Verin's Letters

[Beer Rot]

I think a lot of people are reading Verin's judgement of Mat incorrectly.

 

She had no idea Moiraine might be alive, Mat put Moiraine above and beyond anything in that letter.

 

Also, why isn't this thread about Verin's LetterS

 

I'm FAR more interested in the ones she left Alanna and Rand, than the one she gave to Mat.

[NetSlider]

I think a lot of people are reading Verin's judgement of Mat incorrectly.

 

She had no idea Moiraine might be alive, Mat put Moiraine above and beyond anything in that letter.

 

Also, why isn't this thread about Verin's LetterS

 

I'm FAR more interested in the ones she left Alanna and Rand, than the one she gave to Mat.

 

We don't have a confirmation about Alanna getting a letter do we? (I didn't see anything about it). The whole Alanna situation is weird beyond weird. Maybe she left to save Logain? Or maybe she is black and simply ran after Rand finally felt balanced (she can feel his emotions). In any event (and I've always thought she was black BTW) we need a whole separate thread on Alanna if you ask me.

[Beer Rot]

I think a lot of people are reading Verin's judgement of Mat incorrectly.

 

She had no idea Moiraine might be alive, Mat put Moiraine above and beyond anything in that letter.

 

Also, why isn't this thread about Verin's LetterS

 

I'm FAR more interested in the ones she left Alanna and Rand, than the one she gave to Mat.

 

We don't have a confirmation about Alanna getting a letter do we? (I didn't see anything about it). The whole Alanna situation is weird beyond weird. Maybe she left to save Logain? Or maybe she is black and simply ran after Rand finally felt balanced (she can feel his emotions). In any event (and I've always thought she was black BTW) we need a whole separate thread on Alanna if you ask me.

 

Mat saw more letters with red wax seals in Verin's pouch in TGS, Envelope with a red wax seal was found in Alanna's room, Envelope with red wax seal was delivered to Rand in TV.

[AutomatedTeller]

There was an envelope that was described to be like Matt's in Alanna's quarters. Obviously, that may be a red-herring, but my conclusion is that she got one. As did Galad and Rand.

[Beer Rot]

There was an envelope that was described to be like Matt's in Alanna's quarters. Obviously, that may be a red-herring, but my conclusion is that she got one. As did Galad and Rand.

 

I missed this, could you point me to the chapter/page its in?

[NetSlider]

Now Galad's letter I missed completely. Hmmm.....In any event, I've requested Alanna thread - hopefully it'll come.

[Sharaman]

Alanna disappears into the Borderlands on VoG+2.

It's a reasonable guess that the letter was from Verin and like Caemlyn, revealed an invasion plan.

By then, Kandor, Arafel and Saldeaa seem to have been invaded/ is one the verge of invasion (Egwene knows about it by VoG+4/5).

She's Arafellin - might be trying to rally a defence.

 

I don't think she's BA - Verin and she were together for a huge length of time alone, and Verin actually provoked her into bonding Rand.

I think 1) Verin would have learnt on the Two Rivers trip if Alanna was BA and 2) Verin would not have provoked a BA into bonding Rand.

Her name isn't mentioned by Egwene in the BA list and Egwene had a strong personal connect with her - since TGH - and would remember the name.

(OTOH if Alanna is BA, Verin might have warned her to get the hell out of Tear before Rand returned because he could now tell DFs at a glance.)

 

Galad's letter content is unguessable. He's apparently done nothing, whatever it was, since he's with Perrin.

[The_Ege]

Is it possible that trollocs came through other waygates and attacked other cities while all of the armies were at the Field of Merrilor.

[NetSlider]

Is it possible that trollocs came through other waygates and attacked other cities while all of the armies were at the Field of Merrilor.

 

Wow, I didn't even think of that. That would be crazy and ubercool. Last battle indeed!

[Haran]

In the end I dont think Mat is to blame. however, he will blame himself.

