There Goes the Neighborhood (Game Thread) - GAME OVER MAFIA WIN

[Blackhoof]

THE MOD HAS SPOKEN!

 

*GONG!!!*

[peacesells]

Due to further rule violations, EP Member of the Italian Mob had been Modkilled.

 

MYND, YOU SON OF A *****!!!

 

THAT IS NOT POSSIBLE!!!

 

YOU LUCKY LITTLE-

 

DAMN YOU! DAMN YOU AND YOUR THEORY TO HELL!!!

 

 

Seriously though, im not mad, just mystified. Mynd either got very lucky with his guess or he wove the whole theory, knowing that people would argue about it, and he picked EP (a scummate of his) as the target to vet him!

 

I like the latter option better.

 

unvote, vote mynd

 

You really think that this was a set up considering that EP insulted mynd and pretty much got modkilled as a result? Looks like complete fabrication.

 

unvote, vote blackhoof

 

 

 

[Ironeyes]

I honestly think that Mynd got lucky. Especially considering the fact that his theory was just a load of nonsense designed to stir up reactions.

[bgrishinko]

Well, I go missing for a weekend and somebody pours venom all over the game for no apparent reason.

 

Quick thoughts and moving on:

 

Retarded can be very offensive for some people. Leave it at that, Mynd asked nicely. Similarly, this is why I avoid calling Ithi scum, it's very offensive to her.

Criticizing and mocking gameplay styles is valid and is not personal.

Mynd's theory turned out to work, though it was a risk, but isn't everything in mafia?

 

I think that this early in the game, mafia will have laid low, defended a partner and attacked Mynd as an easier lynch based on what can be easily described as bad game logic by some. The most compelling defense of EP that meets these criteria at this point was that of Nolder.

 

Vote Nolder

[Myndrunner]

And to answer the unasked question of how it is equivalent NOLDER AND EP, allow me to explain. Regardless of a person's physical or mental attributes the terminology cast at that individual can be offensive.

The terminology is medical. If EP had said to Mynd "Do you have Kanner's Syndrom?" Would that have somehow been more acceptable to you? I doubt it. You guys are just making a mountain out of a molehill. The big issue here to me is that you're choosing to take offense rather than just pass it off as common vernacular. You're demonizing EP and that's not right. To me that's so much worse than any implication of retardation.

 

A word's meaning depends on the context. In the context that EP used it was meant to be derogatory. He didn't use the term to say that my math calculations was like one who had down syndrome would come up with, it was rather that my calculations were lacking and inferior. If we are to advance our species in this day and age, we need to break away from derogatory terms that insult an entire group of people.

 

So, attack my game play and call me a jackass - but don't demean those with special needs just because you think its a cool way to hurl an insult.

 

...anyone who has further issues with this, take it up with the Mod. I've said my peace and the Mod has been clear about what happened. Its done, lets learn from this.

 

* * *

 

Now then, to say that I got lucky implies that luck had anything to do with it. I am amazed that we are not celebrating the fact that a mafia is gone. Had I been lynched instead, how long would it have been before you all realized that my theory worked? Try this. Where you sit, say these words "Mynd was right" Go ahead, nothing is gonna happen to you. "Mynd was right" Try that a few times, it gets easier each time. See? No pit of despair opened beneath your feet. No fire and brimstone came raining down upon you. Nobody nicked your credit cards and ran off to the Bahamas. It's okay to admit that Myndrunner was right!

 

Blackhoof.....wow. Yeah, EP and I plotted to get him Modkilled. I love playing with this guy!

 

Nolder, on the other hand, won't let this go because its the only thing he's got right now to get me lynched. He wants to push the issue so that I look like I got poor, innocent EP modkilled because of my hypocritical bastard self. The reality is that when you peel away his argument, he voted me in retaliation for my vote on Eternal Phoenix and refused to let up. He freely admitted that if I claimed Finder of Healer that he would not unvote me. Now that EP has flipped mafia (in whatever manner it occured) he has egg on his face and he's trying to save that face in front of the town.

 

Bottom line: As long as I continue to appear the bad guy, Nolder looks justified in his argument. Step back and see his actions for what they really are.

[Songstress]

I've been quiet for a few days because the atmosphere in this game has gotten positively nasty, to tell the truth, and it's been a lot less fun to play.

