First Time Reading the First Book

[David Selig]

I am all for Perrin bashing, but in fairness to him, let's not forget that Egwene is supposed to be Rand's girlfriend, they are almost engaged. I really don't see what's sexist about Perrin not liking it when she started to blatantly flirt with some handsome guy she met 5 minutes ago, after all Rand's a close friend of Perrin.

 

He's been chased by Trollocs ever since he left the village, he's been assured by an Aes Sedai the Dark One himself wants to get him, which was confirmed by his own weird dreams, so of course he is worried and frustrated that the Tinkers are moving so slowly and are so calm. If I were in his position, I'd have been overly paranoid and nervous too.

[csarmi]

Egwene is not only supposed to be Rand's girlfriend, she is, too (not to mention the only reason they aren't engaged yet is because Bel Tine was ruined).

[David Selig]

I said supposed to, because for all the talk about it, Rand and Egwene really don't act like they are in a real relationship, except in some rare moments, at least IMO. They barely ever talked in TEOTW from what I recall. Of course, with the Trollocs, Fades and all that they had other things to worry about at the time. ;)

[Suttree]

Egwene is not only supposed to be Rand's girlfriend, she is, too (not to mention the only reason they aren't engaged yet is because Bel Tine was ruined).

 

I never really got that indication at all. Yes things were setting up to go that direction before they left the TR, there was an attraction and they were planning on dancing together at the festival. I'm know there was talk between the parents about a potential match but what makes you think that she was his gf let alone that they were to be engaged on Bel Tine night? Apologies if I am forgetting, it has been some time since I read tEoTW.

[Sleeper]

Egwene is not only supposed to be Rand's girlfriend, she is, too (not to mention the only reason they aren't engaged yet is because Bel Tine was ruined).

 

I never really got that indication at all. Yes things were setting up to go that direction before they left the TR, there was an attraction and they were planning on dancing together at the festival. I'm know there was talk between the parents about a potential match but what makes you think that she was his gf let alone that they were to be engaged on Bel Tine night? Apologies if I am forgetting, it has been some time since I read tEoTW.

I can't quote any specific lines, but on my latest reread I think I remember Egwene thinking of Rand as if they're in a relationship at least until midway through TGH. She mentioned she wanted to bond him a couple of times, and there were the scenes inside the rings.

[Pantherus]

I always thought of them as having like an arranged marriage of sorts, it was always expected they'd hook up (kinda head-cheerleader and captain of the football team type stuff), they just hadn't got around to it yet - remember Rand wasn't in town often...

[Erunion]

Yeah, it always seemed to me like a not-really arranged marriage - everyone thought they were going to get married, including them. It's just what was going to happen, everyone saw it coming and the parents certainly pushed in that direction.

And then a bunch of Trollocs attacked, just in time to mess everything up!

[Luckers]

I really don't know how to make this any clearer--next person to make a rude or derogatory post will get a seven day ban.

 

Who made a rude or derogatory comment after your last warning?

 

I removed the comment in question.

[csarmi]

Very silent here :)

[Suttree]

Yeah, it always seemed to me like a not-really arranged marriage - everyone thought they were going to get married, including them. It's just what was going to happen, everyone saw it coming and the parents certainly pushed in that direction.

And then a bunch of Trollocs attacked, just in time to mess everything up!

 

Yeah thats how I read it, in terms of expectations from the community on what was going to happen between the two. They certainly don't act like a couple that has been seriously dating in EotW though nor do I recall any talk of engagement on Bel Tine night.

[Agitel]

Yeah, it always seemed to me like a not-really arranged marriage - everyone thought they were going to get married, including them. It's just what was going to happen, everyone saw it coming and the parents certainly pushed in that direction.

And then a bunch of Trollocs attacked, just in time to mess everything up!

 

Yeah thats how I read it, in terms of expectations from the community on what was going to happen between the two. They certainly don't act like a couple that has been seriously dating in EotW though nor do I recall any talk of engagement on Bel Tine night.