 

 

Well, Talmanes is a reasonable guy. Maybe the most reasonable guy in the whole series. Him and Tam al'Thor.

Unless Talmanes dies a heroic death in Cam I can't really see him not making Olver promise not to tell about the letter.

[Coltsfan]

Why wouldn't Verin simply put all of these plans in her book, that she handed off to Egwene, with all the Black Ajah names. Also Mat waited the thirty days to head off to the ToG, so if he had simply opened the letter before he left, he would have been free of his oath to Verin and all would have been well.

[Sharaman]

Why wouldn't Verin simply put all of these plans in her book, that she handed off to Egwene, with all the Black Ajah names. Also Mat waited the thirty days to head off to the ToG, so if he had simply opened the letter before he left, he would have been free of his oath to Verin and all would have been well.

Mat promised to

a) either open the letter after 10 days and do what it said

b) or wait 30 days and NOT open the letter

[Mr Ares]

Verin barely knew Mat. She couldn't have told him directly, due to her Oaths, and Mat has all those deaths at his feet as well, don't forget.

I disagree with Mat being to blame in any way, shape, or form. He didn't know what was in the letter, and Verin didn't make it sound important. While it's likely to blame him, I think it borders on baroque to have /any/ logic that makes Mat to blame. :)

He didn't know what was in the letter because he refused to open it. He had the information, and failed to act. That is clearly his fault. Verin said that if she didn't need him to do what was in the letter, she'd come back and take it from him. She didn't, so she needs it done, surely an indication that it is somewhat important? So, he failed to do something that he knew was important to Verin, at the very least. His fault. His dislike of AS is irrational - how often have they acted against him, rather than saving his life? His fault. Hell, Verin has saved his life before. People can also say that he refused to open the letter because then he would have been forced to do as it said - but doing as it said would be his choice. He chose not to open it, and he chose not to act on the information within. Clearly, Mat is at fault here too.

Well he made a vow that he would follow what was in the letter.

Which he could have broken. He chose not to find out what was inside, what was important to Verin.

So while the letter was important to Verin, it might not have been to Mat. For all we know, it could have said: "A friend of mine got captured by the Seanchan and is being held at Falme. Please help her escape."

Well, Mat could either find a way to delay ("she didn't say I had to do it immediately") or just ignore it. His choice. How many people have died because Mat didn't want to read that letter?

Considering Mat had like a billion things to do, that would have been yet another complication while important to Verin, was not to the overall picture. Obviously it wasnt that, but it could have been for all Mat knew. And thats the thing, it could have been anything. And while Verin may have implied it was important, she never actually said so.

Oh, an argument to mat's stupidity. She should have spelt it out to him. Gotcha. And just as it might be important to Verin but not the big picture, it might be very important to the big picture. He doesn't know and he makes no attempt to find out.

 

And how is his dislike of Aes Sedai irrational?

When have they ever acted to harm him?

Mat has saved enough Aes Sedai in his time - and gone out of his way to do so - that he owes absolutely nothing to them.

When has Mat ever saved Verin's life? Verin has saved Mat's.

And I cant blame him for not being caught up in Aes Sedai schemes. Not to mention, Mat hardly knew her. He liked her (for an Aes Sedai) but hardly knew her.

Because the only significant amount of time they spent together was when he was dying from the SL dagger, and she kept it from killing him.

Come on, why would he open that letter.

Because it was apparently something Verin needed Mat to do.

And Verin implied in book 3 that they could just let Mat die and chose their own person to blow the Horn; so she wasnt exactly on Mats side of the fence, so to speak.

Actions speak louder than words. She didn't let him die, she saved his life.

 

In the end I dont think Mat is to blame. however, he will blame himself.

I do. Both of them bear some of the blame.

[Duskfire]

Which he could have broken. He chose not to find out what was inside, what was important to Verin.

 

But Mat doesnt break vows, thats part of the whole point of his character. He stands by his word when he makes it. So no matter what was in the letter, Mat knew he would had to have followed it.

