The aMoL 'Memories of Light' Releases

[mbuehner]

If its a well, its several orders of magnitude larger than the 'large' well Nynaeve has. She was well on the way burning through hers in Far Madding doing some rather trivial channeling. Rand would have used that up in a fraction of a second at Maradon, unless it was hugely larger.

 

Also- isn't filling a well done by embracing the source through it like you would an angreal? I'm not sure if that equates to channeling through it or not, and if thats any easier.

 

And it was Tear Rand went to to collect something, and it was after Maradon. If Rand has an angreal it seems odd that he wouldn't keep it on his person at all times. Callandor and the CK were temptations with terrible repercussions, but Rand had no issue with carrying around the fat man before.

[yoniy0]

Let me say here that we've all known something's fishy with there being no more excerpts as of 3 months prior to the release, and some of us have said so. What Peter said, if intentionally misleading, is really impolite. I prefer to think he was told no new chapters are being released, and he paraphrased that for us, not realizing that what he said wasn't strictly accurate.

[Amandera]

And it was Tear Rand went to to collect something, and it was after Maradon. If Rand has an angreal it seems odd that he wouldn't keep it on his person at all times. Callandor and the CK were temptations with terrible repercussions, but Rand had no issue with carrying around the fat man before.

He returned to Tear after collecting something, and it is indeed before Maradon. You are thinking of AMoL Prologue Aviendha's PoV, this is different. I quoted it from ToM, Ch15.

[mccullough]

And it was Tear Rand went to to collect something, and it was after Maradon. If Rand has an angreal it seems odd that he wouldn't keep it on his person at all times. Callandor and the CK were temptations with terrible repercussions, but Rand had no issue with carrying around the fat man before.

He returned to Tear after collecting something, and it is indeed before Maradon. You are thinking about AMoL Prologue, this is different. I quoted it from ToM.

 

 

It was likely in his safe deposit box at the First State National Bank of Tear.

[herid]

@ herid - no idea.

I'm assuming the statue made it's way into Falme along with the other items Damon had. Rand could have seen it in Turak's collection and ignored it at the time. But, with new found knowledge, post VoG, realised it's true value and gone looking for it. This is where it gets tenuous I guess...

Rand wouldn't know where Turak's collection is now. It can be anywhere for all we know even back in Seanchan somewhere.

 

 

@Barid why do you think that drawing from a Well is any different from drawing from the True source directly? I don't recall anything in the books suggesting this.

 

 

Well there is no direct evidence, I don't think, but it is like a glass of water (per RJ). The channeler who fills the Well already draws from the True Source to fill it.

 

They have already done the hard work in procuring the "water" and they have a glass filled, all that needs doing is to be used.

 

I guess that's how I have always seen it. It doesn't require Nynaeve to go through the same excercise to Draw upon the Well in Far Madding, she can't even sense the source. So it implies it is just a manufactured product ready to use without the need to "seize" or "surrender" to it.

 

Again, my take on it, there is nothing conclusive, so really, it is speculation.

I must say this is pretty sketchy. However now that I think of it, it looks like the Eye of the World allowed Rand to channel very strongly. His performance at the Eye is similar to Maradon and took much less time too. Perhaps the Eye (or more generally any Well) works as a angreal too in that it allows the person using it to channel more than is normally safe provided the Well is big enough.

[mbuehner]

And it was Tear Rand went to to collect something, and it was after Maradon. If Rand has an angreal it seems odd that he wouldn't keep it on his person at all times. Callandor and the CK were temptations with terrible repercussions, but Rand had no issue with carrying around the fat man before.

He returned to Tear after collecting something, and it is indeed before Maradon. You are thinking about AMoL Prologue, this is different. I quoted it from ToM.

 

"Tomorrow is key" Aviendha said. "His plan."

... a bit later

"He went through a gateway to Tear earlier this evening and returned with something," Melaine said.

 

Did Maradon happen the same day, including returning to Tear and then meeting the Borderlanders at FM? I assumed there was some time between that day and the meeting at FoM. There dont seem to be any good timelines that are up to date.

 

-edit, nevermind not reading my own quote. Rand went to Tear to retrieve something the night before the FoM meeting. Maradon happened earlier, there are only hours in between. Doubtless he had been back and forth to Tear many times for various reasons, but its odd to think he got his whatever, used it in Maradon, took it back to Tear, and then fetched it again that evening. Not impossible, but why?

