Sherlock Holmes Role Madness Mafia Town wins

[Turin Turambar]

@Len, First off the line about the dinner was a dig at Mynd not being in the thread. I didn't mean to imply that you were faking about going out. Sorry if it came out that way. 

 

As to the points. My tone was exactly that it made NO sense to go at Ithi as she has been IMO as town as can be in her posting. Sometimes mafia get flusterd tho and try to make a big play. It would still make sense to try especially if there was a chance you could get saved by a governor.

 

I am not clearing him on the character at all. I wasn't even voting him as I am thinking that X is more likely mafia early. I was finding it odd that Mynd was portraying the character as a pure scum alignment when from what is actually written to me would make her survivor at worst and quite possible as town. I only know what I am reading in the wiki because I never really read the books. So I am not putting much stock into the characters and was finding it very odd that Mynd was using a character reference (wrongly IMO) to draw such a conclusion. 

 

Last for my part, about the lurking, maybe it was unfortunate timing but even you must admit that you had not posted for some time until right when the entire thing went down. Would you say that Hallia was lurking? 

[Tsukibana]

X vs Tsuki seemed forced. It was a very minor point that they were arguing and yet not voting each other. It tool Ithi's persistence to get Tsuki to vote. I smell a classic distancing here. The posts did not feel natural at all.

 

 

Umm... it took TIME for me to place the vote, or do you miss the whole "don't post first day" thing I do that some people call stupid??

 

I like the way your list has all the people who are being read as scum solidly in the middle of the pack. Way to avoid taking a stand - call the current scum reads null, pick the few people who haven't been judged one way or another (all voteless, irc, before the challenge), and lock clear Turin and Ithi cause you ain't got the britches to antagonize EITHER of them...

 

Whole post and list smell funny to me.

[Ithillian Turambar]

Mynd went Offline at 4.56pm BST today btw.

 

What time was the challenge issued?

 

It's 19.43pm BST now - so it must have been very close to the time all this kicked off.

 

I guess we have to wait for him to come back to figure out what he's up to.

[Pralaya]

Umm... it took TIME for me to place the vote, or do you miss the whole "don't post first day" thing I do that some people call stupid??

 

I saw that. It looked like an excuse nite than anything.

 

I like the way your list has all the people who are being read as scum solidly in the middle of the pack. Way to avoid taking a stand - call the current scum reads null, pick the few people who haven't been judged one way or another (all voteless, irc, before the challenge), and lock clear Turin and Ithi cause you ain't got the britches to antagonize EITHER of them...

 

Whole post and list smell funny to me.

Eh? Why should I have the same scum reads as others? Or as majority? You seem to be grasping at straws here. Not that you or X haven't been FoSed either.

 

Also, I am taking a stance. I have my scum reads right there.

[Ithillian Turambar]

For those who may have just thought I was having a 'hissy fit'

 

Mynd also changed his mind about what he said about the character. He said she was likely to be a mafia role and then said he never said that - twice - till I quoted him, and then said that she would be a mafia or 3rd party role.

 

He was getting muddled up about what he'd said and people who are telling the truth don't do that.

 

Because they don't have to try and remember what they made up.

 

Anyways I checked and Thane made his comment about finding out who was considered to me more Town out of me and him a little while before the challenge was issued and he logged off shortly afterwards.

 

So - maybe he had plans and stuff

 

Or maybe he thought he'd done enough that he'd come back and I'd be dead.

 

 

I think there were some pretty awful posts just after the challenge by Len and also Hallia. CSarmi asking for a full claim from both of us was also pretty bad.

[Ithillian Turambar]

I mean Mynd made his comment - not Thane.

 

I think I need a nap.

[Hallia]

I don't think what Csarmi was asking for was that bad.

[Tsukibana]

 

Umm... it took TIME for me to place the vote, or do you miss the whole "don't post first day" thing I do that some people call stupid??

I saw that. It looked like an excuse nite than anything.

 

I like the way your list has all the people who are being read as scum solidly in the middle of the pack. Way to avoid taking a stand - call the current scum reads null, pick the few people who haven't been judged one way or another (all voteless, irc, before the challenge), and lock clear Turin and Ithi cause you ain't got the britches to antagonize EITHER of them...

