[Advanced] Mass Effect II mafia

[Guest]

I agree with Maws assessment from whT I've read it seems pretty accurate. I still feel like I'm stumbling around in the dark but I imagine it will get better as the game progresses. I agree with the general consensus that Leyrann is being a bit aggressive. Based on what I've read and seen so far is a characteristic of wolf.

 

Vote: Leyrann

as a favor to Cor who can't vote right BUT who has sent me a box of chocolate with this little message : please help me, mighty and awesome Chae, you are the best and most evil person in this world

 

i will vote for him with the right format Vote : Ley

 

Remember all : i really accept bribes ... lol

 

*tries to keep RTE civil*

is that even possible ?

 

*pokes RTE in the ear with her little finger*

[Netbattler11]

All right, good morning all. I see there have been some heated reactions to my list.

 

We will go random before we lynch Ley today, just so everyone is clear on that.

Maw would be a good lynch btw

I contest both these statements.

 

Maw because he is trying to sell everything he says and because he split the whole thread into can/can't lynch and only left two choices.

That's the same sort of rhetoric that people use to get others to argue two party systems.

[v] maw [/v]

I'm not sure what you mean here about trying to sell everything I say. That is the basis of playing Mafia, is it not? To present a course of action and support it with solid reasoning? I'll get to the two choice thing in a minute.

 

I find it odd how people jumped on ley when I prodded him. I think he answered my concerns fine, he seemed sincerely upset when I voted him for a misinterpretation of his post.
I agree with darthe on maw, I didn't like how he answered a post directed towards another person, or his post when alanna called him out on defending her.
[v]MAW [/v]

Specify which post you mean? I think you're probably talking about when I had a problem with Darthe's posts, and I don't see a reason to shift on that. I don't think Darthe's playstyle has been contributing to the village. And I'll reiterate what I said earlier: I was making a point of opposing Darthe rather than making a point of defending Alanna. I like her thoughts and think she's probably town and therefore don't have a problem with coming down on her side, but she was not the focus of that conversation.

 

I read Maw's post as saying he wasn't willing to lynch anyone else as per now.

That is my fault, and I apologize. I should have been more clear. Ley and Talya are the two people I feel would be most beneficial as Day One lynches. I could be convinced to vote a couple other people, but those two I have the strongest feelings about. In addition, this is NOT a comprehensive list of who I think are mafioso, and I don't see why people took it as such. It's not a list of who I think should never be lynched ever in the entire game, merely people who I think should survive day one. It will be updated as time goes on and more information is gathered. Finally, no, I do not want to vote myself. I feel that should be obvious, but I included my name on my list so the entire roster would be represented. I'm fairly sure no one wants to vote themselves (save a jester or something else weird), and am rather confused that that is even a point worth arguing over.

 

I'm happy with my vote where it is for the moment.

[Leyrann]

Maw, can you please respond to my defense, that your whole "case" on me is build on "he came off annoyed", which, as I guess you very well know, has nothing to do with whatever alignment I may be in mafia and much more with who I am.

[Leyrann]

I don't see how that's worthy of a lynch, even day 1.

[Leyrann]

I do like that you're attempting to take an active role though.

[Netbattler11]

You may have a point. I shall peruse your posts more perceptively.

[Netbattler11]

 

Ley apparently I am not the only one who read it like that, but that is how I took it, and I found it frustrating. 

[unvote] 

 

what is your opinion on others?

 

I don't really have anything clear on others, it generally takes me a bit longer to form an opinion on people. Basically, everyone starts out in null and drifts to one side or another depending on what they do, and this game hasn't been that active, so there hasn't been that many drifting.

 

 

Ley is snarky the same way Darthe is Darthe-y. I don't think too much of it myself. When Ley went full derp all game long last game I just ignored it. So far he's been more clear- (and less dense) headed. 

 

I don't want to play with snarky, I play to enjoy it, and won't put up with snark, I've had it a few times this game already. Why can't people play nicely. We are here to enjy tthis, not tto geet one over, or say people shouldn't play.

 

 

I'm sorry Talya. Should have worded things differently.

 

Ley the way you wrote that could be taken both ways. I also thought your "explanation" was a bit condescending and if aimed at me I would have taken it as rude and gone you for it.

