Two Male Sa'angreal more powerful than Callandor?

[Mighty Chin]

I was just re-reading The Shadow Rising and Lanfear says this to Rand in the Stone if Tear.

 

"There are only two more powerful that a man can use. One at least, I know, still exists. No, Lews Therin. I will not trust you yet with that."

 

We know the Choedan Kal is one of them what is the other and have we seen it yet?

[OsaroLJ]

Question of the century...seems like RJ has some tricks up his sleeves yet

[Arkelias]

I've been wondering this for years.  Are there any tidbits or clues he's left in the story I may have missed?  I don't think he's given us anything about what the other Sa'angreal might be.

[Mashiara Sedai]

I read somewhere (can't remember where...) that it might be in the White Tower.  When Elayne and Nynaeve use need to find the Bowl of the Winds, they were first taken to a storage room in the Tower.  They specified that their "need" was for something that would help Rand, and possibly bring him and the rebel Aes Sedai to each other.  They dismissed it since there was no way of getting it while Elaida held the Tower.

 

Might be a shot in the dark, but it's a possibility.

 

~Mashiara

[Tyrell]

We know the Bayle Domon had a male 'angreal of some sort (an ivory carving of a man holding a sword). I have a feeling it may pop up again or RJ wouldn't have bothered mentioning it and attaching so specific an attribute to it, were he just adding random AoL flavour items to Domon's collection.

 

Tamyrlin's ring is a possibility too. That is more-or-less pure conjecture, though I did read this, supposedly from the glossary of To The Blight (Part two of the two-part young-adult marketed version of The Eye of The World) :

 

    Ring of Tamyrlin (TAHM-ehr-lin): a legendary ring, believed mythical by most people, worn by the leader of the Aes Sedai during the Age of Legends. Stories about the Ring of Tamyrlin include that it was an angreal or sa'angreal or ter'angreal of immense power. It supposedly was named after the first person to learn how to tap into the Source and channel the One Power, and in some tales, was actually made by that man or woman. Despite what many Aes Sedai say, no one knows whether it was a man or a woman who first learned to channel. Some believe that the present title of Amyrlin is a corruption of Tamyrlin.

 

Which is still speculation. Taken from here.

[BKVMC]

I read somewhere (can't remember where...) that it might be in the White Tower.  When Elayne and Nynaeve use need to find the Bowl of the Winds, they were first taken to a storage room in the Tower.  They specified that their "need" was for something that would help Rand, and possibly bring him and the rebel Aes Sedai to each other.  They dismissed it since there was no way of getting it while Elaida held the Tower.

 

Might be a shot in the dark, but it's a possibility.

 

~Mashiara

 

 

FOrgot about that  little  bit  i agree it could very  well be in the  white  tower from the  foreshadowing.

[Luckers]

We know the Bayle Domon had a male 'angreal of some sort (an ivory carving of a man holding a sword). I have a feeling it may pop up again or RJ wouldn't have bothered mentioning it and attaching so specific an attribute to it, were he just adding random AoL flavour items to Domon's collection.

 

Tamyrlin's ring is a possibility too. That is more-or-less pure conjecture, though I did read this, supposedly from the glossary of To The Blight (Part two of the two-part young-adult marketed version of The Eye of The World) :

 

    Ring of Tamyrlin (TAHM-ehr-lin): a legendary ring, believed mythical by most people, worn by the leader of the Aes Sedai during the Age of Legends. Stories about the Ring of Tamyrlin include that it was an angreal or sa'angreal or ter'angreal of immense power. It supposedly was named after the first person to learn how to tap into the Source and channel the One Power, and in some tales, was actually made by that man or woman. Despite what many Aes Sedai say, no one knows whether it was a man or a woman who first learned to channel. Some believe that the present title of Amyrlin is a corruption of Tamyrlin.

 

Which is still speculation. Taken from here.

 

The likelyhood of the ring of Tamyrlin, which was a symbol of authority worn by both men and women, being a male sa'angreal (in an age that placed no especial respect on strength in the power) seems unlikely.

 

I read somewhere (can't remember where...) that it might be in the White Tower.  When Elayne and Nynaeve use need to find the Bowl of the Winds, they were first taken to a storage room in the Tower.  They specified that their "need" was for something that would help Rand, and possibly bring him and the rebel Aes Sedai to each other.  They dismissed it since there was no way of getting it while Elaida held the Tower.

 

The Tower destroyed all male angreal and sa'angreal they found, but I really hope we learn what that was. My (weak) guess is that it was the Horn.

[Thor]

it's one thing to say that they destroy all male angreals, sa'angreals, but it's quite another to actually do it.

 

you really believe the browns would truly allow the most important artifacts to be destroyed?

