets or silks, which would put the cost up.

 

We could do longer fringe--prices goes up--or shorter fringe--price goes down. *lol*

 

There's lots of ways to customize.

[Mashiara Sedai]

I'm almost done with five more (Yellow, Red, Blue, Brown, and Gray). I'll have a more exact price for each one in the next day or so.

[Hallia]

Awesome, can't wait!

[Ahmyra al'Ruley]

If I ever get raised Aes Sedai I wòuld love one :)

[Ryrin]

I have confidence in you, Ahmyra!

 

I'd love one!!

[Mystica]

if I may be critical, I love the white one. The Yellow one is on the cusp but the Green one looks like a carpet/curtain to me if I'm totally honest. Perhaps it's the type of fringe used?

 

Also, please be aware that there are some restrictions in to making shawls apparently (especially for selling). Make sure you or your friend don't get in trouble over this. I'd hate that after your hard work which is obviously well intended.

[Wren of the Brown]

Because copyright law is tricky and costuming is fun:

 

http://trystancraft.com/costume/2012/01/18/an-introduction-to-copyright-for-bloggers-especially-costume-bloggers/

 

Basically, and I can only speak for American law here, you can't copyright a costume or a piece of clothing because it's a utilitarian object.  The Aes Sedai symbol is a part of a brand trademark but I'd bet they're safe to use it.  If you look at the costume/cosplay work on Etsy, you'll see entire articles of clothing made from video games or movies and nobody really bats an eye.  Do your research but from what I've seen on Etsy and read elsewhere, it won't be too much of an issue so long as you reference the source and inspiration of your garments.

 

Actual patterns are copyrighted material, so if you were to make a garment from someone else's pattern and resold it despite their explicit wishes, you would have a problem.  Garments reconstructed from archeological digs, illustrations or descriptions don't violate copyright because they are draw from both public domain and general folklore.  A triangle shawl is a ubiquitous design and it would be quite a stretch to argue it's stolen.

 

Here's some Etsy policy.  I hope it helps?

 

https://blog.etsy.com/en/?s=Seller%20Handbook

[michellem]

if I may be critical, I love the white one. The Yellow one is on the cusp but the Green one looks like a carpet/curtain to me if I'm totally honest. Perhaps it's the type of fringe used?

 

Also, please be aware that there are some restrictions in to making shawls apparently (especially for selling). Make sure you or your friend don't get in trouble over this. I'd hate that after your hard work which is obviously well intended.

 

I can assure you, it looks absolutley wonderful IRL!

 

 

 

Mashi is amazing!

[michellem]

If I ever get raised Aes Sedai I wòuld love one :)

 

You don't have to an AS here on DM to have a shawl!

[Rhea]

I'd be interested!

[Ryrin]

if I may be critical, I love the white one. The Yellow one is on the cusp but the Green one looks like a carpet/curtain to me if I'm totally honest. Perhaps it's the type of fringe used?:

I think it's the type of material.... to me it looks "heavy." I would choose a lighter type of material.

[Mashiara Sedai]

if I may be critical, I love the white one. The Yellow one is on the cusp but the Green one looks like a carpet/curtain to me if I'm totally honest. Perhaps it's the type of fringe used?

 

Also, please be aware that there are some restrictions in to making shawls apparently (especially for selling). Make sure you or your friend don't get in trouble over this. I'd hate that after your hard work which is obviously well intended.

I appreciate the constructive criticism, Myst!  The Green one did use a tassled fringe instead of the regular fringe.  However, they did look really good together IRL.  I think it's the picture that doesn't do them justice!  But you are right, it's all about personal preference!

 

Because copyright law is tricky and costuming is fun:

 

http://trystancraft.com/costume/2012/01/18/an-introduction-to-copyright-for-bloggers-especially-costume-bloggers/

 

Basically, and I can only speak for American law here, you can't copyright a costume or a piece of clothing because it's a utilitarian object.  The Aes Sedai symbol is a part of a brand trademark but I'd bet they're safe to use it.  If you look at the costume/cosplay work on Etsy, you'll see entire articles of clothing made from video games or movies and nobody really bats an eye.  Do your research but from what I've seen on Etsy and read elsewhere, it won't be too much of an issue so long as you reference the source and inspiration of your garments.

 

Actual patterns are copyrighted material, so if you were to make a garment from someone else's pattern and resold it despite their explicit wishes, you would have a problem.  Garments reconstructed from archeological digs, illustrations or descriptions don't violate copyright because they are draw from both public domain and general folklore.  A triangle shawl is a ubiquitous design and it would be quite a stretch to argue it's stolen.

 

Here's some Etsy policy.  I hope it helps?

 

https://blog.etsy.com/en/?s=Seller%20Handbook

 

Thanks Hiarth!  Once we actually sit down to get the store, we'll look through all that legal stuff.  But I know that Etsy, Ebay, Amazon, etc., all sell fan-art or fan inspired items.  As you said, as long as we aren't using anyone's pattern--and we aren't--we are fine.  (Sometimes the names of the items need to be changed, like a "Moon Princess" costume instead of a "Sailor Moon" costume, so we'll see on that.)

 

 

if I may be critical, I love the white one. The Yellow one is on the cusp but the Green one looks like a carpet/curtain to me if I'm totally honest. Perhaps it's the type of fringe used?:

I think it's the type of material.... to me it looks "heavy." I would choose a lighter type of material.

