Nyn and Rand - their unfulfilled relationship

[szilard]

Nobody can deny that there is something special (a bond without bonding) between the two of them. To me, they are more than just very good friends.

 

Unfortunately, Jordan did not explore this relationship on deeper levels; any idea why did Jordan choose to ignore it in book 9-10-11?

[Adam Ziarnik]

I always felt that their relationship was almost like that of siblings. It was like she was his big sister. There was friction between them, but she was looking out for him and wanted the best for him. I never read any kind of unfulfilled romance or sexual tension into their relationship. 

[Ferule]

I agree with Adam Z, the bond is that if pseudo siblings. With that being said, I feel it is explored, and in full detail by the culmination of the series. And most certainly their bond is developed in books 9-11. The cleansing of the taint is one of the most momentous events in the series and Nynaeve was participating directly with Rand. All her interactions with him henceforth are less older sister looking after a younger sibling that needs constant chastisement and more older sister seeing that younger sibling develop into an equal (even if it is grudging).

 

It's noteworthy that the development of this relationship has been present in all books; the end of book 9 is simply the strongest build of their relationship, after which Rand progressively becomes someone she fears more than fears for until after TGS. 

[Sabio]

Siblings/son mother.  SInce it's clear early one Nyn feel motherly towards Rand and the others.  They need me to protect them/ I will do whatever it takes to keep them safe.  She never loses the instinct that she must protect/look out for Rand. 

[Peanut Butter Toast]

I don't recall ever once detecting anything close to romantic undertones between them. Nynaeve clearly has a very maternal relationship with the other Two Rivers kids.

 

I do feel like they should have had more moments with both Nynaeve and Egwene interacting with Rand in a less bitchy (or begrudgingly non-bitchy) way, though. At the end of the day the guy just wanted to save everyone's ass, and I feel like the female side of his "Two Rivers family" should have given him the benefit of the doubt more often, much like how Perrin, Matt, and Tam generally did. 

[dexterryu]

I agree on the older sister feel to their relationship. While she's protective of everyone from the TR her relationship changes with each of the other 4.

 

With Mat - She treats him like her younger brothers bad influence. She recognizes that overall he's a decent guy, but just enjoys things that she doesn't approve of.

 

Perrin - Very little interaction between the two in the entire series. The two are rarely together (parts of EoTW and then the start of TSR) Almost as if Perrin was already an adult in her eyes... He was on his way to being a blacksmith before they left, then gets married.

 

Egwene - Big sister to start, then equal. You could say the Egwene gets the upper hand at times but outside of her station as Amyrlin you could say that Nyneave out-stripes her in several ways.

[szilard]

I always felt that their relationship was almost like that of siblings. It was like she was his big sister. There was friction between them, but she was looking out for him and wanted the best for him. I never read any kind of unfulfilled romance or sexual tension into their relationship. 

 

I did not talk about any romantic/sexual thing between them either. Maybe (maybe?) I chose my words poorly.

 

When I read especially Nyn's chapters I always get the 'we are like 'twins', I care about him the most, I will help him no matter what's the cost, I trust him, ofc he's an idiot sometimes' feeling.

 

But we don't get a situation like this: they talk to each other in an 'intimate' (familiar) situation. Just the two of them without wives and a husband. It's like the sit. between Avi and El: they talk to each other, cry together, comfort each other, but Jordan gives us a passing sentence nothing more.

 

I agree with Adam Z, the bond is that if pseudo siblings. With that being said, I feel it is explored, and in full detail by the culmination of the series. And most certainly their bond is developed in books 9-11. The cleansing of the taint is one of the most momentous events in the series and Nynaeve was participating directly with Rand. All her interactions with him henceforth are less older sister looking after a younger sibling that needs constant chastisement and more older sister seeing that younger sibling develop into an equal (even if it is grudging).

 

It's noteworthy that the development of this relationship has been present in all books; the end of book 9 is simply the strongest build of their relationship, after which Rand progressively becomes someone she fears more than fears for until after TGS. 

 

Yes, but I don't feel satisfied by this.

 

Siblings/son mother.  SInce it's clear early one Nyn feel motherly towards Rand and the others.  They need me to protect the/ I will do whatever it takes to keep them safe.  She never loses the instinct that she must protect/look out for Rand. 

 

So nothing more? Their relationship is not more important than Nyn-El, Nyn-Eg etc ?

 

I don't recall ever once detecting anything close to romantic undertones between them. Nynaeve clearly has a very maternal relationship with the other Two Rivers kids.

