Jump to content

DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY
Luckers

The Aiel Thing in the Epilogue

Recommended Posts

I'd say that there is good possibility that Demandred is in control of the Sharans, though it is not necessarily true. Shara has been mentioned several times in the books, and is also briefly mentioned in ToM, which leads me to believe that it is of some importance. I think that especially since we don't have great descriptions of the Sharans we can assume that they are similar to the Aiel in many ways. I mean look at the landscape for one.

 

They are separated by the Cliffs of Dawn, which could easily be a change caused by the breaking separating the Aiel of the time.

 

There are Waste-like badlands immediately to the east of the Cliffs of Dawn and the Great Rift, but Shara is pretty big and probably has a lot of variance in terrain in its interior.

 

The few things we do know about Sharans are that they're deceitful to outlanders, they practice chattel slavery, and they seem to be totally obedient to their rulers and to the "Will of the Pattern." None of that sounds anything at all like Aiel.

 

We can also easily assume that they have ships, as they do have ports and although they generally have no wish to leave, considering they are somewhat advanced although primitive in many ways, I'd say it is much more likely for them to have ships than the LoMM. We also know that just across the ocean from Shara is Seanchan. This means that the Seanchan could have had contact with the Seanchan already, which could possibly explain a reason to want to attack them. We do know that the Seanchan eventually have contact, as we see in Avi's POV in Rhuidean that in the future the Seanchan have the Sharans hunting the Aiel if they go too far East.

 

The Sharans likely do have ships and could easily be the force attacking the Seanchan (crossing the Morenal Ocean and attacking the Seanchan continent from the west). I don't think they have anything to do with the evil similar-to-Aiel people in the Blight, though. The description is too obviously suggestive of Aiel, and assuming that Sharans just happen to resemble Aiel just feels like too much of a stretch. (It is still possible that the ships with red sails and the red-veiled people are completely unrelated.)

Well it kind of has been thousands of years so the culture of the Sharans would obviously change. And it really isn't much of a stretch that they look like Aiel, its even likely in my opinion. Like I said they could have come from the same group, and they also live in similar terrain, meaning much of their physical appearance would remain the same in that aspect. I also see it as much less of stretch than virtually any other theory provided.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well it kind of has been thousands of years so the culture of the Sharans would obviously change. And it really isn't much of a stretch that they look like Aiel, its even likely in my opinion. Like I said they could have come from the same group, and they also live in similar terrain, meaning much of their physical appearance would remain the same in that aspect. I also see it as much less of stretch than virtually any other theory provided.

 

There's also the fact that the Aiel probably have the best historical record of any culture in the Rhuidean pillars. The various offshoots of the original Da'shain (the Tinkers, the Jenn, and the modern Aiel) are pretty clearly documented in the pillars, and are key events in Aiel history. If the Sharans had a cultural connection of some sort to the Aiel, wouldn't that be mentioned in the pillars' account as well?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not necessarily unless someone of Sharan descent went through the pillars, although you make a good point.

 

The pillars only work for those with Aiel blood.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The pillars only show the Aiel part of the ancestry for those with mixed blood.

It's possible let's say, that not all the Aiel settled in the Waste and some carried on across into Shara.

For the Sharan=Aiel lost tribe concept to show up in the pillars though, you'd need somebody seeing something like his great^n granddad's brother saying "We'll carry on" while his direct ancestor settled down.

It may have happened - every Aiel sees different past lives stuff till the one key scene and we only have 1 PoV for what they actually saw.

Since they never discuss it, it would just be forgotten, or written off as "those poor sods who died".

Edited by Sharaman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The pillars only work for those with Aiel blood.

 

Didn't Moiraine go through the pillars? I know she went to Rhuidean and I thought she went through the pillars.

 

James

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The pillars only work for those with Aiel blood.

 

Didn't Moiraine go through the pillars? I know she went to Rhuidean and I thought she went through the pillars.

