Who is the man in the black coat in Book 7 A Crown of Swords?

[headtreads]

I looked at a few topics on this but everyone seems to fly off into random tangents and never discuss the actual question. So who is this guy? Does the book give any other clue to find out who this guy is? I'm figuring it is Rands real father. THats all speculation of course.

[Muad Cheade]

Janduin, Rand's birth father, is dead. He was killed by Slayer.

 

That man was Moridin. That's why Rand didn't see him make his bar of balefire; Moridin was using the True Power. I think that was the sanest we've seen Mordin/Ishamael/Ba'alzamon.

[headtreads]

Moridin is suppose to be the Nameless is he not? So why would he try to help the Dragon Reborn? I know he is not fond of any of the forsaken but they are still being used by the Great Lord. Plus, Moridin is using the forsaken like novices. Is there any evidence showing in any of the following books that Moridin is in fact the "Man in the Black Coat? One other thing. Both Rand and this "Man in the Black Coat, was blown backwards right? If he was using the true source, that would have overpowered anything that would go againts it. Maybe I'm wrong, any opinions? Throughout the whole book, this is just getting on my nerves.

[water_seeker]

It's Nae'blis...and Moridin makes his own decisions based on what serves him the best at any given time.

[seasnake]

Thought about this.  Ishamael was a great philosopher, and had a really deep understanding of how things worked and why.  I think he's puzzled out that the Dragon and the Dark One have fought the same battle a million times and they'll always do it again resulting in the same thing:  A new age.  Ishamael truly wants to end the battles once and for all, and he's reasoned out that the only way to do it is to not have Rand and the Dark One fight with the same tired outcome, but somehow get them on the same side. 

 

I think that's why Rand's hardening is so crucial, and what is killing the seals.  I think that as Rand closes himself off more and more, and becomes less and less good by repeatedly doing dark things in the name of the light, he allows more of what is the Dark One into himself, and thus becomes more and more in the Shadow's camp.  That's why I think Ishamael is trying to keep him alive, he wants him to become evil, and surely Rand in the name of good intentions is doing more evil.  He's not like Perrin who saw what depravity he could do and then refused, Rand thinks he has to out-heartless the Dark One.  That is what will give the Dark One his victory. 

[erickm001]

I think that as Rand closes himself off more and more, and becomes less and less good by repeatedly doing dark things in the name of the light, he allows more of what is the Dark One into himself, and thus becomes more and more in the Shadow's camp. 

 

What "dark things" has Rand done in the name of the light?

[Mr Ares]

Thought about this.

Not hard enough.

Ishamael truly wants to end the battles once and for all, and he's reasoned out that the only way to do it is to not have Rand and the Dark One fight with the same tired outcome, but somehow get them on the same side. 

 

I think that as Rand closes himself off more and more, and becomes less and less good by repeatedly doing dark things in the name of the light, he allows more of what is the Dark One into himself, and thus becomes more and more in the Shadow's camp.

Aridhol became pretty dark, but was anathema to the Shadow to the end. By making Rand dark, they don't put him on side. You see the flaw in your theory?

 

I looked at a few topics on this but everyone seems to fly off into random tangents and never discuss the actual question.

There is nothing to discuss.

[headtreads]

Once again everyone goes off to random tangents. So does everyone agree it is Moridin? or is it just stipulation? Where in the book 7 or 8 gives proof of this? I have read both books about 5 times each more than the others trying to figure out what I'm missing. As far as I know, he was never mentioned again correct? Maybe in the 12th book but not since book 7.

[JenLenaMom]

There is a POV from Moridin where he thinks specifically about the incident and about how their bars of balefire touched, but I don't know which book it's in.

[Shard]

Once again everyone goes off to random tangents. So does everyone agree it is Moridin? or is it just stipulation? Where in the book 7 or 8 gives proof of this? I have read both books about 5 times each more than the others trying to figure out what I'm missing. As far as I know, he was never mentioned again correct? Maybe in the 12th book but not since book 7.

 

Everyone agrees.

[Zaladane]

I think it was Ishy too.  Wasn't there standing orders at the time not to kill Rand?  To be honest though at first I thought it might somehow be the next Dragon from the next age and that past present and future can connect.  Not just the past dragon and Rand, but that was just stupid.  Then I thought maybe the creator.  Nope I thought to myself that would be dumb too.  I even considered the Dark one himself being able to manifest itself briefly.  But yeah in the end I think Moridin is the answer.  I could be wrong though...

[Cybertrolloc]

There is a POV from Moridin where he thinks specifically about the incident and about how their bars of balefire touched, but I don't know which book it's in.

KoD, but that's Rand thinking about Mori. Probably early PoD then. ;D about , yay Strong Bad!

[jsbrads]

time travel explains how the man knew him, but he did not know him

[silverraven]

Moridin is the only possible person that it could be. Its not the least plausible person its the most plausible person.

[Dmitri]

time travel explains how the man knew him, but he did not know him

 

Errr...

 

Can you explain what exactly do you mean by time travel in this context?

[Mr Ares]

So does everyone agree it is Moridin?

Yes. http://www.wotmania.net/faqtopic.asp?ID=18

 

time travel explains how the man knew him, but he did not know him

No-one can time travel in this series. It was Moridin.

[jsbrads]

Clearly time travel hasn't happened yet, never said it did, just said it was a possible explaination, moridin does not make sense, why would he do that? How would he know to find Rand there? 

[Mr Ares]

just said it was a possible explaination

It's not.

moridin does not make sense

Yes it does.

why would he do that?

Read PoD Prologue.

How would he know to find Rand there?

Well, he has been spying on Sammael.

[Blackhoof]

I agree with you, Ares, but you should maybe think about what Arkelias says and state your opinion in more words than "nuh-uh". Give reasons for your disagreement. But your right.  :P

[Thor]

it was morridin, there is no question about it.

 

but people can time travel, not in a controlled way, but they can.  by entering vacuoles.

[mb]

Clearly time travel hasn't happened yet, never said it did, just said it was a possible explaination

If time travel becomes possible at one time, I think it would become possible for all times since there would be no way to exclude any 'time'. Thus it has not happened yet would mean that it will never happen; so it is not (and will not be) possible.

 

[jsbrads]

Not a problem if the people in the future discover traveling but make a pact not to tell people in the past

 

spying on moridin? in Illian? how did he follow to Shadar Logoth? seems thin at best, and why would he help, i've read the books too, the best we have seen in chosen who avoid Rand, others continue to go after him silently even after commanded to allow Rand to live.

[Blackhoof]

Sammy broke the no-kill order, or was attempting to, and moridin needed rand alive. He killed two birds with one stone.

[Bob T Dwarf]

And, it was probably Graendal that ratted Sam out.

 

 

[mb]

Sammy broke the no-kill order, or was attempting to, and moridin needed rand alive.

The order's wording was 'Let the Lord of Chaos rule'; which could be interpreted in a number of ways.

To me 'Spread chaos' and/or 'let chaos spread' would be more accurate interpretations of it.

The earliest the Forsaken were explicitly told not to kill Rand was in Knife of Dreams.

 

To me we cannot be certain of Moridin's reason for wanting Sammael dead until Moridin tells why.