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A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

Favorite Wheel of Time curse


LeeM.Erickson
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I came on here to post this topic, and saw that there was a similar one about favorite Wheel of Time sayings. But that seems more serious, I thought it would be fun to hear everyone's favorite Wheel of Time curse (or just general exclamation).

 

For me, it begins and ends with "Mother's milk in a cup!"

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"Bloody ashes" says it all.

 

Do I remember correctly that some people were bummed on this one? Thought RJ always said "blood and ashes" or "blood and bloody ashes" and BS botched it...

Indeed, it was completely botched.

 

 

'Blood and ashes!' would probably be my favorite. I also liked 'Phaw!'

 

My favorite instance of cussing would definitely be Uno in TFoH, when he's trying to limit himself to one every other sentence. It was a great example of RJ's ability to put two very different characters together with hilarious results.

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"Bloody ashes" says it all.

 

Do I remember correctly that some people were bummed on this one? Thought RJ always said "blood and ashes" or "blood and bloody ashes" and BS botched it...

Indeed, it was completely botched.

 

 

'Blood and ashes!' would probably be my favorite. I also liked 'Phaw!'

 

My favorite instance of cussing would definitely be Uno in TFoH, when he's trying to limit himself to one every other sentence. It was a great example of RJ's ability to put two very different characters together with hilarious results.

 

 

If, "blood and bloody ashes" is legit, then how is it a stretch to think someone might occasionally say just, "bloody Ashes?". I mean seriously... do you need something to complain about SO badly...?

 

"Phaw" hands down.

 

^^ This

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My favorite? When one of the sea folk referred to someone as a "fish loving such and such" and the character (Nynaeve or Elayne I think?) didn't understand what they meant. Blood and ashes is classic though.

 

As to the botching of "Blood and ashes". Well, it's true, sure people do say "blood and bloody ashes" when very angry/frustrated, but Brandon didn't just occasionally use "Bloody ashes", he consistently and repeatedly said it in such a way that it made it appear that he actually just messed up one of the most common oaths in the series, replacing the classic version.

 

Something like that stands out, and it is a very valid critisiscm of someone entrusted to be true to the series. I realize it appears small, and truly it isn't a big deal. I like Brandon's writing, but it definitely jars everytime I read it...well, that and the word tempest.

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If, "blood and bloody ashes" is legit, then how is it a stretch to think someone might occasionally say just, "bloody Ashes?". I mean seriously... do you need something to complain about SO badly...?

 

The "bloody" in "blood and bloody ashes" works as an interjection. It's merely one swear interjecting into another swear. It's like saying "abso-f*cking-lutely." When you remove the initial "blood" the "bloody" becomes the adjective form. And adjectives are supposed to merely add to a description. That is, removing them does not alter the sentence itself.

 

"The brown cat jumped."

 

"Brown" is an adjective. Removing it gives you the sentence "the cat jumped." The meaning is not lost.

 

Because "blood and ashes" does not work at two separate swears put together, saying "ashes" alone is not a swear. The only context we've ever seen "bloody" in is acting as an adjective. For example, "That bloody woman."

 

The only swear there is "bloody."

 

Along those lines, saying "bloody ashes" would mean that the "bloody" is the swear and it'd be equivalent to the character simply saying, "Ashes!" Which is patently ridiculous. No one would say that. So no one would say "bloody ashes."

Edited by Roxinos
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If, "blood and bloody ashes" is legit, then how is it a stretch to think someone might occasionally say just, "bloody Ashes?". I mean seriously... do you need something to complain about SO badly...?

 

The "bloody" in "blood and bloody ashes" works as an interjection. It's merely one swear interjecting into another swear. It's like saying "abso-f*cking-lutely." When you remove the initial "blood" the "bloody" becomes the adjective form. And adjectives are supposed to merely add to a description. That is, removing them does not alter the sentence itself.

 

"The brown cat jumped."

 

"Brown" is an adjective. Removing it gives you the sentence "the cat jumped." The meaning is not lost.

 

Because "blood and ashes" does not work at two separate swears put together, saying "ashes" alone is not a swear. The only context we've ever seen "bloody" in is acting as an adjective. For example, "That bloody woman."

 

The only swear there is "bloody."

 

Along those lines, saying "bloody ashes" would mean that the "bloody" is the swear and it'd be equivalent to the character simply saying, "Ashes!" Which is patently ridiculous. No one would say that. So no one would say "bloody ashes."

