[Game]: Black Tower Mafia II - The revolt.

[ReleaseTheEvil]

What anti-town behaviour?

 

Inquiring about an inactive player who had drawn a lot of heat and had yet to show up?

 

Prepare the noose...

 

I don't have to worry about csarmi buddying me, he has to worry about that. That is his play. If I buddied up to you right now would that be my problem or yours?

[hazelkrs1]

Lol @ CSarmi. Now the semantics debate about defending/not defending.

 

 

I don't care two bits what kind of scumhunting you prefer from me. My scumhunting has led to good things before. I think I'll stick with it, thank you. And for the record, Wombat likes the way I scumhunt

[hazelkrs1]

It would be my problem, RTE, since helping to find scum is EVERY townie's problem and responsibility. Pray hadn't caught much serious heat besides the quick train on him that developed out of nowhere. And as I mentioned, he isn't the only inactive player in the game. Why were you so worried about whether or not he'd get replaced, as opposed to the other inactive players?

 

No, you saw an easy train to join, and joined it. Cause you're mafia.

[csarmi]

Lol @ CSarmi. Now the semantics debate about defending/not defending.

Oh yes the semantics. I defended no one. For the record, I don't like RTE's play either.

 

I just find this modkilling argument (as a whole) disgusting. That's why I asked you to drop it.

[hazelkrs1]

In other words, it WOULD be your problem RTE, CS buddying up to you. Scum don't turn themselves in very often, or at least since Rand got busy. Townies should be concerned with people buddying them, as its possible those people are scum. Townies don't like being linked to possible scum, so would pay special attention to those who come to their defense apropos of nothing.

[hazelkrs1]

Okay well what else bothers you about RTE's play CS? I'm not going to drop the modkill argument just because you say so. That isn't the only point I raised against RTE tho.

[csarmi]

I don't care two bits what kind of scumhunting you prefer from me. My scumhunting has led to good things before. I think I'll stick with it, thank you. And for the record, Wombat likes the way I scumhunt

Before you point out why I wasn't reacting on this part - I don't think I can do that without getting myself a Post Restriction.

[hazelkrs1]

?

 

Have no idea what you're referring to there, CS. /shrug

[hazelkrs1]

I didn't expect a reaction to that tho

[csarmi]

@Despo - RTE doesn't seem to be interested in scumhunting, there's the "I will catch up" post and the "I can't believe you guys lynched me" post and now he's getting defensive.

[hazelkrs1]

I agree with all those points. So why not join me on the train?

[csarmi]

I still prefer to toss the Dice though :)

[hazelkrs1]

Anyways, I'm headed to bed. See y'all later.

[鲍勃不是我的名字]

 

 

@Turin:

 

RTE all but asked me to make that statement. You're harping on this being a basic game is noted. Hint: read the rules.

Did he ask you to make it twice?

 

If you could be clearer about the read the rules instruction. I just reread them and don't see what you are getting at. Or was that a roundabout way to remind me to be nice?

 

Nope. NotBob kept asking me about my announcement yesterday (still don't know why), so in the end I decided to post it as clearly and as fully as I could.

 

RTE asked me if I was scum. What else could that be than asking for an LD statement?

Him having an LD shot is very low, but I saw no reason not to comply.

 

As for the rules, I'm not sure if you're being obtuse on purpose here. Read the part about what kind of game it is (right before the list of rules).

 

 

You made a claim.  I wanted to understand that claim for later analysis.

[鲍勃不是我的名字]

Too many players mailing this game in.

 

Still have two players with less posts than Basel or Darthe.

 

***looks at Pralaya and Dice***

 

Get busy living or get busy dying. 

