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DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

S1E3: A Place of Safety


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49 minutes ago, MasterAblar said:

I agree, I do think they need to show him at some point between those 2 appearances. Maybe show him among the shadowspawn or something? 

I feel a simple moment was missed, as the group rode away from the river and the fade stood there and screamed you cold have had Fain appear after they had ridden off, standing next to the fade, the trollocs giving him space. A few seconds of scene to show the audience there is more to him. 

 

You could then start Episode 4 with him leaving Shadar Logoth, the sound of Trollocs yelling slowly dying out until silence, him staring at the wall of the city before then heading off. Just a minute or 2 of TV time to show the audience that the Trollocs had gone into the city, all died but he had escaped. 

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11 hours ago, Chwooly said:

It doesn't bother anyone that in E1 it is mentioned that Trollocs hate deep water then in this episode Nyneave kills one after it follows her and search's in a deep pool?  Also how did she find everyone when they are on horses and moving quickly and she is on foot?  

 

Suspension of disbelief is important but this is not something you can just ignore. 

 

I have to say, I am very disappointed in the 3 episodes I have watched so far, Not just because I am a fan of the books. 

 

I have been able to overlook some of the glaring deviations from the source material. 

But the poor CGI, bad pacing, poor plot explanations, wooden acting, make this  hard to watch, It is sad that this might make it thru 2 seasons (only because they have already paid for 2 seasons)  but I don't see the writing, acting or effects being strong enough for it to last to MOL And it is not because of the source being to difficult to bring to TV. The Expanse, Foundation, GOT, Dune and LOTR's have all have very intense and complex stories and so so far they have all been able to have decent runs.

So far this is more hobbit then LOTR. 
 

As for the magical pool, deep enough for Nym to hide in, then just up to Trollocs knees, then deep enough for the body to dissapear in that made no sense. 

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24 minutes ago, Sir_Charrid said:

So far this is more hobbit then LOTR. 
 

As for the magical pool, deep enough for Nym to hide in, then just up to Trollocs knees, then deep enough for the body to dissapear in that made no sense. 


Did anybody notice how the blood in the pool created a dragon fang?! It was super subtle so I guess I wouldn’t be surprised if I’m the only who saw that. 

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6 minutes ago, DaddyFinn said:

I don't even..

Watch it back it makes no sense logically. There is a concept in film and TV you have to earn the right to get the viewer to suspend belief. John Wick is the best example of this, the films are largely realistic so those moments, which are not count as 1-2 a movie, where you can ignore the obvious are forgiven. 

 

That whole scene with Nym killing a trolloc anyway just felt wrong but you add in the logic of that pool and it forces me as a viewer to question the reality of the scene which removes me from being immersed in the show. 

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28 minutes ago, Sir_Charrid said:

As for the magical pool, deep enough for Nym to hide in, then just up to Trollocs knees, then deep enough for the body to dissapear in that made no sense. 

Human can hide in a very shallow water. Nynaeve was probably vertical and crouching when she went below the surface.

 

The water was up to the trollocs upper abdomen. Over waist-high.

 

Trolloc body isn't that thick when it's laying horizontally. Certainly not as thick as the length of legs to abdomen. Of course the water is deep enough to hide it.

 

 

I just checked all of those. Maybe we are seeing different things ?

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And there is the question of why the Trolloc's blood made a fang-shape in the water in the first place? Was it because the Dark One's evil influence just makes things look like fang-shapes sometimes, when his dark minions are involved? Or was it just because of, ya know, symbolism is cool? Except, is it? Seems like hokey fan-service to me, unless there is a deeper, in-world explanation forthcoming.

 

Same for Lan discovering the dead animals in the forest, shaped like a fang, in an undeniable parallel to scenes from GoT of White Walkers strewing corpses in creepy patterns. In this case, again, why? Does the Fade forces the Trollocs to leave the carcasses in the fang-shape, or do the Trollocs do it unconsciously because the Dark One's evil spirit is seeping through their subconscious or something like that? And if the Fade makes them do it, why? Does it just enjoy doing art projects in the woods in the middle of the night? Is it to alert other Trollocs and evil creatures to their location, a sort of rallying flag? But it's never explained—right after we see it, they quick-cut away and it is never mentioned again.