[Luckers]

it's one thing to say that they destroy all male angreals, sa'angreals, but it's quite another to actually do it.

 

you really believe the browns would truly allow the most important artifacts to be destroyed?

 

I've not problem with the idea, no. Aes Sedai are deeply prejudiced towards anything related to saidin, across Ajah.

[Hybrid]

I was just re-reading The Shadow Rising and Lanfear says this to Rand in the Stone if Tear.

 

"There are only two more powerful that a man can use. One at least, I know, still exists. No, Lews Therin. I will not trust you yet with that."

 

We know the Choedan Kal is one of them what is the other and have we seen it yet?

Interesting question.  Of course, it's highly possible that the other has been lost forever, by the actions of the Aes Sedai or simply in the turmoil caused by the Breaking.

[Tyrell]

We know the Bayle Domon had a male 'angreal of some sort (an ivory carving of a man holding a sword). I have a feeling it may pop up again or RJ wouldn't have bothered mentioning it and attaching so specific an attribute to it, were he just adding random AoL flavour items to Domon's collection.

 

Tamyrlin's ring is a possibility too. That is more-or-less pure conjecture, though I did read this, supposedly from the glossary of To The Blight (Part two of the two-part young-adult marketed version of The Eye of The World) :

 

    Ring of Tamyrlin (TAHM-ehr-lin): a legendary ring, believed mythical by most people, worn by the leader of the Aes Sedai during the Age of Legends. Stories about the Ring of Tamyrlin include that it was an angreal or sa'angreal or ter'angreal of immense power. It supposedly was named after the first person to learn how to tap into the Source and channel the One Power, and in some tales, was actually made by that man or woman. Despite what many Aes Sedai say, no one knows whether it was a man or a woman who first learned to channel. Some believe that the present title of Amyrlin is a corruption of Tamyrlin.

 

Which is still speculation. Taken from here.

 

The likelyhood of the ring of Tamyrlin, which was a symbol of authority worn by both men and women, being a male sa'angreal (in an age that placed no especial respect on strength in the power) seems unlikely.

 

I read somewhere (can't remember where...) that it might be in the White Tower.  When Elayne and Nynaeve use need to find the Bowl of the Winds, they were first taken to a storage room in the Tower.  They specified that their "need" was for something that would help Rand, and possibly bring him and the rebel Aes Sedai to each other.  They dismissed it since there was no way of getting it while Elaida held the Tower.

 

The Tower destroyed all male angreal and sa'angreal they found, but I really hope we learn what that was. My (weak) guess is that it was the Horn.

 

Theoretically it could be a unisex 'agreal, but regardless, as it was supposedly created by the first Channeller then I'd imagine the original purpose would be to use it as a weapon. This is pure conjecture, I know, but something extremely drastic would have had to have occured to end the first and bring about the second age; I would suggest that the emergence of Channellers would have sparked global warfare. If Tamyrlin was a leader or figurehead of some kind, regardless of the original purpose the ring's symbolism would have changed over the years.

 

Where does it say that the tower destroyed male 'angreal? It's supposed to be pretty hard to break any power-related object and dangerous to do so besides. I can understand why they would want to do so - 'angreal are weapons, or have the potential to be weapons in the right (wrong) hands; any random male sparker could do a huge amount of damage if they had access to an angreal or sa'angreal to increase their power level. I question though the tower's capacity to do so - Suian's comment about Callandor implies that she doesn't know that 'angreal tend to be tuned to one gender or the other, the tower's general cluelessness about AoL artefacts (How would they even locate and identify male 'angreal) and the general danger + difficulty involved in damaging power-related items all suggest that the white tower, certainly the white tower of recent times would be incapable of managing such a task.

[Thor]

it's one thing to say that they destroy all male angreals, sa'angreals, but it's quite another to actually do it.

 

you really believe the browns would truly allow the most important artifacts to be destroyed?

 

I've not problem with the idea, no. Aes Sedai are deeply prejudiced towards anything related to saidin, across Ajah.

 

you've got absolutely no proof of that statement.

 

on the other hand i can argue that the combination of the white ajah (logic) and brown ajah (knowledge) would mean that there is no way that they would destroy every artifact.

 

aes sedai might be incompetent these days but those who are not black do still serve the light.

[mb]

The thing Boyle had or the Tamyrlin might be the 3rd male sa'angreal.  The Eye might have been another possibility.  Something in the White Tower, something in Tear's Hold, something that was at Rhuidean, something that was at Ebou Dar, or something that was in Sammael's possession might be other possibilities.  Or it might be none of these things.

 

The books do not tell of Aes Sedia ever destroying every saidin artifact; there might be a chance that some of the unknown things could be saidin artifacts.