 

Whole post and list smell funny to me.

Eh? Why should I have the same scum reads as others? Or as majority? You seem to be grasping at straws here. Not that you or X haven't been FoSed either.

 

Also, I am taking a stance. I have my scum reads right there.

 

 

I call BS on that - you were just in the OUAT game with me - I did the SAME THING. Or are you gonna rip off Ithi and say you only play in the moment??

 

NOT grasping as straws. just stating it is convenient that you neither have came out and called the "current gen" of scum-reads town or scum. It's like you are shrugging your shoulders and going "meh, can't clear em, cause that'll make me look bad when they flip scum, but can't call em scum cause they don't need anymore pressure than they already got".

You AREN'T taking a stance. You "conveniently" don't have to place a vote on any of the people on the scum list. You may not be active on the weekends, but you sure made an appearance once the challenge had been issued (to be fair, so did a lot of others).

[Turin Turambar]

Did you say that about not voting in the first 24 hours of a day? or is that only D1? I don't remember either way TBH.

 

I must say I don't agree with all of the places that people are listed by Pral and can see how that could look like mafia hiding since they can get away without voting any of them today. But it is a stance and is on record. Now if they change drastically tomorrow then that would be a huge red flag.

[Ithillian Turambar]

TBH - I think that most people have a much better memory than I do. It used to be quite good - you ask me something I learned about some random thing and I'd know the answer. I'm a whiz in a pub quiz.

 

You ask me to remember what happened in the last game I played and I just don't know - unless it was something brilliant that really stood out. I don't mean to make it difficult for you but I simply can't hold onto all this stuff.

 

I'm sure I'd play better if I did - but I can't.

 

Len posting about going to Father's day reminded me that I also have a Father and I was able to text him. Yup - it really is like that - although we don't see each other a lot these days. If it's not in my phone or repeated and rote remembered - or useless junk fact - it's simply not staying put these days.

[Turin Turambar]

I don't think what Csarmi was asking for was that bad.

You believe that both of them are town correct? So following that premise,how is it a good thing to force them BOTH to full claim in this situation. Then what we end up with is one dead town player and one forced to claim that might well be killed due to said claim. Or at best two that were forced to claim if you should deem to pardon them.

[Hallia]

Treasure your dad as long as you have him, it's a gift to be able to text him

[Hallia]

I'm not 100%, but I feel good as far as Ithi, not sure on Mynd because well, he's vanished.

[Ithillian Turambar]

I certainly didn't mean to forget. It's more like it didn't register that today was father's day and thus I should have got my own father something.

 

I got the boy's dad a few nice things.

 

I'm just not wired right atm. Hopefully it will all come back once things settle down.

 

but I'm ok - really :)

[Hallia]

^_^ You're the best Ithi.

[Mrs. Cindy Gill]

Vote count:

 

Mynd (5): Ithi, Turin, Tsuki, Chae, Pral

Ithi (1): Mynd

 

 

Not Voting (10): everyone else

 

 

With 16 alive it takes 9 to lynch.A deadline is now in effect.

 

DL is set for Tues. June 17th at 9 PM EST.

[Hallia]

We have plenty of time, stop voting him until we hear from him, it doesn't seem fair not to hear him out as well.

[Tsukibana]

Did you say that about not voting in the first 24 hours of a day? or is that only D1? I don't remember either way TBH.

 I try not to vote first 24 hours of the day, as it gives me time to get stuff read, and avoid making bad calls. Also, since days usually start in the week, it gives me time to read while still doing the work thing. When I vote, I like to be able to place a case on the guy first, see how he responds. That said, I have been known to go against that policy - UOAT game, day three (I think) I jumped on Thane almost instantly, and almost got myself lynched (when me and AJ started going at each other hard), and did it once in the Real Genius game, and it turned out I had been led by scum...

[Lenlo]

 

My unvote is believing that it would be unlikely to claim vanilla town as a fake claim in a role madness game - I was still a bit iffy on him though.