[Turin Turambar]

Csarmi, I read the rules yet again. It clearly states that the roles in the game are basic. There are other things that can happen that I read to be possible random occurrences. Now you may have more information about this than I do since you claim to have been affected on night 1. I can only guess you are saying that your not being viewable N1 was do to an effect. Of course I am wondering if it waa merely a ploy to avoid being viewed. Small basic game means mafia can win by putting slightest bits of doubt in town minds. Fear of a wasted view when every one counts. Obvious LD statement n a game unlikely to have an LD. Looks shady to.me

 

RTE, yes I'm town. Win with town. And my willingness to say so has no bearing on anything. Even in a game with a LD mafia will lie knowing that they have to. But in this game without one (my opinion) then mafia will be even more brazen about it. Which is my point about csarmi trumpeting his townie-ness at the slightest prompt. Your current I'm town so I don't care if someone buddies me is also in the same vein. Sketchy..

 

Despo, stop agreeing with me... It is like we are in an alternate universe.

[Turin Turambar]

BTW csarmi, are you viewable tonight?

[csarmi]

Csarmi, I read the rules yet again. It clearly states that the roles in the game are basic. There are other things that can happen that I read to be possible random occurrences. Now you may have more information about this than I do since you claim to have been affected on night 1. I can only guess you are saying that your not being viewable N1 was do to an effect.

I was told a couple of hours after the start of D1 that I was gonna be unviewable on N1. That must have been some sort of event, effect, whatever.

In any case, I'm not ready to make assumptions about what may and what may not happen.

 

I'm sure you see what I mean.

 

If someone wants me to to clarify my announcement, sure.

If someone wants me to make an LD statement for some reason, fine, why not.

[Turin Turambar]

Get busy living or get busy dying.

Shawshank'd... Love that film.

[Turin Turambar]

Has anyone else been told they have been affected with regard to N1? I would not want anyone else to announce any abilities gained that would effect N2.,

 

This is too see if the effects were handled the same way?

Corroborate or counter csarmi's take will lead to.more discussions hopefully netting the mafia.

[Pralaya]

Alright, went through the whole thread. No kidding, I missed a lot. Sorry/
 
Let's start with this.
 

ok, not as much use as I first thought, cos I misjudged the numbers slightly, but anyway, this was my thought.
 
I am prone to beleive that there was one or two mafia voting Ley before he revealed, wether to run a quick lynch, or buddy town or whatever, their votes wouldn't stand out in all the other quick voting.
 
These are the people who were voting Ley, in the order they voted
 
Cloud
Turin
Darthe
Desp
Csarmi
Basel
 
now that means that there are two (or maybe three if there was only one mafia voting Ley) out of the people not voting Ley.
 
not voting Ley
Dice
Talya
Ed
NotBob
Lenlo
Pralya
RTE
 
Town:
Ley and me
 
so yes, I am aware that I have just divided everyone into two roughly equal groups and said there are two mafia in each, but it was a much better idea when I thought for some reason there were people voting Ley (I got confused with the number needed to lynch) . when that second group would only have had five people in it.
 
But still, I think there's a good chance that three out of those seven are mafia, maybe only two. And this is a list generated from gameplay, not just randomly picked names.

 
First, that is a nice little analysis. I agree with via that there is at least one scum in both the lists. At the same time, I am not comfortable with the timing of this post. This is something most people would have thought of when there is information available - maybe later in the game or when alignments are revealed. Anyway, I colored the town and that definitely helps us shorten the list.
 
Next, let us look at Basel's lynch
 
 
Basel (8): Ed, Turin, Ley,  Lenlo, Dice, Via, Cloud, Csarmi
 
The most interesting of those two vote counts are Cloud and Turin. Both of them had early votes on Ley and both of did start the train on Basel. While Turin stays consistent on his vote, the voting pattern of Cloud did seem interesting. After starting the train on Basel, he drops out when there has been sufficient votes on him, votes the other train which is growing (presumably to get two set of votes) and then switches back to Basel with the pretext of consolidation.
 
Here are his vote pattern

 

 

Unvote.
 

You were at L-2.

I was at either L-2 or L-1, Csarmi. So, yeah...

You were at 6 votes, 8 to lynch, so L-2. I don't think you were in any real danger of being lynched, not yet.

 

 
Are you seriously claiming that L - 2 isn't in danger of being lynched? A person can pick up two votes awfully fast.

 

 
Now, after Csarmi said that Basel placed the L-2 vote I went back to check and he actually did. And yet he now appears to be FoSing Csarmi for saying that running someone up to L-2 isn't dangerous!
 