 

I do feel like they should have had more moments with both Nynaeve and Egwene interacting with Rand in a less bitchy (or begrudgingly non-bitchy) way, though. At the end of the day the guy just wanted to save everyone's ass, and I feel like the female side of his "Two Rivers family" should have given him the benefit of the doubt more often, much like how Perrin, Matt, and Tam generally did. 

 

Hmm.

 

I agree on the older sister feel to their relationship. While she's protective of everyone from the TR her relationship changes with each of the other 4.

 

With Mat - She treats him like her younger brothers bad influence. She recognizes that overall he's a decent guy, but just enjoys things that she doesn't approve of.

 

Perrin - Very little interaction between the two in the entire series. The two are rarely together (parts of EoTW and then the start of TSR) Almost as if Perrin was already an adult in her eyes... He was on his way to being a blacksmith before they left, then gets married.

 

Egwene - Big sister to start, then equal. You could say the Egwene gets the upper hand at times but outside of her station as Amyrlin you could say that Nyneave out-stripes her in several ways.

 

 

So nothing more? Their relationship is not more important than Nyn-El, Nyn-Eg etc ?

[dexterryu]

 

 

I agree on the older sister feel to their relationship. While she's protective of everyone from the TR her relationship changes with each of the other 4.

 

With Mat - She treats him like her younger brothers bad influence. She recognizes that overall he's a decent guy, but just enjoys things that she doesn't approve of.

 

Perrin - Very little interaction between the two in the entire series. The two are rarely together (parts of EoTW and then the start of TSR) Almost as if Perrin was already an adult in her eyes... He was on his way to being a blacksmith before they left, then gets married.

 

Egwene - Big sister to start, then equal. You could say the Egwene gets the upper hand at times but outside of her station as Amyrlin you could say that Nyneave out-stripes her in several ways.

 

 

So nothing more? Their relationship is not more important than Nyn-El, Nyn-Eg etc ?

 

 

I apologize, I wasn't clear. I meant her older sister-ness with Rand was more. Their sibling like bond is more true than any of the 5 from the Two Rivers. This goes both ways. Rand trusts Nyneave completely even when he's at his darkest, and likewise she still supports him during this time because she knows he's doing his best.

 

This is expounded a bit with the Egwene/Rand relationship. She goes from a romantic interest between the two of them to saying she loves him like a brother then becomes more loyal to the Tower than to him.

[szilard]

I apologize, I wasn't clear. I meant her older sister-ness with Rand was more. Their sibling like bond is more true than any of the 5 from the Two Rivers. This goes both ways. Rand trusts Nyneave completely even when he's at his darkest, and likewise she still supports him during this time because she knows he's doing his best.

 

This is expounded a bit with the Egwene/Rand relationship. She goes from a romantic interest between the two of them to saying she loves him like a brother then becomes more loyal to the Tower than to him.

 

Thanks. You know, people say that they don't have to say out loud things because the other one knows what do they feel to each other. What I'm really missing all the time a conversation between them. Just throw a few (embarrassed) words/sentences into the books and I, the reader, can get calm that they had talked about that 'issue'.

 

On the romantic interest: was there anything between them at all? Except the duty?

[Sabio]

Well part of Nyn's loyalty is she knows who Rand is and what he has to do.  She doesn't fully trust Cas and knows he needs someone around him he can trust, if she left who would he have?  Nyn also in some ways doesn't like the tower.  Had she followed tower rules she never would of fixed being severed from the source. 

 

I never got a hint of anything romantic, after all he had three ladies and she was in love with Lan.  By the time she was traveling with Rand she knew his love for the three ladies and she was married to Lan by then.

[Verbal32]

 

I apologize, I wasn't clear. I meant her older sister-ness with Rand was more. Their sibling like bond is more true than any of the 5 from the Two Rivers. This goes both ways. Rand trusts Nyneave completely even when he's at his darkest, and likewise she still supports him during this time because she knows he's doing his best.

 

This is expounded a bit with the Egwene/Rand relationship. She goes from a romantic interest between the two of them to saying she loves him like a brother then becomes more loyal to the Tower than to him.

 

Thanks. You know, people say that they don't have to say out loud things because the other one knows what do they feel to each other. What I'm really missing all the time a conversation between them. Just throw a few (embarrassed) words/sentences into the books and I, the reader, can get calm that they had talked about that 'issue'.

 

On the romantic interest: was there anything between them at all? Except the duty?