 

The prejudice against saidin, the highest degree would likely be in Reds.

If the other Ajahs have any prejudice against saidin, they likely would not carry it (the prejudice) as far as destroying anything related to it (saidin).  Reds might, but doubtfully the others.

 

[Rinkai]

it's one thing to say that they destroy all male angreals, sa'angreals, but it's quite another to actually do it.

 

you really believe the browns would truly allow the most important artifacts to be destroyed?

 

I've not problem with the idea, no. Aes Sedai are deeply prejudiced towards anything related to saidin, across Ajah.

 

Maybe this is what Verin has been up to all along. That would be cool. Also, what if the crystal throne is male sa' angreal

[Luckers]

The Crystal Throne is a ter'angreal.

[Germs]

it's one thing to say that they destroy all male angreals, sa'angreals, but it's quite another to actually do it.

 

you really believe the browns would truly allow the most important artifacts to be destroyed?

 

I've not problem with the idea, no. Aes Sedai are deeply prejudiced towards anything related to saidin, across Ajah.

 

you've got absolutely no proof of that statement.

 

on the other hand i can argue that the combination of the white ajah (logic) and brown ajah (knowledge) would mean that there is no way that they would destroy every artifact.

 

aes sedai might be incompetent these days but those who are not black do still serve the light.

Hold on. You're asking for proof that Aes Sedai don't like/hate/fear sadin? Have you read the books!

[Germs]

The Crystal Throne is a ter'angreal.

I didn't know that. What does it do?

[Balefire to da face!]

The Crystal Throne is a ter'angreal.

I didn't know that. What does it do?

 

Induces awe and obidience for the one who sits on it(i.e the Empress). At least, that's what I have heard. Not sure if it as been explicitly confirmed in the books, or just very strongly indicated. It would explain why Seanchan nobility actually mean it when they say "the Empress, may she live forever" instead of the constant backstabbing that goes on in Randland.....

[pxnsolid]

I believe it was in the big book that the Crystal Throne is said to be a ter'angreal. Ive always thought that the viewing/dream/prophecy about Rand sitting in someones chair, and them being murderously angry pertained to the Seanchen throne.

[Phariah]

The Ring of Tamyrlin i would guess would be a ter'angreal seeing as how both sexes would use it.

 

the someone being angry for sitting in the chair was the Lion Throne.

 

and i forget who said it. but i recall someone saying,i think Tuon, that even the most ambitious noble would change their attitude when they knelt before the Crystal Throne. kind of gives the impression it was a ter'angreal that influences people.

 

and i don't ever reading that AS destroyed any male angreal. and i don't know how they would know if an object is one seeing as how they couldn't test it.

[Toy and Minion]

and i don't ever reading that AS destroyed any male angreal. and i don't know how they would know if an object is one seeing as how they couldn't test it.

 

Most likely, they would just throw the suspected items in an unused room like the High Lords of Tear.

 

A room like this one:

 

I read somewhere (can't remember where...) that it might be in the White Tower.  When Elayne and Nynaeve use need to find the Bowl of the Winds, they were first taken to a storage room in the Tower.  They specified that their "need" was for something that would help Rand, and possibly bring him and the rebel Aes Sedai to each other.  They dismissed it since there was no way of getting it while Elaida held the Tower.

 

RJ never does anything for no reason.  I think there is a good possibility that this room could hold male angreal/sa'angreal.  Perhaps even this third unknown most powerful one.

 

Or it could hold something even more important.  Or less important.  *shrugs*

[Blackhoof]

and i don't ever reading that AS destroyed any male angreal. and i don't know how they would know if an object is one seeing as how they couldn't test it.

Most likely, they would just throw the suspected items in an unused room like the High Lords of Tear.

 

I agree, i dont think that they can destroy angreal or sa'angreal or ter'angreal, and if they could, it would be impractical to destroy everything that might be a male artefact, how would they know? destroy every statuette of a suspicopusly male nature?

[Luckers]

I believe it was in the big book that the Crystal Throne is said to be a ter'angreal. Ive always thought that the viewing/dream/prophecy about Rand sitting in someones chair, and them being murderously angry pertained to the Seanchen throne.

 

As someone else pointed out, the angry thing was Elayne with the Lion Throne. Rand will never sit the Crystal Throne because he will never go to Seanchan. RJ stated this.

[Mr. Dragon]

I think we can reasonable assume that more ter'angreal like the bowl of winds were made than ultra-powerful sa'angreal as the bowl of winds was only meant for the area close by. So the probability is that the one in the store room is a climate control ter'angreal or something else, but as was said earlyer, we just don't know.

[Majsju]

The 3rd male sa'angreal is totally Whitebridge. A bridge that survived the Breaking? Come on! ;D