 

Re: Mynd and his theory... I'm sorry, Mynd, but I just can't make myself say you were right. I will say you got lucky, because I firmly believe EP was no more likely to be scum in this game than you or I, or Ishy, or Hoof, or any number of us. Well, maybe not Ishy, according to your theory he's been scum too recently to qualify.

 

That said, I've been going back through trying to catch up my notes looking for who might have defended EP or fought his lynch particularly hard, and I came to the same conclusion BG did. Nolder's pinging me the most.

 

This post, for instance:

 

It's almost always a crapshoot on day one, so why not?

people who try to justify picking one person out of the bunch "at random" sets alarm bells off in my head

 

granted Mynd's BS says that his vote isn't "random" but I guess that's also kind of my point

he didn't vote at random so I have to ask myself why that is

 

There are plenty of people who try to pick someone out seemingly at random on Day 1 and justify lynching them. Sometimes their logic is a complete stretch, and sure, that pings hardcore. But then he goes on to say that Mynd wasn't voting at random, and that makes him suspicious. Nolder's reasoning here seems to be that Mynd is suspicious no matter what he does, frankly. His reactions to Mynd have been quite interesting this game...

 

I think my best bet right now is to Vote Nolder.

[Sakaea]

Due to further rule violations, EP Member of the Italian Mob had been Modkilled.

MYND, YOU SON OF A *****!!! THAT IS NOT POSSIBLE!!! YOU LUCKY LITTLE- DAMN YOU! DAMN YOU AND YOUR THEORY TO HELL!!! Seriously though, im not mad, just mystified. Mynd either got very lucky with his guess or he wove the whole theory, knowing that people would argue about it, and he picked EP (a scummate of his) as the target to vet him! I like the latter option better. unvote, vote mynd

 

Wow. Just....wow....I can't see how you can think this, honestly. IMHO, the whole thing with EP, and how he flipped, makes me think Mynd is town more than ever. Much too early in the game for a gambit such as you're describing. Vote Blackhoof for voting for an, IMO, almost certain townie.

 

The Nolder lynch is interesting, seems like people are bandwagoning on him for not agreeing with the use of the R word.

[Aiel Heart]

I was doing a reread but am now too livid to think clearly.

 

Not to stir the ashes, as the game is probably moved past this point by now, but I am a special education teacher. That word is derogatory and offensive, and anyone who interacts with children with special needs would probably get as upset over by that use of the word. They should at least.

 

I'm getting off before I say something I'll regret.

[Niniel]

Due to further rule violations, EP Member of the Italian Mob had been Modkilled.

MYND, YOU SON OF A *****!!! THAT IS NOT POSSIBLE!!! YOU LUCKY LITTLE- DAMN YOU! DAMN YOU AND YOUR THEORY TO HELL!!! Seriously though, im not mad, just mystified. Mynd either got very lucky with his guess or he wove the whole theory, knowing that people would argue about it, and he picked EP (a scummate of his) as the target to vet him! I like the latter option better. unvote, vote mynd

 

Wow. Just....wow....I can't see how you can think this, honestly. IMHO, the whole thing with EP, and how he flipped, makes me think Mynd is town more than ever. Much too early in the game for a gambit such as you're describing. Vote Blackhoof for voting for an, IMO, almost certain townie.

 

The Nolder lynch is interesting, seems like people are bandwagoning on him for not agreeing with the use of the R word.

 

I agree that Blackhoof´s post was very, very weird. Can´t see how he could be right. Just wanting to jump on the leading train? That said, why is Mynd almost certain a townie? We have a lot of players in this game. We could have third party players, two mafia teams or maybe a cult. We can almost certain say that Mynd and EP weren´t on a team together but we have no proof yet that Mynd is town.

[Myndrunner]

Anyone else notice irony in the title of this game?

[SBoydW]

Anyone else notice irony in the title of this game?

 

Haha... All to frequently...

[Nynaeve]

Anyone else notice irony in the title of this game?

 

Heh, spot on.

 

 

Both Nolder and Blackhoof seem like viable options. I'm currently leaning towards Blackhoof because I think he overdid it. His notion that Mynd simply lucked out is possible. But the whole EP and Mynd working together to get him modkilled seems like he's grasping at air to try and rekindle Mynd's bandwagon. I agree that EP flipping scum doesn't automatically mean that Mynd is town. But seeing someone use such flimsy reasoning to vote him pings me.