 

James

 

She went through the rings, the Apprentice test, very like the Accepted test for Aes Sedai. Like the Apprentices, it seems she only saw possible futures involving herself directly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For one, if the Sharans were a separation of the Aiel they would have Aiel blood, and also do we know for sure anyway that only Aiel can use the pillars? Has anyone else ever tried?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok, I think there is one thing to consider. And I may be WAAYYY off, but seeing as no one brought it up ... well, why not. Could they not be the Foxes? Think about it, if they were going to travel disguised, the have red standing hair and sharp teeth with malicious smiles. Think about how they were dressed too. Black with leather. The spears throw it off, so maybe those were just thrown in for the disguise, but they killed him with a knife which is what the Foxes use. The snakes and foxes were said to be evil in a different way from the shadow, the books also say that questions of the shadow are very dangerous around them (this could possibly be why - a connection). It also might explain the fact that the snakes and foxes should have know that Mat would escape twice and that maybe mat didn't really win yet. Take a fox, slap on a veil and throw in a spear, and you have exactly what it describes. Especially the way that they crouch around. Just a thought.

Edited by jdun7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's not true. The foxes are supposed to look human, with some fox like features. Mat even exclaims that they look extremely human at times, except for the hair, the broad shoulders, the teeth, the eyes, and the way they move. Every thing about these Aiel fit that except for the broad shoulders which would be extremely easy to overlook.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's not true. The foxes are supposed to look human, with some fox like features. Mat even exclaims that they look extremely human at times, except for the hair, the broad shoulders, the teeth, the eyes, and the way they move. Every thing about these Aiel fit that except for the broad shoulders which would be extremely easy to overlook.

A somewhat noticeable difference between fox canines and filed teeth. Also between dark eyes and yellow/green ones.

They're also unnaturally tall - even taller than Aiel, with bottle brush red hair.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's not true. The foxes are supposed to look human, with some fox like features. Mat even exclaims that they look extremely human at times, except for the hair, the broad shoulders, the teeth, the eyes, and the way they move. Every thing about these Aiel fit that except for the broad shoulders which would be extremely easy to overlook.

A somewhat noticeable difference between fox canines and filed teeth. Also between dark eyes and yellow/green ones.

They're also unnaturally tall - even taller than Aiel, with bottle brush red hair.

Possibly, although when you are staring death in the face and you see some one with pointy teeth, I think the natural description that would come to mind would be that they were filed. I think some of his descriptions were fitting what he understood of his reality, not as they really were. Kind of like how he mistook them for Fades and then for Aiel. I guess the eyes kind of throw it off though. I disagree with the Aiel channelers theory though. The guy said they were something else, almost inhuman.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's not true. The foxes are supposed to look human, with some fox like features. Mat even exclaims that they look extremely human at times, except for the hair, the broad shoulders, the teeth, the eyes, and the way they move. Every thing about these Aiel fit that except for the broad shoulders which would be extremely easy to overlook.

A somewhat noticeable difference between fox canines and filed teeth. Also between dark eyes and yellow/green ones.

They're also unnaturally tall - even taller than Aiel, with bottle brush red hair.

Possibly, although when you are staring death in the face and you see some one with pointy teeth, I think the natural description that would come to mind would be that they were filed. I think some of his descriptions were fitting what he understood of his reality, not as they really were. Kind of like how he mistook them for Fades and then for Aiel. I guess the eyes kind of throw it off though. I disagree with the Aiel channelers theory though. The guy said they were something else, almost inhuman.

The other thing is, we have some ambiguous quotes by Rj about the Finns being unable to affect the WoTworld. Those could be construed to mean anything from they can't move around at all to they're reduced to normal corporeal creatures who can't play their strange games with time and space.

If the former, it can;t be them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's not true. The foxes are supposed to look human, with some fox like features. Mat even exclaims that they look extremely human at times, except for the hair, the broad shoulders, the teeth, the eyes, and the way they move. Every thing about these Aiel fit that except for the broad shoulders which would be extremely easy to overlook.

