Frozen Mafia Game Thread--GAME OVER--MAFIA WIN

[Shad_]

Oh, and Razen's reads.  It's a bit of wifom since he knew he was going down.  Does Razen continue to try and town or does he try to spew his team mates clean by targeting them?  Hard to say.  He had to put Hallia and Kronos at null realistically because they'd barely participated at that point.  He put Zander strong town, AJ slight town, Kaylee slight scum.

[Shad_]

One last thought because I want to win this: if scum collectively planned to bus I don't think there's any way the Godfather doesn't play along and tries to protect Razen for a while before caving in to the lynch.  Like, I don't see a scum qt discussion here where they go "Hey, no one's going to expect 4 of us, let's all hard bus Razen for cred and ride a smooth train to an early lylo that no one will see coming".  I think the bus happened by accident.

[Kaylee]

 

 

Zander, didn't you just say last night that you would go with Sooh over Kaylee and voted accordingly? What changed?

Dice's vote on her. now hes basically confirmed town and no longer a suss to me. Also not a fan of her sheeping.,

 

and i will go Sooh. she was always bottom PoE. 3rd party stuff is leaving me somewhat confused.

Catching up now... not sure if I'll finish since my lunch is almost over.

 

AJ is right. Ask Nyn. I sheep as both alignments. When I'm lost it's what I do.

[Kaylee]

Almost caught up lunch ended. I'll claim when I get home. Running late to getback.

[Shad_]

I'd love to hear Zander explain that.

AJ, way in the past here but do you remember what you meant by this? I remember what I thought you meant.

[Shad_]

I suppose it's really not that important.

[Zander?]

 

I'd love to hear Zander explain that.

AJ, way in the past here but do you remember what you meant by this? I remember what I thought you meant.

 

 

my vote on Razen

[Shad_]

Way to defeat the purpose of the question. :\

[Aiel Heart]

 

 

 

I am King Agnarr, VT

 

I'm Pral.2 and Sili's daddy.

Oh lord...

 

I'm AJ's wife.

 

[v]Kaylee[/v]

 

 

 

something you wanna tell us....lolololololol

 

He's King Agnarr, I'm Queen Iduna.

 

And oh God! Even worse! I'm Sili and Verb/Pral's mother!

 

*faints*

 

 

 

JFC Im Dice's adopted father???!!!!

 

*SNOOOOOOOORT* 

[Aiel Heart]

AH, I request if possible that you don't end the next night phase early if there is one.  I'll be out most of the day, would like to have another chance to look at things tonight.

Night will probably still be 12 hours. I can make day last a little longer possibly. We'll see. 

 

 

 

Official Vote Count

Sooh (4) - Kaylee, Andrej, Sooh, Shad

Kaylee (2) - dice, Sooh

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Countdown

 

That's a lynch!!!!

[Aiel Heart]

As King Agnarr renewed the search of the kingdom, rope in hand, Queen Iduna stepped out of the limelight. She would go into her daughters' rooms, sit on their beds, imagine the conversations they'd be having were they still here. She walked the halls, remembering how Anna had once run through them alone. 

That was perhaps Iduna's greatest regret; Anna having grown up so apart from her sister. They'd never had a chance to reforge their bond... And now they'd never know love, never have families of their own...

Iduna slid down Elsa's door and wept. 

Then she heard footsteps in the hallway. Knowing that her husband wanted to give her updates as often as possible, she opened the door. 

The knife in her heart became a physical reality. 

 

Sooh, Queen Iduna, vanilla town, has been killed. 

 

It is now Night 5. It will last 12 hours or until all actions have been submitted.

Countdown

[Shad_]

12 hours is great for me, I was just hoping it wouldn't be like 4 or 5.

[Shad_]

Also Zander you forgot to pretend you were happy when Salami flipped.

[Kaylee]

Just got caught up.

 

With believing Shad's claim that means my town read on Dice from before was right.

 

That leaves AJ or Zander.

[Kaylee]

Also I'm Buda the Troll Mom

[Zander?]

 

Not lynching me here is madness. Maybe in an experimental game?

 

Anyway lets have fun.

 

 

 

 

Also Zander you forgot to pretend you were happy when Salami flipped.

 

 

Really?  you're using the word pretend.  Shad dont blow this for us im town FFS.

[Zander?]

Of course this happens on a Tuesday evening which is the one evening when I'm gone for a long chunk of time :P

 

 

 Official Vote Count

Sili (1)--dice,

Kaylee (1)--Razen, 

Razen (7)--Aj, Kaylee, Sooh, Shad, Sili, Hallia, Zander

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

There is currently no deadline

 

That's a lynch! Scene incoming!