 

As for Nolder. I am not completely sure if he was truly protecting EP or simply arguing the topic at hand because he feels strongly about it. I would expect that with his level of experience he wouldn't have connected himself so bluntly with EP. Then again even experienced players can make mistake at the heat of the moment. So I'm watching him.

 

I'm going to wait a bit to cast my vote just to see if there are new developments... but those are my thoughts at current.

 

 

 

Nyn

[bgrishinko]

Well, looks like despite the drama, we are looking at a typical day 1. Mynd throws out a crazy scheme. Turns out randomly it would have worked, and people start voting Blackhoof at the end of the day. Good times.

[Nynaeve]

Funny. I seem to recall you going with his 'crazy scheme'. At least initially.

 

 

 

 

Nyn

[bgrishinko]

Funny. I seem to recall you going with his 'crazy scheme'. At least initially.

 

 

 

 

Nyn

 

So? Nothing wrong with crazy schemes. I've gone along with my fair share and attempted a few myself. At very least, they draw in reactions, and at most catch scum right out.

[Myndrunner]

My experience is Blackhoof looks scummiest when he is town. He goes out of his way to look innocent when he is scum. He's acting a fool therefore likely town.

 

Nolder has a hidden agenda. Look back to where he voted me and his reasons why. Then the whole unspeakable whatever happened and he kept stirring it to keep the heat on me.

[John E. Kelley]

I don't think he kept on about it for any game reason. He felt strongly about his opinion. Using the nastiness to further a game agenda is the worst sort of hypocrisy. Drop it already.

[Nolder]

Nolder, on the other hand, won't let this go because its the only thing he's got right now to get me lynched. He wants to push the issue so that I look like I got poor, innocent EP modkilled because of my hypocritical bastard self.

You're right. I said I'd let it go and I kept going. I'm sorry.

I'm letting it go now though. I'm not going to say any more about it.

I will say that I have not pushed your lynch since this issue came up and it's somewhat annoying that you'd spin it like I am.

 

He freely admitted that if I claimed Finder of Healer that he would not unvote me.

I've seen you say this several times now. That didn't happen. You're lying and that speaks for itself.

[Myndrunner]

Read the following posts by Nolder in chronological order...do you see the same desperate pattern that I do?

What I am trying to illustrate is that players who have been mafia in past games are less likely to be mafia again. Now, Verbal would be the first to swoop in and say "THATS NOT TRUE" and he would be right in raw numbers. If you flip a coin 50 times, the odds of it flipping heads on the 31st time are the same as the 1st. Therefore, the odds of flipping 50 heads is 1/2. The LIKELYHOOD is not that simple since it would only take one tails to ruin the entire gambit. Still with me? Hopefully this will make sense now.

Verbal's not here so I guess I'll have to do

 

That's not true AT ALL

 

you're just as likely to scum every time you play a game (well actually the amount of players changes things a little bit)

in the recent past I got like 4 or 5 scum roles in a row for different games

what you're saying is entirely false and has no more bearing on the game than if we sorted players by their names in alphabetical order and said those most likely to be scum will be near the end

 

And then you follow all this BS up with a vote

unbelievable Mynd

 

Unvote: Nyn

Vote: Mynd

Other math?

 

Im getting this weird feeling. I kinda want to defend mynd a bit. I must be going crazy.

I dont have time to go through it all properly now but what mynd said at the start was true. D1 lynches often start for complete bullshit reasons on the hope we get one of the mafia. The fact that he just went for it and didn beat around the bush got everyone's tail feathers ruffed.

The ruffling got some interesting reactions though.

But yea, I think what mynd did at the start was just choose someone at random and put some values to it to see help give it some sway (next time just light a torch, works better Mynd ;) )

Im off to sleep. Start work really early again'

 

Peace out

I disagree

I've seen Mynd do just what you're saying before

this isn't how he does it

he actually tries to justify it by calling certain things scumtells and getting in the face of anyone who defends the person he's going after

then, if he feels like it, he'll flip and go after the people who agreed with his BS

 

the difference in this case is that he isn't accusing anyone of being scum for anything they did

he's essentially "picked at random"

that doesn't sit right with me

I have a feeling Mynd was aware of his own logical fallacy

my guess is he was betting no one else did

 

and hey imagine EP being a member of his scum team or a third party scum and we lynched him

imagine how long he could keep up lynching people based on this whole process if he "got it right" the first time