 

Look at it like this right; Mats line of thinking could easily have been "if its so important, why put me on a time limit?" or "why couldnt she do it herself." He has no idea she was Black Ajah who had to do this stuff to get around her vows to the Dark One. Reading through it, I am not even sure why Mat should think it was important at all. She never stressed that it was important, and said he could just sit around not open it if he wanted, as long as he waited a certain number of days for her to take care of it. Again, that doesnt sound like something that is so overwhelming important that the letter must be read.

 

When has Mat ever saved Verin's life? Verin has saved Mat'

 

Well we're talking Aes Sedai in general. Verin is still Aes Sedai, and Mat didnt want to get caught up in her schemes. He himself may not have saved Verins life, however he doesnt owe anything to her, or any Aes Sedai for that matter. Certaintly not enough to open an ambigious letter that he had made an oath to follow should be open it. That entire concept has "Aes Sedai scheme" written all over it.

 

In any case, we both interpret it differently, which is fair enough. I put myself in Mats shoes, and opening that letter would be the furthest thing form my mind with the Gholam on my ass, Dragons needing to be made, an army to look over, and Moiraines rescue on the horizon. To me, a letter that wasnt mentioned as being important at all would be that: not important. You see it differently, which is cool.

[NetSlider]

Verin barely knew Mat. She couldn't have told him directly, due to her Oaths, and Mat has all those deaths at his feet as well, don't forget.

I disagree with Mat being to blame in any way, shape, or form. He didn't know what was in the letter, and Verin didn't make it sound important. While it's likely to blame him, I think it borders on baroque to have /any/ logic that makes Mat to blame. :)

He didn't know what was in the letter because he refused to open it. He had the information, and failed to act. That is clearly his fault. Verin said that if she didn't need him to do what was in the letter, she'd come back and take it from him. She didn't, so she needs it done, surely an indication that it is somewhat important? So, he failed to do something that he knew was important to Verin, at the very least. His fault. His dislike of AS is irrational - how often have they acted against him, rather than saving his life? His fault. Hell, Verin has saved his life before. People can also say that he refused to open the letter because then he would have been forced to do as it said - but doing as it said would be his choice. He chose not to open it, and he chose not to act on the information within. Clearly, Mat is at fault here too.

Well he made a vow that he would follow what was in the letter.

Which he could have broken. He chose not to find out what was inside, what was important to Verin.

So while the letter was important to Verin, it might not have been to Mat. For all we know, it could have said: "A friend of mine got captured by the Seanchan and is being held at Falme. Please help her escape."

Well, Mat could either find a way to delay ("she didn't say I had to do it immediately") or just ignore it. His choice. How many people have died because Mat didn't want to read that letter?

Considering Mat had like a billion things to do, that would have been yet another complication while important to Verin, was not to the overall picture. Obviously it wasnt that, but it could have been for all Mat knew. And thats the thing, it could have been anything. And while Verin may have implied it was important, she never actually said so.

Oh, an argument to mat's stupidity. She should have spelt it out to him. Gotcha. And just as it might be important to Verin but not the big picture, it might be very important to the big picture. He doesn't know and he makes no attempt to find out.

 

And how is his dislike of Aes Sedai irrational?

When have they ever acted to harm him?

Mat has saved enough Aes Sedai in his time - and gone out of his way to do so - that he owes absolutely nothing to them.

When has Mat ever saved Verin's life? Verin has saved Mat's.

And I cant blame him for not being caught up in Aes Sedai schemes. Not to mention, Mat hardly knew her. He liked her (for an Aes Sedai) but hardly knew her.

Because the only significant amount of time they spent together was when he was dying from the SL dagger, and she kept it from killing him.

Come on, why would he open that letter.

Because it was apparently something Verin needed Mat to do.

And Verin implied in book 3 that they could just let Mat die and chose their own person to blow the Horn; so she wasnt exactly on Mats side of the fence, so to speak.

Actions speak louder than words. She didn't let him die, she saved his life.