 

 

Official Vote Count

Csarmi (6) -- Aj, Thane, dice, Zander, Sili, Hallia

Sili (1) -- Hallia

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch

Countdown

 

 

That's a lynch!!!

 

 

Pral.2 will be replacing Verbal!

 

 

Official Vote Count

Hallia (1) - Thane, Aj, Kaylee, Zander, Sooh

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. 

With an extra 24 hours added in because it's a weekend, deadline is 6pm Sunday. Countdown

 

That's a lynch!

 

 

like SW man im on every lynch.  sure id bus a teammate as scum....but my entire team...come on now,

[Andrej]

Well we've got the troll mom and the troll dad to pick from.

 

Awesome

[Shad_]

#196 -- AJ is the first of our suspects to talk about Hallia. A soft suss, completely null.

 

 

 

 

I didn't really expect Hallia to not take sides, least of all say Dice is as scummy as me.

 

Also, in the case Dice and I are both town, then Hallia's comment can be perceived to be encouraging people to focus on a town pair instead of catching scum.

Not a bad observation. Then again - she literally did the exact opposite as a scum in our last game together. She just labeled the argument v/v and left it alone.

 

I'm trying to take a moment. Lately I'm very bad at reading Dice. My gut reads are wrong with him. He almost always comes across as scum, and I want to make certain I'm not mistaken.

You pushed Dice as a wolf in your last game as well, although there you were using a false meta and here you are attempting to at least explain. So credit where it is due - but - do I need to be concerned again? :(

 

 

 

#243 -- Caught this in passing. Razen corrects Sili's criticism of AJ. Pretty weird considering AJ was Razen's first real target. It comes after AJ barreled over him. Makes me wonder if Razen is trying to kiss a town's butt.

 

#313 -- Zander's first mention of Hallia, sort of mirrors what AJ said.

 

 

 

 

Ehhh, I don't like the whole Sili/Dice thing. I don't get town/town from it, but I don't know yet which one is scummier.

Hallia....you know what happened you tried to push Dice in last game....

 

please elaborate on this for me.

 

 

 

He goes on to +1 Sili's comment that Hallia should know Dice's meta.

 

#315 -- Zander's the first to actually call Hallia scummy.

 

 

 

 

I'm trying to take a moment. Lately I'm very bad at reading Dice. My gut reads are wrong with him. He almost always comes across as scum, and I want to make certain I'm not mistaken.

Hallia you're doing that "looking scummy" thing again....im not liking it FWIW.

 

 

 

#359 -- Zander's first read list, bottom three are Hallia then Sili then Razen.

 

#379 -- Hallia's catch-ups, mostly about confirmed town. Quotes some AJ and says she disagrees with him irt Razen but thinks he's looking town.

 

#382 -- Hallia continues to catch up, quotes more AJ irt Razen and how she's starting to see his point. Uses the face at him which is hardly anything, I know, but coming from scum!Hallia I equate it with butt kissing.

 

#393 -- Hallia giving really lame excuses to town read Zander in this post. But let's not forget that Zander was the first to call her scummy:

 

 

 

Ok I'm caught up.

 

Uh. Ppl clearing zander too fast.

 

Sooh town.

Ummm.....please explain both these lines of thought cause atp. Nothing really here to substantiate either so....

 

That's how I felt.

 

 

 

Uh. Ppl clearing zander too fast.

 

Sooh town.

Ummm.....please explain both these lines of thought cause atp. Nothing really here to substantiate either so....

 

Do you mean you don't think you're being cleared, or not being cleared too fast?

 

atp no one cleared me AT ALL....so WTF are you even talking about?? Verb made a comment about not voting for me today cause I posted a funny pic of Yolo Darth Vader. I mean i dont think you're stupid so to me you're making stuff up and trying to fling dirt at people.

 

Right? I'm glad it wasn't just me.

 

Adding Zander to my townish leans.

 

 

 

#400 -- Shad bashing Razen like a pro

 

#405 -- AJ not convinced Zander is town yet

 

#421

 

I think may be what he meant but it's sort of bad ettiquiet to talk about it so we'll just wait for replacement or modkill imo

 

I am null on Pral. Didn't really agree with his point on Shad but I don't remember much else

~~If I understand how AJ's mind works at all he would never make this post for the purpose of difusing suspicion of a scum mate. It's an integrity thing. I think scum!AJ would be less likely to say it in general.

 

#430 -- AJ raises a point in Razen's favor. To be fair, the same thought crossed my mind.