 

I assume that it wasn't necessarily arranged but that it was obvious to the townspeople they were both crushing on each other and everyone just assumed they were to be married, especially with them coming of marriageable age at the same time.

[dholm]

It is stated outright at some point -- they never said the words before the Wisdom that would cause them to be engaged, but after Egwene began following Rand around when they were younger, Tam and Marin talked together and afterwards everyone treated them as if they were engaged.

[Always Sunny]

Hey, everybody! I've got another blog post up. We're getting into some good chapters, here. Well, I think so. Hope you're enjoying everything today!

 

 

If that's a problem, let me know.

 

Psht, no problem at all!

 

Where, may I ask, have you seen any indication that women are considered anything less?

 

Here's the thing. I haven't seen it one way or the other. In your response/essay (I agree with the others: very good & supported points and very well-written!) you cite facts that I've never seen to back up your interpretation of the quotes you provided. I can only assume that this information comes from later books and I don't have access to that information. I can't deny what you say, in other words.

 

Since I don't have that future knowledge I have to fill in the gaps I see with something else. That something else is the real world. I've been operating under the assumption that this is exactly like the real world unless otherwise stated. Human beings have two eyes, the sun rises in the east, the Mayor is an elected position in charge of a city, and so on. In the real world, most rural local governments have one governing body, not two separated by gender. So until the text outright tells me that the Women's Circle is a co-equal political entity in charge of domestic affairs I'll assume that it is something else (since the town already has a government in the form of the Village Council).

 

So where have I seen indication that women are considered anything less? I see it in a Village Council without women, see it in a temporary military without women, and a traditional farming village with women in the homes and men in the fields. Does that make any sense to ya'll? I see no female dominance outside of wives henpecking their husbands and a young bellicose Wisdom angry at not being taken seriously because of her age. So with no real dominance (as in an authority figure giving orders or something like that) shown I infer that women aren't dominant. That means equal or less. So no women on the Council, no women peddlers or gleemen or ferry operators, all that means "not equal." There is only one other option left.

 

It doesn't affect them, not in the way you believe it does, not anymore than it does the men, and that's what I mean when you've misread all the interactions between characters in a story.

 

I can definitely see this to be true. But I've just written it off at bad writing. Something that would piss off a normal person is just ignored by these characters. Getting convinced to leave your home by a wizard belonging to a group you think destroyed the world? That should piss you off, especially when she says you have to leave now and can't say goodbye to your families. Being told that wizards never lie but then finding out that Moiraine and Lan go by aliases in Baerlon? That should raise an eyebrow. Covering two Whitecloaks in mud for no reason? Rand should have said something. There are more examples where characters do things to advance the plot and not because it would be what a normal human being would do. So I assume the same thing applies to their reactions to abuse and belittling back home.

 

You keep reiterating that you've no evidence that the Women's Circle has any influence, but I'd like to go back to the opening chapters of The Eye of the World.

 

"What are we going to do about Nynaeve, al'Thor?" Congar demanded. "We can't have a Wisdom like that for Emond's Field."

 

Tam sighed heavily. "It's not our place, Wit. The Wisdom is women's buisness."

 

"Well, we'd better do something, al'Thor. She said we'd have a mild winter. And a good harvest. Now you ask her what she hears on the wind, and she just scowls at you and stomps off."

 

"If you asked her the way you usually do, Wit," Tam said patiently, "you're lucky she didn't thump you with that stick she carries. Now if you don't mind, this brandy--"

 

"Nynaeve al'Meara is just too young to be Wisdom, al'Thor. If the Women's Circle won't do something, then the village council has to."

 

"What business of yours is the Wisdom, Wit Congar?" roared a woman's voice. Wit flinched as his wife marched out of the house. Daise Congar was twice as wide as Wit, a hard faced woman without an ounce of fat on her. She glared at him with her fists on her hips. "You try meddling in Women's Circle business, and see how you like eating your own cooking. Which you won't do in my kitchen. And washing your clothes and making your own bed. Which won't be under my roof.

 

"But, Daise," Wit whined, "I was just. . . ."

