WoT Season 2 Episode 7: Daes Dae'Mar

[Ralph]

6 hours ago, ilovezam said:

 

 

If Lanfear could have just randomly yeeted Mat to Falme after knocking him out, why involve Min at all? If the Dark wants Moiraine dead now, why did Ishy only bother with stilling her to begin with?

 

both are Lanfear not working with Ish

[Irvyne]

Oh geez.

What have they done to Lan...?

What have they done to Siuan...?

What have they done to Mat...?

This show, man. I swear the writers have never actually read the books. They just looked at names and general plot points and said, "Ah, we're all right. We can do better."

/ shakes head in disbelief

[ilovezam]

40 minutes ago, DaddyFinn said:

Maybe Siuan intended to just get Lan out of the way. Oaths are full of loopholes. 

 

Haha, the classic "Your Honour, I pressed the trigger of the gun I pointed at him, but I did not actually want him dead!" 

[Agitel]

Ishy wanted Moiraine alive. Lanfear gave the order to Liandrin to have her killed by Barthanes.

[SinisterDeath]

1 hour ago, ilovezam said:

 

Haha, the classic "Your Honour, I pressed the trigger of the gun I pointed at him, but I did not actually want him dead!" 

In this case, it wasn't a weapon, it was crowd control. Like a fire hose. 

 

I think the easiest way to think about the 3rd oath, is to approach it the same way we do modern day police use of force.
"Oh shit! That person blinked at me! MY LIFE IS IN DANGER!"

[Windigo]

9 hours ago, Rhaze said:

 I am so freaking glad Moiraine's sister is NOT a dark friend. I am proud of her accomplishments in some silly kind of way and I did not want them to be lessened because of her being a DF.

This was well done. I look forward to what they have planned for the future with Anvaere, and some of the theories on what roles she will play, if those pan out then it will really add meaning to some of them.

 

[king of nowhere]

ok, just started but i'm stopping here because, as much as i wanted to see the gitara foretelling, that scene really does not work.
first, the blood snow. the batle was in winter. shaiel if fighting in the snow. but there's no snow in tar valon, not anywhere that we can see. in fact, the vibrant greens we see in the fields in the distance imply late spring. the season does not fit. the juxtaposition between the scenes of the fight and the foretelling, with gitara saying it is happening now, only highlights it.

and second, gitara flinches from the stab on the side, as if she was connected to shaiel and was feeling the blow. then she delivers her short speech. then she dies as shaiel dies. a birth can take hours; tens of minutes even in the best case, and a mother stabbed is probably not a best case. so either shaiel managed to delive the child in 30 seconds, or gitara took half an hour to say her few sentences.

 

I liked lan telling moiraine that she has to trust somebody because she can't do everything alone. i can totally picture somebody telling the same thing to rand eventually. it can be a powerful moment.

 

oh, siuan is wonderful. i really hope they keep her part in the story - wait, she was wonderful until she decided to keep rand trapped. minus 100 coolness points for you, siuan

 

huh, aviendha gets beaten by bain and chiad. I guess she made some mistake that caused the death of jolien, and she's paying toh. I don't like that they are cutting out of the sequence, though. the public will need to have it explained.

they actually managed to explain what toh is in half a minute. kudos to the scriptwriters for that. the aiel reaction in front of the sea could have been funnier.

 

i was hoping barthanes was not a darkfriend this time. he looked like such a nice guy.

wait, wait, wait. barthanes will try to kill moiraine; does that mean lan will get to do something for once?

 

is verin revealed as a black? she didn't say the amyrlin sent for her, she said that the amyrlin needed her, which is vague enough to respect the oath. but the part about the order? is that a direct lie, or a mistake in translation?

 

so, in this version of the story tying waves was a talent lost since millennia? it certainly explains why moiraine didn't suspect it. however, tied shield was a perfect explanation for how liandrin carried the girls through the ways. i hope they considered the implications, and won't open plot holes.

 

the end was... surprising. and confusing.