 

Actually, no, it couldn't be taken both ways. I had a special post explaining why it was not ambigious, and where I should have placed it if it should be taken the other way, and where it would be ambigious.

 

 

Welcome to today's episode of To Lynch Or Not To Lynch. I'm your host, Mawthtex. Let's run through our contestants:

 

Sooh: Not. She's been fairly quiet, but when she contributes her posts seem pretty sound. Not entirely sure about her though.

Darthe: Not. I dislike his playstyle but apparently it's normal and no one else seems to be concerned about it, so we can deal with it in the future.

Thane: Not. I like his impressions of the game and his play so far.

Zander: Not. He was kind silent for a while, but he's been chiming in more lately. I think he bears watching, but I don't think he's today's lynch.

Talya: Lynch. She seems to be vibrating between being quite intelligent and misreading key parts of posts. I would be willing to vote for her.

Corvhin: Not. His inexperience is showing, but he's putting forth a good effort.

Release The Evil: Not. I get the impression he's town, although not a strong one.

Mawthtex: Not. I like myself too much to lynch me.

AlannaLynn Not. We seem to think along the same lines, which suggests to me we are both looking out for the town's best interests.

Seph: Not. He seems to have a pretty good head on his shoulders most of the time, although he bears watching.

Verbal: Not. He seems to be playing a pretty strong town game so far.

Leyrann: Lynch. He's been playing more aggressively than helpfully. Not sure I quite understand where he's coming from, and I'd be willing to put a vote on him.

Dice: Not. I don't have a strong read on him but neither do I have suspicions.

 

So, to summarize, I think Leyrann or Talya should be the lynch today. They've played the spottiest of everyone here.

 

[v]Leyrann[/v]

 

Tell me why you shouldn't go down today.

 

 

Well, first of all, because I'm town. Second, because your whole "case" on me is based on me being annoyed that someone read my posts wrong. That's the weakest reason ever to lynch someone, and you're even getting people on the train somehow. Meanwhile your list is basically such, that there are not enough reads that are NOT town to form a mafia team, so you should probably examine again and look for more mistakes. We can't have 11 (or something) town in a 13 player game. It'll be 3 or (most likely, imo) 4 mafia, and you're barely even at that many "unsure" reads.

 

I agree with Maws assessment from whT I've read it seems pretty accurate. I still feel like I'm stumbling around in the dark but I imagine it will get better as the game progresses. I agree with the general consensus that Leyrann is being a bit aggressive. Based on what I've read and seen so far is a characteristic of wolf.

 

Vote: Leyrann

 

Characteristic of a bad wolf only. If you're mafia, you want to stay under the radar and survive without taking notice. Letting emotions get the better of you (like happened to me) is just a dumb thing for mafia. What you want to do is stay in the background and nudge lynches on bad-looking townies while shooting the good-looking ones at night.

 

We will go random before we lynch Ley today, just so everyone is clear on that.

 

Maw would be a good lynch btw

 

I would just like to point out that it's a hybrid hammer, so no majority is needed.

 

That said, I do agree with your opinion on Maw. He's risen up my list quite a bit with that not-willing-to-lynch nearly everyone. Far too closed down.

 

 

All right, first off: You're right. It wasn't that strong of a case. There hasn't been anything in this game that was particularly noteworthy, and so none of the cases are going to be particularly strong. 

 

Second (see the bold), it's an unreasonable expectation to have the entire mafia team pegged on the first day with barely 20 pages (15 of actual gameplay) existing. You blew that entirely out of proportion. There is no way to uncover the entire team day one, and furthermore there is no need to do so: you can only lynch one, so reaching and making cases on people who won't be relevant until day two is entirely unnecessary. It's better to focus on the strongest cases instead of overreaching and muddying the waters.

 

Third, and this is for both you and darthe: Why is it bad to be 'closed down', as you say? Why is it a bad thing to eliminate unlikely outcomes and limit your focus to actually accomplishing something, especially on day one where information is so limited?

 

 

 

i don't think nor feel that there's anything off about his posts. I haven't played with him before, so i don't know his usual playstyle. That, for me, is something i prefer. I get a neatral look on him, unbiased. 

 

He looks fine to me, general gameplay is well within what i would like to see from town.

