Most under-rated book in series

[OptimusPrime]

I loved the Cleansing; it was awesome and a half

 

Hahaha

 

I agree, its one of my favorite scenes. I dont think it was rushed myself. It was just good to see so many of the Forsaken in one place doing something instead of sitting around trying to figure each other out. And the fact that they lost, I do not put that as a dig into their overall badassery, because they were expected, well prepared for, and well unprepared for what they went up against. They didnt lose points, the Light gained some. I think we were so used to it being the other way round that some people dont see it like that. Rand had male and female channelers, a ton of angreal and ter'angreal, and he had Cadsuane. They won that battle because of her.

[Zhipp]

A Crown of Swords. I honestly don't understand why that book get's so much hate...aside from the ending, that is.

Winter's Heart is generally spoken of favorably, isn't it?

 

Hahaha

 

I agree, its one of my favorite scenes. I dont think it was rushed myself. It was just good to see so many of the Forsaken in one place doing something instead of sitting around trying to figure each other out. And the fact that they lost, I do not put that as a dig into their overall badassery, because they were expected, well prepared for, and well unprepared for what they went up against. They didnt lose points, the Light gained some. I think we were so used to it being the other way round that some people dont see it like that. Rand had male and female channelers, a ton of angreal and ter'angreal, and he had Cadsuane. They won that battle because of her.

 

The Forsaken couldn't lose points for that because they didn't have anymore points to lose.

[The Watcher and Wanderer]

I've gotta go with POD. If you can get through about the first 1/4 of the book (The Perrin parts) its really a pretty good book. The bits with Rand going after the Seanchan are very exciting especially since this really illustrates the extent of Rand's madness and the flow in Calandor (sp). Winter's Heart would be a close second as most underrated.

 

The first 6 books are generally loved as are 11-13 so I don't think any of these books could be said to be underrated. Its mostly 7-10 that people complain about and CoT is not underrated, it deserves ever bit of criticism it gets.

[WWWwombat]

Crossroads of Twilight of course. Is there a more hated book that actually has plenty to offer? Didn't think so.

 

CoT deserves most of the hate it gets. I chose TSR even though people like it because I think it's the best in the series and I haven't seen other people saying that.

[OptimusPrime]

Winter's Heart is generally spoken of favorably, isn't it?

 

Yea, but I think a lot of people only like it for the Cleansing. Theres a lot more to that book though IMO. Taim has the black aura in the prologue and a lot of us dismissed that on our readthroughs before TGS.

 

Me, I like it because I am convinced Taim is Moridin and a lot of stuff in Winters Heart looks different if you believe he is.

[Southpaw89]

haha they were pretty dumb but then again the Cleansing was pretty hectic. Moridin was the smartest one and just didn't go

[Hael Me]

My vote: Knife of Dreams.

 

Some really great scenes and confrontations in there: Galad vs Valda, Loial vs his mother, Mat vs Tuon, Mat and the Band vs the Seanchan in Altara, Perrin vs the Shaido, Perrin vs Aram, Rand vs Semirhage and my favourite of them all: Pevara vs Mazrim Taim.

 

In my opinion this is one of the best entries in the series, a lot of things happen, but it's also under-rated for some reason.

[Ataxia]

I always thought the Cleansing was meant to show that if men/women worked together, the Forsaken and their cronies wouldnt stand a chance.

[The Fallen One]

Voted for WH, there is just a lot of good stuff there and I do not see why so many people do not like it. If I had to choose a second one, I would say CoT. Yeah, it has some issues and reading it the first time was pretty hard, but after KoD was out it became a lot less frustrating to read. There is a lot of good stuff in the Aes Sedai camp and the few chapters that take place around Rand were awesome. I don't mind seeing the different viewpoints of the cleaning either. My only complaint was that there was not much of a climax for any of the arcs except Perrin's whole giving up the axe thing which I thought was a really powerful scene.

[True Source Creator]

Is there a thread for favorite book? I don't know the acclaim for all, so I'll just post my rankings of the books, and that should say which one I think is most under-rated if it is not as critically acclaimed as others.

 

1. The Fires of Heaven - loved this book, especially its sad ending

 

2. Lord of Chaos - great continuation to TFoH and with some big shocks

 

3. Eye of the World - fantastic way to start the series

 

4. The Dragon Reborn - loved the ending in Tear

 

5. The Shadow Rising - something about the earlier books just seems more "magical"

 

6. The Great Hunt - almost as good as the first and it features one of the best endings with the battle at Falme

 

7. Winter's Heart - the ending at Shadar Logoth is epic. Loved the Forsaken

 

8. A Crown of Swords - after LoC, the series isn't as good; it's good, yes, but it never reached what it did after that one

 

9. The Path of Daggers - see above

 

10. The Crossroads of Twilight - this is the only one that has disappointed me. It was a disappointing follow up to Winter's Heart, and outside of Egwene being captured at the end, not much of importance seemed to have happened to progress the story beyond where it was in Winter's Heart. I did like the scenes in the White Tower, especially when Mesaana is revealed (well, kind of revealed), though.

