RJ has said it's very rare for souls to always be playing major roles, most the major players will be different souls next time.  You look at the heroes tied to the horn and see most of the souls tied to the horn were missing the Last Battle.  The Forsaken will be different etc.  Since it would kill the free will if the forsaken were the same every time, it would also mean souls could be perm evil.  So most of the major players this time are just people who got lucky this time, but next turning they could just be ordinary people during the Last Battle.

Being Ta'veren he didn't have a lot of freedom since the pattern was going to push him along regardless.  He could have said I'm not going to Tear but there was always the chance the pattern would have forced him to go there regardless.  

I don't think everything needs a lot of foreshadowing, to me this falls in with who killed Asmo.  It was too vague if BS was expecting more people to guess it since how it ended seemed pretty final with Lanfear dead.  Maybe having something like the body vanishes or something to make people say she's dead but why would the body vanish?  Lanfear interactions with Perrin was odd and made me wonder, but never would I have guessed she was alive.  But it depends on if he wanted people to guess it or wanted people to simply talk about why is Lanfear doing this.  Or if this was just a way for BS to one have a big shocking thing to reveal.  

Isn't Avi's vision also because the Aiel were going to be left out of the Dragon's Peace?  The Aiel admitted they were going to go to war with the Seachean pretty much as soon as the Last Battle was over to free the Wise Ones.

On 1/24/2023 at 4:48 AM, Stedding Tofu said:

 

This is a very good point.  We can suppose the Aiel tradition is at least several thousand years old so either The Dark One / Ishamael only hit on this idea recently or generations of male channelers have been cooling their heals in The Blight.  The Trolloc Wars would have been the perfect time to unleash an army of red veils.  We're told very early in the series that Aiel men who can channel head to The Blight to try and kill The Dark One so it seems more likely that RJ had the surprise up his sleeve all along than hitting on the idea much later.  The best explanation is that it's a one-time reveal: once the Aiel realise what happens they will no longer send their men so the red veils have to be reserved for Tarmon Gai'don.

 

I honestly feel the same about Shara.  It is deliberately kept very vague with only mysterious hints so that as we get to see the distant and unfamiliar peoples offpage of Randland - the Aiel, Seafolk and Seanchan - we view the Sharans as pure worldbuilding rather than the next people to erupt into the story - until of course they do...

That's how I look at it. Once the red viels are known then the Aiel would stop going to the blight. In the Origins book RJ had planned for there to be seven Eyes of the World, each holding a seal.  The red viels (sight blinders) original job was to find each Eye and destroy the seals.  RJ changed it to one Eye and the red viels did try in vain to find and "blind" the one Eye of the World.  But in his notes RJ did write they are being held back as a surprise for the Last Battle.

It was Rand's connection to Moridin that allowed him to use the True Power. 

All I could really find about Callandor is after hearing of the fortellings of the Prophecy of the Dragon, the Aes Sedai of the time built the Stone of Tear to safeguard callandor. They used the One power to make powerful wards to prevent anyone but the true Dragon Reborn from touching it.  The wards were so effective that not even the Forsaken could circumvent them. Which does raise more questions on how these wards would allow Rand to get the sword and no one else.

I never understood Callandor either.  Since only the DO can grant someone access to use it and it wasn't something the DO just allowed any person to use.  All the companion says is created during the War of Power , toward the end of the technological age.  A manufacturing flaw was discovered when it was used during the War of Power, it lacked a buffer, which made it possible to draw too much of the One Power while using the item.  

One thing I noticed the Companion left out is the part about the possibility a man (if not in a circle) could be forced into a link by women. It could simply be that when it was made it allowed all channeling so the One Power could be used and the people who made it never knew.  It certainly took Ishy by surprise.  My guesses are that like the Choden Kal, the forces of light had no access to Callandor anymore.  it could have been deemed too dangerous to use there.  Since there were no females present, whoever used it would be vulnerable to being controlled.  Or the female Aes Sedai hid it from LTT so he couldn't use it.