 

In the end I dont think Mat is to blame. however, he will blame himself.

I do. Both of them bear some of the blame.

 

Mat does not share any blame at all. If Verin simply said, "you don't have to do what it says if you don't want to" then he would share some blame. As I said before, the whole letter is not very good plot set up. I don't see why Verin had to insist on "you have to do what letter says" as if Mat would open the letter and having a choice not do anything while Camlyn faced with invasion from Trolocs. Verin comes out as a complete idiot (which she is not) and if you ask me this was a nice attempt to put a little more twist to the whole story line with a bit of irony in it and it did not work. So, this being said, Verin is the only one to blame, if you exclude whoever came up with this whole moronic plot line in the first place (I think BS in this case, I just don't see RJ doing something like that). Still this is a good book and it wouldn't be any less so if the whole letter from Verin to Mat would never make an appearance.

[David Selig]

Mat does not share any blame at all. If Verin simply said, "you don't have to do what it says if you don't want to" then he would share some blame.

Exactly. Given that Mat would be in Caemlyn when he reads the letter, of course he'll alert the authorities there.

 

Verin knows very well that 99% of Randlanders will do anything possible to avoid getting tangled in an Aes Sedai plot. And even the slightest bit of research on Mat (talking with Nynaeve for example while they were in together between WH and KoD) will show that Mat is even more paranoid than most people about Aes Sedai. So saying "if you open the letter, you must do what's written in it" was not just unnecessary, but lowers drastically the chance of Mat (or anyone in his position) opening it. I was really disappointed with this because it made probably the smartest character in the series so far look like a complete dimwit. It's one of those clumsy plot devices which go totally against character consistency which Jordan had an unfortunate tendency to use from time to time.

 

If I were in Mat's position, I wouldn't have opened it either. Tarmon Gai'don is coming, I have lots of stuff to do, and for all I know this letter could've said "You must go by foot to the centre of the Aiel Waste and stay there for months". Why take the risk? And what if Verin was really Black Ajah at heart and the letter was just a device to keep him tied up to some pointless task on the eve of the Last Battle or it was even a trap?

[Guest EmeraldSuzaku]

Since Mat's letter contained information about the Shadow's plans, and she passed them on before the hour of her death, it is possible that Verin *had* to make sure that it was unlikely the letter be opened in order to not break her dark oaths--even though the conditions she placed on Mat would have made it likely that even if he had opened it, she would already be dead.

 

That aside, it's also possible that the point of the letter was not to give a timely warning, but to keep Mat and the Band parked in Caemlyn. It could very well be that the 10-day time limit was actually arbitrary, and her real time frame was to get Mat to read the letter around 30 days after getting it.

 

Unless I'm reading the (admittedly snarled) timeline wrong, there was actually time to open the letter after the 30-day window and still act on its contents before the invasion.

 

Or maybe (and this is *really* reaching), the letter was really intended for someone else to open, but she gave it to Mat to ensure that it stayed sealed for a time. I'm not really seeing that as terribly plausible, but I suppose Verin could be tricksy.

[NetSlider]

Since Mat's letter contained information about the Shadow's plans, and she passed them on before the hour of her death, it is possible that Verin *had* to make sure that it was unlikely the letter be opened in order to not break her dark oaths--even though the conditions she placed on Mat would have made it likely that even if he had opened it, she would already be dead.

 

That aside, it's also possible that the point of the letter was not to give a timely warning, but to keep Mat and the Band parked in Caemlyn. It could very well be that the 10-day time limit was actually arbitrary, and her real time frame was to get Mat to read the letter around 30 days after getting it.

 

Unless I'm reading the (admittedly snarled) timeline wrong, there was actually time to open the letter after the 30-day window and still act on its contents before the invasion.

 

Or maybe (and this is *really* reaching), the letter was really intended for someone else to open, but she gave it to Mat to ensure that it stayed sealed for a time. I'm not really seeing that as terribly plausible, but I suppose Verin could be tricksy.

