17 minutes ago, Mirefox said:

Yeah, I get that that’s how they are in the books but they clearly aren’t that in the show.  I’m trying to figure out how her visions work since she kind of botched this one.

Whenever you notice something is wrong, just go to the shows default COVID mistake excuse.

15 minutes ago, Gary Again said:

I don't think the boat scene was impacted by Moiraine's oaths she didn't attack the Seanchan with the power she attacked the boats and then the seanchan either lived or died based on their own actions which is what she did with the ferry in season one and I think that was probably foreshadowing to this.

 

As to if she could do that I don't see a problem with it because when Bayle Domon is running from the Seanchan in the books they make it really clear that the Seanchan can easily sink his boat from distance and they showed that Moiraine focused on the damanae first, she should be able to clearly see them since they are channeling and then she just systematically attacked ships until they fled. If she just wiped out their entire fleet in one shot that would be overpowered but they showed her just strategically and systematically go from ship to ship so to me I can buy that.

 

Shielding at that distance is problematic but Ishy was there so who knows what he pulled, it could have been a circle with him leading it, could have been a gateway inverted and hidden or a scrying device so I'll give some leeway because Ishy knew he was trying to have them shield Rand so I'm sure Ishy can think of a clever way to do it where an untrained Rand wouldn't see it coming that is entirely believable to me.

You're still using a weave that might kill a lot of innocent slaves, etc.  I mean the chance any, but a few will be able to make it to shore safely is pretty slim.  It's clear the fire was meant as an attack, using the power, to kill these people.  By that logic an Aes Sedai could set a house on fire and be like I just set the house on fire, it's not my fault the people didn't get out in time.  Sinking the ferry wasn't the same thing, no one was at risk, she didn't kill anyone.  She saw the ferry as a way for the shadowspawn to cross so stopped the possibility.  She didn't sink the ferry with the people on it and say up to them to swim to safety.  

2 minutes ago, ilovezam said:

 

If that's the case, could she not just straight up channel against Renna or cave her head in with a baseball bat by disciplining her thoughts in a way such that these actions would not be rationalized as "causing harm"?

The Egwene/Renna bracelet vs bracelet scene just makes my head hurt thinking about.  I really have no idea what the show as thinking when they came up with that idea.  

To me a good example of the flaw with this series is how much time was spent on Nyn not being able to heal Elayne?  Yet Rands encounter with Turak lasted 5 seconds, his dialogue with Ishy was over quickly.  The Heroes of the Horn, gone in a flash.  It really seems like the important stuff gets just rushed past and useless stuff like poor Nyn who can suddenly heal an entire cave of people just sits in the street helpless.  They spent almost an entire episode in season 1 getting us to care about this warder, just at the end to be like ok he died.  To me is a huge waste of time that could have been spent building up your main characters.  Instead they waste it on a secondary person just to kill him.  It feels like they are clueless as to what makes certain things meaningful.  Ingtar coming out as a DF and sacrifing himself was a powerful thing, Siuan knowing she is allowing the Dragon to walk freely but understands he has to do certain things was important.  It lead to her downfall, now she is surprised Moiraine didn't get a male channeler ready for the Last Battle?  Siuan is just another he needs to be chained up until the final fight, totally ruining the big risk she was taking by knowingly letting him be free and leading to her downfall..

The episode just seems poorly thought out, with many holes and head scratching moments.  

The Ishy vs Rand fight had to be the worst, most anti-climatic fight ever.  I was like, that was it, Ishy just stands there as Rand just walks up and stabs him in the chest?  Maybe he was like ohh I can't beat this poorly trained girl, I deserve to die.

They are trying too hard to make everyone equally important.  It seems forced, like ohh what to do with Mat, ok make him a hero of the horn.  

Uno is a hero and Mat is a hero?  Seriously Uno?

I think it would have been better had they kept Ingtar arc, with him trying to get redemption.  I mean why even care about the character, he's now just some noble who sacrificed himself.  Who lasted like 5 seconds.

I didn't mind the Rand vs Turak fight, it was actually pretty funny, but the Ishy fighting and not able to get past some poorly trained novices was just dumb.  Not to mention Moiriane has the power to conjure a giant fire dragon?  Shouldn't the three oaths of stopped her from attacking the ships?  They weren't shadowspawn and Lan and her weren't in any danger.   Ishy couldn't think of any better weaves to use and some-one who has a few months of training can hold him off?

I loved the ending with Moghi putting Lanfear in her place.  

Shouldn't the Egwene vs her Suldam fight have been a standoff, with neither being able to hurt the other?  If you can't hurt your Suldam how can you choke her?  Egwene went from crippling pain if she tried to hurt a Suldam to, being choked isn't so bad.  

The dagger is now a lightsaber able to cut through anything.   Yet if cuts flesh it just kills instantly unless it stabs an important character, then it just leaves normal wounds.  Seems a bit odd.