 

Well, what about him apparently thinking that ELEVEN people (10 if not counting himself) should NOT be lynched? He's basically veto'ing 80% of the game from his vote.

 

Ley people dont read in perfect grammar. Change where you take the breath on that sentence and the meaning changes. 

 

As for Maws list. Its D1. having two people he is willing to lynch seems reasonable to me. Do you expect him to have 4 picked out? Cause right now the only way someone could have 4 picked out is if they are mafia. Not enuff has happened for 4 people to have really stood out in a bad way.

 

The whole reason for commas is to show readers where to take a breath though. Because the sentence that brought all the fuzz was immediately behind the "who", it belongs to the "who" and not the "you". That's just how it is, I'm sorry.

 

Bolded again: The fact that I included myself in the 'do not lynch' catagory has absolutely no bearing on anything. You have no reason to bring attention to it except to try and discredit me. I don't think we should lynch me. You don't think you should lynch you. Seph doesn't think we should lynch him, and so on. 

 

Perhaps I should have been a little more clear on my intentions for that list,but as I said I am not trying to exclude any other candidates from being lynched, simply highlighting the people who I think would be the best lynches.

 

 

i also wouldn't like to lynch about 90% of the game right now. Does that make me a horrible player too? It's D1, and every townie with some good senses would try to avoid lynching another townplayer D1. 

 

The problem is that one can only tie knots together with the first flips. Statistically, a townie will probably be lynched, but it would be a very nice thing to avoid if possible. 

 

Well, I'm willing to lynch most people. That means, I'm not saying "not willing to lynch" on anyone, because there's no one of who I am sure is town. Maw RULED OUT the possibility for him to vote 80% of the game. Of course, I'm going for specific targets, but even if a lynch happens that I disagree with, it gives information. Information can be used to see who is suspicious. And we can get further in the game. If everyone would give a list like Maw did, we wouldn't get a majority.

 

--snip--

 

Even if I were in fact as regimented as you claim, we don't need a majority today.

 

 

 

 

 

i don't think nor feel that there's anything off about his posts. I haven't played with him before, so i don't know his usual playstyle. That, for me, is something i prefer. I get a neatral look on him, unbiased. 

 

He looks fine to me, general gameplay is well within what i would like to see from town.

 

Well, what about him apparently thinking that ELEVEN people (10 if not counting himself) should NOT be lynched? He's basically veto'ing 80% of the game from his vote.

 

Ley people dont read in perfect grammar. Change where you take the breath on that sentence and the meaning changes. 

 

As for Maws list. Its D1. having two people he is willing to lynch seems reasonable to me. Do you expect him to have 4 picked out? Cause right now the only way someone could have 4 picked out is if they are mafia. Not enuff has happened for 4 people to have really stood out in a bad way.

 

The whole reason for commas is to show readers where to take a breath though. Because the sentence that brought all the fuzz was immediately behind the "who", it belongs to the "who" and not the "you". That's just how it is, I'm sorry.

 

 

its stuff like this that is not helping your case.  Not likely anyone is gonna have 4 maf leans day 1 with some people hardly posting at all.

 

 

I'm not saying you have to have X mafia leans, I'm saying you should not exclude 80% of the participants from your vote. If you're not willing to lynch someone, that means you are so sure this person is town that you're not gonna vote them, no matter what. At day 1, that's ABSURD.

 

--snip--

 

Why is that absurd? With such limited information available, and especially in a game where a majority is not needed today... Why is it harmful to limit the pool of suspects?

 

So, I don't think you responded effectively, I don't think your comments can be substantiated, and I continue to think that you're a reasonable lynch today.

[Netbattler11]

Mods, could we get an updated countdown timer to the new deadline?

[Leyrann]

I'm NOT trying to hold it against you you put yourself in the no lynch category. I just mentioned it because I personally believe it's better to totally exclude oneself when talking about reads. Therefore, there are 10 people out of 12 you say should not be lynched today. End.

 

Basically, what I dislike, is that you're saying you "are not willing to lynch" (yes you DID say that) these people. You should have a preferred lynch, not an only-possibility lynch. Saying "I am not willing to lynch this person", mostly if you're the first to give a list, makes people consciously or unconsciously close down their suspects to agree with you more, while you yourself too agree that there are possible mafia out there. NO ONE who is not cleared or the towniest town who ever towned should ever be a "not willing to lynch" person. There are MANY lynches out there that get stuff done that are not me and Talya. For example, Seph, Dice and you.