 

Yes, except her latter says that she expected Mat to open in within a week or such.

[Bob T Dwarf]

Mat does not share any blame at all. If Verin simply said, "you don't have to do what it says if you don't want to" then he would share some blame. As I said before, the whole letter is not very good plot set up. I don't see why Verin had to insist on "you have to do what letter says" as if Mat would open the letter and having a choice not do anything while Camlyn faced with invasion from Trolocs. Verin comes out as a complete idiot (which she is not) and if you ask me this was a nice attempt to put a little more twist to the whole story line with a bit of irony in it and it did not work. So, this being said, Verin is the only one to blame, if you exclude whoever came up with this whole moronic plot line in the first place (I think BS in this case, I just don't see RJ doing something like that). Still this is a good book and it wouldn't be any less so if the whole letter from Verin to Mat would never make an appearance.

 

Wrong. The only mistake Verin made was in assuming Mat would behave responsibly rather than continue to be a willful child about everything.

 

Ignoring the letter, ignoring all the trouble Verin and the Wheel itself took getting that letter into his hands was utterly irresponsible.

 

Mat, as always, took counsel exclusively from his fears and his fantasies. Mat is entirely responsible for his own choices. His choice not to open that letter will needlessly cost lives. That is entirely on his head.

[NetSlider]

Mat does not share any blame at all. If Verin simply said, "you don't have to do what it says if you don't want to" then he would share some blame. As I said before, the whole letter is not very good plot set up. I don't see why Verin had to insist on "you have to do what letter says" as if Mat would open the letter and having a choice not do anything while Camlyn faced with invasion from Trolocs. Verin comes out as a complete idiot (which she is not) and if you ask me this was a nice attempt to put a little more twist to the whole story line with a bit of irony in it and it did not work. So, this being said, Verin is the only one to blame, if you exclude whoever came up with this whole moronic plot line in the first place (I think BS in this case, I just don't see RJ doing something like that). Still this is a good book and it wouldn't be any less so if the whole letter from Verin to Mat would never make an appearance.

 

Wrong. The only mistake Verin made was in assuming Mat would behave responsibly rather than continue to be a willful child about everything.

 

Ignoring the letter, ignoring all the trouble Verin and the Wheel itself took getting that letter into his hands was utterly irresponsible.

 

Mat, as always, took counsel exclusively from his fears and his fantasies. Mat is entirely responsible for his own choices. His choice not to open that letter will needlessly cost lives. That is entirely on his head.

 

And did she explain about any of these "trouble" to Mat and he should understand? And actually, what trouble? Wheel forcing her to find Mat? And what does Mat know about it in the first place - he remembers Verin very, very badly from the time he carried the dagger. Even Lanfear understood the implications of having that dagger and the mistrust it now seeds in Mat. And the dagger is something that is not even from Lanfear's times. Verin should have known better than assuming that Mat will open letter within couple days. Very AS like if you ask me.

 

And Mat actually behaved like an adult for a change. He made a deal with AS and he stuck to his side. It was under his discretion not to open the letter and Verin did nothing to make sure he opens it. "You have to follow the instructions"...why not say, if you want you can follow the instructions? He would and she should have known it. Instead she put his back up.

 

In any event, I think we argue about nothing here and IMO all this is a side mass of a try to bring the timeline to cohesiveness by BS if you ask me. Verin just as well could have brought the letter to the queen of Andor with instructions to open it in 10 days or the fate of Andor is at stake. And she should have simply given Mat a lift to his destination. But than why pattern forced her to Mat and not some ashaman? Well, maybe that's just poor judgment on BS or RJ part or maybe we don't know the whole picture yet. But as things stand now, this whole business with Verin, letter, and Mat is completely out of whack.

