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Luckers

Mat's Arc

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Do you mean when he was talking to Setalle Anan, who had heard from Joline? I don't think he asked her about the buns; Setalle was just telling him that Joline was very grateful for all he had done from them. And then he mentioned the prank in passing, but it was just sort of an offhand comment, which is probably why Setalle didn't really say anything about it.

Yep that was it. Didin't really remember what happened after reading it, was very tired. Must read it again the book.

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Well, I think we got a huge hint about Tuon eventually deciding to learn to channel in the last chapter, with Mats fierce insistance that he under no circumstances would be bonded to anyone. After all, we know what happens when Mat tries to refuse somethingbiggrin.gif

 

Have to wonder what this means about the visions Aviendha saw. If Tuon learns to channel, the Seanchan empire would not leash channelers still (because we know they go back to reclaim seanchan in an outrigger novel)

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I was also a little disappointed by the gholam's end. It was a tactically clever strategy but story-wise it feels like a cop-out to me. I was thinking maybe the asha'man (forget the name) that helped Perrin create his power wrought hammer combined with Elayne's studying of the ter'angreal could result in some sort of anti-gholam blade or some such.

 

I guess I'm just not satisfied with no weakness being found. Its one thing to outmaneuver a specific character who is more wily or more powerful than others like him (e.g. Egwene manipulating people to do stuff she can't lawfully order) but leaving the gholams (since we know there are most likely more that may or may not make appearances) as mostly invincible bothers me. If I'm not mistaken, the shadowspawn are all creations of aginor (a human, w/e the 'chosen' think) created using human abilities (OP/TP). I believe we also have confirmation that Aginor created the gholam also. If it can be created by man then it should be possible to destroy it with the power of man.

 

I was pleased by it. Wasn't expecting it at all and it was rather clever on Mats part. I think the gholam's weakness in the end was its overconfidence, felt the channeling and didn't care.

 

Cuenllindar created by man but it cant be destroyed by the powers of men and women.

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You guys have a really crazy notion of "out of character", you know that? I'm fully fluent in two languages and have no problems spelling in either of them, but sometimes I write in lolcats grammar for effect, comical or otherwise. Is that somehow out of character for me?

 

And the important part is, it worked. The outrageous letter was the one that actually reached her. None of the others had, and it wasn't the first one he sent. The comment in the end about Thom laughing should have tipped you off: Thom was laughing at Mat writing a highly zany letter out of the amusement of it, not at Mat's inability to spell - that would have been out of character for Thom. But even if you missed that, the part where he said of course he was going to swear at her, how else would she know it was from him was also clear: Mat and Elayne's rapport was established on swearing.

 

If he'd wanted to write a perfectly proper letter with grammar and spelling and all, he would have. But he's not stupid, he writes the way he wants.

 

1. When approximately 80% of dedicated fans who have weighed in on this thread so far all have the same opinion, and you're the one disagreeing, the 80% probably aren't the crazy ones.

 

2. You have a crazy definition of out-of-character if you think Thom laughing at stupidity would be out of character for him.

 

3. Neither the spelling errors nor the crossed-out words would make anyone more likely to bring the letter to Elayne's attention. The tone, certainly, and I can believe the tone is something of what RJ intended. The grammatical mistakes, absolutely not. If anything, the mistakes would make him seem more like a typical mercenary captain with no connection to Elayne.

 

4. Since intentionally including grammatical mistakes would in no way serve Mat's purpose in writing the letter (unlike your writing for comic effect), there is no reason for them to have been included other than Sanderson botching the character.

 

5. In the postscript mentioning Thom, Mat says he was going to rewrite the letter because of the "scratched out words and bad spellings," and the only reason he didn't was because Thom was "laffing" at him. (Laughing at him, not with him.) That's clear-cut evidence they weren't intentional.

 

 

Sanderson screwed up. It happens sometimes. He's a good enough writer that his fanboys don't have to defend every word he ever writes.

 

nope sanderson didn't screw up. you clearly don't understand mat at all.