 

 

Are you sure you aren't confusing Rand/Nyn with Rand/Egwene.  The "romantic interest" bit above is about Rand/Egwene, and I thought your point was asking about Rand/Nynaeve.....

[jack of shadows]

what romantic interest between rand and egwene?

[Verbal32]

The one that tEotW began on - the "promise" that they would eventually get married.

[dexterryu]

 

I apologize, I wasn't clear. I meant her older sister-ness with Rand was more. Their sibling like bond is more true than any of the 5 from the Two Rivers. This goes both ways. Rand trusts Nyneave completely even when he's at his darkest, and likewise she still supports him during this time because she knows he's doing his best.

 

This is expounded a bit with the Egwene/Rand relationship. She goes from a romantic interest between the two of them to saying she loves him like a brother then becomes more loyal to the Tower than to him.

 

Thanks. You know, people say that they don't have to say out loud things because the other one knows what do they feel to each other. What I'm really missing all the time a conversation between them. Just throw a few (embarrassed) words/sentences into the books and I, the reader, can get calm that they had talked about that 'issue'.

 

On the romantic interest: was there anything between them at all? Except the duty?

 

 

I don't feel like there was any romantic interest between the two at all. Not saying that there couldn't have been but both had eyes for other characters from the first page to the last.

 

Rand starts EoTW with eyes for Egwene. Bye the end of EoTW Nyneave and Lan have fallen in love and Rand is aware of this due to overhearing their conversation on their way to the Green Man.

 

Nyneave sticks with Lan through the series and Rand moves from Egwene to Elayne/Avi/Min.

[Sabio]

Eg and Rand were pretty much destined to be married had they not left.  Eg breaking up with him in the stone. Mins viewing about they like each other but they are not meant for each other, not in the way they want.  Eg asking rand if he would dance with her during the festival.  Believe there was also something about Eg's mom going to talk with Tam. 

 

Pretty sure that would of been a huge scandal in the town had Rand and Nyn gotten together, even married.  As Mat said Wisdoms seldom married

 

Rand only sees Nyn if I am right, one time, from when they left Tear till he goes to the palace to ask her for her help (The time in the world of dreams when he was fighting Rhavin).  The barely see each other in book 2, not sure if at all book 3, and book 4 I don't remember them speaking at all.  By then he is smooching Elayne in the Stone.  Nyn knows Rand and Egwene were going to be an item when they were back home, so it's unlikely after leaving she would of ever considered trying to start anything with him.  Not to mentiond we see how Rand moons over Egwene, during the first two books.  I can't see him suddenly having eyes for the Wisdom.  By the time she is back with Rand, he has 3 women and she has a husband.

[Verbal32]

Not to mention Nyn's humorous reaction when Rand meets with all 3 women and Nyn hears it and is horrified, lol.

[Sabio]

Not to mention Nyn's humorous reaction when Rand meets with all 3 women and Nyn hears it and is horrified, lol.

 

That was classic.

[jack of shadows]

poor nynaeve,she became overwhelmed and went into meltdown. LOL.

"rand al'thor,nynaeve SHRIEKED,that is the most outrageous thing i

ever heard out of your mouth! the very idea of telling three women you

love them! you're worse than a lecher! you apologize right now!

[thehumantrashcan]

I think that quote of Nyn's "meltdown" shows quite clearly the closeness they have together as "brother/sister." No one speaks to the dragon reborn like that unless they have a relationship as close as a family member. I understand the desire to deepen their relationship as "brother/sister" through dialogue but their actions, all the way to the end of the series, describes volumes of their trust, love for each other, and ultamately defines their relationship.

[Ryrin]

I didn;t observe any romantic feelings between the two. I think Nyn may have spanked Rand when he was young. Motherly figure.

[wotfan4472]

Nynaeve is like the older sister that has to take care of her younger brother because mum is not alive to do it. That is what forges the very strong bond between Rand and her. She treated Tam like a grieving father, Mat like someone you wish would behave better, and Egwene like a little sister you want to string up when she upsets you, and congratulate when she does well. Perrin is like the brother that is independent, and does not need the connections the others did with her. He will seek that advice when he needs it, as opposed to the others that do not even know they need any advice at any time, so they will get it regardless.

[szilard]

I think that quote of Nyn's "meltdown" shows quite clearly the closeness they have together as "brother/sister." No one speaks to the dragon reborn like that unless they have a relationship as close as a family member. I understand the desire to deepen their relationship as "brother/sister" through dialogue but their actions, all the way to the end of the series, describes volumes of their trust, love for each other, and ultamately defines their relationship.

 

True.