Ashaman Ajah's

[Stormofheaven]

_{Hello all,}

 

_{Couple interesting topics came to mind while reading some of the books.}

 

_{1) What Ajah's do you think the Ashaman will have for the future? Just copy the Aes Sedai's Colour codes?}

 

_{2) What new purpose do you think the Red Ajah will do? I personally believe that they will be a kind of Aes Sedai Police force for capturing rogue channelers for both Male and Female. I can see a type of Warder bonding for Male Ashaman "red" Ajah and Red Aes Sedai. A sort of tag team to capture Rogue Channelers.}

 

_{Agree to Disagree? Any thoughts?}

[Maleshub]

After the Last Battle, the White Tower might have to rethink its current Ajah structure. Two areas that will require immediate attention are:

- Recruitment of female and male channelers on a systematic basis in all of Randland.

- Items of Power: search for items and research of new ones

 

Other areas that might require attention are education, health, construction, and traveling issues for the general population. And all need considerable number of Aes Sedai stationed in major cities or kingdoms to provide those services.

[Arath Faringal]

If they were smart, then they wouldn't copy the Aes Sedai ajahs. If they had ajah at all, the best way to do it would be treat them more like clubs. Membership in one doesn't prevent you from joining another.

[SparrowHawk]

I think it would be cool (and somewhat necessary after TG) to have Asha'man units to rebuild and bring aid to the populace. Greens should be protectors, and I think it would be cool to have a policing unit of Asha'man, as is there a use for scholar(brown) Asha'man, etc.

 

But I think it would also be interesting to have more task based units, similar to an "Army Corps of Engineers" of Asha'man, considering man's strength with earth. It would be cool to see them work alongside ogier to rebuild destroyed cities, even Malkier. maybe the brown Asha'man could work with people like Aludra and the Murandian who outfitted Mat with Crossbow cranks, to create either power wrought weapons, or weapons that somehow used the power (I guess just ter'angreal?)

Just a thought :)

[Nightstrike]

I'm kind of fond of those Ajahs. But all things change as the Wheel turns, I guess. If Asha'man and Aes Sedai merge, then there's probably a chance that the men will adopt the concept. I wonder how much of their future we will see written? Maybe we won't know for sure how that goes?

[Agitel]

Assuming the Towers persist, I think Jordan intentionally avoided having ajah structures in the Black Tower. Jordan felt that a male political system would naturally tend to focus on a more direct hierarchy while the women would develop a consensus building, multi-party structure. At best we'll (continue to) see a "two-party" political structure in the Black Tower.

[baalsmistress]

At the very least, the Ashamen will not have a fraction of their number devoted to the ttracking down and severing of any man that can channel.

[Knivy]

Assuming the Towers persist, I think Jordan intentionally avoided having ajah structures in the Black Tower. Jordan felt that a male political system would naturally tend to focus on a more direct hierarchy while the women would develop a consensus building, multi-party structure. At best we'll (continue to) see a "two-party" political structure in the Black Tower.

I agree with this completly. There is constant contrast between male and female motivations in every word in the book. Men tend to be up front and open in their arguments (the wisdom can come to the village council's meetings) but women's business is off limits (men messing with womens circle is a big no-no)

[Mr Ares]

The WT's Ajah system is deeply flawed, so copying it wouldn't really be a good idea. The system also has its roots in the formation of the WT - given the differences in the formation of the BT, starting such a system makes no sense at all.

[TristanWebb]

The Ajah system never really made sense to me: Let's divide our unified tower into 7 divisions and then have a perminant choice about which one our recruits join at a point where they have been treated as children for the past 20 years. Oh and we will pretend our leader isn't part of any of them even though she totally was.

[Mr Ares]

The Ajah system never really made sense to me: Let's divide our unified tower into 7 divisions and then have a perminant choice about which one our recruits join at a point where they have been treated as children for the past 20 years. Oh and we will pretend our leader isn't part of any of them even though she totally was.

As I said, it's rooted in the formation of the WT. The WT was formed by several different AS groups coming together - the Ajahs were, at least initially, vestiges of that. (Which is why it makes no sense for the BT. It doesn't have those same roots.) The idea of the Amyrlin being of all Ajahs and none is something seen in our world - some modern Presidents are non-partisan (or are supposed to be, at least).

[EmperorMayhem]

i've always kinda been annoyed in the back of my mind, about how some of the AS with Rand's group bonded Asha'man and they basically became glorified warders. And then there's Logain bonding some AS against their will and making them do stuff...

 

I want to see an AS and an Asha'man bond of an equal decision and be equal partners, not one commanding the other one to protect them, or one being in service to the other.

[Barid Bel Medar]

i've always kinda been annoyed in the back of my mind, about how some of the AS with Rand's group bonded Asha'man and they basically became glorified warders. And then there's Logain bonding some AS against their will and making them do stuff...

 

I want to see an AS and an Asha'man bond of an equal decision and be equal partners, not one commanding the other one to protect them, or one being in service to the other.

 

Indeed! This is my thought. Logain's situation is a bit different, I agreed with the initial decision, since they were sent to effectively kill everyone, but still, not a great thing to do and keep them for that long.