A somewhat noticeable difference between fox canines and filed teeth. Also between dark eyes and yellow/green ones.

They're also unnaturally tall - even taller than Aiel, with bottle brush red hair.

Possibly, although when you are staring death in the face and you see some one with pointy teeth, I think the natural description that would come to mind would be that they were filed. I think some of his descriptions were fitting what he understood of his reality, not as they really were. Kind of like how he mistook them for Fades and then for Aiel. I guess the eyes kind of throw it off though. I disagree with the Aiel channelers theory though. The guy said they were something else, almost inhuman.

The other thing is, we have some ambiguous quotes by Rj about the Finns being unable to affect the WoTworld. Those could be construed to mean anything from they can't move around at all to they're reduced to normal corporeal creatures who can't play their strange games with time and space.

If the former, it can;t be them.

 

 

However, the way Mat left the tower likely has never been done before. That unique event might have made a way for them to leave the ToG and travel the WoT world. In response to them becoming powerless, it does not mean that they cannot use a knife and move in that way. And who hung Mat in the Tree from his Spear if they cannot affect the WoT world? :)

 

I do not actually buy this option, but I can see the merit in that. I like the Dark Clan issue. There are options that might make it happen. Someone mentioned that the 13x13 thing being a recent activity, but it was done during the Trolloc Wars IIRC. So actually, that could mean that while Ishy has been using the Black Ajah thought the years, he could have been turning the Male Aiel Channelers and forming a new Society or Clan around them using DF's or Borderland stock. This could account for the Aiel-like things that were seen as well as the deviation as there are other cultures being blended in.

 

I know that they might not all turn evil, but depending on how long they wandered the Blight and what their mental state was at the time, they might have been turned enough to the Shadow to at least work in the new Society. Also, depending on how long this has been happening, is it possible that few of the channelers, male or female in this society would even still be living. We could be talking of decendants of these people as well as possible member of the BA or turned AS as well being used here. If they did not turn enough to be useful being returned to the Tower, they could end up here. And I like the WO's training Isam/Slayer too.

 

there are a lot of great theories here. I just want to see the last book!!!

Edited by Hatrel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

RJ, quote, Talmanes. Anyone else can wonder in and nothing with happen to them, it is keyed to the Aiel to show them their past.

Ah ok, really wasn't sure. But still if they were separated it would still work, or even if they weren't I still think there is a good chance it could be Sharans.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the Finn theory is good, remember they are said to wear the skin of humans we just assume it means clothing. he had an ecstatic look as

he killed barriga.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
the Finn theory is good, remember they are said to wear the skin of humans we just assume it means clothing.

 

They're not "said to". The clothing of the Eelfinn looks like it might be human skin. The Aelfinn wear cloth wrappings.

 

he had an ecstatic look as he killed barriga.

 

No. He smiled. Whether he was actually ecstatic or not...who knows? Even if he were, so what? It's not as if people in the series, and especially those on Team Evil, never enjoy killing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

my money is soul swapped Aiel, with myrdraal souls. Just to be unique.

 

it also explains how the DO was able to do so many different soul swaps with success since he would be practiced at it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Obviously, there was a mishap with a Portal Stone and Baraka somehow got sent to Randland..

 

He was obviously, delirious, was seeing triple and just didn't see the knife was coming out of his arm.. Duh.

 

 

On a more serious note, I sort of thought it was turned Aiel channelers when I read it, but I 'dunno what to think yet. Will see with AMoL.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The sharpened teeth should be a big clue for us. They are cannibals, obviously. We haven't heard of any culture that practices cannibalism so my guess is that they exist in the Blight, as a civilization undiscovered. It makes sense for them to be cannibals as this would create a culture where only the strongest survive, making them perfect weapons for a future war.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...