 

I do have to confess that my view on him as Town strengthened when I saw how hard Mynd wanted him Lynched.

 

What is your view on Thane & BG@ Tsuki - same to you Tina.

 

If I were Gaming the Mod I's assume that one of Thane or BG was lying - but as I don't know for sure that there is only one VT in the game I will watch how they go.

 

I see how Tina put a negative spin on my reasoning though - do you want me to get into trouble? maybe you'd prefer me to be MKd?

 

 

 

 

I need to concentrate on scrabble now. It's very close.

 

 

Does no-one want to ask Mynd any questions? Do you know that he won't be about or sommat?

Already answered @ Len.

 

I wasn't having a hissy fit with Mynd. I believed he was intentionally trying to lead the Jury with misinformation about a character.

 

I think Turin was more having a ponder about Mynd's vanishing act that you going to your Father's Day do. You didn't stay for very long. You should have stayed and had a chill and stuff.

 

Im popping in and our via phone, im still out. :D

 

@ Len. I didn't say the missrepping thing. That was you.

 

I messed the quotes up.

 

I couldn't give a flying fox about misrepping cos everything comes out in the wash at the end.

 

You do seem quite concerned about it. You've said it a couple of times. You could just say what you meant instead of going all negative and aggro with the 'stop misrepping me stuff'

 

after all - did you not just say that two people could have completely different interpretations of what was written on a page, and that was perfectly ok?

Ah sorry, I thought you had said that and copied what I wrote to be kinda mocking. Didnt know the quote messed up. It has also been a very fun, if kinda stressful, day so im abit out of sorts.

 

@Len, First off the line about the dinner was a dig at Mynd not being in the thread. I didn't mean to imply that you were faking about going out. Sorry if it came out that way. 

 

As to the points. My tone was exactly that it made NO sense to go at Ithi as she has been IMO as town as can be in her posting. Sometimes mafia get flusterd tho and try to make a big play. It would still make sense to try especially if there was a chance you could get saved by a governor.

 

I am not clearing him on the character at all. I wasn't even voting him as I am thinking that X is more likely mafia early. I was finding it odd that Mynd was portraying the character as a pure scum alignment when from what is actually written to me would make her survivor at worst and quite possible as town. I only know what I am reading in the wiki because I never really read the books. So I am not putting much stock into the characters and was finding it very odd that Mynd was using a character reference (wrongly IMO) to draw such a conclusion. 

 

Last for my part, about the lurking, maybe it was unfortunate timing but even you must admit that you had not posted for some time until right when the entire thing went down. Would you say that Hallia was lurking? 

Sorry Turin, I misunderstood what you meant though I do appreciate the apology even though it was my bad.

 

Yes your correct the timing of my posting was very poor, but nothing I can do to help that I post when I can. Trying to see things from a clearer/your point of view now. For Hallia yes I would. she was relatively quite until this whole thing happened.

[Myndrunner]

For reference....

My case against Thane.

 

 

By sooth and spit in a pint of ale, I be here!!!  Ain't NOBODY gonna talk 'bout Gentleman Holmes wittttout dealin' wit me farst! *burp*

 

Still catching up, but I'm already at 7 Multi-Quotes, so.....

 

I'm Thaddeus Sholto, Town Miller.

It really sucks to get dealt a miller role.  csarmi's play here places him in the "likely truthful" column simply because this is one of the only real ways to play.  If you are miller, the best pro-town move is to get it out there in the open.  He risks nothing by doing so IF he is telling the truth.  It's already out there and now our cop won't waste his/her time targeting him. 

 

Sure, there is a slim chance that this is one huge scum gambit, but for csarmi to have sat back prior to the game start, researched all the possible characters who would fit in the role of a miller, then tossed the dice that someone else wasn't also roled the same way just so that MAYBE we would believe him and not lynch him to be sure is HIGHLY unlikely.  

 

csarmi is likely telling the truth and made a very pro-town move. 

 

You're missing the point I think. Miller is a negative utility role. Usually better off dead.

So you for anything for now Thane?

 

^ First sentence here sums it up.  Better come clean immediately when you are a Miller.  I HATE that role!!!  I look scummy just fine WITHOUT it!