 

Still reading - Knife of Dreams (improvement over Crossroads so far)

 

Not yet read:

-The Gathering Storm

-The Tower of Midnight

[True Source Creator]

I voted Fires of Heaven.

 

 

SPOILERS!!!

 

BTW, I wish whoever said that thing about Taim's black aura had spoilered it. I haven't gotten that far (to Gathering Storm, that is), but now I know there's speculation that Taim is Moridin, which would have been an awesome shock for me. I regret having read this thread.

 

:(

[Vambram]

I voted Fires of Heaven.

 

 

SPOILERS!!!

 

BTW, I wish whoever said that thing about Taim's black aura had spoilered it. I haven't gotten that far (to Gathering Storm, that is), but now I know there's speculation that Taim is Moridin, which would have been an awesome shock for me. I regret having read this thread.

 

:(

 

Don't worry. According to Robert Jordan's answers over the years to questions about Taim... you can be certain that Taim is NOT Moridin, and that Taim is NOT Demandred.

[Bluedust9]

I voted Fires of Heaven.

 

 

SPOILERS!!!

 

BTW, I wish whoever said that thing about Taim's black aura had spoilered it. I haven't gotten that far (to Gathering Storm, that is), but now I know there's speculation that Taim is Moridin, which would have been an awesome shock for me. I regret having read this thread.

 

:(

 

Don't worry. According to Robert Jordan's answers over the years to questions about Taim... you can be certain that Taim is NOT Moridin, and that Taim is NOT Demandred.

 

wut

[sandoz12]

I voted Fires of Heaven.

 

 

SPOILERS!!!

 

BTW, I wish whoever said that thing about Taim's black aura had spoilered it. I haven't gotten that far (to Gathering Storm, that is), but now I know there's speculation that Taim is Moridin, which would have been an awesome shock for me. I regret having read this thread.

 

:(

I think you will start getting right back into the series as you get to the last three books. Pity about the spoilers but if you continue to read this forum you will come across plenty more as spoilers are allowed right up to the end of TOM. To avoid spoilers you can use the Structured Wheel of Time Discussion sub-forum.

[capuga]

Crossroads of Twilight of course. Is there a more hated book that actually has plenty to offer? Didn't think so.

 

CoT deserves most of the hate it gets. I chose TSR even though people like it because I think it's the best in the series and I haven't seen other people saying that.

 

Almost everyone says that. It usually wins the favority book polls by a wide margin.

[sandoz12]

Crossroads of Twilight of course. Is there a more hated book that actually has plenty to offer? Didn't think so.

 

CoT deserves most of the hate it gets. I chose TSR even though people like it because I think it's the best in the series and I haven't seen other people saying that.

 

Almost everyone says that. It usually wins the favority book polls by a wide margin.

Exactly my thoughts. I did mention when I created the post that I wouldn't expect to see either TSR or LOC score since they generally battle it out for any favourite book (with TSR winning as you mention). In hindsight perhaps I shouldn't have even given people the option of voting for TSR or LOC but didn't want to have to decide which books to leave out so just put the whole lot on there.

 

What is interesting is that neither TGS nor TOM have got a single vote. TGS would definitely be in my top five and maybe even my top three but not sure how highly rated it was by general fandom - I have seen conflicting reviews.

[OptimusPrime]

I voted Fires of Heaven.

 

 

SPOILERS!!!

 

BTW, I wish whoever said that thing about Taim's black aura had spoilered it. I haven't gotten that far (to Gathering Storm, that is), but now I know there's speculation that Taim is Moridin, which would have been an awesome shock for me. I regret having read this thread.

 

:(

 

Ok that was me, sorry about that. But in all fairness this thread obviously covers all books in print, which is why I didnt think to say spoilers.

 

Apologies.

[True Source Creator]

^

No, I understand, but as it was talking about Winter's Heart, it would have been nice to have spoilered it.

 

As it is, I didn't even observe that black aura about Taim when I read WH.

[Arc]

Crossroads of Twilight of course. Is there a more hated book that actually has plenty to offer? Didn't think so.

 

Thanks for mentioning this and I totally agree. RJ is often praised for his great descripitve writing style and extensive character building, and there's generally no book in the sequence that has more of it than this one. Next to his inability to kill of main characters, these two qualities are what set RJ apart from a great many other Fantasy writers like GRRM, TG, FH, JRRT, etc. So I always wondered why this book didn't get more credit than it did/does. I presume it is because of the stalemate in major story advancement and the Extensiveness of Elaynes' and Perrins' Arc. Ok so I'm no Elayne fan either, but there is so much more to it than that.