[Leyrann]

Mods, could we get an updated countdown timer to the new deadline?

 

Just under 25 hours from now.

[Thane Vakarian]

http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20150609T20&p0=50

[Talya]

Maw - Reread his list and some of his stuff. I have a slight read as town for this. I can't see a wolf would put a list like that out there first thing, it had a few flaws but at this point in the game I wouldn't expect much more. He wasn't scared to go after Darthe despite everyone keeping on saying it's just Darthe. (doesn't mean Darthe is wolf or town). I would like to know who is other couple of lynches he maybe could be persuaded to go for. ("I'd be convinced to vote a couple other people").

 

Seph - I started with a slight lean wolf on him, I think he defense on Zander early on was a little premature, it was after 1 post into Day I believe, convinced his wolf game would be different. He challenged Ley over his interaction to Corv, jumped off as soon as he realised he had read it wrong. don't know what to make of that, sometimes it seems more townie and then I think if he really felt that way about what Ley had said, what difference would it make to whom he said it too.

 

Alanna - I had her down as a slight wolf feeling after the first few posts, but I have reread and gone over her newer stuff, I can feel her frustration with Darthe and I think she has been trying to get the town going.

 

Sooh - hasn't made many posts so far. I feel she is hiding in the shadows a bit and trying not to draw attention. This could be she has been bitten a couple of times on day 1 when she has tried, and got shot down a bit at the beginning here too. Would like to see more of her.

 

Dice - has gone after Ley in trying to pin him down on things. I wish he would also look a bit wider and here about what he thinks of others.

 

RTE - has come in with some posts, another I would like to see give their opinions more of who they think maybe town and may not be

 

Thane - so far I'm like his posts. the only thing here is he is a lot more active in this game than he was in the only other one I was in with him. Not enough to decide on meta so will keep to my first impression for now

 

Zander - had his vote on Sooh for ages, long after the joke vote and he said he was keeping it on there to see what happened, not much else from him, apart from confused about Darthe. Not sure if he and seph are wolves together or seph is wolf knowing zander isn't. Bit of Null read there

 

corv - he's not doing a bad job for first time playing, for the moment a newbie pass for day 1

 

Darthe - null read, and I'm waiting for the fireworks...there better be fireworks

 

Verb - had a slight town read at the beginning, not been around since due to weekend,

 

Ley - I actually think that some of the reason's behind are grasping, I think his posts are not indicative of his alignment. I have a Null read on him now and would like to see his ideas as the game progresses.

 

I think that is everyone. The strongest read I have at the moment

 

[v]seph[/v]

 

 

 

[Guest]

I will post the deadline page 1, so you can easily find it !

[Verbal32]

 

Well you voted me.

I asked why.

You said something about hunting wolves.

Sounds like you calling me a wolf. Why else vote me while proclaiming to be hunting the wolvies?

Hence why I wanted an explanation.

I am town

 

Can you think of any other reason he might vote you and say that?  Does it have to mean you're a suspect in his eyes?  Darthe loves misdirection, so I'm not really buying this post as sincere right now.

 

What I'm getting from Verbal is that he's covering his arse by announcing his crappy mafia-play lately. So if he plays well, he's town?

 

Actually, yes.  But that isn't the point.  I'm being very pro-village thus far, and you are starting to look like somebody that doesn't want a clear villager to appear.

/snip/

Okay I get what you say by misdirection from Darthe, but isn't that inherently anti-town? Like distractions? I don't see how it's not sincere, either. Both me and Maw thought the vote on me was odd.

 

And I do think you've been pro-village thus far, but I also think that mafia-Verbal is capable of self clearing himself on the basis of meta play

 

Re: all the bold - you started with casting suspicion on me, and have taken a few steps back when I responded with a counter-attack.  Now you are (in a couple of posts) saying that I'm pro-village.  I normally would ignore that progression and assume it is ok, but the inclusion of "both me and Maw" sets off some alarms.  Wolves like to link themselves to a villager in this way as it subconsciously obtains agreement from that other player as they know they are a villager and might think mindmelding with another player means they are a villager as well.  I don't think I'm ready to lynch you, but I'd strongly consider it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

im gonna be spotty the next few days.  im gonna do my best to be active.