 

I'm not demanding immediate answers to every mystery, but the way some of these shots are portrayed makes me wonder if they are even intended to be mysteries, or just one-off, visually-cool shots we are intended to forget about a minute later, with no long-term explanation in the plans. For now, I am happy to keep watching to wait and see, but the mental list of unchecked boxes is getting longer...

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36 minutes ago, Borderlander said:

And there is the question of why the Trolloc's blood made a fang-shape in the water in the first place? Was it because the Dark One's evil influence just makes things look like fang-shapes sometimes, when his dark minions are involved? Or was it just because of, ya know, symbolism is cool? Except, is it? Seems like hokey fan-service to me, unless there is a deeper, in-world explanation forthcoming.

 

Same for Lan discovering the dead animals in the forest, shaped like a fang, in an undeniable parallel to scenes from GoT of White Walkers strewing corpses in creepy patterns. In this case, again, why? Does the Fade forces the Trollocs to leave the carcasses in the fang-shape, or do the Trollocs do it unconsciously because the Dark One's evil spirit is seeping through their subconscious or something like that? And if the Fade makes them do it, why? Does it just enjoy doing art projects in the woods in the middle of the night? Is it to alert other Trollocs and evil creatures to their location, a sort of rallying flag? But it's never explained—right after we see it, they quick-cut away and it is never mentioned again.

 

I'm not demanding immediate answers to every mystery, but the way some of these shots are portrayed makes me wonder if they are even intended to be mysteries, or just one-off, visually-cool shots we are intended to forget about a minute later, with no long-term explanation in the plans. For now, I am happy to keep watching to wait and see, but the mental list of unchecked boxes is getting longer...

 

Given how many times the phrase "It's not like in the books" gets thrown about.... weird stuff happens all the time in the books without a lot of logical explanations.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Borderlander said:

And there is the question of why the Trolloc's blood made a fang-shape in the water in the first place? Was it because the Dark One's evil influence just makes things look like fang-shapes sometimes, when his dark minions are involved? Or was it just because of, ya know, symbolism is cool? Except, is it? Seems like hokey fan-service to me, unless there is a deeper, in-world explanation forthcoming.

 


 

Maybe I’m reading too deep, but I saw some powerful symbolism in this scene. The river clearly represents saidar. Eg has to surrender to the current to keep from drowning. I would not be surprised if the spring feeds into the river. Nynaeve keeps the pool clean, as part of her duties as Wisdom, foreshadowing when she helps Rand cleanse the taint later. The trolloc pollutes the pool and Nynaeve kills it, further symbolizing her role later in the books. 

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1 hour ago, JenniferL said:


 

Maybe I’m reading too deep, but I saw some powerful symbolism in this scene. The river clearly represents saidar. Eg has to surrender to the current to keep from drowning. I would not be surprised if the spring feeds into the river. Nynaeve keeps the pool clean, as part of her duties as Wisdom, foreshadowing when she helps Rand cleanse the taint later. The trolloc pollutes the pool and Nynaeve kills it, further symbolizing her role later in the books. 

Hadn’t thought of that! Thanks!!!!!! That scene doesn’t work for me but I like the symbolism 

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On 11/21/2021 at 3:43 AM, Borderlander said:

And there is the question of why the Trolloc's blood made a fang-shape in the water in the first place? Was it because the Dark One's evil influence just makes things look like fang-shapes sometimes, when his dark minions are involved? Or was it just because of, ya know, symbolism is cool? Except, is it? Seems like hokey fan-service to me, unless there is a deeper, in-world explanation forthcoming.