 

 

Yes, we chose this material because of the "heavy"-ness.  It actually works really well.  But again, it's all preference.  And I'd like to make some of out silk, or jacquard, or brocade next.  My goal is to try to make a few a month, and I'll be looking around the fabric stores for materials that inspire me.

[Ryrin]

I was thinking silk but I'd love to see other lighter materials too. Ok, I just saw one with jacquard. Nice. I also like the plain flame.

[Moon Sedai]

Her shawls do look awesome IRL (I have seen them and wants one!)

[dawnflower8]

Those shawls are great. I'd buy one if I had more money.

[Wren of the Brown]

I still want to make my Gleeman's cloak. :/

[Mashiara Sedai]

I still want to make my Gleeman's cloak. :/

That would be so cool!

 

If anyone's adventerous enough, here's a tutorial I did on how to make a shawl. :D

 

http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/90116-wheel-of-time-crafts-aes-sedai-shawl/?view=getnewpost

[Aiel Heart]

So... How long until fancloth cloaks are in production? 

 

:P

 

Considering making myself a shawl eventually... First I'd need to figure out what Ajah I identify to! (probably just Yellow by association :P )

[Wren of the Brown]

*cough* Neon Pink Ajah *cough*

[Mashiara Sedai]

Every time we are at a fabric store, Mavin eyes the camo.  So a Warder's cloak might be coming soon.  *lol*  We could totally do a Neon Pink Ajah!

 

So, the good news is I finished three of the six shawls I started.  They are very, very time consuming.  At least 4 hour per shawl.  *sigh*  But it's good practice!  And I'm starting to get better at constructing them.

 

The bad news is the craftsmanship is SO poor.  Not from lack of trying, just lack of experience.  Because of that, I am not comfortable selling these for $50 or $60.  No one would be willing to pay that much for them!!!!  What I'm thinking I'll do then, is put them on Etsy, once I get a store set up, and sell them at no profit (cost covers materials and shipping only).  The Gray one is almost good enough, but, you'll see in a moment  how it's messed up as well.

 

All right!  Here's the pictures:

 

Yellow (for Nynaeve)

 

The yellow material has a slightly different pattern than the others.  The fringe length is 6 inches.  The backing is a white cotton.  The wingspan is 53 inches.  The length, from neck to point, is 34 inches (about 39 inches with the fringe).

 

 

 

Close up of material and the Flame:

 

 

I messed up on the fringe and got some stuck in the seam.  :(

 

 

Blue:

I love how dark this blue is.  It's beautiful!  The fringe is only 3 inches; there wasn't a lot of blue fringe to choose from.  It would have looked nicer with a longer fringe (I think in the books, it's anywhere from 8 - 10 inches), but I still love how the colors match so well.  The backing fabric is a white cotton.  This is the longest one, 40 inches (about 42 with the fringe), and the wingspan is 53 inches.

 

 

 

 

The tension got messed up, which pulled some of the top thread (blue) through the bottom thread (white).  I might have to redo the seam.  :(

 

 

Gray:

The Flame came out very well on this one.  The fringe is 3 inches long.  Again, it was difficult finding a gray that matched well.  The backing is a white silk.  The wingspan is slightly longer, 54 inches.  The length is 36 inches (about 38 with the fringe).

 

 

 

Close up of the Flame and the material:

 

 

And the only messed up part of this one:

 

 

Not enough fringe at the bottom.  This is something I might be able to fix, if I can get the same exact fringe from the store.

[Mashiara Sedai]

Now a more accurate price range.  When pricing homemade items, they have a formula you're supposed to follow:

 

Materials + Labor + Expenses + Profit = Wholesale x 2 = Retail

 

But, as I said, I'm not comfortable charging that much for work that isn't that great. 

 

The Yellow shawl will be shipped to Nynaeve. :D

 

The Blue shawl will be priced somewhere around $35 (+shipping).

 

The Gray shawl (if I can't fix it) will be priced somewhere around $35.  If I can fix it, sorry but the price goes up.  :P  Maybe to $55.  That would account for my labor only, not my expenses.  I don't think I need to figure all that in unless Mavin and I decide to do this in bulk--which is very unlikely since we both have day jobs we enjoy.

[JenniferL]

Alright, I get to be the party pooper. You can't sell Aes Sedai shawls. I've seen other people try and get served with a very nice, polite, cease and desist from Team Jordan's lawyer. (A guy named Steve, he goes to JordanCon every year. Maybe you met him.) The Flame of Tar Valon is copyrighted. Putting the Flame on a shawl is also copyrighted. The Jordan estate will defend their copyright. Nicely, because they appreciate the fans and realize most of this stuff is done with the utmost love and respect. But if they don't defend their copyrights, they run the risk of losing them. 

 

What is allowed? Making yourself an Aes Sedai shawl for cosplay. Making your friend a shawl as a gift. Making your friend a shawl and having her reimburse you for MATERIALS ONLY. 

 

There is someone who has a license from the Jordan estate to produce custom made shawls to order, but for a variety of reasons, haven't done much with it. If you are really interested, I can get you in touch with them and Team Jordan and see if it's possible to add you to their contract, or have them relinquish the license back to Harriet and create a new contract. I don't know what the options are at this point. Or you could just put your eBay store up and wait a couple weeks for Steve to get in touch with you. =)