 

"If you'll pardon me, Daise," Tam said."

 

...

 

The first part that you bolded (Embolded? What is the right word?) is Tam telling Wit that who picks the Wisdom is Women's Circle business. I agree. But it doesn't explain what the Women's Circle is or even what a Wisdom is. We learn that the Wisdom is a healer/meteorologist and the head of the Women's Circle. Thus we can infer only that the Women's Circle has the same power as a hospital medical board, nothing more (not from that quote). It isn't the Village Council's place to choose the head of the Women's Circle/medical board. That's an internal Women's Circle/hospital matter. That doesn't mean that the Women's Circle has more or even equal power to the Village Council. It does imply that the Village Council can't choose the Women's Circle leader, that's all.

 

The second bold text again tells us the men shouldn't get involved in Women's Circle business (whatever that business might be). Here, she says that Wit has no say in choosing the Wisdom. Okay, great. That doesn't mean anything. He doesn't get to say what Master Luhhan teaches Perrin, either because that's blacksmiths' business. Does that mean blacksmiths are a co-equal branch of government?

 

The way I see this place, based only upon what I've read (and real world examples tossed in to fill gaps) is that the Mayor is in charge, he is supported by the Village Council, and together they are in charge of the town. The Women's Circle is some non-political entity, like a religious group (based upon how you folks describe them policing the locals I can see them as Taliban-like morality officers patrolling the streets with a switch looking for impious behavior), that is in charge of spiritual matters (like healing and weather predicting). The Village Council has no say in what goes on with their spiritual matters and if they overstep their bounds then the Daise will kick her henpecked husband to the curb.

 

Any man who meddles is likely to get a good tongue-lashing at the least, perhaps kicked out of his home and made the town fool at the worst (which goes to show some of the political and social power women have in the village).

 

Now, I am quite sure I've read nothing like this in the first two books. Getting chewed out? Sure. But kicked out and made a fool? No one has kicked out anybody. This is one of two things: Either it's from a later book (and thus I can't possibly know it to be true so it'd be unfair to judge my opinions with it in the picture) or it is something you've interpreted from the text. If I were to say that any household argument, no matter who is at fault, would end up with the woman out on the streets then what text do you have that I am wrong? Remember, to fill in the gaps I'm using the real world (whereas I'm sure you are using later books). When nothing is said then I assume it is just like the real world.

 

The women run the home. I don't mean they run the home and then the man comes in and kicks back, declares himself king of the castle, and orders his wife to make a sandwich. That would get him sent to bed without supper or kicked out of his home (treated as a child for acting like one), and if he has a problem with that he has to go through the Woman's Circle to fix it.

 

Again, show this to be true. The only problem that the Woman's Circle has tried to fix was the Egwene and the Two Rivers Boys getting kidnapped by the Aes Sedai. Nynaeve and the other women first deferred to the Village Council to make a decision (political bodies don't wait for others to act first unless it is to get approval or orders; thus, not equal). When that was taking too long they acted in secret (or behind closed doors, at least) to form their own plan. That is all. That is the only thing the Women's Circle has done in nearly 1,500 pages of story. There is nothing, yet, that says that the Women's Circle is in charge of anything. They could have been a book club that was unhappy that the town government wasn't acting fast enough to get their kids so they sent their strongest member to find them. The book club isn't a co-equal branch of government in this scenario but is equally plausible given what I've read so far.

 

I think it's important to stress that the woman is also a co-equal in running the finances of the house. There's no sense that the men are the breadwinners.

 

Please, stress this! That doesn't mean you can prove it. How was Mistress Hightower co-equal in running the ferry business? How did the haulers' wives run the finances of their households (especially after Moiraine sank the ferry and put their menfolk out of work)? What did Mistress al'Vere do besides make honeycakes and bring Rand some soup? What did Daise do but yell at Wit? You can say that the text implies that women are in charge of finance but where is the scene where Daise is sitting at the table with a calculator and a pile of bills, Wit in the other room thinking, "I'm glad menfolk don't have to put up with that headache!"? In fact, it was Master al'Vere doing paperwork in the inn just after the Trolloc attack. He seemed to be the one doing the home finances (or whatever that paperwork was, in the middle of a crisis) while Mistress al'Vere was off doing something else.