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Edited by Chwooly
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I loved this episode, most especially my girl Nynaeve! She is my favorite character in the books and I have loved her portrayal and actress so far on the show. I especially loved all the Nynaeve / Lan interaction in this one. When she's tied to the tree and giving him the death glare, then when she says "it's not a demand, it's a threat" - pure Nynaeve ferocity. ❤ As Lan says in the book, "You are a lioness, Wisdom."

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On 11/21/2021 at 6:18 AM, JenniferL said:

aybe I’m reading too deep, but I saw some powerful symbolism in this scene. The river clearly represents saidar. Eg has to surrender to the current to keep from drowning. I would not be surprised if the spring feeds into the river. Nynaeve keeps the pool clean, as part of her duties as Wisdom, foreshadowing when she helps Rand cleanse the taint later. The trolloc pollutes the pool and Nynaeve kills it, further symbolizing her role later in the books. 

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3 hours ago, Sabio said:

The quick look showing the dead Aiel's hair I liked.

For me it was the intercutting between this shot and then straight to Rand who's hair is identical in colour. However because the main essence of that scene is him trying to escape a crazy women with a sword it won't be obvious but, once the reveal is made about Rands Ancestry, it will be a nice little call back for people to go, ahhhhh I get it now. 

 

I do appreciate clever foreshadowing such as this. 

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Like I said, I might be reading things that aren’t there. But several times they’ve shown that Rand likes to get up high or climb a mountain when he’s trying to work through negative emotions. And when Moiraine tells the story of Manetheren, you get a reaction shot of Egwene when Eldrene draws too much of the power. Rafe knows the complete story and knows what elements he wants to include in later seasons. There’s no reason not to do foreshadowing now, especially since a good chunk of TEOTW is foreshadowing later books. Min’s visions in Baerlon are basically a Cliff Notes version of the next 13 books. 

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1 hour ago, flinn said:

Any of you notice when Nynaeve killed the trolloc, the blood in the pool was in the shape of a dragon fang?


I went back and watched that scene again in super slow mo and I think you might be right. Good catch!! It’s subtle symbolism like this that really indicates a top notch show runner. 

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1 hour ago, JenniferL said:

Like I said, I might be reading things that aren’t there. But several times they’ve shown that Rand likes to get up high or climb a mountain when he’s trying to work through negative emotions. And when Moiraine tells the story of Manetheren, you get a reaction shot of Egwene when Eldrene draws too much of the power. Rafe knows the complete story and knows what elements he wants to include in later seasons. There’s no reason not to do foreshadowing now, especially since a good chunk of TEOTW is foreshadowing later books. Min’s visions in Baerlon are basically a Cliff Notes version of the next 13 books. 

This is the beauty of the visual medium, in a book the writer can’t add subtleties like this in, you can’t describe an Ailes hair and in the next scene describe again how Rand looks, but I do think it will lead to certain revelations coming far sooner. Seeing a forsaken use a mobile phone for instance gives away the age of wonder was high technology, but in the book you can simply call it a special device and leave the details until you want to make that reveal. 

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4 hours ago, JenniferL said:

Nynaeve keeps the pool clean, as part of her duties as Wisdom, foreshadowing when she helps Rand cleanse the taint later. The trolloc pollutes the pool and Nynaeve kills it, further symbolizing her role later in the books. 

Lovely, but will anyone wearing red ever believe that she did it? ? (She put an entire ajah out of business with that ambitious effort!) 

 

Think of the mess in the pool she had to clean up afterwards!!  Ugh. Will anyone ever use that pool again???

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23 hours ago, ForsakenPotato said:

 

What I actually came to say though: I watched with captions this time because of background noise and apparently when Moiraine is mumbling while injured and unconscious she actually says "Siuan". Wanted to mention because I hadn't seen any discussion of that yet.

 

Putting my response in a spoiler since it's about info that might be revealed in a future episode

 

Spoiler

I always watch with captions and I caught this too. I think I remember reading/hearing Rafe in an interview saying that there will be two friends from the books who will be revealed as more than friends in season 1? The reason I remember this is because I thought that Siuan and Moiraine would make the most sense so I have been watching for this

 

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