 

#5 is just dumb, i'm not a sanderson fanboy, mat's awesome, and the letter fits perfectly IN character for mat

Edited by slacker123

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I'm starting to think Moiraine may be the third in Callandor. Rand commented to Nynaeve that he still didn't know who the third would be, and Moiraine's requests could have been some sort of knowledge and/or weaving ability related to Callandor.

It would make sense, given the preceding events of The Dragon Reborn that Moiraine would have asked about Callandor. Rand needs Callandor (Blade of light etc...), she knows how to use it properly/avoid the flaw, Rand can't succeed without a woman (previously) dead and gone, etc... I guess that's my theory on Moiraine's role.

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My favourite Mat comical moment was in the ToG when he warned Thom and Noal "watch your back these things move faster than an inkeeper at the sound of coins clinking in your pouch"

that had me in tears with laughter that line..deffo RJ's work. :)

 

oh and I bet Olver won that game of snakes and foxes at the exact same time as Mat, it's supposed to be impossible to win ever I guess that they are linked somehow.

 

It also p@ssed me off that Mat didn't open Verin's letter before he left, Camelyn is totally screwed now..

Edited by Cazajay

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My favourite Mat comical moment was in the ToG when he warned Thom and Noal "watch your back these things move faster than an inkeeper at the sound of coins clinking in your pouch"

that had me in tears with laughter that line..deffo RJ's work. :)

 

I at first thought it was comical where they "eased the badger" but now that I am writing this...when they seen the tavern with that name, didn't they ask what it meant because they didn't know?

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I think the badger was a reference to the beginning when Mat was into mischief by letting an angry badger loose on Beltine in amongst the dancing.. It was to get Perrin's attention. Lol

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I'm fluent in about five languages and I can get by in three more. It's more difficult to deliberately misspell and cross out stuff.

No, this is just BS screwing up (mildly) - it would be ok, if we hadn't already seen a perfectly good and very forceful letter written by Mat.

 

Mat wrote for effect. It worked.

I feel the same way.

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My favourite Mat comical moment was in the ToG when he warned Thom and Noal "watch your back these things move faster than an inkeeper at the sound of coins clinking in your pouch"

that had me in tears with laughter that line..deffo RJ's work. :)

 

oh and I bet Olver won that game of snakes and foxes at the exact same time as Mat, it's supposed to be impossible to win ever I guess that they are linked somehow.

 

It also p@ssed me off that Mat didn't open Verin's letter before he left, Camelyn is totally screwed now..

I believe that all those mercs around town will mitigate the damage.

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I think the badger was a reference to the beginning when Mat was into mischief by letting an angry badger loose on Beltine in amongst the dancing.. It was to get Perrin's attention. Lol

 

That was what it was referencing, but although I don't remember the scene so may be wrong, I thought when they later came to some Inn/Tavern in the early books they came to one called "Easing the Badger" and had asked what it meant but had not gotten an answer. It seems if that is true it is a mistake in the book.

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- Why did someone have to come get Lanfear? Why not wait for her to die and transmigrate her soul then? Why risk or pay to come get her? Did they come get her, then kill her off, then wait for DO to move her soul into Cyndane?

 

- Why was the bond with Lan broken instantly if Moiraine was alive all that time and could still channel (albeit weaker)? It wasn't broken when she went into the doorframe in Tear. Why now?

 

- Is the spear the big unnoticed thing? Do we have confirmation on that anywhere?

 

- Verin's letter. Gahh, stupid. Seriously? I don't know why that was necessary at all. Why couldn't she have spat that out to Egwene while dying? Egwene is the Amyrlin and she can Travel, and you think she can't get this info to Caemlyn? I just don't get it.

 

- Olver... creepy... and he won snakes and foxes? Confused.