 

i'm surprised it took so long before someone voted me....

 

Thane had me on his side until THIS!  Posts like the one above are usually a guilty conscience trying to downplay how nervous they really are.  They serve no other purpose than to say "I'm not really bothered by this vote because you are just seeing my everyday town game play scummy which is typical. *whistles*"

 

Thane thinks is weird to claim Miller straight off - then is all friendly - then says hey could still be suspicious.

Uses 'scum' a lot.

Say's I'm voting him cos I always think he's mafia and that I'll always be wrong.

Firstly - it's what he's done this game that makes me believe he is Mafia.

Secondly he attempted to nullify my vote by implying it's just me doing what I always do.

Thirdly - how will I always be wrong about him being Mafia? Is he saying he's never going to be Mafia?

I think he is and I think I have spotted him early as Mafia in the past too.

 

 

*waves back*

 

Would Thane be someone else, i'd probably vote him.

But Thane is Thane and he has his very "special" way to play. For the moment i have to say that he sounds relaxed and chatty... which makes me think he could be town.

Ithi has made a nice case, but as I said, Thane has his way to play.

Need a pillow for that soft defense?  I'm glad you think Ithi made a nice case.  Did she put glitter and stars on it for you too?  Are you gonna hang her nice case up on your fridge so the whole family can see?  Thane being skeptical about csarmi's claim is not scummy, but this pillow defense of him makes me question BOTH of you.

 

Alright, I am softclaiming. I am PR

Really? Me too!!!  We're TWINZIES!!!!

 

BTW, soft defense of Chels noted.

 

I never understand why on day one people wanna defend all over the place, rather than attack.

 

I think like this kid!

 

 

 

And now-I'm going to watch the Opening ceremony. Later

OLE!!!! OLE OLE OLE!!!!!!!!

 

 

So, i'm here and will comment a bit:

 

Yes Ithi, i was at work, i have notifications but no DM access.

 

someone missed me joking, so here it is: Dammit Csarmi, you ruined my groove and now i can't claim Miller anymore! *shakefist*
 
And, i am not scum, i haven't even been provided with a PR... i'm a plain townie. So much for Role madness.... or they got afraid i might vig townies again like in my last game (whoa, another joke!) I do believe Role madness here would indicate at least one JOAT on each side, mafia definately with a GF, and one (perhaps 2) third party/parties.
 
I love the attention, but for scum we need to look elsewhere.... i have a crazy theory, but i'll need to investigate that before i put it out. I do think however that one of the lurkers (at least one) is scum hiding for the moment. eeny meeny miny mo... random guess Tina, but i could be wrong... it's still D1 and we need some of the lurkers to post here to get some reads.

 

My view on the X-files: i think X would be more worried if his train got bigger. What i see here is townies going after eachother, no real mafia in there...

 

Ithi is town, from what i can tell. So are the people 'defending' me, from my pov.

 

and now, seeing i hurt my back last weekend, i will go to bed soon

 

Thane....dude....this kills me to say it but this reeks of desperation from a scum trying to downplay the heat of TWO FRIGGEN VOTES.  The fact that you automatically assume that Ithi is town further suggests a guilty conscience.  Hey, let's look at the inactives?  If you went head to head with Ithi and called her on her weak case, that would have been one thing but you seem resigned to believe her.....and I'm starting to as well.

 

Does anyone else think that what X just said seems awfully familiar?



It's like Deja Vu or sommat.

 

I don't think I've ever said that I know how someone behaves because of past games.

Town or Mafia.

I don't do meta.

I think I did say that Thane shouldn't say I'd never be right if I said he was Mafia - and that I had found him as mafia early on in a game, but that was because of what he did in that game.

I can't hold Meta. I play in the moment. I can just about manage to hold a game till the end and then it's gone.

Ithi, we should play poker some time.  Bring all of your money.  After all, it's just about the cards.  Be sure not to meta the players when you do. 

 

Thane  what exactly does your PM say you are?

 

Dice! Stop reading my MYND and posting my thoughts before I get to!!!!!!