 

#473 -- AJ resolves that he's still weary of Razen regardless of #430. Wonders if Razen is sucking up to him. ~~Kind of like that I was thinking this in my reread and then AJ actually says it.

 

#484 -- Shad has three scum in his bottom 4 but town reads one of you jerks.

 

p26-28 a bit awkward, we're confused as to whether Zander hammered or not, I say I think he's only the 5th vote, I quote the last VC and Zander's vote. AJ says "I'd love to hear Zander explain that." ~~I took AJ to mean explain a blind hammer.~~ Zander took it to mean explain his vote, and quoted all of the posts where he'd sussed Razen. Other people are confused as to why he's posting these quotes and he brings up AJ's statement and posts them again. ~~Is he a little too concerned here about proving that he didn't just tag along for the ride? I mean I do like to brag about taking down scum, but Razen hadn't flipped yet.

 

#556 -- AJ asks Hallia if she changed her mind on Razen based only on AJ's post. Hallia confirms and adds that the train built naturally, felt scum-free. ~~This is interesting because we now know for a fact that Hallia is covering for someone. AJ, Kaylee, and Zander were all part of this 'natural' train. Not sure I can extract who she was covering for though.

 

p30 -- Zander says "Csarmi not in this game!!!!" Sooh at least thought at the time that this meant they wouldn't be scum mates. Kaylee seems to suss him slightly for it. Zander joke votes Salami, Hallia tries to deliver the hammer but it's back to L-1, Zander hammers.

 

p31 AJ's reactions post-hammer pre-flip:

 

"On a happier subject I just opened a delicious coffee stout by Coronado Brewing." and "I kind of feel like regardless of Razen's flip we won't get much info. Meh"

 

a few of us find these statements weird. AJ quotes me saying I'll be clearing a few people if the flip is scum and he says:

 

"Obviously me cause GOAT. Maybe I'm exaggerating a bit because when I actually think about it if he flips scum we can probably eliminate many of the players he misrepped as immediate suspects. As far as who his teammates are though, I'm not too sure.

 

If he flips town? Not much I think that we've earned. The end of his wagon is kinda sketchy but that could just be one of those things. He basically stopped playing after a certain point."

 

~~AJ's sketching me out here a little.

 

p32

-Zander asks "AJ and Shad thoughts on Hallia?"

-AJ says "I'll have a better answer after we see Razen flip. She's pretty null though"

-I say "Her switch from feeling town about Razen and disagreeing with AJ on the matter to supporting his vote obviously stands out and I kind of want to see a flip and look at her timing before I put too much thought into it."

-Kaylee thinks I might be on to something irt Hallia.

 

There's a long break in time before the flip, but Zander and AJ are both on and waiting for it with celebration gifs at the ready. ~~In my limited experience, scum!Zander doesn't wait around for his team mate's flips. But like I said earlier in the game that's an easy adjustment.

 

p33: At this point I misclear scum.

 

#646 -- Zander says "So Hallia next imo."

 

#648 -- AJ says "Maybe Pral actually"

 

 

#656 -- Zander says "@ Shad....i think if you think Dice is spewed Town Hallia looks worse imo."

 

Me and Zander are sort of excitedly saying who all is spewed town by the flip (including each other), AJ is kind of countering it. He's not ready to clear Zander yet, Thane is gth town but he wouldn't stop a lynch on him... I'm not getting happy vibes from him on reread, but I did in the moment and that's probably more accurate. Part of the difference is just general approach to the game. I prioritize clearing town. AJ prioritizes outing scum.

 

#683 -- Zander saying we should go for Hallia next again.

 

#686 -- Zander's feeling slightly better about Sili but still doesn't trust him, thinks Salami could be scum, needs to look at Pral and Thane

 

#687 -- Zander and I kind of mindmeld on the same ping from Thane.

 

#694 -- Zander's wtl is Salami, Pral, and Hallia

 

#698 -- Sooh notes that Razen could have been in anti-spew mode for almost the whole day. ~~This thought's been floating around in my head ever since she said it.

 

~~Seems like a couple people have felt like something's been off about Zander at this point. Heh.

 

#819 -- alright after a bunch of banter irt Pral AJ shows up with some thoughts. He mentions

-a possible connection between Razen and Sili

-wonders if Razen was trying to link town!Kaylee to a possible scum!Sooh or scum!Thane

 

#828 -- Zander shows up wtl Hallia or Sili. He also points out how Sili was wrong about Pral1.

 

~~Pral2 made an interesting observation here that I hadn't followed up on. He wanted us to look at who jumped on Sili immediately after the Pral1 flip, and he called out Zander for it.