 

Again, maybe it is in a later book. But so far, with the information I've got, this isn't true. I don't know what is true. I don't know if the men handle everything, if the women do, if the kids do, or if there is some sort of collectivist society of volunteer accountants that go door to door solving money problems. The text doesn't prove or disprove any of them. So I went with the Real World, again, to fill the gaps.

 

We're talking about small town communities, here, all the businesses are family-oriented, and the role a woman takes is considered no less important in the relationship than that of the man's (and if a man were to tell her so, he'd be kicked out of the house until he either apologizes enough or somehow convinces the Women's Circle he has the right of it). If the women doesn't due her duty, the man has to fill in. If the man doesn't do his duty, he'll be kicked out of the house and the woman will have to fill in.

 

This is about 95% true. In a small community like this then women are absolutely important to survival (I'd say this is true in large communities, too, but whatever). If a woman doesn't pull her weight then someone else has to fill in. True. All true. The thing I take objection to is the fact that the man would be kicked out of the house for not agreeing. Just look at the real world! Women do a great deal of work and are unappreciated for it. Spend all day doing laundry, vacuuming the house, getting groceries, cooking dinner, watching the baby, on the phone getting that damn plumber to get over here and fix that sink before the dripping sound makes us all go insane, and all that stuff? Who cares? It isn't as if she has a job, right? She got to stay home all day!

 

Where does it say that the Women's Circle has the power to keep a person out of his home? I don't remember seeing it anywhere. Maybe I missed it but I don't think so. So it wasn't there and I didn't factor it into my opinion. This very well may have made my opinion wrong (we'll see about that!) but that doesn't mean that I was wrong to come to that conclusion.

 

This might also be the time to address the issue of the braid, which you said was sexist because the men didn't have to do the same. I just have to disagree. The braid confers no sense of gender dominance. It's a statement of pride, a symbol of both culture and tradition. If a woman stopped wearing the braid in the Two Rivers the Women's Circle would disapprove, but they'd be in a righteous fury if a man threw a fit about it, and he'd get a tongue lashing for meddling in women's business. You say that women can be just as involved in enforcing male dominance, but I beg you to show me any example of how this confers dominance to the men in the way it actually plays out in the Two Rivers.

 

The dominance comes in the fact that women must do it and men mustn't. It seems to me to be like the veil or even a burqa. In a culture where two people are equal then they'd have the same style standards. But only the women are forced to wear the braid. In fact, only the women do anything notable. They are the Other, here. Even Perrin comments on this when he and Egwene are leaving the Tinker camp. Egwene has to see help from another woman for help being a woman. Maintaining womanhood takes work! But Perrin just is. He (and most dudes) just live their lives without worrying about braids or "statements of pride" or "symbols of culture and tradition." That's women's business.

 

Now, I'm not unhappy with Egwene for wearing it or not wearing it. She's a big girl and the decision is hers to make. You know, just like the veil in the real world. If a woman wants to wear it then she can. She can wear it and be proud of her culture. That doesn't change the fact that it is, at its fundamental level, a sexist thing. But one of those minor things, you know?

 

Think of it this way: in the real world, in the US, girls wear pink and boys wear blue. This is sexist, sure, but small and easily overlooked. But if girls were forced to wear only pink and boys could wear whatever they want (except pink) then you'd have what we have here with the braid.

 

To pull some more quotes out of the first few chapters.

 

Cenn gave them a sour look. "I've not much good to say about Nynaeve al'Meara. You know that. For one thing, she's too young to-- No matter. The Women's Circle seems to object to the Village Council even talking about their business, though they interfere in our whenever they want to, which is most of the time, or so it seems to--"

 

"Cenn," Tam broke in, "is there a point to this?"

