Sherlock Holmes Role Madness Mafia Town wins

[csarmi]

As for Thane, I got one name for you: Logan.

[Thane Vakarian]

Logan? Why is that?

 

And Des, as i said, i got lynched D1 yesterday in another game being VT, and there all were convinced i was scum too..... Maybe i don't fit into the regular mafia players handguide and i just have a terrible way to play.... i find that i have to defend myself every single game i play in on D1, and it's quite tiring. 

[Ithillian Turambar]

Well you know, you could always try and give your thoughts and reads on the other players, instead of worrying about defending yourself.

[Ithillian Turambar]

The only Logan I know is the one from Logan's Run.

 

Renew?

[Thane Vakarian]

i don't really see how my thoughts and reads on other players might prevent a lynch on me. If some people don't like what i type, i'll get lynched for that anyways... If you don't buy my claim, why would you buy my reads?

[Ithillian Turambar]

So ... You're basically saying that you don't want to help Town find Mafia.

 

Or maybe you are Mafia and don't want any reads to help us find your team?

 

The second one I can understand - the first one not so much.

[Ithillian Turambar]

You see, if you're Town your being quite selfish in thinking that way. It's not all about preventing your own Lynch. If you get Lynched and are Town, then the game goes on and your team can still win.

 

If you're Mafia then not helping Town makes sense and of course you just want to live.

[Thane Vakarian]

as i said to Des, it's getting quite tiring always having to go against the majority on D1. Up to a point where i think that town might not deserve to win. But that wouldn't be fair. *shrugs* I'll list some thought in my next post

[hazelkrs1]

first: congrats Des, your first?

 

second: i've been reading my notifications and the dogpile on me is getting bigger. Still for shady reasons.

 

i've got better things to do than jump in here all the time when people demand i say something. 

 

i randomly picked Tina, which should've been obvious with the eeny meenie thing  *shrugs*

 

unvote dice

 

vote Mynd

 

no idea why you're ok lynching town. Taking advantage of an existing train imo. Ithi needs to stop her bulldogging on nonscum. If she won't listen, then she's a candidate as well. 

 

I also fail to see why i get all the crap for saying i'm not scum, and Pral is getting away softclaiming a town PR and doesn't get any further investigation.

 

Then there are so many people not posting in this game, maybe they all sit back, let townies fight and kill eachother, and they come in later for the NK.

 

Mynd, Ithi, and then, yes, i said it before, in the lurkers you will find scum more than likely.

 

questions? i might or might not answer... depends on who asks

 

I have an adorable six year old daughter, thanks for asking

 

As for the rest of your post, yeesh. Moar AtE in first part, randomly picking people instead of actually, you know, SCUMHUNTING, trying to act like you're conftown or something, this whole thing just reeks. And then trying to act tough guy in last part, when you've been AtEing nonstop... that's just gross dude.

 

guys, is it possible for thane to have a role that would allow him to have info about the game settings ?

 

Like Turin said, considering this came AFTER he claimed to have no special abilities, just makes me think Chae was stretching hardcore to save a teammate

 

Hallia, dawn, BFG, Pral.... all absent, not helping that they are not posting. Still think that Pral could do with some investigating after his claim.

 

Len: Chae could be right, but wrong as well.... haven't made up my mind yet.

 

Then Tsuki and Turin: townleans on both of them for their gameplay.

 

How is it no one has taken Thane to task for trying to direct the Cop? This is just a horrendously scummy thing for Thane to do here, yet I haven't seen a single person mention it.

 

Incidentally, while catching up I figured that if Thane flipped scum, that would spew Pray as town considering how hard Thane kept trying to redirect focus there, but with this post it's possible newbscum!Thane was trying to direct a view towards a GF (Pray in this scenario). He DID mention the scum having a GF, could be a TMI slip.

 

Seriously - if getting voted on D1 demotivates you then you maybe need to find another game.

 

If you are Town - you surely want Town to win. That means you ignore all the stuff you don't like and keep trying to help Town win.

 

Do you understand?

 

I once asked to be a treestump because I always die early game and I wanted to keep on posting and helping.

 

Even though I was dead and gone.