[he who comes with a bong]

most of the time lines are messed up best not to think about them. It will make you go insane trying to figure them out.

[Amandera]

And it was Tear Rand went to to collect something, and it was after Maradon. If Rand has an angreal it seems odd that he wouldn't keep it on his person at all times. Callandor and the CK were temptations with terrible repercussions, but Rand had no issue with carrying around the fat man before.

He returned to Tear after collecting something, and it is indeed before Maradon. You are thinking about AMoL Prologue, this is different. I quoted it from ToM.

 

"Tomorrow is key" Aviendha said. "His plan."

... a bit later

"He went through a gateway to Tear earlier this evening and returned with something," Melaine said.

 

Did Maradon happen the same day, including returning to Tear and then meeting the Borderlanders at FM? I assumed there was some time between that day and the meeting at FoM. There dont seem to be any good timelines that are up to date.

And I am telling you that one is different than what we were talking about.

 

She had to return to the White Tower. It galled her to have to obey Egwene. But obey she would, and leave as soon as Rand returned. He’d gone somewhere this morning. Insufferable man. At least he’d taken Maidens with him. He’d reportedly said he needed to fetch something.

[Ian Ohlander]

It took a few channelers to make the eye originaly and they all had to die to make it so i dont think he made a new one. And Ltt wasnt around when they eye was originally made.

 

And don't forget the reason they died was that both male and female had to work "through the taint" in order to somehow cleanse it and leave it as a pool of pure unadulterated saidin. Given the way Rand cleansed Saidin using an opposite attracting evil, I'm really not sure on how this was accomplished. Assuming the same technique, but on a finite amount of Saidin, how were the channelers the "fllters"? Why would saidin "stick" to the channelers and not pass through them? I wonder if it is simply an early bookism. Because for all of the import that the eye had in the first book, at this point in the series is seems to have been pretty pointless.

 

Getting back the matter at hand, though, I don't know that there's any indication that you could create any kind of *angreal inside a person's body or that it could be made from organic material. Perhaps something similar to the metals and their uses in BS's Mistborn saga, but I have a hard time believe BS would carry the concept over. At least I'd really hope he wouldn't.

 

If a person is shielded (as opposed to being in a place where the one powers is blocked like a stedding or in the guardian control), can they even use a well? Is it the source they are shielded from or their own ability to reach out of themselves? Because if they can't then that isn't the reason Rand wasn't afraid in TV. (My personal opinion was that he has conscious control of his taveren nature, provided it is in harmony with his purpose as Dragon.)

[mbuehner]

And it was Tear Rand went to to collect something, and it was after Maradon. If Rand has an angreal it seems odd that he wouldn't keep it on his person at all times. Callandor and the CK were temptations with terrible repercussions, but Rand had no issue with carrying around the fat man before.

He returned to Tear after collecting something, and it is indeed before Maradon. You are thinking about AMoL Prologue, this is different. I quoted it from ToM.

 

"Tomorrow is key" Aviendha said. "His plan."

... a bit later

"He went through a gateway to Tear earlier this evening and returned with something," Melaine said.

 

Did Maradon happen the same day, including returning to Tear and then meeting the Borderlanders at FM? I assumed there was some time between that day and the meeting at FoM. There dont seem to be any good timelines that are up to date.

And I am telling you that one is different than what we were talking about.

 

She had to return to the White Tower. It galled her to have to obey Egwene. But obey she would, and leave as soon as Rand returned. He’d gone somewhere this morning. Insufferable man. At least he’d taken Maidens with him. He’d reportedly said he needed to fetch something.

 

Which is Rand leaving Tear to fetch something, before Maradon. The Quote from the prologue is specific to visiting Tear and specific to returning with something. They immediately discuss the price Rand has and its relation to the Aiel... which could be lousy writing telegraphing that whatever Rand has concerns the Dragon's Peace and not any kind of weapon.

 

So the way I see it, either Rand is running back and forth to grab something, bring it to Tear, take it to Maradon, return it to Tear, and then fetch it back to Merrilor... or there are multiple errands to fetch different items. Id suspect the latter.

[he who comes with a bong]

Two words Lamans Sword.

