tv show spoilers S1E7: The Dark Along the Ways

[Sabio]

Rewatching the episode, when Rand and Egwene start to snuggle in the Ways. Perin does shoot them a long look.  Is it because he does have feeling for Egwene or it makes him remember he brutally murdered his wife?

[WhiteVeils]

Given the basics they've described for the world (premarital sex is OK in general, including in the Two Rivers), they had to get Lan and Nynaeve to this point before Nynaeve's Accepted test (assuming she gets one).

[flinn]

Makes perfect sense to me.. When you go back and watch there are a lot of tells that Perrin is into Egwene. Then he has to go home to 2nd choice and pretend. Really lowers Perrins character, but I am getting used to all the men being lessened.

[TheDreadReader]

4 minutes ago, Sabio said:

Rewatching the episode, when Rand and Egwene start to snuggle in the Ways. Perin does shoot them a long look.  Is it because he does have feeling for Egwene or it makes him remember he brutally murdered his wife?

 

I think for the show's purposes you're supposed to believe that Perrin has feelings for Egwene.  Rafe and the actress that played Leila shot down the Leila as a darkfriend theory but said that there was something else there.  Maddy said something similar in one of her interviews.  And, of course we have the conflict presented in this episode.

 

As other's have pointed out there is some possible evidence from the books for this (evidence equivalent to how the Nyn/Lan romance was developed) so there is some foundation for it.  

 

It may make more sense if you think of Egwene as replacing Berelain for the Falcon/Hawk dynamic for Perrin and Faile story.

 

[WheelofJuke]

9 minutes ago, Daenelia said:

 

It's a personal thing I suppose. I think for Nyn to take the lead and go into the bedroom knowing full well what she wanted was a great thing.

 

I am not one to pine and long and be wishy-washy either. I've been in a long distance relationship and trust me: pining and longing is way way way overrated.

For sure!

 

Personally, what I want for myself, and what I want for two characters probably differs greatly in many aspects!  ?

 

For me, the Nyn/Lan romance story arc was the most successful of Jordan's character developments, and their consummation was one of the highlight payoffs of the whole series. 

 

Not turning it into Rachel/Ross at the VERY LEAST is a wasted opportunity for later seasons. ? ?

[Skipp]

1 hour ago, Gothic Flame said:

Add in a woman in labor fighting... 

Trope or not, she died of her wounds in the book.  It is canon.

[Sabio]

I think the only 8 episodes per season makes them speed the relationships up.  There is a lot less time for the whole I love you but i don't want to make you a widow thing.

[bringbackthomsmoustache]

2 minutes ago, WheelofJuke said:

For me, the Nyn/Lan romance story arc was the most successful of Jordan's character developments, and their consummation was one of the highlight payoffs of the whole series. 

 

Not turning it into Rachel/Ross at the VERY LEAST is a wasted opportunity for later seasons.

At least it would give him a ready excuse when he gets with the woman his bond is passed to - he can state that they "were on a break!"

[Sabio]

1 hour ago, Gothic Flame said:

Add in a woman in labor fighting... 

When my wife was in labor she wanted to fight the nurse, so I can believe it.  Women in labor are not happy people.

[bringbackthomsmoustache]

9 hours ago, Therese Sedai said:

Really enjoyed the episode and I only have one question.
 

So Rand shows up to Moiraine’s room and is just like “it me” and Moiraine’s just like “aight let’s go.”  
 

Did I miss something from earlier in the episode or is the audience just meant to not read too much into it. Seems like Moiraine would want to know for sure that it’s him before rushing away with him to what could be both their deaths. 

Shall we assume that Rand gave a full exposition of what he had just worked out and we saw in the montage / from Min - would having that on screen make good TV - the audience already knows.

[notpropaganda73]

21 minutes ago, Daenelia said:

 

It's a personal thing I suppose. I think for Nyn to take the lead and go into the bedroom knowing full well what she wanted was a great thing.

 

I am not one to pine and long and be wishy-washy either. I've been in a long distance relationship and trust me: pining and longing is way way way overrated.

 

Lan and Nynaeve is, in my view, the best thing they have done in the show. All of their moments since episode 4 especially, have been excellent. The scene made sense in the show because as others have pointed out, they are apart for so long pretty soon and why would viewers care about the two of them if they hadn't even kissed? 