[Bob T Dwarf]

Mat does not share any blame at all. If Verin simply said, "you don't have to do what it says if you don't want to" then he would share some blame. As I said before, the whole letter is not very good plot set up. I don't see why Verin had to insist on "you have to do what letter says" as if Mat would open the letter and having a choice not do anything while Camlyn faced with invasion from Trolocs. Verin comes out as a complete idiot (which she is not) and if you ask me this was a nice attempt to put a little more twist to the whole story line with a bit of irony in it and it did not work. So, this being said, Verin is the only one to blame, if you exclude whoever came up with this whole moronic plot line in the first place (I think BS in this case, I just don't see RJ doing something like that). Still this is a good book and it wouldn't be any less so if the whole letter from Verin to Mat would never make an appearance.

 

Wrong. The only mistake Verin made was in assuming Mat would behave responsibly rather than continue to be a willful child about everything.

 

Ignoring the letter, ignoring all the trouble Verin and the Wheel itself took getting that letter into his hands was utterly irresponsible.

 

Mat, as always, took counsel exclusively from his fears and his fantasies. Mat is entirely responsible for his own choices. His choice not to open that letter will needlessly cost lives. That is entirely on his head.

 

And did she explain about any of these "trouble" to Mat and he should understand? And actually, what trouble? Wheel forcing her to find Mat? And what does Mat know about it in the first place - he remembers Verin very, very badly from the time he carried the dagger. Even Lanfear understood the implications of having that dagger and the mistrust it now seeds in Mat. And the dagger is something that is not even from Lanfear's times. Verin should have known better than assuming that Mat will open letter within couple days. Very AS like if you ask me.

 

And Mat actually behaved like an adult for a change. He made a deal with AS and he stuck to his side. It was under his discretion not to open the letter and Verin did nothing to make sure he opens it. "You have to follow the instructions"...why not say, if you want you can follow the instructions? He would and she should have known it. Instead she put his back up.

 

In any event, I think we argue about nothing here and IMO all this is a side mass of a try to bring the timeline to cohesiveness by BS if you ask me. Verin just as well could have brought the letter to the queen of Andor with instructions to open it in 10 days or the fate of Andor is at stake. And she should have simply given Mat a lift to his destination. But than why pattern forced her to Mat and not some ashaman? Well, maybe that's just poor judgment on BS or RJ part or maybe we don't know the whole picture yet. But as things stand now, this whole business with Verin, letter, and Mat is completely out of whack.

 

Mat isn't a small child to whom everything needs to be explained in the simplest terms. He's a married man. You're supposed to have achieved some level of maturity before you get married, you know.

 

...He looked at her, meeting those dark brown Aes Sedai eyes. "Blood and bloody ashes," he muttered. "It was you wasn't it? You're the one who's been looking for me!"

 

"For some time, I might add," Verin said lightly. "And rather against my will." ( HELLO, BIG RED TRUCK )

 

...

 

"What do you want?" he asked.

 

"Frankly," she replied, sighing slightly. "What I want Matrim Cauthon is to be free from your ta'veren web! Do you know how long you've forced me to wait in these mountains?" ( HELLO, BIGGER RED TRUCK )

 

"Forced?"

 

"Yes," she said. "Come we have much to discuss." ...

 

IT'S A WHOLE FREAKING CONVOY OF BIG RED TRUCKS. COMPLETE WITH LIGHTS AND SIRENS. GOTTA BE A HECKUVA FIRE SOMEPLACE! Does Mat think of that even once? Nope, she's an Aes Sedai! It's gotta be a devious plot to mess with him!

 

As for why she doesn't give a letter to Elayne, as she's already explained - she's way behind schedule because the Wheel made her wait for Mat.

 

She's working against a deadline. She has to get as much information to as many people as possible before it's too late for that information to do anybody any good. She doesn't have time for the song-and-dance needed to get to see Elayne. She's already given the information to Mat. She has no reason to believe that anything more would be needed.

 

And, if Mat was not such a child, nothing more would be needed.

 

The fault is Mat's. The only thing Verin can be blamed for is not being omniscient. Since she isn't a god, omniscience is a little above her pay grade.