19 hours ago, Elendir said:

I see breaking of world as fault of poor communication. Both male and female sedai had their insane plane and couldn't agree which of them carry out.

 

We have no reliable information about any what if.

What if female sedai went with Dragon. Would be DO unable to retaliate or both half of one power would end corrupted?

If Choedan Kal (female plane) was used, would they defeat DO without risk of counterattack or would they tear apart the fabric of reality as LTT feared?

I believe RJ did say both male and female halves would have been corrupted had they both tried.  Which pretty much would have doomed the world.  

It is the men's fault, but the pattern pretty much set them up for failure.  They had no chance, it was part of LTT's memories that gave Rand the knowledge and ideas how to do it successfully.  LTT and the companions really had no idea what they were doing, they had to fail so the Dragon could be reborn etc.  The pattern made sure the plan would be enacted but that it would also fail.  LTT pretty much got screwed over.

Moridin killed Lanfear to rescue her, she was stuffed in a new body.  She simply chooses to use her old form in the dream world.  Like Grendal, Aginor etc her soul just was placed in a new body.

You have to remember a lot of the story has been lost over time.  The Aes Sedai might have knowledge in the WT library but they aren't going to share it.  Few if any of the age even have any clue what the Choedan Kal are.  What most people know is LTT and the men went ahead with the plan to seal the DO's prison over the objections of the others.  

She probably thought if she aids Perrn with Slayer then she risks making another enemy.  Just like she wouldn't openly aid Rand.  Perrin might become too suspicious if she starts saving his life.  I just assume if Perrin dies, she will have to go with plan B and do what she can so see team good wins and then vanish as best as she can.  If Perrin is dead and if she thinks Rand is dead, those are some of the few that know about her.  Seanchan would be perfect for her, a land in chaos, a disguise, some compulsion and she could start new over there. It would be less likely anyone would be looking for her in Seanchan.  She is past the age of testing so no one is going to just slap a collar on her unless she does something dumb.  Perrin alive and saying he killed her would be the best, but I would guess if he died her next plan is see the DO loses and vanish.

We do know from the companion that the Tinker Song doesn't exist.  

I think another issue with this is that in the Companion it clearly states Cyndane was killed by Perrin.  You would think it would put a little doubt about it.  I do think her living explains why she suddenly decided to help Perrin and do things like remove the dreamspike,  Why help him free the Asha'man then act like she wants to save the DO?  But when the Companion says, "Perrin was able to resist and instead killed Cyndane".

A writer thinking they have made things too obvious when in reality they didn't is common.  RJ always said who killed Asmo should be obvious to anyone who read the first 5 books.  But clearly it wasn't.  I'm not going to say BS went about this in the best way, but it makes sense to me.  Put yourself in Lanfear's place and how far you've fallen, Mogi and Lanfear at the time were the two lowest.  Lanfear is smart, even if she saves the DO is she going to trust the DO for mercy and forgiveness?  She was still helping his enemies at the end, giving Perrin some secrets, not stopping him from removing the dreamspike etc..  If Dem won the army fight, would she be placed above him?  Would someone simply smash her mind shard and be done with her?  Can she guarantee no other Forsaken would survive? 

As readers I think we don't question enough or we question the wrong things.  RJ said he wasn't a fan of tying up every loose end or explaining every detail such as who sent the trollocs to attack the manor.  This is probably what Brandon tried, he thought he left enough clues but really left enough things for us to say this is a bit odd, but IMO it still would have been a big leap for most to say ohh Lanfear is alive.  But it also would have ruined alot had BS been really obvious about it.  He was hoping for people to be suspicious and maybe question some stuff but to be too open about it would have made it sort of blahh instead of ohhh could it be she lives?

I always look at it as when in doubt just assume the one power was used or maybe it came from somewhere else. The tower of Ghenjei is a good example.