 

It's not about you. Especially if you are really VT. That's the best role in the game but maybe you sulking cos you wanted a 'cool' role. You could have been pushing and poking and stirring and instead you went off in a strop.

 

Kinda offtopic somewhat, but eh Ithi don't feel this is a great analogy- you LOVED being a Treestump. Obviously you love helping your team win and everything, but I also think you just like playing the game and talking in general. Not being able to vote was a small price to pay for continuing to influence the game.

 

Point is, I think you were smart to ask for Treestump, not making a sacrifice or anything

 

 

Likely 'cause I didn't feel the best last night.  I got up bright and early just for y'all.

 

 

Thane - Upon reread, I see what people were saying about Thane, with his flipflopping regarding Csarmi's claim

 

Pral - Null, with it being rolemadness it's likely we all have a PR, isn't it?

 

Chae, Don't find her overtly scummy.  Her defense of Thane wasn't a big thing to me, and also her asking about it being dangerous to claim a PR (As Csarmi later pointed out) seemed sincere.  With her being a newer player it's likely she's never played a rolemadness game.

 

Dawn  - She's just Dawn -.-

 

 

Considering how long we had waited for some reads Hallia, I don't think I'm the only one who's disappointed by these. You "see what people were saying" about Thane, then a null read on Pray and Dawn, and then some soft defense of Chae.

 

I'm sorry, but I am not impressed by your performance

 

/GSP'd

 

 

Tsuki - Very aggressive for D1, good feels from him, although picking at Chael over some sentence structure when she isn't a native English speaker seems a bit much.

 

X- Not sure, he's involved, and that's good, but I haven't developed feelings for him, you, or dice one way or the other yet.  On page 9

 

 

The soft defense of X here also makes me feel uncomfortable. I haven't seen much of him lately except whyme fryme, doesn't seem that involved to me.

 

 

Tina - The game only had 11 pages, and you sheeped?

 

X - Read one of Des's WoT (Gasp right? XD )

 

I missed where he said 'It's day 1, and we're on page 5, it's way to early to read into things'

 

Bleeehhhhhh.

 

It's a tossup between tina and X right now.

 

 

 

And y'know, Thane as well.

 

Pfft.

 

"Oh yeah, forgot I'm 'sposed to distance from Thane! Whoops! "

 

 

Wary of Turin pushing that there could be exactly one VT. Sounds like a good way to mislynch all but one of the vanillas.

I think I said it first - so strange that you would suspect Turin and not me. It is quite a standard thing btw.

 

Role Madness will have 1 true vanilla Town.

 

If there's someone else with it then one of them is lying.

 

 

Sad that Ithi was I believe the first to act like we had mod confirmation that there would def be ONE VT. SMH.

 

i have no idea what oracle is (so if someone can explain it could be nice)

 

and for now beside Lenlo, i don"t have "scum" reads.

 

I pointed stuff that i found weird but it is not enough for me to tell that those people are scum. I gave town reads a couple of posts ago. People who are not read as being town for me are suspicious.

 

Not to be harsh, but if you're new in mafia.... why not just google the role names yourself? That way you don't have to wait for someone else to be merciful and help you out

 

If you're scum just trying to play up your newbness, then eh carry on

 

 

Is why it is called role madness. Everyone has a special unique role. Even VT is a special unique role.  Interesting that you didn't know that. 

 

I wonder who else might not have known that. If a mafia team all didn't realize it then they might think it was safest to claim vanilla to prevent getting cc'ed. 

 

Thane Why would you think that the specific roles you mentioned were in the game. I mean GF on a mafia team would be expected in just about any game. JOAT is a fairly uncommon role, and 3rd party is fairly common. Maybe not multiple ones however. 

even though i'm unexperienced in a role madness game, i have encountered JOAT before and i would highly suspect roles like that in such a game. And having one on each side would balance things.

 

 

So lemme get this straight. Last game I play with you, you're all "Dunno what I'm doing LOL!", and then one game later, you think you got enough experience to start speculating on setup???

 

Yeah not buying it, not for one second.

 

 

Why is Len mafia?

 

Why did you say "scum"? Why put the word inside speech marks like that?