Edited by Leah J

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I didn't like the letter from Mat. That was the only part I found jarring. Seems like a cheap way to get a comic effect. Otherwise, it was smooth sailing. So glad to see Moiraine saved (YES!!!) and so sad to see Jain end in such a way. If only Mat could have figured the function of his weapon just a bit earlier! :(

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Was it really just Mats eye that they took? Why would his eye in particular be so desirable? Would they have taken, say, Thoms, or Noals instead? If not and it had to be Mat...it would be because of his ta'veren nature? The finns fed off both Moiraines power and the emotion it caused her to lose it...is it possible that whilst feeding on Mats eye they also fed on some of his ta'veren ability? Might we see mat be less lucky in future, despite his lucky escape from the tower? Or would the ta'vereness they were feeding on at that time not affect his future abilities?

 

Some quotes from the book

 

"it was as if the creature had pressed its deceitful claws into his mind and soul"

 

"Eelfin watched with their horrid, almost human faces, eyes narrowed in ecstasy as they fed on something rising from Mat. An almost invisible vapor of red and white"

 

"How it twists around him![...] How it spins! Scents of blood in the air! And the gambler becomes center of it all. I can taste fate itself!" What is it they mean here - is it the pattern that is twisting and spinning around Mat, and that he becomes center of?

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The finns fed off both Moiraines power and the emotion it caused her to lose it...is it possible that whilst feeding on Mats eye they also fed on some of his ta'veren ability? Might we see mat be less lucky in future, despite his lucky escape from the tower?

 

Well, he seemed to be _more_ lucky, if anything. Which makes his sacrifice a little bit cheap, IMHO. Yes, it was painful, but it made him even more powerful, while Moiraine's made her less. Her other 2 wishes should better be great, given this and the lameness of her first wish.

 

Did somebody think that Mat's refusal to marry Thom and Moiraine and his desire to go to Caemlyn first will be significant? I suspect that this will allow Moiraine to go to Caemlyn with Mat and help him defeat the Trolloc invasion/ lead the Kin/captive sul'dam in destroying the Waygate. She knows that she can't die before marrying Thom and this will give her justification to go into battle before sharing her Finn-bought knowledge with Rand.

 

I almost think that the dreamspike must cover Caemlyn too (but not Mat's camp), since Rand and Co. could easily be alerted and come back in time to repel the invasion otherwise. BT is 10 miles from Caemlyn, right? And Perrin's dreamspike had a radius of 4 leagues or so? That could work, couldn't it? Not to mention that some dreamspikes may be stronger than others.

 

I suspect that the plan is for the BT Dreadlords to support annihilation of Caemlyn, but due to resistance from Logain's faction their participation won't be as strong as planned.

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People are arguing over Mat's letter, but seem to forget something.

 

While Mat has the memories of people from the past, and can [presumably] read, memories and the ability to read does not necessarily mean that one has a good grasp on writing skills.

There are many people who are bright, intelligent, and well-spoken who can barely spell without a spell-checker.

 

[think about it- how many of you guys know at least one person who cannot spell worth a flip?}

 

And Mat has not exactly written a lot of letters, and we don't see him doing a lot of reading either.

 

It's highly likely that mat really CAN'T spell.

 

Mat was desperate and frustrated and NEEDED to see Elayne. I don't blame him.

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Things that can divide a fandom surprise me. Mat's letter was funny and it worked for me and others; it didn't work for some people, and it wasn't funny for them. Nuff said really. Focusing on a half a page of dialogue in that big book just seems...silly.

 

I thought a better subject to divide the fandom, something that exists in this and the last book, would be the fact that differing dialects no longer really exist for people from different countries. Or the fact that when Mat talked in the Old Tongue in the ToG, the sentence structure and word choice didn't change to give you a hint that he was speaking the Old Tongue unconsciously. These two things added flavor to series and I'll miss them, even if i don't know if Team Jordan should take the time fix them.