I assume Ishy death is setting him up for Moridin.  Curious if they will use the same actor.

My only issue with Perrin really killing the dudes father, is it ruins any chance later of a truce between them since Perin can no longer claim he didn't do it.  Now we know that change is coming.  

16 hours ago, A Memory Of Why said:

 

Well obviously there was a legion of kids with incense burners? 

 

And.. there was fog shown in that first scene..

 

Honestly maybe it's just magic 🫠

 

Seriously, the whitecloak charge was cool. I thoroughly enjoyed it, it was kinda the coolest part for the best battle in cinema history - only slightly sarcastic here, I really did think it was cool 🫣

I think it was meant to be the dust from all the horses, but makes you wonder how they got so close to the city in the first place.  

IMO one of the weakest episodes of the season.  I don't mind some changes from the books, but this had way too many.  Honestly they should had kept Rand's meeting with the Amirlyn the same, it would have made more sense.  Instead of Siuan doing the exact opposite and wanting him caged and shielded.  

Did I miss something with Lanfears attack?  It was daylight when she was starting the fires yet it was night when the Aes Sedai were putting it out?  Did we miss a whole fight?  

Most the episode just seemed rushed and a mess.

For those wondering about Rand's training, in a past episode it was mentioned he was training with an old blademaster at the asylum place.  Rand or the guy mentioned Rand trying to sneak a sword in next visit.

I hate them having Rand have to go to Lanfear so many times asking for help.  Apparently Lanfear just sits about waiting for Rand to sleep?

I do like how Lanfear is clearly playing her own game, though since Moiraine has been shielded for so long I'm not sure why she hates Moiraine so much.

UGhhh not the best episode.  Rand to me just acts like an idiot with no real thought to what he does.  He's already making agreements with Lanfear?  Min having to make deals with the Forsaken?  I really hate what they've done with Min.  

They have ruined the whole world of dreams thing, I mean if Lanfear can just capture anyone as soon as they fall asleep.  Seems like lazy writing. 

At this point I'm not even sure why Lan is still in the show.  

All of the Ishy showing up as the burning eyed spooky person in season one seems rather pointless now that he appears as Ishy who openly admits who he is.  

Clearly the Forsaken aren't really feared as both Suroth and Liandrin had no issues talking back to them.  I like giving Liandrin some substance, and her quietly helping Nyn get free was a nice touch.  I think they're pushing too hard with her whole ohh she had a tough life backstory.  Since it really doesn't add a whole lot and with time so limited the scene with Lanfear and her just seems like wasted time.

Still amazes me the difference in quality of the CGI between LOTR and WOT.

I think they're doing a great job showing the breaking of people to make them Damane.

I like Season two better then season one, but IMO it still suffers from a lot of wasted time and some changes that really add nothing.

The Origins of the Wheel of Time explains the meaning and origins of Asha'man.

An oath rod can be used on everyone.  The companion says it can be used on those who can't channel.  It was originally used on violent people who were incorrigibly violent due to personality flaws or madness.  As a way to stop them from committing crimes.  The current Aes Sedai have no knowledge of its orginal purpose.  They would never consider using it on a male who could channel or an ordinary person.  

When they vanish they're reborn, so Brigette will be a few months older than Elayne's kids.  I think brigette did say something about "I am being reborn, now somewhere a woman is preparing to give birth.  It's happening"

I never thought it was a big reveal since there were hints throughout the series Starting in Book 2) that Verin could be BA.  She reminded me a lot of Lanfear in that you got the feeling throughout the series that Verin was playing her own game and she wasn't concerned if some folks died because of it.

1 hour ago, Scarloc99 said:

I mean I have pointed out in much the same way that RJ’s villains are generally far less fleshed out in the books than his hero’s. Liandrin is an example of this in the books she is evil because she does bad things and she does bad things because she is evil. We see very little motivation, especially with darkfriends. 

The series would of ran another three books had RJ tried to flesh out and give reasons/histories to most of the bad people.  The companion has histories/motives for many of the bad people, but you simply can't devote a lot of time in a series to why many of the bad people are doing things.  It also comes down to why spend a lot of time explaining why lesser characters are doing what they're doing?

I like Nyn's test, it really showed the sacrifices Aes Sedai make. My issue is in a series so short of time, so much of the episode focused on her test seemed liked a lot.   The series so far does seem very Nyn centric.

I always put things into two area, changes needed to speed up the pace/needed changes or changes tossed in for what seems like just to change something.  Like in season 1, for such a limited amount of episodes, there was no reason to have them journey to White bridge and all those other places.  So easier to condense it all into meeting in Tar Valon.  That's cool, you can understand that.  Junk changes are like spending all that time in season 1 to show the warder bond and it's effects and just kill him at the end.  After focusing so much on him.  Seems like a lot of wasted time that could have been done in a simpler manner.  Like having him go berserk and crazy, but they wasted their limited time to drag it out.