 

Because when speech marks are used like that it means you know that what you're saying isn't real.

because he plays like mafia would play in my opinion

 

and the "marks" ... well i used them because beside Lenlo, i don't have scum reads.

as i said i am suspicious of some people. but that doesn't make them all scummy

 

 

 

 

@Chae - so what about Len? Anything in particular stands oit?

 

I can't iso from phone.

no nothing particular ... just a general opinion.

 

 

So you have ONE scumread, and no actual reasoning or conviction on that ONE read.

 

 

Yup. I think she believes what she's saying.

 

Oh come on dude. You should know that even if someone IS town (which I highly doubt in Chae's case), they don't actually have any clue whether or not someone else is scum. Your town read on her, or belief in her, should NOT have led to you immediately sheeping her.

 

In fact, I can't even recall Csarmi ever before using this playstyle- just sheeping his town reads like that.

 

no idea how to get her to play.... maybe get some bananas in here.

 

On the other hand: I said it before.... where's Pral? he soft claimed a town PR, and now he's gone under the radar.... 

 

Moar pleading for everyone to look at Pray, without actually having something good to have such conviction over.

 

 

no  im not claiming VT.  my thinking has been that yes there is always one non powered role in a madness game. i thought that role was innocent child.

No. there is one VT in a Role Madness game. there are several roles available that might not have any actions associated with them. Passive roles  but roles none the less. 

 

 

Therefore, since the Dice cc is not happening it is actually a small point toward Thane being town. I would expect the actual VT to step up and cc as it would be well worth trading a VT for a mafia.

 

something on VT and role madness from the wiki. 

 

 http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Role_madness

 

 

Yeahhhhhhh....... I looked there, and nowhere did it say that a role madness game HAS to have one VT, or even that everyone HAS to have a unique role.

 

In fact, it looked to me like the only actual qualifier was that the game have less or no VT's, which incidentally coincides with my idea of a role madness game.

 

So def don't see why everyone went with the assumption that there can only be one VT in a role madness game... unless this is some kind of bizarre Highlander world or something.

 

BFG you realise that by doing that if we lynch thane and he flips town you are probably next right??

 

Overall I was getting some good vibes from Dice the last few pages, but this post right here just made me go

 

 

@Mynd, I do not fully believe the Miller Claim. I have previously explained that I believe Csarmi is actually the perfect one to make such a claim as it would abuse his meta to an awesome degree. He claimed on his first or second post. Basically everyone came out and said "I don't think Csarmi would pull a move like that." The cop isn't going to view him as it would serve no purpose. So unless there is a LD in this game then we are stuck with just accepting his claim. If he was an obvious townie to date then maybe it could fly but his play has not been remarkably townie to me either. Especially the last vote onto Len. It is a blatant sheep vote of a vote that was self admitted as not having any real reason from Chae.

 

 Let me ask you this, if he hadn't claimed Miller what would your opinion of his play be?

 

The thing about mafia is that we can never be 100% sure who is town and who is scum.  All we can really do is try and sort people by "more likely" and "less likely" scum based on posts, events, and good ol' fashioned logic. 

 

Csarmi could be a big fat LLL with pants on fire, but based on game experience and (gasp!) csarmi's playstyle, a lot of folks have placed him in the less likely scum list, myself included.  The thing about a miller role is it can be one of the toughest to play.  Sure, this could all be one big elaborate gambit, but it is unlikely. 

 

The fact that he made the miller claim is a very important part of why many of us have placed Csarmi in the less likely sort. Take that away, I would be just as suspicious of him as most other folks in the game. 

 

What we need to do on D1 is lynch the candidate that will get us the most info.  Lynching a claimed miller kinda defeats the purpose of his claim if he is pro-town.  Lynching Csarmi simply because he might mabye sorta could possibly be a LLL is not a good D1 decision.  If this were D3 and his hands had been bloody on a few townie lynches, then I would find his claim more suspect. 

 

 

Although Mynd has started to ping for me lately, this post seemed pretty reasonable.

 

Catching up from today, feeling really good about BFG.  Her reads are pretty much coinciding with mine.

