Lewis therein balefire dragonmont creation

[Redbranch]

Therein calls down a huge stream of balefire in book one to make dragon mount. Shouldn't some of his family been restored?

[Byzantine279]

It wasn't balefire.

[Hopefire]

It wasn't balefire. It was pure One Power overload.

[Stitch]

Just a whole bunch of the one power... given that it created a mountain (rather than a massive lake/lava flow/gigantic tornado that gouged out a valley etc) I would assume LTT was really gifted in Earth, however we havent really seen an earth power gift in Rand (unless happy rand's tree blossoming counts)

[WhiskyJack]

"The air turned to fire, the fire to light liquefied. The bolt that struck from the heavens would have seared and blinded any eye that glimpsed it, even for an instant."

 

 

 

Sounds like lightning bolt. You cannot balefire yourself.

[Hopefire]

Just a whole bunch of the one power... given that it created a mountain (rather than a massive lake/lava flow/gigantic tornado that gouged out a valley etc) I would assume LTT was really gifted in Earth, however we havent really seen an earth power gift in Rand (unless happy rand's tree blossoming counts)

I think that it was a matter of pure energy just zapping the earth, vaporizing the rock beneath him, straight through the earth's crust. Not a matter of earth (the power) at all; just an amazing amount of energy.

 

 

It actually got me thinking though. Channeling the One Power is forbidden in the Pit of Doom, upon pain of death. The One Power, drawn from the True Source, drives the Wheel of Time and the Pattern. The Dark One's prison is a tear in the pattern. I can't help but wonder if use of the One Power in the Pit of Doom, potentially even just holding it, causes the Pattern to start to knit back together. Perhaps the final thing needed to seal the Dark One's prison shut again will be Rand telling Nynaeve/Moiraine (or whoever is with him at the time) to get the heck out of Dodge, while he draws in everything he can through Callandor. Since Callandor isn't buffered, the resulting amount of One Power he could draw would essentially wipe Shayol Ghul off of the map.

 

Not even my craziest theory!

[Demon_AS]

Just a whole bunch of the one power... given that it created a mountain (rather than a massive lake/lava flow/gigantic tornado that gouged out a valley etc) I would assume LTT was really gifted in Earth, however we havent really seen an earth power gift in Rand (unless happy rand's tree blossoming counts)

I'd be interested to know whether channelers retain their inherent strengths in the Power, as well the spark to channel in every life.

 

There has been plenty of evidence that Rand's strengths lie with Spirit and Fire. But Rand Sedai may well be strong with all 5 powers (we are dealing with the strongest and best male channeler in existence) :).

[Zentari]

I'd be interested to know whether channelers retain their inherent strengths in the Power, as well the spark to channel in every life.

 

There has been plenty of evidence that Rand's strengths lie with Spirit and Fire. But Rand Sedai may well be strong with all 5 powers (we are dealing with the strongest and best male channeler in existence) :).

Well, considering that Lanfear's reduction in capacity was from the Fins,as was Moiraine's,as well as the ability to channel with the same strength while in the opposite gender's body, one can deduce that all the body has is an on/off gene.

 

Presumably then , the strength would remain the same.The ability to channel though could be quirky, if it's not an Age of channeling ,chances are that the body you are in would be incapable even though your soul is.

 

For Rand's strengths , I recall the Dragon being strong in all elements so yeah,he was strong even before VoG.Personal preferences are another matter.

[Awakened]

 

It actually got me thinking though. Channeling the One Power is forbidden in the Pit of Doom, upon pain of death.

 

Where was this written? Not doubting, but I would like to look it up.

[noynaert@gmail.com]

 

It actually got me thinking though. Channeling the One Power is forbidden in the Pit of Doom, upon pain of death.

 

Where was this written? Not doubting, but I would like to look it up.

 

Just about every time we see one of the Chosen in the Pit they have thoughts about how channeling there or even embracing the source would mean instant death.

[Aliriel]

 

It actually got me thinking though. Channeling the One Power is forbidden in the Pit of Doom, upon pain of death.

 

Where was this written? Not doubting, but I would like to look it up.

 

Just about every time we see one of the Chosen in the Pit they have thoughts about how channeling there or even embracing the source would mean instant death.

 

I remember Moggy stating something like this, can't remember the book though, it also had SH walking under the DO'd "teeth" easily but Moggy having to eventually crawl on her belly to get under them if that helps spark someones memory.

 

A.

[Redbranch]

Found a quote from RJ

 

 

Letter to Tom McCormick from RJ - November/December 1993

 

Tom McCormick: Please find out if Lews Therin balefired himself in the prologue in The Eye of the World, or if he just drew too much of the One Power. If it isn't critical to the continuing plot, I'm sure he'll say.