 

You can bend over backwards as far as you want to make this an issue, it's not. It's a curse... it doesn't need to make sense, just make you feel better when you yell it. "blood and bloody ashes" is a sentence fragment in itself, so your grammatical gymnastics is clearly a futile attempt to make a mountain out of a spec of dirt, if that.

 

For example, in Newfoundland they often say "Lord tunderin jesus" or "Lord tunderin jesus christ" or "tunderin jesus christ" or just "jesus christ" or "christ" or "Lord tunderin". Pwned.

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How about Elayne's "So pull your nose out of our coats, you summer ham"

 

I always figured that Elayne must have misunderstood the actual swear words, but for the life of me I can't figure out what it should be.

 

I like "sheep swallop and bloody buttered onions" too :) I don't know what it means either but it sounds downright nasty.

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You can bend over backwards as far as you want to make this an issue, it's not. It's a curse... it doesn't need to make sense, just make you feel better when you yell it. "blood and bloody ashes" is a sentence fragment in itself, so your grammatical gymnastics is clearly a futile attempt to make a mountain out of a spec of dirt, if that.

 

For example, in Newfoundland they often say "Lord tunderin jesus" or "Lord tunderin jesus christ" or "tunderin jesus christ" or just "jesus christ" or "christ" or "Lord tunderin". Pwned.

 

You're looking far too deeply into my post. I was merely answering a question. Why do people make such a big deal out of it? Well, because it breaks a subconsciously understood method for forming swears in the English language.

 

Do I personally care? No. Do I personally have a problem with Brandon Sanderson? No. Do I personally think he's single-handedly ruined the Wheel of Time? No. Do I think that phrases like "bloody ashes" and "blast" are ridiculous in the context of the Wheel of Time? Yes. But does that have anything to do with my post? Absolutely not.

 

I would go over why each of those swears from Newfoundland are grammatically correct, but I have no idea what "tunderin" means. Newfoundland is also home to a few unique dialects of the English language, and dialects often have their own unique rules (especially with regards to colloquialisms such as swearing).

 

It's not an issue. Actually, I'd say no one here really thinks it's an issue. However, there are certainly Sanderson-isms in the Wheel of Time, and to suggest there aren't is just...wow. I don't think there is a word that adequately sums up how muleheaded that idea is.

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It's not an issue. Actually, I'd say no one here really thinks it's an issue. However, there are certainly Sanderson-isms in the Wheel of Time, and to suggest there aren't is just...wow. I don't think there is a word that adequately sums up how muleheaded that idea is.

I'll just agree with this instead of going off on my own rant that says approximately the same thing (while being much less succinct) :rolleyes:

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For me the only reason 'bloody ashes' jarrs is because it marks a sudden inexplicable shift from everything depicted previously. I'm fine with the term itself, it's literally just the sudden change in so many characters speech pattern--with no catalyst--breaks the feel of continuity, and knocks you out of the story a little. Had, say, it just been Naef (whom we hadn't heard swear before), it wouldn't have bothered me at all.

 

It wasn't a huge issue, just a matter of flow in the reading.

 

 

As for my favourite--probably phaw!

 

My other one, and its not really cursing, but Siuan getting all dismissive of the Seanchan, calling them a lionfish with the Shadow as a shark, and Verin just calmly mentions that she'd seen a lionfish chase a shark into the the shallows where it died, and the dropping the bomb about the damane.

 

Love that moment.

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  • 1 year later...

 

"Flaming" seems a decent substitute for a much more familiar word with the same beginning :wink:

Flaming is actually used to swear in the real world, just like bloody.

 

 

Being Australian, I'm bloody used to the word bloody. Use it ever other sentence (I actually don't), but I don't hear a lot of people use 'flaming' as a curse word often. Perhaps it's just I haven't been to too many places. Do you know people or groups of people who use it often though?

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"Flaming" seems a decent substitute for a much more familiar word with the same beginning :wink:

Flaming is actually used to swear in the real world, just like bloody.

Being Australian, I'm bloody used to the word bloody. Use it ever other sentence (I actually don't), but I don't hear a lot of people use 'flaming' as a curse word often. Perhaps it's just I haven't been to too many places. Do you know people or groups of people who use it often though?

It has lost much popularity to other words these days, ones which the sites rules unfortunately bar me from using. But flaming does see some use still, here in Britain.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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