 

Lol that's easy to say after she CC'ed VT like she did.

 

Not saying that her claim proves Thane to be a LLL (his play does that imo), but she seemed to think it would, so yeah her claiming like she did makes her pretty obvtown to me. You trying to chirp that she seems town for having similar reads looks totally fake to me.

 

 

bolded: i totally agree: I got lynched D1 yesterday in the Buffy game, being VT..... and it looks like it's going to happen once again..... *sighs* for real.....

 

 

 

ah, i see.... well, if he's still around, there's no need to replace him yet i'd say. I don't want to be the new Blackhoof

 

i'll be around a little today, need to get my vacation paid. Kids have too many weeks off if you ask me. I wonder if teachers have the same amount of time off during summer, that'd be great if you have kids of your own.... 

 

This is what I was talking about in regards to Thane's recent behavior. BFG had already claimed at this point, yet Thane just kinda BS's about offtopic stuff instead of actually defend himself, or question BFG's claim, or anything like that.

 

Scum resigned to his fate, imo. Let's get this over with.

[Thane Vakarian]

quick post of thoughts, in general and from memory:

 

1. Thrax: townlean for the moment. solid, well thought of, explanatory posting.
2. Len: no idea... chae's gut feeling is usually right, but i haven't seen anything of him recently to believe he might be scum.
3. Mynd: yeah, still keeping my vote there. Call it bussing, i think there's a scummer right there.
4. Dawn: null, not in the game
5. Tina: started to get more active, which is good.
6. Turin: from what i saw, got a townfeel for him.
7. Despo: mixed feeling about that one. Could be scum, could be town... certainly wants me gone..
8. Hally: not much to go after... would've expected more by now (and not only sheeping on the obv target)
9. Chae: are gut feelings enough for a lynch? i dunno, i doubt it. But gut feelings can be right. Town for you for the moment.
10. Ithi: strongest townread in here.
11. Thane: is even town, yup (even if he has a really odd way to show it)
12. Tsuki: townread for now.
13. Dice: LD impression in this game, though didn't like the interaction with BFG.

14. Charis/BFG: Comes in with a focus on the obvious target, being me. Get the feeling she's going for an easy lynch with me. Scummy tingle.
15. Pral:made a few posts, soft claimed town PR, then vanished. Doubt it has to do with DM weekend 
16. Salami: claimed miller fast: Follows Chae without further investigation.... have some problems buying his story

[hazelkrs1]

@Des - I'm not going to put in much #work. Which I actually did say. There is no "men" attitude its just that my time and my health puts hard limits on me.

 

 

As for Thane, I got one name for you: Logan.

 

I don't really think the play between the two players is very similar tbh, but eh

 

Logan? Why is that?

 

And Des, as i said, i got lynched D1 yesterday in another game being VT, and there all were convinced i was scum too..... Maybe i don't fit into the regular mafia players handguide and i just have a terrible way to play.... i find that i have to defend myself every single game i play in on D1, and it's quite tiring. 

 

Dude, if it turns out you actually ARE town this game, you have no one to blame but yourself. YOU'RE the one who typed words that others found questionable. YOU'RE the one who had such an awkward and poorly timed claim. YOU'RE the one who decided to act all emo about the situation instead of try and find actual scum for town to go after.

 

If you get mislynched this game, freaking learn from it, instead of acting all woe is me about the situation. Ask for a mentor. Observe others and how they handle pressure, etc. Sad that I have to say this kind of thing so often.

 

When I first started playing, people found me scummy ALL THE TIME. I learned how to use it to my advantage, or fix the things that got me lynched.

 

Well you know, you could always try and give your thoughts and reads on the other players, instead of worrying about defending yourself.

 

THIS.

 

The only Logan I know is the one from Logan's Run.

 

Renew?

 

It's a cat that plays mafia on Vendetta Strada. Sort of a hyperactive EP that gets more emo and combusts moar easily.

 

i don't really see how my thoughts and reads on other players might prevent a lynch on me. If some people don't like what i type, i'll get lynched for that anyways... If you don't buy my claim, why would you buy my reads?