Vote Basel

 

 
Picked up a slip from Basel (Turin actually pointed it out) . At this point BAsel had 2 votes on him and probably noticed that he was a viable lynch.
 
The Basel train, obviously picks up and reaches to 6 votes on him
 
And, then there is this post - http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/85585-game-black-tower-mafia-ii-the-revolt/?p=3067198
Splitting it up and taking only the important parts
 
 

I found Basel saying that Ley's superdefensive play was a slip pinging and it appears as if he was just parroting Darthe and Des who were also on Ley's train, and him not checking the vote count before he voted wasn't a pro-town move at all considering how fast his train was going. Him saying that he miscounted is convenient, but it doesn appear to match his later post where he was FoSing Salami for saying that Ley wasn't in danger of getting lynched while was at L-2. I also got a townie vibe from his last couple of posts.

 
He starts off by saying all those points that made him suspicious of Basel. Valid points, without the advantage of hindsight. But then, he drops the last line. Very convenient. I went back and saw Basels posts before Cloud's and frankly did not see anything that outrightly gave a good vibe on him. It as just Basel defending some points and giving out his reads. Nothing by Cloud on what posts by Basel he found townish.
 
And, in the same posts he unvotes Basel and votes Lenlo.
 

 

@Lenlo: its uberscummy to try and look more townie by scolding everyone for something in hindsight. How was anyone that joke-voted Ley (I think the majority of votes on his train) supposed to know if he was the cop?
 
For that matter, how do you know he isn't lying? How do you know we don't already have one scum in the bag by pressuring someone easy to pressure right off the bat?
 
You trying to scold everyone when he brought all the negative attention on himself with that guidelines list is completely unnecessary.
 
Also, your vote on Basel does seem somewhat opportunistic to me (you just parrot what others have said about him), but lastly you trying to stick to your fos on Pray for his first post when EVERYONE else in the game saw that as a joke-post, and Pray himself said it was, is enought to make me
 
Unvote, Vote Lenlo

 
I agree with your case on Lenlo and so I will move my vote to him.
 
 
Unvote, Vote Lenlo

 

 
At this point Lenlo had 3 votes and Basel had 6 votes. Unvoting Basel for a frivolous reason and voting Lenlo parroting Des' case on him. End result - kind of evened out the train as the deadline was approaching.
 
And, finally, the obligatory "consolidation vote"

I simply quoted his case because I agreed with everything he was saying about Lenlo.
 
 
Unvote, Vote Basel for consolidation. I will make sure to check in just before the deadline on my phone and switch my vote again if need be.

 

Tl;Dr 

Both his votes, he was picking up on easy slips by others. Both times he was parroting what others cased. Was early on both Ley's and Basels' train. Dropped out when the train had enough people to even it out with Lenlo's train. Consolidated back on Basel on deadline.

 

vote Cloud

[Pralaya]

All caught up. Not sure how informative the lynch nor the NK was but we'll make due with what we have.

 

Vote Pral. Now let's hope he doesn't just get replaced... Modkilled would give us more info.

 

Also can't believe you guys lynched "me".

 

Going to try to be much more active, especially now that I got caught up on about 175 posts...

 

This post is interesting. Agreed, I was inactive and that's the reason for the vote. But, then at that point of time, RTE himself was not active. After his initial talks about Ley situation and modkilling, he was kind of absent till Basel got lynched. 

 

He then starts the talk of replacement and modkilling but I think that has been covered alreasy.

[Lenlo]

Good case Pral. My big reasons for wanting to lynch you before was that initial scummy post and how quiet youd been but now your back and making good cases so one of those no longer applies. Having read that case im good with either an RTE or Cloud lynch today but id prefer RTE if I had the choice.

 

unvote RTE

[Lenlo]

unvote vote RTE

 

My bad

[csarmi]

So.

 

Yup I got no special effect on me now as far as I'm aware.

 

I read as town too, nothing special about that.

 

I was told specifically that it were to affect last night only. I have checked with the mod anyway and I was told that indeed its only Night1.