[Amandera]

And don't forget the reason they died was that both male and female had to work "through the taint" in order to somehow cleanse it and leave it as a pool of pure unadulterated saidin. Given the way Rand cleansed Saidin using an opposite attracting evil, I'm really not sure on how this was accomplished. Assuming the same technique, but on a finite amount of Saidin, how were the channelers the "fllters"? Why would saidin "stick" to the channelers and not pass through them? I wonder if it is simply an early bookism. Because for all of the import that the eye had in the first book, at this point in the series is seems to have been pretty pointless.

As far as I can remember, we only know they died because Moiraine said so. Aes Sedai have been known to be wrong, very frequently actually.

 

Getting back the matter at hand, though, I don't know that there's any indication that you could create any kind of *angreal inside a person's body or that it could be made from organic material. Perhaps something similar to the metals and their uses in BS's Mistborn saga, but I have a hard time believe BS would carry the concept over. At least I'd really hope he wouldn't.

Agreed.

 

If a person is shielded (as opposed to being in a place where the one powers is blocked like a stedding or in the guardian control), can they even use a well? Is it the source they are shielded from or their own ability to reach out of themselves? Because if they can't then that isn't the reason Rand wasn't afraid in TV. (My personal opinion was that he has conscious control of his taveren nature, provided it is in harmony with his purpose as Dragon.)

They can.

[Amandera]

Which is Rand leaving Tear to fetch something, before Maradon. The Quote from the prologue is specific to visiting Tear and specific to returning with something. They immediately discuss the price Rand has and its relation to the Aiel... which could be lousy writing telegraphing that whatever Rand has concerns the Dragon's Peace and not any kind of weapon.

 

So the way I see it, either Rand is running back and forth to grab something, bring it to Tear, take it to Maradon, return it to Tear, and then fetch it back to Merrilor... or there are multiple errands to fetch different items. Id suspect the latter.

Or it could be hard to carry it on your person, so he leaves it behind when he doesn't need it specifically. Could be either.

 

Two words Lamans Sword.

He had that thing since TFoH and a lot of people know about it. It could be Justice though. He never told anyone that it actually is Justice, not even Min. I don't know how it can be significant though. Unless it's another Sword That Is Not A Sword, so to speak.

 

Crazy idea: Justice is a ter'angreal with the same function as the Crystal Throne.

[herid]

@Ian Ohlander

 

 

Interview: Feb 26th, 2003

 

tarvalon.net Q&A (Verbatim)

Question

 

Can someone channel from a Well while they are shielded?

Robert Jordan

 

Yes, they could. If they had the Well.

[Tyzack]

I'm in the *angreal camp; most likely a ter'angreal since we have no indication of rand channeling, or needing to, there. My guess would be the "hides the holder from the sense of the dark one" which would have been useful if the there was a planned ambush on the force of the light's gathering once rand was spotted at it.

[he who comes with a bong]

Which is Rand leaving Tear to fetch something, before Maradon. The Quote from the prologue is specific to visiting Tear and specific to returning with something. They immediately discuss the price Rand has and its relation to the Aiel... which could be lousy writing telegraphing that whatever Rand has concerns the Dragon's Peace and not any kind of weapon.

 

So the way I see it, either Rand is running back and forth to grab something, bring it to Tear, take it to Maradon, return it to Tear, and then fetch it back to Merrilor... or there are multiple errands to fetch different items. Id suspect the latter.

Or it could be hard to carry it on your person, so he leaves it behind when he doesn't need it specifically. Could be either.

 

Two words Lamans Sword.

He had that thing since TFoH and a lot of people know about it. It could be Justice though. He never told anyone that it actually is Justice, not even Min. I don't know how it can be significant though. Unless it's another Sword That Is Not A Sword, so to speak.

 

Crazy idea: Justice is a ter'angreal with the same function as the Crystal Throne.

 

he didhave that sword since fires but after he got hawkings sword he stopped wearing it and took up wearing hawkwings. Then in either chapter 1 or the prologue he is wearing lamans sword, and not justice. so he had to go somewhere to get it, and i do belive that it was in Tear.

[mbuehner]

I really like the idea of this being somebody besides Rand, although I don't think it likely. That would be a great way to kick off these spoilers. If it were, say Demandred, and he has an angreal, and he's glad he had it to extricate himself from Rand's light storm, that would be cool. But i doubt it (why wouldn't he launch his attack on Rand after he tired himself out).