 

I hope this is what happens with Androl and Pevera, I think they will be the first of the new order. Perhaps a dual bond, each bond the other.

 

ON the subject of Ajah's, it is no longer an effective system, the White Tower split between Ajah's proved its weaknesses, and although it was perhaps a necessary part of the formation of the White Tower, times have changed, I don't think even the White Tower should keep the Ajah system. They should be reduced to something akin to University electives. You have to learn to be an "overall" Aes Sedai, but can choose a few things that appeal to you personally.

[GB]

i've always kinda been annoyed in the back of my mind, about how some of the AS with Rand's group bonded Asha'man and they basically became glorified warders. And then there's Logain bonding some AS against their will and making them do stuff...

 

I want to see an AS and an Asha'man bond of an equal decision and be equal partners, not one commanding the other one to protect them, or one being in service to the other.

 

how about daigan and eben hopwil? these 2 genuinely seem to be fond of each other other than just being aes sedai and warder

[MasterAblar]

i've always kinda been annoyed in the back of my mind, about how some of the AS with Rand's group bonded Asha'man and they basically became glorified warders. And then there's Logain bonding some AS against their will and making them do stuff...

 

I want to see an AS and an Asha'man bond of an equal decision and be equal partners, not one commanding the other one to protect them, or one being in service to the other.

 

The situation of the bonded Ashaman is definitely one of the things that annoys me the most, especially the one between Narishma and Merise. Merise treated more like a servant than a warder at times, making him wear a blue coat and sending him to the corner. And why did she feel it was necessary to take away his dragon pin? It's Ashaman buisness, what is she butting into it for? A warder can only accept what comes from an Aes Sedai? What is he her slave? Seriously, I wanted to strangle her at times. And it doesn't help my opinion of Cadsuane that she apparently fully approved! I wanted to cheer when Narishma refused to shut up and told the Aes Sedai about what happened to Eben Hopwil. At least the situation between the other two Ashaman and their Aes Sedai improved.

 

Personally, I think the priority for both Towers after the Last Battle is to recruit, and massively. Send a bung of people to the major cities, and make an announcement that you're testing for anyone with ability. Lack of numbers is one of the main reasons why the Aes Sedai were unable ti fulfill their duty as well as they should have.

[EmperorMayhem]

their relationship was closer to a normal one, yes. however it was still AS and warder. one bonding the other, not AS and Asha'man. i imagine them coming up with a way to do equal bonding- both bonding the other at the same time? (in regards to the more "normal" pairs of bonded AS/Asha'man

[baalsmistress]

I wouldn't see there being any need to form a bond in the situation you describe. Simply linking in a circle while working would be enough. The bonding is in effect a kind of pledge of alliegence and service.

 

Even if you look in the modern world, and equate bonding to marriage (I know, I know, terrible analogy), it's rare to find marriages where the 2 partners are genuinely equal. It is far far more common to find a tendency in 1 partner to defer to the other. Where you get equally strong partners, there is a greater impetus towards conflict in the case of disagreements, that is a negative indicator to the relationships longevity.

[Stormofheaven]

At the very least, the Ashamen will not have a fraction of their number devoted to the ttracking down and severing of any man that can channel.

 

I actually thought the "red Ajah" would be transformed into a police unit with "Red Ashaman" to track down rogue channelers. A police force for both. Basically people, using their powers for Nefarious means. Ie Swindle people, get rich, etc.

[SQuigleyRN]

I doubt Logain, who would probably be the leader, would be happy copying the White Tower's Ajah system

[SQuigleyRN]

I feel like the Red Ajah would be women who bonded Asha'man as warders, and worked with the combination of saidar and saidin to discover more about the One Power. I do feel, however, that Cadsuane will have to do some kind of reformation, perhaps the addition of an Orange and Purple Ajah...one to be bound BY Asha'man, either for the same basic purpose as stated above for the Red, or for studying & creating angreal, ter'angreal, & Sa'angreal, and to craft power-wrought weapons. The other Ajah would be sisters sent to apprentice with other organizations of women who could channel like the Sea Folk, the Aiel, the Kinswomen, the Sharans and the Seanchan. (Those latter two might not be possible for obvious reasons). Surely the White Tower would want to learn what knowledge they could from those groups. Recruitment and retention should be the goal of all Aes Sedai, regardless of Ajah

[Orderofolde]

_{Hello all,}

 

_{Couple interesting topics came to mind while reading some of the books.}

 

_{1) What Ajah's do you think the Ashaman will have for the future? Just copy the Aes Sedai's Colour codes?}

 

_{2) What new purpose do you think the Red Ajah will do? I personally believe that they will be a kind of Aes Sedai Police force for capturing rogue channelers for both Male and Female. I can see a type of Warder bonding for Male Ashaman "red" Ajah and Red Aes Sedai. A sort of tag team to capture Rogue Channelers.}

 

_{Agree to Disagree? Any thoughts?}

I wouldn't call them Ajahs, they are more like Factions.  We saw that with Taim and Logain's camps and even Androl has supporters.  Also the Two Rivers lads banded together.  We see that "Factions" are popular in one version of the world that Rand and the DO keep making and remaking where in the 4th Age Basel Gil betrays Rand for hi clothing.