tv show spoilers S1E5: Blood Calls Blood

[dwn]

59 minutes ago, grayavatar said:

 

I don't understand why Stepin had to drug Lan in order to kill himself. When they showed the knife missing I thought Stepin was perhaps a darkfriend gone to kill Moiraine. With Lan rushing off to save her. Why else would you drug a warder.

 

I think the scene where Nynaeve gives him the tea and Lan waking up could easily have been removed.

 

Because Lan was there specifically to keep him from hurting himself. (Why else would Lan be there instead of guarding Moiraine?) We're lead to believe that Stepin went to Nynaeve for the sleeping aid because he intended to overdose on it, but that was both foreshadowing and misdirection--he really wanted it as a means to escape from his watchers.

[Beidomon]

1 hour ago, grayavatar said:

 

In the books Loial is very expressive with his forehead and eyebrows but in the show that whole area seems like inflexible rubber.

Exactly. It’s a mess. At least he can move his mouth but everything around the eyes is just totally immobile and fake. 

[king of nowhere]

when moiraine opens that sort of tabernacle, what's she looking at? I can't understand that scene

 

Probably someone already explained it, but can't read 40 pages of discussion

[DaddyFinn]

9 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

when moiraine opens that sort of tabernacle, what's she looking at? I can't understand that scene

 

Probably someone already explained it, but can't read 40 pages of discussion

It's a picture/painting of a woman looking outside from a window/door.

Edited December 8, 2021 by DaddyFinn

[king of nowhere]

36 minutes ago, DaddyFinn said:

It's a picture/painting of a woman looking outside from a window/door.

huh? what does it mean, them? i assumed it would have some kind of special significance...

[DaddyFinn]

2 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

huh? what does it mean, them? i assumed it would have some kind of special significance...

I guess it's clarified later. WAFO is the way ?

[flinn]

17 hours ago, dwn said:

 

Because Lan was there specifically to keep him from hurting himself. (Why else would Lan be there instead of guarding Moiraine?) We're lead to believe that Stepin went to Nynaeve for the sleeping aid because he intended to overdose on it, but that was both foreshadowing and misdirection--he really wanted it as a means to escape from his watchers.

 Yep, Lan was the Epstein guard. Wonder if he got paid off to let Stepin "suicide".

[Jearom Gaidin]

On 12/2/2021 at 6:41 PM, TheDreadReader said:

We got a Blood and Bloody Ashes...

 

 

Loved it!!!!

[Jearom Gaidin]

On 12/2/2021 at 5:28 PM, CaddySedai said:

Will post running thoughts on the episode here: Weeeeee. 

 

• I do like that both sides of the battle got a proper burial. Thats classy of the Aes Sedai.
• The shallow graves don’t bother me - deep graves are for coffins and to ensure flooding doesn't unbury. Im sure thats not likely an issue here.
• The circle is reminiscent of the Wheel. Heavy symbolism.
• LMAO - a month later. Damn show you jump even when not jumpin.
• ”Warders are not supposed to outlive their Aes Sedai”
• ”I think I’ve seen it before” - Welcome home Lewis Therin. I mean not the Dragon Reborn.
• Tar Valon looks gorgeous.
• BLOOD AND ASHES!!!!!!! BLOOD AND ASHES!!!!!!
• Yes Rand, Tar Valon is expensive. Thats how supply and deman works. 
• I like that Mat fears he killed the family. The character depth ❤️
• Finally using proper words like “The Source”
• “I’ll be joining the dogs” - you don't say Perrin?
• Whitecloaks keep dat hand strooong lol 
• YAY - Loial and the Prophecy! 
• Heron Mark.
• ”An Aielman from the Two Rivers who insists he is not an Aielman”
• The laughing is wonderful lol. Bless Logain’s heart.
• The feels for Stepin.
• ”first you lose Moiraine” - wonder if someones gonna feel a bit like a heel later lol.
• Melty Ring Rituals FTW. Way easier than the One Ring.
• Finally an explanation of the crutch.
• Child Valda got read like a book. Lol. Still a monster tho.
• Laylas death confession. Daaang
• Light Protect Me! What are you?
• I want the Chosen statues! Someone 3d print that ish naaaaao.
• Stepin ?
• Throat singing.
• Very Maori of them

Portal stones appearing twice?? First as Moraine and Lan riding, then again as Mat and Rand are walking into Tar Valon outside villages

[DaddyFinn]

2 minutes ago, Jearom Gaidin said:

Portal stones appearing twice?? First as Moraine and Lan riding, then again as Mat and Rand are walking into Tar Valon outside villages

Someone translated these on twitter

 

[Bruan]

10 minutes ago, flinn said:

 Yep, Lan was the Epstein guard. Wonder if he got paid off to let Stepin "suicide".

all they’re missing a one ‘e’ to make it an anagram. Makes you wonder if the name was originally ‘Stepine’ or something lol.

[Jearom Gaidin]

1 minute ago, DaddyFinn said:

Someone translated these on twitter

 

Wow amazing!!

 

[Jaysen Gore]

16 minutes ago, Bruan said:

all they’re missing a one ‘e’ to make it an anagram. Makes you wonder if the name was originally ‘Stepine’ or something lol.

By baseball rules, the "E' was Lan's drinking the tea, so there you go.

[Beidomon]

16 minutes ago, Bruan said:

all they’re missing a one ‘e’ to make it an anagram. Makes you wonder if the name was originally ‘Stepine’ or something lol.

He was clearly transitioning toward the end, so that makes a lot of sense. 

[DaddyFinn]

51 minutes ago, Jearom Gaidin said:

Wow amazing!!