 

A few badass/funny Mat moments that I loved:

 


  •  
  • Birgitte Mat dicing with the guards after they caught him sneaking in the palace.
  • His reunion with Perrin /w badger.
  • "Pretty as [Joline] was, Mat did not think of her as a match for one of his friends. He would never wish Joline upon someone he liked"
  • The gholam fight but especially when he slammed the duplicate foxhead medallions into its palms, smiled and said "Guess I just got lucky."
  • The Tower of Ghenjei. Very tense, with the "Oh, Motherf***er!" moment, of him using the damn dagger-staff to escape. Hidden in plan sight, well done Mr. Jordan.
  • The image of Mat tossing two dozen coins in the air, then calmly staring at Birgitte as they all land face up.
  • But my all time favorite Mat moment in this book was just a simple one. Him walking in the rain at night, without his medallion, getting more and more freaked out about no one being about, not even beggars or thieves. Then he hears a noise, stops, and sees a robbery happening down a dark alley way. The four thieves see Mat, leave their victim and come charging Mat, swinging weapons.

 

Mat relaxed, wiping his brow free of rainwater. So there were footpads out this night. What a relief. He had been jumping at nothing!

 

Then he proceeds to kicks all their asses.

 

That's pure Mat Cauthon.

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Re: The letter.

 

Mat has often claimed "I read a book once", but we never see him reading. He expressed an INTENT to read before, but never actually did so.

 

Also, to his letter to Tylin, did we actually read that letter? Or did we read what Mat intended it to say? Reading past typos and scratched out words to the intended message.

 

Also, Mat has battle memories. Memories of tending an army and warfare. He doesn't remember the mundane parts of these generals lives, only the battles. Also, most generals have secretaries or manservents to write letters they dictate.

 

Was it perfect? Maybe not. But it was extremely funny.

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A. Yes he does remember, I point to LoC when he's dancing in that inn just before the Band moves and he's reminded of when he was a minor lord dancing in a palace with a Seafolk ambassador. Additionally, I also point to KoD where he remembers taverns and pseudo strip clubs.

 

B. Yes, we do read the letter, not what the characters thought it said, but the actual letter itself.

 

The intent of the letter was good, I laughed, but the typos were just sloppy writing and a rushed editing process, and I really disliked the 'p.s.' parts, but that's a beef I have with how modern BS writes.

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The letter was written that way to stand out and be recognizable by Elayne. I don't see the big deal.

 

It seems Mats luck is off charts in the book. Since his luck is tied to blind chance it seems, losing the eye will likely only make it better. Though having someone rip your eye out got's to be a bish.

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Except that Mat says that Thom is laughing at him, not with him as though he was in on the joke but at as though he's laughing at just how bad he writes. Ultimately, it's Occam's razor, it makes a lot more sense for this to be proof of a joke that didn't work(and a rushed editing job) then some conspiracy on Mat's part. And I hardly think that anything can get more attention-getting than 'Your Royal Pain in my Behind' or some such.

 

Jeez, what is it with this 'repel the boarders' attitude people get about BS' writing. He's improved a lot on how he writes Mat since tGS, but he still doesn't get him. Hopefully he'll improve a lot more in aMoL and make him less buffonish and less one-liner reliant.

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I laughed really hard after reading his letter. I thought it was hilarious myself. Other than chapter 8 and the last chapter, everything he did was borderline EPIC. Loved him in this book.

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My favourite Mat comical moment was in the ToG when he warned Thom and Noal "watch your back these things move faster than an inkeeper at the sound of coins clinking in your pouch"

that had me in tears with laughter that line..deffo RJ's work. :)

 

oh and I bet Olver won that game of snakes and foxes at the exact same time as Mat, it's supposed to be impossible to win ever I guess that they are linked somehow.

 

It also p@ssed me off that Mat didn't open Verin's letter before he left, Camelyn is totally screwed now..

 

Yeah I'm thinking Oliver won against the Snakes and Foxes because Mat did also.

 

Favorite moment: Mat meeting Perrin with the badger, hilarious.

 

 

I'm thinking Moraine is probably going to be the 3rd with Nynaeve and Rand in using Callandor. One of her questions probably had something to do with that I'm sure.

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