 

Nynaeve shook her head. "So that's why the peddler's wagon stands abandoned. I heard people rushing to meet it, but I couldn't leave Mistress Ayellin till her fever broke. The Council is questioning the peddler about what's happening in Ghealdan, are they? If I know them, they're asking all the wrong questions and none of the right ones. It will take the Women's Circle to find out anything useful." Settling her cloak firmly on her shoulders she disappeared into the inn.

 

 

Again, this doesn't say that the Women's Circle is equal to the Village Council. Cenn says that the Circle butts into Council business but they throw a fit when the reverse happens. This could be taken three ways. One, that they are equal branches. This quote doesn't refute or support that position so let's set it aside for now. Two, that the Women's Circle is more powerful than the Village Council. After all, it appears the Circle can meddle in Council matters with impunity. Three, that the Council is more powerful than the Circle but still restricted from meddling in their affairs (the way that the US federal government has much more power than a small business but what goes on in that small business is none of the government's concern).

 

So I can read that quote and logically get three different conclusions. So the quote by itself isn't proof of anything but rather support used to bolster some other evidence. I have seen no other evidence that the Circle and Council are equal or that the Circle is more powerful. I'm forced to go with the third option here.

 

But young men and women are both reliant on their families before marriage, and to a large degree after. A young woman is just as likely to get economic independence as a young man (fairly small chance, but equal).

 

I'm inclined to agree with this. Especially the first part. The second? Other than children I don't see many unmarried people in Two Rivers so I can't make a call on that. But is this something you've taken from the text or is it something you've taken from the real world an applied to the gaps in the background?

 

I think my main point is that you say sexism only matters when it has an affect on gender dominance.

 

Sexism matters whenever there is a non-biological difference between genders. From hair styles to clothing styles to taking a man's last name after marriage to saying "women can't drive" to saying "real men don't like ballet" to all sorts of different things. All of that matters. But you can't go around pointing out every single difference. You'd get nowhere. So you have to stick with the big things, usually. The big things usually involve gender dominance.

 

Women don't need to go behind men's backs to do things, men aren't the heads of households, they're co-equals.

 

I thought this was the whole point of the book. I thought that women really do need to go behind men's backs. Look at how Nynaeve got approval to chase after the Boys. Outside of Two Rivers, isn't this the driving force behind the Aes Sedai? Outside of Queen Morgase (I'll have to admit that I've only seen Queen Morgase and King Easar Togita in modern times, but also King Mandragoran and King Aemon in the past) it seems that women only advise, only influence, only plot behind the scenes. Even the Amyrlin Seat has to "ask" Lord Agelmar to do things for her. Women may not need to go behind men's backs. But they do. Over and over again. It's kinda their thing.

 

The Village Council and Women's Circle are effectively unions in addition to political bodies.

 

Yes! I agree that they seem to be unions. But not that they both are political bodies. That'd be the Village Council only. I know we're only seeing things from the point of view of a teenage boy (who doesn't even live in town!) so there might be things going on that fly right over his head. These things might show up in later books (I'm 100% sure they will!).

 

But from what I've read so far there are so very few clues, one way or the other, about what the Women's Circle really is.

 

There seems to be a Wheel motif (with a little Ecclesiastes thrown in), too. I haven't got to the Balance themes this series is supposed to have. At least, I don't think I have. I get the feeling that this is a broken, dying world that needs to be kicked in the ass so that it can be reborn into a better world. Nothing about setting the scales back to where they should be.

 

With that theme missing (as of now) I have no reason to see the perfect world of Emond's Field to be that way because of gender balance (while the big world is ruined because of women's unchecked runaway power).

 

So what's the point of all my words? One, I could be wrong about Two Rivers and gender. The quotes can be taken to mean different things and I've taken them to mean one thing while others took them to mean something else. I think this difference is because of both factual examples in later books support your thesis and that the themes this series covers work better with a balanced Emond's Field.