 

Prior to scum killing Pral, Zander's wtl: Hallia, Salami, Pral

After scum kill Pral, Zander's wtl: Hallia, Sili

Between the two, he votes Sili.

 

#838 -- Sili asks Zander to build a case on him and asks how Hallia can be scum. Zander says:

 

"My Case: I'm 90% sure Sili is scum....."

 

As in the Pral flip. Red flag? For Hallia he says "Hallia is her interaction/read/response concerning Dice."

 

#842 -- Zander calls out Dice for not wtl Sili whenever Dice had linked Sili and Razen before.

 

#843 -- AJ follows Sili's blind vote onto Salami, doesn't explain.

 

#846 -- Zander thinks Sili might have set up the Pral1 NK in order to clear himself.

 

~~I didn't catch all of this before. We lynched scum!Laine for this sort of behavior in Belichick and I'm still kicking myself for not doing the same to scum!Nolder last game. If I could have the last lynch back again I think I'd spare Sooh and test Zander for this string of posts alone. It's a theory that has yet to fail me.

 

#847 -- AJ explains his vote on Salami, says he's at the bottom of the POE and he's hoping the votes on him will force him to engage.

 

#848 -- AJ thinks Pral might have been a vig shot. He's the third to say this. Hallia said it first and then Sili.

 

#850 -- AJ thinks Hallia is town. Agrees that her hop onto the Razen wagon wasn't great but likes her treatment of Dice, refers to the points he'd made in #196 but doesn't quote that post. Thinks Sili is in the POE but not for today. ~~Disconnect? In #196 AJ was sussing Hallia for roughly the same reason he's town reading her for here.

 

 

 

Hallia I want to think could be townie.

 

I agree that her change in stance regarding Razen gives me pause, but eh. I also think her handling of Dice is fairly different than what she did in Age of Legends, like I mentioned earlier. She's much more expressive, as to where in the other game she used false meta.

 

Sili is probably gonna have to be resolved before too long, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

 

 

#858 -- Dice asks AJ to help him through Hallia because he's not seeing town in her. AJ says "I mean, I could be wrong but at this stage I think she's more likely a villager than not."

 

#898 -- Sili asks Zander what he thinks of Salami. He says: "atp im not sure tbh. my only real worry was the sub-out which now makes it a little harder with the Verb subout as well. I'd just lynch Csarmi because it would make me lolololololol and I PROMISE this not alignment indicative for either of us."

 

p46: Hallia votes Sili and soft claims vig, Zander starts going at Sili.

 

#931 -- Zander wants me on the Sili wagon too.

 

#937 -- Zander surprised to see Dice doing reads lists, asks if he did them in (I assume a scum game)

 

p49: Sili is freaking out about Thane's mod confirmation and thinks it could be some trap. Around the same time he is the first to "tinfoil" on the possibility of 4 scum. AJ later sussed me for doing both of these things. Surprised Sili didn't bother him. <_<

 

#998 -- "I'm not sure I believe your confusion. You're starting to push it for me" ~~Oh but THERE IT IS. Sili DID bother him. Good consistancy.

 

#1003 -- Zander getting excited that AJ is starting to think Sili's scummy.

 

#1018 -- AJ lays out the yes or no question to Hallia. "Did you shoot Pral?"

 

p52: Sili claims tracker and says Hallia didn't shoot Pral. This is at a point in the game when Sili is under some pressure and Hallia isn't.

AJ says: "No. Why did you track Hallia? Hallia - why did you shoot Pral?"

Zander says: "gtfo" "Well that confirms my that least one of my Hallia and Silli are scum reads!!!"

 

~~Scum knows there is no tracker. At least, attentive scum like AJ do. Scum!Zander could have been baffled here. So both players react as scum certainly could in this situation. Meh.

 

#1055 -- AJ unvotes Salami after the tracker claim and

 

#1065 -- revotes when Sili claims to have viewed him.

 

~~Should I be really bothered that AJ called BS on the tracker claim (scum knows there's no tracker) but immediately accepts the cop claim? Maybe not. Sili had been town reading Hallia, so why would he have tracked her?

 

#1072 -- Zander, on the other hand, thinks Sili is lying with the peek claim. ~~Dice and I did too, but we had good reason.

 

#1087

 

heres my take on it:

 

Sili tells the truth and is the NK...like lets say 90% of the time....lolololololol so 1 4 1 basically

 

sili is lying. we lunch csarmi. and lose another town to NK. so 2 for 1 .

 

am i missing something?

<b>~~Weird/terrible post here where Zander argues that it would be op to lynch someone else and determine which of Sili/Salami are scum based on whether Sili gets night killed.</b>

 

#1088 -- AJ is arguing to test the claim.