 

Inquiring MYNDS do want to know though....who is Thane's Role?  I find it highly UNlikely that Thane is vanilla in a game called ROLE-MADNESS.  Sure, it is possible, but so is it possible that lobsters will crawl out of my anus and dance the Nae Nae down Main Street. 

 

Thane has basically resigned to Ithi's weak case, suggested we go after inactives, and reduced his town value to "VANILLA" which gives us little risk. 

 

A lynch on Thane would A) confirm he was vanilla, and say a lot about his accusers and defenders   B) bag us a scummy on D1.

 

My only other thought here is that maybe Thane is masking a more valuable TOWN role, but in a game called ROLE MADNESS, he would be one of many roled townies so his value would still be next to nil as far as risk.

 

It makes sense.....   [v] Thane [/v]

 

Convince me otherwise, bro, and I'll remove my vote.

 

 

 

 

so, yeah, i'm calling BS on Ithi's reasoning. Says she plays every game as every game, i keep getting the same crap from her and it's annoying me. I'm always read as scum by a lot of people, it's my playstyle and she knows it. Last game, Ithi called me scum, i was lynched D1 (with selfvote) and flipped... town. Wow, what a surprise.

 

Ithi: tunnelvision, BS reasoning, likely scum. If you're town, go hunt for real and not lynch another townie again. 

 

Hence, Des: follows Ithi easily, no investigation of his own = possible scum

 

And Len, waiting to hammer, Possible scum too. 

 

I'll go play in my other current game, it's more fun than this one.

 

 

 

 

I think we just solved the game.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...and now, here is where the debate about character claims begins.

 

 

 

 

 

ok, skimming is bad: i missed BFG's claim there. Seeing it's a hard claim, i will give you my name too: i'm Irene Adler. And i'm still town.

 

Could it be Two townies in a game? Or is it IMPOSSIBLE to have 2 VT's in a role madness game? After all, it's the mod who gives out roles to his/her liking. I seriously get the feeling that everybody plays 'how it was and how it should be' instead of 'what are the real possibilities'.

 

I'm terribly sorry, but there is no FRIGGEN way that Irene Alder is vanilla town.  Oh quite the contrary.

 

second bolded is perfect example for first bolded....

 

 

Sure, it is possible that a game built around the Sherlock Holmes mythology would have Irene Adler as a vanilla town, but it is also possible that the sun will explode today.  It is very unlikely, but it might. 

 

Claiming to be Irene Adler in a Sherlock Mafia game is the equivalent of claiming to be Catwoman in a Batman mafia game.  There is too much history between her and Mr. Holmes for her to be vanilla town.  She is either scum or some kind of third party character. 

 

She would be a terrible fake claim as well. 

 

So yeah, there is nothing wrong with playing on how it should be or supposed to be AND playing what is possible......but to use the good detectives own words,

 

When you eliminate the impossible, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truth.

 

...and now my follow-up to that would be, sort information into likely and unlikely using logic.  Go with the choice that seems most logical because it likely is the truth.

 

 

 

 

Never heard of this woman so I read the wiki now.

I disagree with Mynd, she could easily be a lot of roles, VT included.

Relying on char claims is a bad idea BTW.

 

I'll address the irony of the bold in a moment, Mr. Miller.

 

Again, it is possible she would be VT, but highly unlikely.  She is a character DEEP in the Sherlock Holmes mythology and a devious one.  Mrs. Hudson would be a likely VT character, but not Irene "Black Widow" Adler.  I can almost hear the character herself scoffing at the notion that she would be vanilla in any game. 

 

This is Irene Adler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utwenXbh9hA  (SPOILER!)

 

This is also Irene Adler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1hcFQzeq_Q  (NSFW)

 

Now then, we have moved you to the not likely scum list BECAUSE of your role claim.  It is all possible that you are a LLL, but unlikely.  The best course of action is to go with the move that gives us the most information.  You claim Miller in your first post.  We could lynch you to prove you are telling the truth, but that would be a waste if you indeed flipped as you said.  Anyone who has had a miller role should understand that there are only a handful of ways to play it, and coming clean on D1 is extremely pro-town.