 

thus far

 

town reading Dice, Alana, Ley,

 

slight town seph

 

null darthe Maw Sooh.

 

rest no idea yet

Question: you have Darthe Maw and Seph in null, but then you have "no idea" on the rest. That bothers me for some reason lol

 

Also, what are your thoughts on Corvhin?

 

 

im not the best on day 1 reads on my limited exp playing as well as its pretty early for SOLID reads imo...darthe is an enigma to me....maw never played with and seph ive misread before.

 

corvs 1st game...1 post in 14 pages is not good...but not gonna say hes wolf because of it yet.

 

 

Question:  at this point, I had several posts and was actively involved in the discussion.  I'm not willing to accept you have "no idea" on me yet.

 

 

 

Can we all back up to the moment Talya really suggested that there was a player on this forum who could direct me?

 

I'm going to remember this post for reference in future games.  ;-)

 

 

 

 

We will go random before we lynch Ley today, just so everyone is clear on that.

 

Maw would be a good lynch btw

 

Agree on first sentence, disagree on second.  I want to see them both post @ each other more.

[csarmi]

My co mod is awesome.

[Guest]

*bows*

 

Still, i will let you post the next VC lol

[Verbal32]

I'm not saying you have to have X mafia leans, I'm saying you should not exclude 80% of the participants from your vote. If you're not willing to lynch someone, that means you are so sure this person is town that you're not gonna vote them, no matter what. At day 1, that's ABSURD.

 

I think people are misunderstanding what Ley is trying to say here.  Ley, allow me to state what I think you're saying, and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

 

"I totally get not lynching people you think are villagers, but putting the vast majority of the playerbase into that category on D1 is excessive and suspicious."

[Netbattler11]

I'm NOT trying to hold it against you you put yourself in the no lynch category. I just mentioned it because I personally believe it's better to totally exclude oneself when talking about reads. Therefore, there are 10 people out of 12 you say should not be lynched today. End.

 

Basically, what I dislike, is that you're saying you "are not willing to lynch" (yes you DID say that) these people. You should have a preferred lynch, not an only-possibility lynch. Saying "I am not willing to lynch this person", mostly if you're the first to give a list, makes people consciously or unconsciously close down their suspects to agree with you more, while you yourself too agree that there are possible mafia out there. NO ONE who is not cleared or the towniest town who ever towned should ever be a "not willing to lynch" person. There are MANY lynches out there that get stuff done that are not me and Talya. For example, Seph, Dice and you.

I'll accept that you prefer that, but I wanted to have an full list of everyone in the game.

 

I did not ever say that. Those quotes imply that I said those exact words, which I did not. If I said something you want to quote, go find it and include that post. Please don't put words in my mouth, it's bad practice. Now, I should have clarified my categories to 'People I think are good lynches today' and 'People who I do not think are good lynches today, but at no point did I set in stone that those two people would be the only people in the game who I will vote for today.

 

I still think that you are the best lynch today, but if you have a better alternative, by all means continue making a solid case for it. Your vote on Dice is not unsupported, but seems a little lackluster to me.

[Leyrann]

@Talya: Don't worry. Darthe doesn't disappoint. Last game he got the game that active that we had 25 pages in one night.

 

@Verb: That's indeed basically what I meant. Thank you.

[Leyrann]

 

Welcome to today's episode of To Lynch Or Not To Lynch. I'm your host, Mawthtex. Let's run through our contestants:

 

Sooh: Not. She's been fairly quiet, but when she contributes her posts seem pretty sound. Not entirely sure about her though.

Darthe: Not. I dislike his playstyle but apparently it's normal and no one else seems to be concerned about it, so we can deal with it in the future.

Thane: Not. I like his impressions of the game and his play so far.

Zander: Not. He was kind silent for a while, but he's been chiming in more lately. I think he bears watching, but I don't think he's today's lynch.

Talya: Lynch. She seems to be vibrating between being quite intelligent and misreading key parts of posts. I would be willing to vote for her.

Corvhin: Not. His inexperience is showing, but he's putting forth a good effort.