 

I don't trust it and I don't trust him

not this time

It's almost always a crapshoot on day one, so why not?

people who try to justify picking one person out of the bunch "at random" sets alarm bells off in my head

 

granted Mynd's BS says that his vote isn't "random" but I guess that's also kind of my point

he didn't vote at random so I have to ask myself why that is

I find it odd that several people besides myself have spoken out against Mynd's math idea but I'm the only one voting him

he's using your expectations against you

 

that's my stance and it's not changing today

If you're not scum you made a big mistake by trying to justify a day 1 vote based on previous games

that's on you not me

Due to further rule violations, EP Member of the Italian Mob had been Modkilled.

Now watch him switch gears...

This is some of the most ridiculous crap I've yet seen. Voting Mynd for being Mynd? He stirs the pot in every game people, it's what makes him dangerous.

As I said I think he's using your expectations against you

you expect him to make crap cases to "stir things up" but you don't hold him accountable for said cases

that's a bad use of meta

that is just as bad as not voting Hoof on day 1 because he "always dies on day 1"

it's not logical

 

but whatever

do what you want I guess

also re: EP/modkilling

 

I think you're all being too sensitive and PC myself

I think you should be able to say or do anything you want in mafia to provoke a reaction from people

I don't think EP meant any harm

 

it doesn't matter anymore though I guess

All I asked is that he not use that word. It is offensive to those who have friends or family members with special needs.

What's offensive about it?

All I asked is that he not use that word. It is offensive to those who have friends or family members with special needs.

What's offensive about it?

It is a derogatory term. It is the equivlant of using the N word to one of African American descent.

1. Are you mentally challenged? If you're not then it's not equivalent

2. It wasn't meant maliciously and you know it. It's the same as saying "dumb", "stupid", "idiot". You're getting offended about this but you wouldn't be offended if someone told you to shut up even though that's not polite or nice either.

3. It's over and done with. I think you and anyone who was offended is wrong but it doesn't matter anymore so let's drop this discussion.

[Myndrunner]

These are the postings of a player who has painted himself in a corner. He vehemently defended EP, with the sole purpose of discrediting my theory. When EP was modkilled, he did what he could to stir the hornet's nest, on a subject that everyone else was trying to move on from. Again, the sole purpose was to keep bad guy heat on me and off the fact that he defended a revealed mafia player.

 

Nolder will flip scum.

[John E. Kelley]

Sorry, but I'm with Nolder on this one. I respectfully disagree Mynd.

[Myndrunner]

Sorry, but I'm with Nolder on this one. I respectfully disagree Mynd.

 

So Nolder cannot be scum for defending a player who flipped mafia?

[John E. Kelley]

Of course he can. But I think he wasn't defending EP, he was arguing against the logic you presented. I would be willing to bet that had your initial vote based on your theory been against anyone, he would have said the same.

 

And as for the disagreements following the nastiness, again I think he was arguing a point of view, not arguing for or against a mere player in the game. It got very serious in here for a day or two and we went off on a tangent. It then became a discussion on political correctness and not about game moves.

 

I hesitate to put words in Nol's mouth, as he's a big boy and more than capable of defending himself. This is merely my interpretation of the matter.

[John E. Kelley]

And also, using your logic,since I disagree with your case on Nolder, I guess that makes me scum as well? Well done, you've nabbed three on Day One!!

[Basel Gill]

Okay, I just got home from work (my first day back after being medically out of commission for 2 1/2 weeks) and have taken the time to examine my reads on people.

 

Mynd: EP flipped scum. Mynd pulled a wild and crazy theory out that shouldn't have worked, but it did. He's still done some pingy things, but this is Mynd we are talking about. In light of EP's flip, I think I want more evidence before I make a decision on him. Therefore, unvote.

 

Which leaves me with other options to explore. There's been a lot of round and round between Mynd and Nolder, with Hoof joining in on it too. But this post jumped out at me as sounding like it was defending EP by going after Nyn for her EP vote.

 

I do not think that mynds theory was malicious in purpose, merely misguided and suspicious for trying to justify a random vote. I am wary of BG for attempting to justify it further.

 

But, BG has removed his vote, and nyn hasn't. She maintains a vote on EP because "someone has to go anyway".

 

I agree, so let it be you, nyn

 

Vote Nyn

 

Vote Hoof.