[Byzantine279]

Verin made a mistake, she overestimated Mat's curiosity and underestimated his fear of being tied in Aes Sedai strings. She should have phrased it "Please open this letter in 10 days, you do not have to do what it says unless you wish to do so." Mat would have opened it then, her mistake was binding him to the letter, rather than simply saying it was important.

 

Well, Bob, he had good reason to believe it was. Aes Sedai have been trying to control the 3 of them from the start, the fact she was being forced to do so by his luck wouldn't have changed anything from his point of view, he hates his Ta'veren effect sometimes as well.

[SheriLevisay]

Verin made a mistake, she overestimated Mat's curiosity and underestimated his fear of being tied in Aes Sedai strings. She should have phrased it "Please open this letter in 10 days, you do not have to do what it says unless you wish to do so." Mat would have opened it then, her mistake was binding him to the letter, rather than simply saying it was important.

 

Well, Bob, he had good reason to believe it was. Aes Sedai have been trying to control the 3 of them from the start, the fact she was being forced to do so by his luck wouldn't have changed anything from his point of view, he hates his Ta'veren effect sometimes as well.

 

Here's another question: Why did she give this particular task to Mat? If her object were to have the Waygate sealed so the trollocs would be forced to emerge elsewhere, she would have done better to send the request to someone else who had a better chance of sealing it. Maybe she thought a fight was inevitable and decided Mat would be the best to lead that effort.

 

It does seem as though she's overestimated Mat's curiosity. It's hard to avoid judging these characters' moves when our viewpoint, as readers, is so much better informed.

[NetSlider]

Mat does not share any blame at all. If Verin simply said, "you don't have to do what it says if you don't want to" then he would share some blame. As I said before, the whole letter is not very good plot set up. I don't see why Verin had to insist on "you have to do what letter says" as if Mat would open the letter and having a choice not do anything while Camlyn faced with invasion from Trolocs. Verin comes out as a complete idiot (which she is not) and if you ask me this was a nice attempt to put a little more twist to the whole story line with a bit of irony in it and it did not work. So, this being said, Verin is the only one to blame, if you exclude whoever came up with this whole moronic plot line in the first place (I think BS in this case, I just don't see RJ doing something like that). Still this is a good book and it wouldn't be any less so if the whole letter from Verin to Mat would never make an appearance.

 

Wrong. The only mistake Verin made was in assuming Mat would behave responsibly rather than continue to be a willful child about everything.

 

Ignoring the letter, ignoring all the trouble Verin and the Wheel itself took getting that letter into his hands was utterly irresponsible.

 

Mat, as always, took counsel exclusively from his fears and his fantasies. Mat is entirely responsible for his own choices. His choice not to open that letter will needlessly cost lives. That is entirely on his head.

 

And did she explain about any of these "trouble" to Mat and he should understand? And actually, what trouble? Wheel forcing her to find Mat? And what does Mat know about it in the first place - he remembers Verin very, very badly from the time he carried the dagger. Even Lanfear understood the implications of having that dagger and the mistrust it now seeds in Mat. And the dagger is something that is not even from Lanfear's times. Verin should have known better than assuming that Mat will open letter within couple days. Very AS like if you ask me.

 

And Mat actually behaved like an adult for a change. He made a deal with AS and he stuck to his side. It was under his discretion not to open the letter and Verin did nothing to make sure he opens it. "You have to follow the instructions"...why not say, if you want you can follow the instructions? He would and she should have known it. Instead she put his back up.

 

In any event, I think we argue about nothing here and IMO all this is a side mass of a try to bring the timeline to cohesiveness by BS if you ask me. Verin just as well could have brought the letter to the queen of Andor with instructions to open it in 10 days or the fate of Andor is at stake. And she should have simply given Mat a lift to his destination. But than why pattern forced her to Mat and not some ashaman? Well, maybe that's just poor judgment on BS or RJ part or maybe we don't know the whole picture yet. But as things stand now, this whole business with Verin, letter, and Mat is completely out of whack.