 

 

[WheelofJuke]

Oh! 

And to be fair and balanced, I DID IN FACT see a shot that used a light source from behind the subject, leaving the face in shadow in order to create a sense of foreboding. 

 

Not unlike Rembrandt pioneered. ?

 

I call it like I see it, good or bad, lulz.  ?

[TheDreadReader]

9 hours ago, Therese Sedai said:

Really enjoyed the episode and I only have one question.
 

So Rand shows up to Moiraine’s room and is just like “it me” and Moiraine’s just like “aight let’s go.”  
 

Did I miss something from earlier in the episode or is the audience just meant to not read too much into it. Seems like Moiraine would want to know for sure that it’s him before rushing away with him to what could be both their deaths. 

 

One of the values of doing a montage reveal like that is the audience will easily make the connection between the reveal and the acting on the reveal.  Just like they will make the connection between Lan's statement of masking the bond and Rand and Moiraine leaving without telling anyone because Rand "can't lose anyone else in this room".

 

 

 

[ManetherenTaveren]

5 minutes ago, TheDreadReader said:

I think for the show's purposes you're supposed to believe that Perrin has feelings for Egwene.  Rafe and the actress that played Leila shot down the Leila as a darkfriend theory but said that there was something else there.  Maddy said something similar in one of her interviews.  And, of course we have the conflict presented in this episode.

As presented, it seems a bit ridiculous, but as you mentioned, who knows where this conjured conflict is going? Surely, their time with the tuatha'an and CotL would have brought them closer, but I would have preferred for P & E to have met in tel'aran'rhiod at some point and had a critical encounter with an escalated evil that raised the stakes and forced them to discover and relate to each other on another level. Hence, Perrin would have found Rand to be ignorant and in need of some quick education of mind and body.

 

Unfortunately, Perrin has been relegated to a dumb brute in the show thus far, which is somewhat frustrating.     

[Deviations]

Overall, I liked this episode and for me it was easily the best so far.

 

Blood snow - Awesome.  My non-book reader wife loved it too.  "She's a bad ass".  Tam showed up as a good guy.  Almost all I needed for Christmas.  The folks on here had me convinced he was going to kill Tigraine.

Fever dream - Too short but it filled in a couple of gaps.  Should have been in the first episode.  I've never agreed with the 'who's the dragon' hide and seek game this series has played.

Mat has darkness inside him?  I don't write well enough to share my disgust with that change to his character.  I don't care where they are trying to go with it. 

Algemar - Why is he an antagonistic ass?  Why swap his wife with a little sister?

The Ways - underwhelming CGI but not a huge problem.  The voices were great.

The Triangle - Stupid.  Perrin is a waste so far.  All he does is stumble around with a sad face.

Lan/Nyneave - Too Early.  I still like her in this series but her behavior is muddy in the series compared to the books.  I don't know how to better describe that but an example is her dialog by the lake - something like I've already put myself out there more than is proper....  Here, she follows him and then later goes into his room.  Directionally similar, but not as interesting to me.  Think about Hailey Steinfeld in True Grit.  Very sharp tonged with biting wit.

The blight -  Very disappointing.

Perrin's Eyesight- Glad they brought it up but I like Jordan's version better.  Rust from a distance not only demonstrating eyesight but that a family had been wiped out and their possessions left behind to disintegrate.

Rand- At one point, someone is talking about Rand and my wife says "Which one is Rand again?".....  Glad he is revealed.  His remembrance of using the power was a bit rushed but at this point, they didn't really have much choice.  I would have traded the whole warder death/bond downside/Lan shirt rip arc with Rand and Mat on the ship with Tom.

Rand's Archery- He should have been shooting at a much greater distance.  He should have been better even before he achieved the flame and void.  He should have had to explain what he was doing with the flame and void, maybe in front of Lan.  Lan could have given him a bit of borderland kingly wisdom about duty.

 

Looking forward to the finale but not sure how they are going to show a HUGE battle given the way they've done things so far.

 

[DermidAjala]

3 minutes ago, Deviations said:

Algemar - Why is he an antagonistic ass?  Why swap his wife with a little sister?