 

Two, I really don't want to talk about any more. I know, such a cop out. I won't admit I'm wrong, of course. I will admit that I could be wrong. Hell, you all could be wrong, too! The final book isn't out so everything we talk about could be mistaken, right? So I'll continue to think my own way, see the books in that light (ha, and interpreting all that subtext the way I want to!), until the books tell me I'm wrong. I mean, I do believe you all about what you say. I do! But what was it that Reagan said? Trust but verify.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Anyway!

 

In this newest blog post we're wrapping up Perrin and Egwene and their wilderness adventure. Thank the Light. It looks like we're getting into Rand and Mat and their Caemlyn Road Road Trip. This particular trio of chapters ends with some confusing lucky ass pull what I now realize to be channeling. Right now, in my reading, I'm going with Nynaeve and Egwene down to Tar Valon to learn some magic in The Great Hunt. Hopefully they'll explain how magic works because, I'll be honest, I have no clue. Lots of spells have been cast but I still don't understand how it all goes down.

 

Hope you all enjoy this next one. I did!

 

Children of Shadow, Play for Your Supper, Four Kings in Shadow

[randsc]

At this point in your reading, you have been introduced to the Queen of Andor and the Amyrlin Seat. Continued insistence that women have no political power is just plain silly.

[Always Sunny]

At this point in your reading, you have been introduced to the Queen of Andor and the Amyrlin Seat. Continued insistence that women have no political power is just plain silly.

 

Yes, it would be plain silly to continue to insist that women have no political power. Though, to be honest, I haven't insisted on that before.

 

I have insisted that the Women's Circle doesn't have political power. I may be proved wrong in the future but I'm sticking to my guns right now. I have insisted that women who do have power only exercise it by manipulating men, though. With the exception of Queen Morgase (as far as I know), so far that holds true. Even the Amyrlin Seat needs approval from local lords before taking action (approval almost always given, sure).

 

But let's wait until I get there before we talk about it, cool? Talking about that part skips all the neat things we'll read about along the way!

[randsc]

You're trying to have it both ways. On the one hand, you admit you're reading ahead of your blog postings at least in part because you want to be armed for these kinds of debates. On the other, whenever someone calls you on one of your misinterpretations (which I really believe, at this point, are willful), you're all, "Well you need to wait until I get there!"

 

So which is it? I've tried dealing with this stuff on your terms (for example, by making a real effort to avoid spoilers, even though a spoiler or two would very often immediately resolve a question in my favor). But it's time for you to step to the plate and participate in an honest debate, or acknowlege that other people have read further and more closely, and may have greater insight into these books.

[A2597]

After reading your response, I'd have to say you're intentionally misreading it to keep women down, rather than reading it as it is. But eh...we'll just let you keep reading.

[David Selig]

Maybe this has been posted 10 pages back, but since the issue still persists, I'll quote the Glossary of TEOTW about the Women's Circle and its relative power compared to the Village Council:

 

Women’s Circle: A group of women elected by the women of a village, responsible for deciding such matters as are considered solely women’s responsibility (for example, when to plant the crops and when to harvest). Equal in authority to the Village Council, with clearly-delineated lines and areas of responsibility. Often at odds with the Village Council.

 

Also:

 

Wisdom: In villages, a woman chosen by the Women’s Circle to sit in the Circle for her knowledge of such things as healing and foretelling the weather, as well as for common good sense. A position of great responsibility and authority, both actual and implied. She is generally considered the equal of the Mayor, and in some villages his superior. Unlike the Mayor, she is chosen for life, and it is very rare for a Wisdom to be removed from office before her death. Almost traditionally in conflict with the Mayor.

[Thor]

like i said pages back (although i said appendix, not glossary), if people just read the glossary first it would have eliminated 99% of the questions.

[Feral]

Even the Amyrlin Seat needs approval from local lords before taking action (approval almost always given, sure).

 

I'd just like to point out that's nothing to do with gender. If the Amyrilin Seat was a King, he'd still have to be careful not to rub nobles up the wrong way or he'd end up with a civil war on his hands. Also, it would be local ladies, not just lords

[Agitel]

Even the Amyrlin Seat needs approval from local lords before taking action (approval almost always given, sure).