 

As far as relying on character claims, sure anything goes and nothing is certain, but when the goal is to seek out what is likely over what is unlikely, it can be useful. A WOT game would likely make Rand al'Thor a powered town player, or at the very least, vanilla town.   Graendal, on the other hand, would not likely be a vanilla town at all, would she?  Even Lanfear would likely be something other than vanilla town. 

 

 

 

 

I must have missed where I actually said that Irene Adler would be scum.   Could someone point that out to me?

 

 

I am very surprised no one is hammering Ithi and Turin right now for their baffling logic.  I am not sure what happened, but one minute, I was having a debate with csarmi about whether or not character claims are relevant to casing.  Suddenly, Ithi and Turin are lunging at me with rabid fangs claiming that I am pushing for Thane's lynch.   I ask you to go back and read where I was pushing for Thane exactly. 

 

Keep in mynd, that I had already voted Thane ages ago at this point.  At first, it was a pressure vote but when he "quit" I kept it right there. 

 

Turin is "demanding" my scum casings or something, Ithi is making comments that I guess she thinks makes her look cute, but what exactly have they done today that has been founded in real scumhunting?

 

The likelyhood that Thane is telling the truth is slim, but still, even if you believe Thane, would you defend him to the rabid dog level that Ithi and Turin have done?

 

I assumed everyone else would see this stark raving insanity for what I see it as......scum protecting their own.  Even if Ithi is town, do you really consider what she has posted as helpful to the town?  So, I activated my one shot gladiator role.  I am Wiggins, Leader of the Baker Street Irregulars, Holmes little minions.  Here is a link to my wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiggins_%28Sherlock_Holmes_character%29#Wiggins

 

I really am surprised anyone sees Ithi and Turin town a this point.  I dare say that at best, their rabid attack was personal? I hope not.   I hope it is just gameplay.  No reason to ever take a game like this personal.  If it is gameplay, however, I really don't understand exactly what I did to suddenly warrant this kind of reaction.

 

I leave it to the town....who would you rather want to remain in this game?  Me or Ithi.  Your call.

[Ithillian Turambar]

I don't seem to be the one calling people rabid dogs repeatedly.

 

Nor the one who shot my load off at the first bit of pressure.

 

And I'm being emotional and personal?

 

 

I think you are mistook.

 

 

 

You won't Lynch me today. Hopefully your Governor friend will save you.

 

Because basically I must be Mafia because I said you were wrong and I think you Mafia.

[Ithillian Turambar]

Because I don't believe for one second that you actually believe anything that you've posted.

 

You're not that emo.

 

You a player - yes?

 

Hence - this is playing.

[Myndrunner]

I don't seem to be the one calling people rabid dogs repeatedly.

 

Nor the one who shot my load off at the first bit of pressure.

 

And I'm being emotional and personal?

 

 

I think you are mistook.

 

 

 

You won't Lynch me today. Hopefully your Governor friend will save you.

 

Because basically I must be Mafia because I said you were wrong and I think you Mafia.

 

If you don't think that your reaction to my debate with csarmi was extreme and maybe a bit personal, then I can't help you.

[Ithillian Turambar]

However - just because I know you're making stuff up again.

 

Please provide quotes of anything I said that could have possibly been taken as personal and not just pointing out the mistakes you made in your posts.

 

Thank you.

 

Although I did mention Old yeller after the first time you called me a rabid dog.

 

And I mentioned your big hat.

 

But otherwise.

 

Mynd appealing to the audience because he has hurt feelings is just total funny.

[Ithillian Turambar]

 

I don't seem to be the one calling people rabid dogs repeatedly.

 

Nor the one who shot my load off at the first bit of pressure.

 

And I'm being emotional and personal?

 

 

I think you are mistook.

 

 

 

You won't Lynch me today. Hopefully your Governor friend will save you.

 

Because basically I must be Mafia because I said you were wrong and I think you Mafia.

 

If you don't think that your reaction to my debate with csarmi was extreme and maybe a bit personal, then I can't help you.

 

Not personal. I don't need your help.

 

Please provide any quotes that back up your baseless accusations.