 

 

Amalisa was always his sister. It really bugged me that they made him antagonistic though because he is exceptionally welcoming and supportive

[WheelofJuke]

1 minute ago, DermidAjala said:

 

Amalisa was always his sister. It really bugged me that they made him antagonistic though because he is exceptionally welcoming and supportive

Perhaps they're playing up that angle to provide some "whodunit" aspect to the DF betrayal at Fal Dara. 

[notpropaganda73]

I honestly didn't find him all that antagonistic but from reading this thread and seeing some book reader reviews of the episode, I am in a minority of one lol 

[JeffTheWoodlandElf]

11 hours ago, bringbackthomsmoustache said:

Also it was not necessary of reasonable to have her fighting at all - the books only indicate that she died in child birth (very common in a low tech culture especially without assistance of a midwife).

Women never die. That would be sexist. 

[TheDreadReader]

For Algemar... they have to find a way to show how the general population of the westlands mistrust the Aes Sedai.   Adding in a little mistrust and antagonism from the Borderlanders is pretty easy way to show it.

 

In the books, does Algemar and Fal Dara send word to the Tower asking for help and then not receive any?

I seem to remember that but I'm not 100% sure.

 

 

[TheDreadReader]

1 minute ago, notpropaganda73 said:

I honestly didn't find him all that antagonistic but from reading this thread and seeing some book reader reviews of the episode, I am in a minority of one lol 

 

I didn't find him antagonistic as much as I found him unimpressed by the Aes Sedai.  But, I also don't think that we are really supposed to think of the Aes Sedai as being "good, noble, and pure" at this point.  So, expecting a little mistrust of them seems appropriate.

 

 

 

 

[notpropaganda73]

3 minutes ago, TheDreadReader said:

 

I didn't find him antagonistic as much as I found him unimpressed by the Aes Sedai.  But, I also don't think that we are really supposed to think of the Aes Sedai as being "good, noble, and pure" at this point.  So, expecting a little mistrust of them seems appropriate.

 

Yes agreed, I thought the scene functioned to show how much respect Lan had versus Moiraine in that room as well. Uno and the lads all bowed to Lan, Lord Agelmar addressed Lan first, Moiraine was an afterthought in many ways. Like you say, unimpressed rather than antagonistic. 

 

Edit: And he does go on to say something about a long-standing friendship with the White Tower, or something similar, doesn't he? 

 

 

Edited December 17, 2021 by notpropaganda73

[Elder_Haman]

7 hours ago, Seraphine said:

I do like the explanations that minimize/explain the love triangle (Perrin cares for Egwene but didn't fully understand love when he was younger, Nynaeve is misreading things, etc.). But part of what the Black Wind says to Perrin is that he loves another woman more than his wife. My impression of the Black Wind is that it feeds on one's insecurities/fears, so it seems like there's a part of Perrin that worries about this, which I don't like. I would have been much happier with the Black Wind feeding his fears about violence. While I suspect the love triangle issue not going to turn into a big thing (e.g. Rand and Perrin dueling for Egwene), I still don't get the purpose of having it be a thing at all.

Here's where I think this is going: Perrin clearly blames himself for Laila's death. He loved her deeply and felt guilty about having feelings for anyone other than Laila. At the same time, he is also very fond of Egwene and so Machin Shin is using that to feed into that blame about Laila's death. "You don't love Laila enough" is the thing that is eating at him. In my opinion, it's a way to set up Faile. Perrin's early arc will be about him coming to terms with his guilt and being able to love again.

 

The "love triangle" isn't a thing. Rand acknowledges this to Egwene. (And can we take a moment to reflect on how well Rand played the petulant jealousy thing - foreshadowing some coming behavior changes). But it's put out there as a thing to help the audience see how much Perrin is protective of Egwene but also struggles with the idea that he was somehow unfaithful to Laila. At least that's my take.

 

[Deviations]

22 minutes ago, DermidAjala said:

Amalisa was always his sister.

My bad....

[Elder_Haman]

1 hour ago, WheelofJuke said:

But I found the "cheapening" of the slow burn of their feelings for each other in the books unfortunate; as the tension created from the uncertainty of whether or not they would be able to realize their love for each other brought much to their characters.  

Are you arguing that the Nynaeve/Lan romance was a 'slow burn of feelings'? That somehow there was a build up to a "will they/won't they"? RJ was a great writer of many things - romance was not one of those things. The tv relationship feels 1000% more organic than the one from the books. And this from someone who is generally not thrilled with the changes to Lan.