[hjustinpace]

I'm in the *angreal camp; most likely a ter'angreal since we have no indication of rand channeling, or needing to, there. My guess would be the "hides the holder from the sense of the dark one" which would have been useful if the there was a planned ambush on the force of the light's gathering once rand was spotted at it.

 

The "hides the holder from the sense of the dark one" ter'angreal doesn't seem to make sense, because Rand expresses concern that he almost provoked a (premature) confrontation with the Dark One by his actions in Maradon.

[Tyzack]

I'm sorry, I misread "Maradon as Melinor"

 

I will give you that the "angreal" line is now much more plausable.

[Rubberninja]

I'll go out on a limb here and suggest that its NOT Rands PoV, but a shady Asha'man, or even one of the Forsaken doing the channeling at Maradon, to create the explosion. I'd point a finger at Demandred or Taim at this point, and in this case, I favor Demandred. It might even be the fat man, since most are convinced Taim had his men look for it at Dumai's Wells with no luck. Could have been Demandred in sheeps clothing, nicking it before anyone noticed.

 

mbuehner: I'd assume Demandred left as soon as the hole was punched in the city walls, or else had to flee the storm of light. An angreal certainly bolsters how much of the power you can hold, but it does not increase the speed or agility of your weaving, and if you're spending all your time defending, what good is more power?

 



"Surveying the devastation his plans had caused in Caemlyn, Demandred paced the cleared ground near the now constantly open Waygate as more troops were brought in. Al'Thor could not afford to ignore his invasion of the city, if not for his emotional ties to the place, then for its tactical positioning.

He fingered the angreal in his pocket. It had been usefull at Maradon. Nobody knew he had it. That was important.."

 

Only with better flow, prose and whatever..

[JakeBarnes]

I will say that if 'it' is the fat man, I would love for this to be Demandred's POV.

[hjustinpace]

There is the "Nobody knew he had it. That was important." angle to it as well. Why is it so important to Rand that no one knows he has an angreal when he is the strongest channeler in the world and has access to Callandor? One of the Forsaken, on the other hand, has ample reason to hide possession of an angreal. An angreal can be a decisive factor against a fellow Forsaken or Rand if they aren't ready for it. And Moridin can't appropriate what he doesn't know about.

[Grimmauld]

About the possibilities of the hiding from the shadow ter'angreal - Even if the ter'angreal doesn't allow the Dark One to sense the holder, surely it would not be too tough for the dark side to figure out that Rand was present given the awesome level of destruction being rained upon them by one man - before the army was wiped out it would surely have passed the message along.

 

About the Eye of the World - I always wondered whether the eye was intended to force the Dragon to max out as quickly as possible - give him access to a huge safe supply of saidin so that his power bumps and he does not wander along learning for a few years. But this may have been interfered with due to the nature of him accessing it in conjunction with his battle with Aginor.

 

About the teaser itself - how fantastic it would be if this really is all smoke and mirrors and the line actually refers to somebody other than Rand. Or to Rand in a way that we do not expect. And if it's a darksider's POV, all the better.

[mbuehner]

There is the "Nobody knew he had it. That was important." angle to it as well. Why is it so important to Rand that no one knows he has an angreal when he is the strongest channeler in the world and has access to Callandor? One of the Forsaken, on the other hand, has ample reason to hide possession of an angreal. An angreal can be a decisive factor against a fellow Forsaken or Rand if they aren't ready for it. And Moridin can't appropriate what he doesn't know about.

 

That's a great point. I would say that Taim would be a good suspect by that logic- he has to know sooner or later there will be a showdown with Rand given that Rand knows where to find him. It would be vitally important that Rand not somehow find out, and that his new peers (who don't know him as well as they know each other) not know he has one. And indeed, Moridin might pluck it away on a whim. Applies equally well to Demandred though.

 

Another good possibility is another Asha'man that has gone to the dark side. Perhaps one of Taims men grabbed the fat man at Dumai's Well- that gives us a couple hundred suspects ;) It would also be vitally important that Taim nor anyone else not find out about it, or the man would be as good as dead. Could be a Dreadlord POV.

[Tyzack]

If the suspicsion is that it is the fat man (last scene at the wells) could it be one of the good asha'man who were also at maradon? A good asha'man with an angreal would be important the fight for the black tower.