 

[csarmi]

Despo we're talking about a player who genuinely believes (and I know this for a fact) that claiming town makes you so. And what you quoted above.

 

How do you deal with that? I have no idea how to read that properly.

 

How did Cory read that?

 

Just lynch every game until he learns better?

[Thane Vakarian]

Well, i try to make the best of it, but it seems like nobody ever believes a thing i say. For example, i remember the OuaT game where i figured out the scum quite early, but the game took a long time before solving because nobody believed what i tried to say.

 

If nobody believes what i say or type, then why bother? I don't have to convince myself, just all you stubborn, silly people with your ideas on how to play mafia. If i don't fit into the general idea of how to play, then yeah....

 

unvote

 

vote Thane

 

get this over with so it's done. I've given my reads, use them as you will (or not). I'm not scum resigned to it's fate, i've just had it with getting pounced on on D1. I'll finish my other game on the Mafia games board and will not annoy you people again. Even in that game, i was main lynch train D1 and i'm the bloody cop in that one. And if you call me emo, then you're right. I'm seriously fed up right now. 

[Ithillian Turambar]

Cats can play Mafia?

 

I'm feeling very dubious about Mynd. He did seem very happy to be nudging the Thane lynch along - while at the same time saying it was a weak reasoned one.

 

He said Turin and Tsuki were doing a better job - but then stayed away from X.

 

The 'funny' memes seem to be there to suggest how non threatening he is.

 

Dice's conversation about innocent child is weird. The Mod will confirm an innocent child as town and it's totally different from a VT.

[csarmi]

Thane you aren't supposed to talk about other ongoing games ever. That's a very serious offence.

[Ithillian Turambar]

Get a grip Thane.

 

Deadline isn't till Tuesday.

 

All this AtE is making me wonder if I wasn't right to start with about you.

[Thane Vakarian]

everybody who reads the thread sees i claimed already, so the info is out in the open. And basically i don't care anymore

[Ithillian Turambar]

quick post of thoughts, in general and from memory:

 

1. Thrax: townlean for the moment. solid, well thought of, explanatory posting.

2. Len: no idea... chae's gut feeling is usually right, but i haven't seen anything of him recently to believe he might be scum.

3. Mynd: yeah, still keeping my vote there. Call it bussing, i think there's a scummer right there.

4. Dawn: null, not in the game

5. Tina: started to get more active, which is good.

6. Turin: from what i saw, got a townfeel for him.

7. Despo: mixed feeling about that one. Could be scum, could be town... certainly wants me gone..

8. Hally: not much to go after... would've expected more by now (and not only sheeping on the obv target)

9. Chae: are gut feelings enough for a lynch? i dunno, i doubt it. But gut feelings can be right. Town for you for the moment.

10. Ithi: strongest townread in here.

11. Thane: is even town, yup (even if he has a really odd way to show it)

12. Tsuki: townread for now.

13. Dice: LD impression in this game, though didn't like the interaction with BFG.

14. Charis/BFG: Comes in with a focus on the obvious target, being me. Get the feeling she's going for an easy lynch with me. Scummy tingle.

15. Pral:made a few posts, soft claimed town PR, then vanished. Doubt it has to do with DM weekend

16. Salami: claimed miller fast: Follows Chae without further investigation.... have some problems buying his story

This seems a reasonable list. I see you flip floppped back onto me being Town again. Is that because I'm not voting you anymore?

[Myndrunner]

 

 

ok, skimming is bad: i missed BFG's claim there. Seeing it's a hard claim, i will give you my name too: i'm Irene Adler. And i'm still town.

 

Could it be Two townies in a game? Or is it IMPOSSIBLE to have 2 VT's in a role madness game? After all, it's the mod who gives out roles to his/her liking. I seriously get the feeling that everybody plays 'how it was and how it should be' instead of 'what are the real possibilities'.

 

I'm terribly sorry, but there is no FRIGGEN way that Irene Alder is vanilla town.  Oh quite the contrary.

 

second bolded is perfect example for first bolded....

 

 

Sure, it is possible that a game built around the Sherlock Holmes mythology would have Irene Adler as a vanilla town, but it is also possible that the sun will explode today.  It is very unlikely, but it might. 