RJ: Lews Therin did not use balefire on himself; he simply drew as much of the One Power as he could, then kept on pulling it in.

 

 

Guess that answers it!

[mb]

Like others told Lews Therin's death was not balefire; just an overload of the One Power.

 

I take Earth + Fire created Dragonmount.

 

 

About channeling at Shayol Ghul (and thus Pit of Doom), that is True Power.

 

About Rand & the trees, I guess that would be Water or a combination containing Water.

[PastorDeSemolaDeGranoDuro]

The volcano he created probably would have been enough to create its own lightning storm although I'm fairly certain the bolt was Power oriented. I wonder whether or not Dragonmount will erupt like a traditional volcano at any stage. A nice pyroclastic flow off that hill would be a big concern for any resident of Tar Valon. Since it hasn't happened (as far as I am aware anyway) for 3000 years it would have to be due to pop its top.

[Hopefire]

Like others told Lews Therin's death was not balefire; just an overload of the One Power.

 

I take Earth + Fire created Dragonmount.

 

 

About channeling at Shayol Ghul (and thus Pit of Doom), that is True Power.

 

About Rand & the trees, I guess that would be Water or a combination containing Water.

I don't think that specific flows were used in the creation of Dragonmount. Not a matter of fire and earth, but just raw power overloading in a completely uncontrolled and undifferentiated burst of pure energy. Rand and the trees I believe were a matter of Rand being a ta'veren that now only produces good effects, and whose good effects are basically turbocharged. It wasn't Rand channeling; it was the Pattern correcting itself and ensuring that the village supported by the orchard would survive.

 

 

The earliest mention of channeling in the Pit of Doom and its environs occurs in Lord of Chaos; Demandred notes in the prologue that on the slopes of Shayol Ghul, only a fool would appear ready to channel. The second is also in the Lord of Chaos prologue; Semirhage is musing about Shaidar Haran and notes "Had channeling there not been a sure way to die, she would have destroyed the Halfman, or traveled from the pit itself." Finally, also in the Lord of Chaos prologue, Osan'gar notes that channeling around Shayol Ghul can be dangerous, but figures that Aran'gar doing something stupid was more dangerous, and reached for saidin - not the True Power.

 

The only other trip to the Pit of Doom that's been referenced that I can think of, that of Moghedien, also touched on how channeling in the Pit of Doom is effectively a death sentence. Still: three separate characters in the Lord of Chaos prologue specifically mention how its dangerous to channel the One Power in Shayol Ghul, with special emphasis placed on the Pit of Doom itself.

 

The Dark One really doesn't want the One Power used around him.

[solarz]

I just recently started re-reading EOTW, and the where I wasn't terribly impressed with the Prologue in my first few read throughs, this time I enjoyed it very much.

 

Standing out in particular is the death scene of Lews Therin. I was impressed with how well it followed physical/geological principles.

 

At first, the description of "liquid fire" made me think of balefire as well, but then the text mentions that stone and earth turned to vapor. This tells us that it wasn't balefire. Remember that balefire erases something from the pattern, as if it never was. Whatever is hit by balefire simply vanishes, while "turning into vapor" suggests a powerful thermal reaction.

 

The column of liquid fire bore through the mantle of the earth and created a conduit for the magma underneath to spew forth: that's how volcanoes in real life are created. Dragonmount is a volcano.

 

However, it did make me wonder: why *didn't* LTT balefire himself? It could have restored his wife and kids. Perhaps balefiring oneself is physically impossible?

[mb]

Long ago I speculated one way::

Do a Gateway to directly behind you then channel the weaves through that Gateway.

 

Though there is at least this problem with that::

We do not know whether weaves can go through a Gateway; unless Towers of Midnight showed an attempt.

[mbuehner]

We do not know whether weaves can go through a Gateway; unless Towers of Midnight showed an attempt.

 

Back when Elayne almost killed everybody inexplicably trying to unravel a gateway weave on the way out of the Kin farm, wasn't there some channeling done by Aviedha (and possibly others) when the Seanchan showed up on the other side? I definitely recall Birgette shooting arrows through but i'm not sure about the channeling.

[Manscher]

In chapter 54 "To Caemlyn", after Rahvin kills Aviendha and Mat and Rands open the gate way to Rahvin in rage, it states

 

"Sending fire and lightning ahead of him, he stepped through and let the gateway close behind him. He was death"

 

Seems pretty clear to me that Rand threw fireballs and what not through the gateway, before stepping through it and into the hall that Rahvin and his pets were staying in.