 

It'll be fun to see if those are portal stones(I don't think so) or just signposts for the roads

[Bruan]

45 minutes ago, DaddyFinn said:

It'll be fun to see if those are portal stones(I don't think so) or just signposts for the roads

The portal stones as described in the book seemed much more deliberately made cylindrical Stone posts, and much larger... so it wouldn’t surprise me if these were what they came up with since they look so different than you’d think.

[dwn]

Given the visual medium, I expect these were sign posts that are superficially similar to portal stones. It'll make the introduction of portal stones feel more natural, and it'll be a nice surprise for anyone unfamiliar with the books when chaos ensues.

[ArrylT]

One thing I like about Episode 5 is the continued arc of Perrin.   I think that the Stepin arc can be tied into so many things, and that was its intent.   Warder bond, Mental health, Personal Choices, foreshadowing.  

 

With Stepin we see someone who chose not to live before and tried to die by violence, but was averted through friendship.   That could have been Perrin.   He could have decided he could not have lived with the guilt from the accidental death of Laila.  He came close in Episode 5, willing to let Egwene go free and die for what he perceived were his sins.    But instead, and like young Stepin, and unlike old Stepin, he got past this mental hurdle, with help from a friend.

 

Egwene chose to accept Perrin for all his flaws, just like Kerene did with young Stepin. And so Perrin chose not to take the easy path. Old Stepin was tired (mentioned in Ep4), worn down with guilt & grief, so his choice, tragic as it is, can be understood.   Perrin had his whole life ahead of him still and still came close.

 

We've talked about how this is really an ensemble show, which after the early books, is basically the book series.  I've mentioned about balance and acceptance.  This episode really showcases this in terms of mental balance and acceptance of friends.  Your friends are there for you.  Lean on them when you need them.   Stepin could not.  Perrin could.   

 

 

[Sabio]

This issue is they spent alot of time drawing you into Steph's arc, Logains etc.. just to kill them or have them vanish for a long time.  It feels wasteful considering the limted time they have for the series.  Ok Steph is this interesting guy, going through emotional trauma, ok now he's dead.  They just wasted your time in an episode killing someone they spent alot of the episode building up.

[deathgate]

12 hours ago, Sabio said:

This issue is they spent alot of time drawing you into Steph's arc, Logains etc.. just to kill them or have them vanish for a long time.  It feels wasteful considering the limted time they have for the series.  Ok Steph is this interesting guy, going through emotional trauma, ok now he's dead.  They just wasted your time in an episode killing someone they spent alot of the episode building up.

 

It worked for GOT. Of course the book readers know they aren't big characters (Logain is later) but it does add some of that GOT/SoF&I dread that one of your favorite characters may die at any moment. I almost stopped reading GOT because of that but it slowed way down after the first book. WOT is almost the opposite where all of the favorites live so adding some that may seem favorites that die or are tossed aside makes the others vulnerable (to the non book readers).

[nsmallw]

On 12/8/2021 at 8:21 AM, DaddyFinn said:

I guess it's clarified later. WAFO is the way ?

Perhaps it's an angreal ?

[NetNightmare]

1 hour ago, deathgate said:

It worked for GOT. Of course the book readers know they aren't big characters (Logain is later) but it does add some of that GOT/SoF&I dread that one of your favorite characters may die at any moment. I almost stopped reading GOT because of that but it slowed way down after the first book. WOT is almost the opposite where all of the favorites live so adding some that may seem favorites that die or are tossed aside makes the others vulnerable (to the non book readers).

Mmm imho there is a difference here.. in SoI&F Martin love to kill characters, but those that do have a role in main\side plot and mainly whose readers may have developed an affinity with... here we are killing "stepin" .. again stepin who ????. As a side note there are definitely lots of "favorite" who dies in WOT, that obviously depends of who's one favorite are heh.

 

I think that  for most of the "strange" changes made, people are desperately trying to attribute them, all sort of convoluted meaning, as if that will in some way give it a higher purpose.

 

I do watch the show, I will stay awake till 1 am tonight to watch the new episode. I do somewhat enjoy it, but to be honest I was hoping to love it (which sadly is not the case) especially this one we will se the next see you in the next thread he he

[Sabio]

I believe it was Sanderson who said Martin has worked with TV before so when he made GOT they were probably made with the thought of adapting them to TV later.  Martin has a better idea of what works etc and if you read GOT you expect some main people will get killed, because the series is about the last person/house standing wins it all sort of thing.  In a series like Star Wars, WOT etc you already expect most the good guys are making it out alive.  If WOT had been about the Forsaken, you would expect alot of the characters are going to get murdered by one another.

 

But in a series where time is so short don't waste the viewers time getting them so invested in Steph just to kill them 50 minutes later.   I think it could have been just if not more powerful, if on the way back he is over come with grief and just rides off in a rage. You could still fit in info of what a warder feels when their Aes Sedai dies but use the extra time to build up main people like focusing on Mat's sickness more.

[fra85uk]

Stepin had to die in the berserk attack vs. Logain in ep4.

Then of course the actor is very good and he delivered well in ep5 and all the arc was done properly...but still filler episode.

[NetNightmare]

58 minutes ago, fra85uk said:

Stepin had to die in the berserk attack vs. Logain in ep4.

Then of course the actor is very good and he delivered well in ep5 and all the arc was done properly...but still filler episode.

I disagree, imho Stepin had to die in a berserk attack against the false dragon army as soon as he sensed Karene die, his attack to Logain was the worst thing he could do, I find it amazing none of the other Aes Sedai or the other Warders stopped him from endangering all the others... but of course they had to show Nyn AoE heal...