 

#1094 -- AJ doesn't like Hallia's reason for vigging Pral but doesn't see where it would make sense for scum to shoot him.

 

#1098 -- Still trying to wrap his head around Hallia's vig claim but thinks we should test Salami first no matter what.

 

~~Point to note here, scum is in a bit of a pickle because there options are 1) kill Salami who has been peeked by a cop or 2) kill the next person in the POE besides Salami or Sili, which seems to be Hallia, and then kill Salami who has been peeked by a cop. Lynching Salami here so Hallia has time to recover is definitely the op scum move. AJ would know that. Would Zander? I'm not as sure. I would feel better if Zander was arguing to lynch Hallia instead of Salami, but he just leaves it at not lynching Salami.

 

#1101 -- ok well now Zander's back to wtl Sili.

 

#1104 -- caves and votes Salami but says he doesn't like it.

 

#1162 -- encourages Sooh to hammer Salami.

 

p62: AJ encouraging us to not tinfoil on complex theories and just hammer Salami

 

p63: Sili and I suss Hallia's hammer the moment she drops it, so the idea of her next might already be floating out there a bit.

 

~~Zander doesn't really ever comment on Salami flipping scum. I find that unusual.

 

#1310 -- still sussing Sili in spite of Salami's flip

 

#1317 -- but repeats what me and Sili said that Hallia's hammer was pretty bad

 

#1367 -- Zander asks if it still makes sense for there to be a vig. (At this point me Sili and Sooh all have our eyes on Hallia)

 

#1393 -- Zander asks if we can ask Pral2 what Pral1 did. ~~I kind of hate this question because the answer is obvious. It's one of those questions scum can ask to look town because they know the answer won't come back to haunt them.

 

#1424 -- Zander asks if I'm absolutely sure Sili's not scum. Says it's the last time he'll ask.

 

#1436 -- Kaylee returns to the game! Yay! She jumps right into sussing Hallia. Doesn't like her Razen vote. Doesn't like her vig claim. Quotes my earlier post saying "Thane and Hallia next?" and says not Thane but likely Hallia.

 

#1441 -- Zander starts asking for info on Kaylee, #1444 asks her for thoughts on Hallia. She says: "I just did, but yes. I don't like how she was town reading Razen, then when he was picking up heat she changed to sheeping AJ (Liking all he had to say)...then voted him. Thane made a good point about how she thought she was hammer then sounded disappointed when she realized she wasn't. I don't believe her claim. It seems convenient and the timing seems off...gut feeling. There's just something that seems off to me about her." She has Hallia as her top lynch option for the next day.

 

By the time AJ shows up to the game, Hallia's already a lost cause. She's top wtl for me, Sooh, and Kaylee. Sili is sussing her. Zander isn't saying wtl explicitely but he's keeping her in the conversation. AJ says "Was thinking about rereading but I think I'll just stick to the plan of Pral.2/Hallia and hope for the best."

 

When day starts Hallia gets strung up so fast there's not much to say.

 

#1520 -- "Well I guess that isn't game over if we have a Night DL" ~~I like that AJ bothered looking.

[Shad_]

Don't expect me to actually read the above post.

[Shad_]

(Oh fine I will.)

[Shad_]

But not until later! My "I did this over a long period of time and didn't actually connect my own thoughts yet" first impression says AJ would be my gut lynch, Zander would be my head lynch, Kaylee's probably just guilty of long spurts of inactivity.  I generally side with my head.  Would be nice to have Sooh back and I'd never have lynched her if I hadn't gotten the kill mechanics all mixed up and not noticed until it was too late to direct traffic.  :\

[Zander?]

jesus christ shad....wth is dice?  are you talking to him about this???

[Shad_]

Uh, I can't tell you where he's at.  That was a rather frantic post you just made.  Is all well?

[Zander?]

Uh, I can't tell you where he's at.  That was a rather frantic post you just made.  Is all well?

 

Yeah man im honsetly sorry,  im wont answer the is all well part because im not a fan of AtE type crap.  Im honestly frustrated cause ive felt ive been playing a real towny game and the better we've been doing the more invested i get.  I know everyone has played pretty towny game but I just dont know what else I can do so we dont lose the damn game. I know I was like tunneling on SIli but he seemed scummy to me so i went at him man. Ive been on every lynch I wasnt the first on everyone but i was pretty early con calling some out. and as far as bussing in Belicheat man me and Talya agreed to that early theres no way i bus my whole team im just not like that.

 

Again im sorry.

,