 

I'd just like to point out that's nothing to do with gender. If the Amyrilin Seat was a King, he'd still have to be careful not to rub nobles up the wrong way or he'd end up with a civil war on his hands. Also, it would be local ladies, not just lords

 

In addition to this, Lord Agelmar is a lord of a foreign city, while the Amyrlin is effectively Queen of a separate city state. She can't command him what to do, however most foreign leaders do put a lot of stock into the White Tower's opinions, even countries somewhat hostile to the Tower step lightly. We'll see this as it goes, but the Amyrlin asking instead of outright commanding isn't a reflection of less authority, more of a show that Lord Agelmar is of a completely different nationality. It should be said that the White Tower's influence has been slowly diminishing over the last 3,000 years, but it's single opinion is still pretty much more influential than the opinion of any other monarch or government in the region.

 

I'm tempted to go down and explain every government we've seen in the world, as it's a shame we'll get a closer look into a male dominated government and (I believe) culture in the third book and beginning of the fourth.

 

Checking out the glossary at the end of the book might help sometimes. Only worry is that there's an occasional spoiler back there.

 

I just want to also add, though I'm sure it has been said (probably already by me), while Jordan did try to make the genders balanced overall throughout the world, he didn't go out selling it as such. This is more something that's better discussed and noticed deeper into the books.

 

What was revolutionary about the beginning books was the prominence of strong females in the story (Moiraine, Nynaeve, Egwene), where in most older fantasy they tend to take a back seat aside from some rare exceptions.

 

Ah well, enough justifying, gonna read your latest update. I was sad to see you didn't update yesterday, but I suppose you're taking weekends off.

[Threepy]

But, really, two weeks to learn to juggle that well? Not likely

 

Juggling isn't too hard to learn. On a lonely day last summer I learnt to juggle three balls. Four didn't take much longer. More would obviously get more difficult but it's fantasy.

 

Nice read anyway. Like a lot of others I think the sexist issue is perhaps pushed too much but I I won't get into that - there's enough debate going on as it is and I do appreciate that you haven't read all the books. If you ever do read the entire series however, I'd love to know if your opinions have changed.

[Erunion]

One thing about the Eye of the World: Rand, Mat and Perrin aren't heroes. They're just ordinary dudes trying to survive. Eventually, they get more and more heroic. But right now? Staying alive is top priority.

Yes, it's dickish. But it's what 90% of humans would do (I like to think that I wouldn't, but hey, I've never been in that situation). Kudo's to RJ for making his characters at least start out as normal, self-absorbed people, more worried about where their next meal is coming from than about the moral injustice of the town they are walking through.

 

Just a heads up, the Amyrlin seat has a role a heck of a lot like that of the Pope during the Middle-Ages - is selected by a council, rules her own city-state and has tremendous political influence anywhere her "religion" is followed (in this case, where Aes Sedai are respected, not truly a religious thing). Like the Pope, there are places where the Amyrlin is not well thought of, and places where she is outright hated, but even to them she is still the leader of a powerful political body. Also like the Pope of the Medieval era, she has no technical authority outside of Tar Valon/Vatican or Aes Sedai/Religious matters, but almost anyone in any of the nations that respects her would be willing (or at least feel obligated to) do anything she asks.

[A2597]

Re: Mat learning juggling. This is a minor spoiler, but I'm going to say minor enough that it doesn't matter.

 

Mat has really really fast hands. Useful for juggling, or given his mischievous childhood, probably pilfering cookies. I'm assuming this goes with fast reaction time as well, as they would be closely related. Anyhoo, juggling wasn't a challenge for him. The flute with Rand, eh, I'll just say it was natural for him. ;)

 

I did like your bit about the least effective spy in the world. That was quite true and funny. That's all I'll say about this particular spy in the story. :)

[Smittyphi]

The flute with Rand, eh, I'll just say it was natural for him. ;)

 

*facepalm*

 

Duh! I'm rereading it again and it makes sense now. I got the juggling.

 

*facepalm again*