Getting a producer credit is also where the money is.

Her setting it all up would explain why she used such a small amount of compulsion on Perrin instead of just going full out Grendal pet on him.  If all you need him for is to help you kill someone, then why just use a small amount?  Just make him a blathering idiot to do the job, a job which she really didn't need any help with anyway.  

See I never got the vibe she really wanted to rule through Perrin.  She had eyes for only LTT, and wasn't the sharing with anyone else type.  Even with Rand she wants to be the power in the relationship this time.  The key point she has to face is even if she helped team good win, she is still a forsaken and responsible for tens of thousands of deaths, and many other bad deeds.  She would still face punishment for her past actions.  So BS is right even if team good wins she will still be hunted down.  His reasoning makes sense.  I guess since we know at the end Perrin did have compulsion on him that we should have been wondering when she actually did it, so how long has he been under compulsion and not known of it.

ROP was better IMO but it had two big advantages.  It had a much larger budget and since ROP was forbidden from using a lot of the lore, they had to make most of it up.  Which prevents the issue the Movies had with it strayed too far from the books etc issues.  WOT will always be compared to the books, and IMO  there is too much in the books for an 8 episode season not to feel rushed and seem like they cut alot.

On 12/29/2022 at 2:43 PM, tsunamic84 said:

That's how I felt. How many times is he gonna use the Ways? Not this time!

Imagine trying to use the ways and bring all the Aiel with him?

Portal stones were around long before the Ways.  The Ways were for Stedding to Stedding, the portal stones were for other worlds. fast traveling to other areas.  The Dream World not everyone could enter and it was frowned upon to enter physically.   

Why did Fain go there and demand Rand follow?  It seems he had orders to take the Horn to the Blight.  I assume she knew Rand was the True Dragon and the False Dragons were no big concern.  Fain taking the Horn there, the prophecy, and such I assume probably led her to believe Rand had to go there and since Rand had already used a portal stone he probably could do it again.

I always thought it was werid Lanfear was spending so much time helping Perin, and the count to three thing seemed out of place.  I never understood what she was hoping to gain with aiding Perin like that.  But I never figured she was alive since there was really no indication she had compulsion on him until the ok count to three and attack thing.  Matt is right, Perin served no purpose in the plan since she easily could have killed both Nyn and Moiraine by herself.  Rand and Moiridn would have been helpless to do anything.  So it was a job she didn't need any help.  I think this falls under that to the writer it seems obvious but to the reader it isn't.  Like Jordan saying it should be obvious who killed Asmo but it really wasn't.  Jordan thought we should pick it up easily when in reality it wasn't that obvious.  My hat off to Matt for catching it and thinking there was more to it.  

Somewhere out there someone has her mindshard.

My thing is what does this mean for her soul shard thing?  The thing that if it gets broken she dies.

I think to reach Forsaken level, you've gone past a few bad life choices and into the a lot of folks have died because of you.  

RJ would never want the Forsaken to be portrayed as Sympathetic.  He made them evil, all of them have done horrendous things and are responsible for tens of thousands of deaths.  They kill anyone without hesitation or remorse.  They're suppose to be the evil beings that give people nightmares and whose names make people tremble in fear.  They all went over to the shadow for selfish reasons.  He even said Samm was a vile being not worthy of a better death scene.   

There are a few DFs that you can feel sorry for Verin and Ingtar are a couple.  DF's aren't just bad people, they are the worst who have pledged their soul to the DO.  There are plenty of people in Randland doing bad things that would be horrified at the thought of being a DF.  DF's have the same motivations as the Forsaken the desire for power, wanting revenge, etc...  

RJ said channeling is tied to the soul so one either has the potential to channel or they don't.  So she couldn't take someone like Min and make her able to channel.  The hole is something caused by being stilled/gentled.  If you had never been stilled/gentled there would be no hole there.