Release The Evil: Not. I get the impression he's town, although not a strong one.

Mawthtex: Not. I like myself too much to lynch me.

AlannaLynn Not. We seem to think along the same lines, which suggests to me we are both looking out for the town's best interests.

Seph: Not. He seems to have a pretty good head on his shoulders most of the time, although he bears watching.

Verbal: Not. He seems to be playing a pretty strong town game so far.

Leyrann: Lynch. He's been playing more aggressively than helpfully. Not sure I quite understand where he's coming from, and I'd be willing to put a vote on him.

Dice: Not. I don't have a strong read on him but neither do I have suspicions.

 

So, to summarize, I think Leyrann or Talya should be the lynch today. They've played the spottiest of everyone here.

 

[v]Leyrann[/v]

 

Tell me why you shouldn't go down today.

 

 

Here you are.

[Netbattler11]

 

 

Welcome to today's episode of To Lynch Or Not To Lynch. I'm your host, Mawthtex. Let's run through our contestants:

 

Sooh: Not. She's been fairly quiet, but when she contributes her posts seem pretty sound. Not entirely sure about her though.

Darthe: Not. I dislike his playstyle but apparently it's normal and no one else seems to be concerned about it, so we can deal with it in the future.

Thane: Not. I like his impressions of the game and his play so far.

Zander: Not. He was kind silent for a while, but he's been chiming in more lately. I think he bears watching, but I don't think he's today's lynch.

Talya: Lynch. She seems to be vibrating between being quite intelligent and misreading key parts of posts. I would be willing to vote for her.

Corvhin: Not. His inexperience is showing, but he's putting forth a good effort.

Release The Evil: Not. I get the impression he's town, although not a strong one.

Mawthtex: Not. I like myself too much to lynch me.

AlannaLynn Not. We seem to think along the same lines, which suggests to me we are both looking out for the town's best interests.

Seph: Not. He seems to have a pretty good head on his shoulders most of the time, although he bears watching.

Verbal: Not. He seems to be playing a pretty strong town game so far.

Leyrann: Lynch. He's been playing more aggressively than helpfully. Not sure I quite understand where he's coming from, and I'd be willing to put a vote on him.

Dice: Not. I don't have a strong read on him but neither do I have suspicions.

 

So, to summarize, I think Leyrann or Talya should be the lynch today. They've played the spottiest of everyone here.

 

[v]Leyrann[/v]

 

Tell me why you shouldn't go down today.

 

 

Here you are.

 

Yes. There we are. I never said I was unwilling to lynch anyone else, you misunderstood the categories I created, you blew my intentions completely out of proportion, and you continue to do so.

[Leyrann]

You called them "Not to lynch". That sounds to me like you're not okay with lynching them. Maybe that 9.5/10 I got for my English exam isn't representative, but I doubt that.

[Sooh]

I am not sure how to feel about this whole Mawt/Ley discussion. On one hand I think Ley might be blowing stuff out of proportion, but he reads more frustrated villager than anything else to me now. On the other hand I had Mawt as a slight wolf lean before, but I haven't seen anything to really solidify that lean. I'm going to ISO him when we get closer to EOD. 

 

There's a good of action/reaction going on in the game right now, so I think any flips we can get will be useful in terms of information. That being said I would of course rather lynch a wolf. It looks like the main focus is Ley/Mawt/Talya right now, maybe even Seph or Dice also. I was struggling to find a recent VC. I'll be paying extra special attention to them as we move forward. 

[csarmi]

Votecouunt. Yes. I gonna try and do one.

[Verbal32]

I am not sure how to feel about this whole Mawt/Ley discussion. On one hand I think Ley might be blowing stuff out of proportion, but he reads more frustrated villager than anything else to me now. On the other hand I had Mawt as a slight wolf lean before, but I haven't seen anything to really solidify that lean. I'm going to ISO him when we get closer to EOD. 

 

There's a good of action/reaction going on in the game right now, so I think any flips we can get will be useful in terms of information. That being said I would of course rather lynch a wolf. It looks like the main focus is Ley/Mawt/Talya right now, maybe even Seph or Dice also. I was struggling to find a recent VC. I'll be paying extra special attention to them as we move forward. 

 

Ley and Talya are not on the table today.