 

Claiming to be Irene Adler in a Sherlock Mafia game is the equivalent of claiming to be Catwoman in a Batman mafia game.  There is too much history between her and Mr. Holmes for her to be vanilla town.  She is either scum or some kind of third party character. 

 

She would be a terrible fake claim as well. 

 

So yeah, there is nothing wrong with playing on how it should be or supposed to be AND playing what is possible......but to use the good detectives own words,

 

When you eliminate the impossible, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truth.

 

...and now my follow-up to that would be, sort information into likely and unlikely using logic.  Go with the choice that seems most logical because it likely is the truth.

[csarmi]

Never heard of this woman so I read the wiki now.

 

I disagree with Mynd, she could easily be a lot of roles, VT included.

 

Relying on char claims is a bad idea BTW.

[Myndrunner]

Never heard of this woman so I read the wiki now.

 

I disagree with Mynd, she could easily be a lot of roles, VT included.

 

Relying on char claims is a bad idea BTW.

 

I'll address the irony of the bold in a moment, Mr. Miller.

 

Again, it is possible she would be VT, but highly unlikely.  She is a character DEEP in the Sherlock Holmes mythology and a devious one.  Mrs. Hudson would be a likely VT character, but not Irene "Black Widow" Adler.  I can almost hear the character herself scoffing at the notion that she would be vanilla in any game. 

 

This is Irene Adler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utwenXbh9hA  (SPOILER!)

 

This is also Irene Adler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1hcFQzeq_Q  (NSFW)

 

Now then, we have moved you to the not likely scum list BECAUSE of your role claim.  It is all possible that you are a LLL, but unlikely.  The best course of action is to go with the move that gives us the most information.  You claim Miller in your first post.  We could lynch you to prove you are telling the truth, but that would be a waste if you indeed flipped as you said.  Anyone who has had a miller role should understand that there are only a handful of ways to play it, and coming clean on D1 is extremely pro-town.

 

As far as relying on character claims, sure anything goes and nothing is certain, but when the goal is to seek out what is likely over what is unlikely, it can be useful. A WOT game would likely make Rand al'Thor a powered town player, or at the very least, vanilla town.   Graendal, on the other hand, would not likely be a vanilla town at all, would she?  Even Lanfear would likely be something other than vanilla town. 

[Niniel]

@ Thane - as far as I can remember, Pral is rarely on DM on weekends.

 

Selfvoters get no sympathy from me.

[csarmi]

Where's the irony?

 

Why are you mixing up char claims with role claims?

 

Also my wiki said that character only appears in one work (bohemian stuff) and is mentioned in passing at a few places as Holmes would be admiring her. Why that would fix her char to a role, I dunno.

 

As for your WoT example... I wouldn't hesitate to make Lanfear vanilla town in my game.

[Myndrunner]

Where's the irony?

 

Why are you mixing up char claims with role claims?

 

Also my wiki said that character only appears in one work (bohemian stuff) and is mentioned in passing at a few places as Holmes would be admiring her. Why that would fix her char to a role, I dunno.

 

As for your WoT example... I wouldn't hesitate to make Lanfear vanilla town in my game.

 

Its the same reasoning. Many of us have ruled you out (for now) because of your miller claim.  I am ruling Thane likely scum more because Irene Adler is a likely scum character.

 

It is possible for Irene Adler to be vanilla town, but unlikely.  Sure, based on what happens with Lanfear, I can see her as VT, but Graendal was clearly not so much.  In Holmes mythology, Adler was one of his greatest adversaries.  What is the point of having a themed game if it isn't based on the mythology?

 

So, it is unlikely that Irene Adler is VT.

 

I'm a huge fan of Sherlock Holmes, but I had to look up my char as well. 

[Ithillian Turambar]

I read the wiki too - it don't say anything about her being a major adversary. She had an affair with some prince and he hired Holmes to get a compromising photo - but she outwitted him and left a photo of herself there.

 

Which was the only thing he asked for in payment for the job.

 

He admires her and she's apparently the only woman he had feelings for.

 

Maybe her role got sexed up for some tv show or film.