[Vartija]

I wish they'd given Rand more of an equal moment with Siuan. Feels wrong to first have Lan say his "face it on your feet"-speech and then have him literally crouch in a corner for much of the scene. In the books, I thought it was a beautiful moment when his void shatters and he stumbles but regains his composure. The scene in the show lacks the part in the book where Siuan & Moiraine are also shaken or at least uncomfortable by the experience but in a different way. This was more like a one sided put down which imo is a bit of a disservice to Rand's character development at this point. Like, in some ways he should be way ahead of his book persona when facing Siuan in the show and I thought this could have been a great moment for him to show some of his power but instead we were reminded how unlearned he is just one episode before the season's finale. 

[nsmallw]

I enjoyed this episode pretty well. Just three things that bothered me. All of which i've seen from others before me. Cold open was too short, needed to be more developed. It seemed the shortest cold open in the whole show, but I could be wrong. It needed more of the Gitara portion. Second, Barthanes as DF was kinda anti-climatic to me. Why didn't he get another DF to help him find Moiraine instead of some random dude who obviously by his demeanor was NOT going to be helping Barthanes.  Barthanes was too trusting and I may be wrong but were those soldiers sent to guard him holding Rifles ??. Please someone tell me I'm wrong about that. Thirdly, to me Rand is woefully unprepared to face Ishy. Everyone can over power him! No really developed sword fighting to handle Turok and his seemingly unknowledgeable of any defensive weaves, or any weaves for that matter is an issue to me. I am really stoked for episdose 8, I really hope Amazon gave them even more time to use and money to spend, because they've got to do so much to end the season on a high note. Please we don't need another season one , episode eight !

That's all folks. 😄

Edited September 29, 2023 by nsmallw
edit a word

[SinisterDeath]

4 minutes ago, nsmallw said:

Barthanes was too trusting and I may be wrong but were those soldiers sent to guard him holding Rifles ??.

For the love of the light calm down, those weren't rifles. They were spears.

[Guire]

I think I have figured out show Lan.  After his rescue from Malkier he was raised by his surrogate family in their noodle shop in Fal Dara.  Lan grew up idolizing the Shienaran soldiers and entertaining them with martial arts exhibitions. His stage name was Battle Lord. After Aiel War ended and country side was safe Dai Shan took his show on the road to Chachin to explore franchising the Seven Towers noodle house.  He met distraught Moraine on road and cheered her up.  Lan is Kung Fu Panda or Lan Pandragoran if you will.

[nsmallw]

7 minutes ago, SinisterDeath said:

For the love of the light calm down, those weren't rifles. They were spears.

Whew! Thanks SD  🙂 The bad lighting threw me. 

[Agitel]

The screenshots and clips I see from other people are all at least twice as dark as what I actually see on my TV. It's weird.

 

I guess I just stealth bragged but it's surprising to me.

[king of nowhere]

30 minutes ago, nsmallw said:

Whew! Thanks SD  🙂 The bad lighting threw me. 

you may not have noticed a few weeks ago when we discovered the trick; you have to download the episodes and watch them from downloaded. they are better quality, and with better light. i also couldn't make out much beofre i discovered that trick

[ilovezam]

1 hour ago, SinisterDeath said:

In this case, it wasn't a weapon, it was crowd control. Like a fire hose. 

 

I think the easiest way to think about the 3rd oath, is to approach it the same way we do modern day police use of force.
"Oh shit! That person blinked at me! MY LIFE IS IN DANGER!"

It was also the exact same move Liandrin did against the Wonder Girls that made Elayne go "SHE BROKE ALL THE OATHS" 😛

[fra85uk]

Ok, so now we officially know that of course Moraine was not stilled and this was a subplot to have some Moraine/Lan arc in S2.