Because not everyone would see him as the DR and they were putting the world at risk by knowingly allowing a man who could channel run about free.   That alone would make the Reds rather angry.  Even many who would see him as the DR would be upset she had him in her grasp/talked to him and didn't capture him so the Aes Sedai could control him.  Knowingly letting a man run free who could channel is reason enough for many in the WT to see her punished.

The Aes Sedai (even non BA) in the past had murdered an Amyrlin, killed numerous innocent men etc.  So roughing up Siuan really isn't a big deal.  Then figure in the BA were involved in pulling Siaun down, Siuan knows a lot so they especially would be eager to see her tortured for info and then killed.

They could still be used for finding ore, building stuff, making gateways now, manipulating weather/wind and such,

That's a good question.  I know the big difference between a normal circle and what the Seanchen do is the collar forces the channeler into a link but the Suldam contributes nothing and is just controlling the flows.  They are forcing the person to channel, so if it goes against the oaths that person simply can't do it.  Where a circle everyone is contributing, even the person directing it.  Seems like it's then up to the person leading the circle.  Once you're in a circle I don't think there is anyway to get out of it or block your power.  

An Aes Sedai is still bound by the three oaths.  It would still come down to what the Aes Sedai believes.  Having the ground erupt under someone is clearly a weapon used to harm, but as we saw in other books once the Aes Sedai felt threatened that could use the power.  If the Seanchean are smart enough to look for loopholes is another thing.   I think the necklace prevents linking into  circle, at least from what I remember RJ saying.  Th

SInce season 2 is said to combine book two and at least some of three.  They might combine Rands fights with Ishy.  Rand proclaiming himself the Dragon Reborn would be a great way to end the season.  8 episodes is just not enough.

The Whitecloaks were more than that.  RJ said the Whitecloaks were like Nazi's, Teutonic Knights, etc.  People who claimed to know the truth and anyone who didn't blindly agree with them were wrong.  Their way is the only way.

Verin said she doubted the BA thought is as a loophole since few BA would be willing to sacrifice themselves just to betray the BA.  Even if a BA was about to be executed it's unlikely, they would betray the BA because it would still mean they would be executed.

Season 2 is probably safe, with a rumored Summer or Fall release it's likely Season 2 will go on.  I was reading that Rings of Power Season 2 won't be affected since they had planned for this in advance.  Any writer/producer can't help, but any producer not credited as a writer can still oversee production.  WOT probably had taken a possible strike into account. 

I did find this:

"Amazon, HBO, Warner Bros. TV, NBCUniversal, Disney, CBS Studios and other major struck studios will be suspending some first-look and overall deals amid the ongoing writers strike.

Sources close to the situation tell Variety that Amazon will be sending letters out Monday notifying those affected. The studio does have some carveouts for creatives who are rendering producing services but non-writing."

Doesn't look good for season 3 unless they had most of the writing already finished.

On 5/9/2023 at 6:05 PM, Bryen said:

3 random questions:

 

Why doesn’t Rand realize Rahvin is in Andor before Lanfear tells him?  Asmodean tells Rand that something along the lines of ‘He running a kingdom with a Queen as a plaything’.   How many kingdom's are ran by Queens??

Did Mat/Elayne/Thom never mention that Morgase has a random new lover?

 

Why does Moraine think the plan with Siuan about Rand will work?  Plan I’m talking about is that Siuan is supposed to be approaching all the rulers announcing Rand is the Dragon.  Like the Forsaken are running most of the kingdoms and she knows about at least Illian. Shouldn’t Moraine be smart enough to know that many of the other kingdoms are probably in the same boat? So the announcement isn’t likely to do what she thinks it will.

 

Why do Mat and Perrin not tell Rand about there ‘powers’?  

Some nations in the Borderlands have a queen, a few of the southern nations have queens.  Rand also isn't getting up to the moment intel from all the nations.  Rand at this point is still pretty ignorant on the happenings of other nations.  

  I'm not sure Mat knew Gabriel was a forsaken until Rand broke then news to him.  Mat only knew Morgase's lover wanted Elayne dead.  

Not to derail the topic but even Verin says it would take something special to redeem her.  It would be nice if we had more info on things Verin or Ingtar had done to earn Black Ajah/DF status.  Verin most likely has a few murders on her hands and she did join the BA to save her own skin.

Well authors do lie, RJ said Taimadred was never a thing, and we now know at one time RJ not only had Taimadred being real but Dem killing Asmo.  No one knows why he changed his mind, but we know when RJ was saying Taimadred wasn't a thing that he lied.  Just because BS or RJ said they intended this or that doesn't mean it was always that way.

Verin wasn't a surprise because she lied in Book 2 and was about to murder Casudane.  It would have been more of a surprise had Taim not turned out to be a DF.

The big question for me was if that one general Weirmon?? Was a DF or just really dumb and incompetent.