 

Mat isn't a small child to whom everything needs to be explained in the simplest terms. He's a married man. You're supposed to have achieved some level of maturity before you get married, you know.

 

...He looked at her, meeting those dark brown Aes Sedai eyes. "Blood and bloody ashes," he muttered. "It was you wasn't it? You're the one who's been looking for me!"

 

"For some time, I might add," Verin said lightly. "And rather against my will." ( HELLO, BIG RED TRUCK )

 

...

 

"What do you want?" he asked.

 

"Frankly," she replied, sighing slightly. "What I want Matrim Cauthon is to be free from your ta'veren web! Do you know how long you've forced me to wait in these mountains?" ( HELLO, BIGGER RED TRUCK )

 

"Forced?"

 

"Yes," she said. "Come we have much to discuss." ...

 

IT'S A WHOLE FREAKING CONVOY OF BIG RED TRUCKS. COMPLETE WITH LIGHTS AND SIRENS. GOTTA BE A HECKUVA FIRE SOMEPLACE! Does Mat think of that even once? Nope, she's an Aes Sedai! It's gotta be a devious plot to mess with him!

 

As for why she doesn't give a letter to Elayne, as she's already explained - she's way behind schedule because the Wheel made her wait for Mat.

 

She's working against a deadline. She has to get as much information to as many people as possible before it's too late for that information to do anybody any good. She doesn't have time for the song-and-dance needed to get to see Elayne. She's already given the information to Mat. She has no reason to believe that anything more would be needed.

 

And, if Mat was not such a child, nothing more would be needed.

 

The fault is Mat's. The only thing Verin can be blamed for is not being omniscient. Since she isn't a god, omniscience is a little above her pay grade.

 

Your arguments are so twisted I don't even know where to start. Imagine this, someone comes to you and says that here's a letter, you have to wait 10 days before you open it, but once you open it after 10 days no matter what it says you must do IT, no questions no arguments. Or you can wait 30 days and don't open the letter and you can go on your marry way. In return I'll give you a lift to whatever place you want.

 

Now, you have other things to do and simply put, why should you commit to anything without even knowing what it is by simply opening a freaking letter. Instead you can wait 30 days and go on your marry way. After all, the person said you can do that so no harm done, right? Now, all of the sudden something terrible happens and it was in the letter you had (the one that you didn't have to open as long as you waited 30 days) and it's all your fault. WHERE IS THE LOGIC IN THIS???

 

IF IT IS IMPORTANT, PERSON KNOWING THE CONTENT OF THE LETTER SHOULD MAKE SURE THAT THE INFORMATION IS CORRECTLY HANDLED AND PASSED TO RIGHT PEOPLE IN THE RIGHT MANNER. TO SAY THAT MAT'S AT FAULT IS FREAKING CRAZY!!!

[Bob T Dwarf]

Verin made a mistake, she overestimated Mat's curiosity and underestimated his fear of being tied in Aes Sedai strings. She should have phrased it "Please open this letter in 10 days, you do not have to do what it says unless you wish to do so." Mat would have opened it then, her mistake was binding him to the letter, rather than simply saying it was important.

 

Well, Bob, he had good reason to believe it was. Aes Sedai have been trying to control the 3 of them from the start, the fact she was being forced to do so by his luck wouldn't have changed anything from his point of view, he hates his Ta'veren effect sometimes as well.

 

If Verin accompanies the letter with a throwaway line like, "Please open this letter in 10 days, you do not have to do what it says unless you wish to do so." that just insures that it won't get read. If she doesn't attach dire importance to it, why is Mat supposed to?

 

And, no, no Aes Sedai has ever just messed with him. They are at least responsible enough to only pressure him for things that honestly are important.

 

Mat has an important role to play. The Aes Sedai are insistent that he play it. Mat just wants to be Peter Pan and fly back to Never-Never-Land.

 

That childishness, far more than anything Elayne or anyone else has done, gets people killed needlessly.