[Vartija]

Overall I felt similarily about this episode as I did with S1 E8. By that I mean I was entertained enough and curious about where they were going, but I had to shut down my book-brain to be able to enjoy it, especially the Siuan-Moiraine-Lan parts. Also, it felt like they crammed a lot into this episode. We were constantly jumping from Cairhien to Egwene to Perrin to Mat and back to Cairhien that it felt a little rushed and disjointed. This to me is a bit of an issue with the show. The pace can be really slow for several episodes and then suddenly very frantic. All this has me a bit worried for the season finale. Though one could argue this episode was "sacrificed" for getting everyone ready for a more focused finale. 

[SinisterDeath]

4 minutes ago, ilovezam said:

It was also the exact same move Liandrin did against the Wonder Girls that made Elayne go "SHE BROKE ALL THE OATHS" 😛

Liandrin also knocked all of them unconscious, with the intent to do harm. Siuan's intent was to push Lan off to the side and out of the way.

[Agitel]

What Siuan did in no way broke her oaths. We see Aes Sedai tie people up with air, pin people against walls with their feet off the ground, switching people with weaves of air, to pick up and toss hard objects at people, all in the books. They don't view these types of things as weapons. Weapon has a much more narrow definition, presumably more along the lines of maiming and killing.

Edited September 29, 2023 by Agitel

[Windigo]

34 minutes ago, Agitel said:

The screenshots and clips I see from other people are all at least twice as dark as what I actually see on my TV. It's weird.

 

I guess I just stealth bragged but it's surprising to me.

That is how I see all the dark scenes, no matter what adjustments I make. I find myself going back and grabbing images to then adjust with editor to even see anything. It is really a pain, If I were not 33 year book reader I would have given up on watching a show where half the time I can not see anything. 

[Windigo]

Ok so while not a fan of Lan's arc this season I was not hating on it, as it was more Lan later than Lan earlier in some ways.

But this episode when Lan fakes out and leaves Logain after an implied promise of giving him the key, that made me angry at it, because if there is one thing Lan is at his core it is honorable. I could put up with a softer honorable Lan, but this really bugged me. 

[SinisterDeath]

1 minute ago, Windigo said:

Ok so while not a fan of Lan's arc this season I was not hating on it, as it was more Lan later than Lan earlier in some ways.

But this episode when Lan fakes out and leaves Logain after an implied promise of giving him the key, that made me angry at it, because if there is one thing Lan is at his core it is honorable. I could put up with a softer honorable Lan, but this really bugged me. 

Well he did say he was going to give him the key... When he gets to the White Tower.

 

Which will be pivotable when Siuan gets deposed... 

[Windigo]

32 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

you may not have noticed a few weeks ago when we discovered the trick; you have to download the episodes and watch them from downloaded. they are better quality, and with better light. i also couldn't make out much beofre i discovered that trick

First I am hearing of that trick, I have tried every other adjustment or settings change with no changes. Not sure I even knew downloading episodes was an option. 

[mogi68]

14 minutes ago, Windigo said:

That is how I see all the dark scenes, no matter what adjustments I make. I find myself going back and grabbing images to then adjust with editor to even see anything. It is really a pain, If I were not 33 year book reader I would have given up on watching a show where half the time I can not see anything. 

 

Does your TV have an "HDMI Black Level" setting? I couldn't see anything in dark scenes and then I discovered that in the menu and now I can actually tell what's going on

[Mirefox]

Some notes as I watch:

 

-Both Moiraine and Susan were planning on retiring and living in a fisherman’s hut together?  Stupid.

 

-Rand had been training.  Why were we never shown it?  The showrunners insisted that we needed a Steppin episode because they need to “show, not tell” but with Rand he just miraculously has sword training.

 

-Hey, look, yet another “knock a character out to relocate them” trick.  This time, to get Mat to Falme instantly.  Such lazy writing.

 

-Damane pacifiers are the single stupidest-looking costume design in this series.  

 

-Bain and Chiad look like Aiel.  Why doesn’t Avi?

 

-Mat’s memories better not come from freaking Forsaken tea.  I like the nod to him hanging, though.

 

-The Moiraine stilling thing was handled clumsily from start to finish.

 

-Siuan accused Moiraine of lying!  She outright called Moiraine black ajah.

 

l