Basically this book gave Randland much more color and dept, something needed to appreciate other books in the series to a greater extend. Andoran politics, AS squable, Shaido, Seanchan, Traveling circuses, common life, etc. These things make certain comments, references and character development earlier- or later on even better than they already were. Several of the secondary and tertiary characters receive more personality to. Also the easygoing descriptive way of writing helps you, IMO, to blend in much better. You really know where you are and how everything looks around you,.. or it's just me.

Furthermore there are actually things happening in CoT. We got the introduction of badass Ituralde (nice), at several points in the book different channelers feel the cleansing (which was always fun to read and gave the cleansing a deeper impact overall. Especially since so many people complain about it being rushed in WH), Sevanna's an actual villain with a plan, though not a very good one I andmit, introduction of Tylee, The message from Rand to the AS camp, The torturing by Perrin, the inexplicable bonding between Mat and Tuon (Yes Mat is in this one to, like you all very well know), long sequences to nurture your AS dislike (Never read a book that made me enjoy hating characters so much. Another indication of RJ's mastership, who can make you hate what's going on in the story, but still keeps you going?), and so on...

And if you must you can easily skip some of the hall-walking and bathing in Andor from time to time, but I have to say, that's not diehard :).

 

 

To conclude: It's been quite some time since I read CoT, so I might be misplacing or forgetting things, but the fact remains that it ís the most under-rated book of the series. Not the best one for sure, but under-rated.

[jwood01]

I totally agree with Kadere and Arc that CoT is the most underrated book in the series. Almost everyone hated or hates it. I didn't like it until my first re-read. If it is read immediately prior to reading Knife of Dreams it is good. I am by no means arguing that it is the best in the series, but since KoD has been published, COT no longer deserves its reputation as the worst book in the series.

[Sid]

To conclude: It's been quite some time since I read CoT, so I might be misplacing or forgetting things, but the fact remains that it ís the most under-rated book of the series. Not the best one for sure, but under-rated.

Like many that try to defend CoT, you're adding things in your defense that happen in KoD. Is it the most under rated book of WoT? I would say no, since it's easily the worst of RJ's contributions to WoT. Does it deserve 1 star reviews on Amazon.com? No. Is it poorly written? No. There are really good scenes in there. We get an enlightening Karede PoV, good stuff from Perrin, Mat is always good, etc. On the other hand, nobody really gave a midden heap about the near-nothing that took up 5 chapters in and around Andor, and there were only two chapters with Rand present (and only 1 with his PoV). Was it unbelievably disappointing when it came out? Yes. Do WoT fans have long memories? Yes. Was the book structured more with the series in mind than as a single volume? Obviously. On its own it was a flop, but it's fine on a re-read.

[Smittyphi]

Was it unbelievably disappointing when it came out? Yes. Do WoT fans have long memories? Yes. Was the book structured more with the series in mind than as a single volume? Obviously. On its own it was a flop, but it's fine on a re-read.

That's why I voted CoT. I loved it as I didn't have to wait for it or after it. The first one I had to wait for was ToM.

[sandoz12]

I totally agree with Kadere and Arc that CoT is the most underrated book in the series. Almost everyone hated or hates it. I didn't like it until my first re-read. If it is read immediately prior to reading Knife of Dreams it is good. I am by no means arguing that it is the best in the series, but since KoD has been published, COT no longer deserves its reputation as the worst book in the series.

But some book has to be the worst book in the series? And if it's not COT what is it?

[Terez]

Eh, just because it's the worst book in the series doesn't mean it's not underrated.

[sandoz12]

I totally agree with Kadere and Arc that CoT is the most underrated book in the series. Almost everyone hated or hates it. I didn't like it until my first re-read. If it is read immediately prior to reading Knife of Dreams it is good. I am by no means arguing that it is the best in the series, but since KoD has been published, COT no longer deserves its reputation as the worst book in the series.

 

 

I totally agree with Kadere and Arc that CoT is the most underrated book in the series. Almost everyone hated or hates it. I didn't like it until my first re-read. If it is read immediately prior to reading Knife of Dreams it is good. I am by no means arguing that it is the best in the series, but since KoD has been published, COT no longer deserves its reputation as the worst book in the series.

But some book has to be the worst book in the series? And if it's not COT what is it?

 

 

Eh, just because it's the worst book in the series doesn't mean it's not underrated.

I wasn't saying it wasn't underrated. COT imo is both the worst book in the series and also underrated. I was just curious to find out (having said that COT of is no longer the worst book in the series) which book they now place at last.