Lan & Nynaeve

[liatildina]

Mat could never be celibate, we all know that he is just too adorable to ever be alone for long.

 

Nynaeve is mature. You might find her strength intimidating, but that's okay because Lan doesn't seem to mind.

 

These very strong women characters are written by a man.

 

Obviously RJ is okay with strong, brave, mature women.

 

That's why women adore his books!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[OzzieAlThor]

Nynaeve is mature. You might find her strength intimidating' date=' but that's okay because Lan doesn't seem to mind.

 

These very strong women characters are written by a man.

 

Obviously RJ is okay with strong, brave, mature women.

 

[/quote']

 

Temper, rudeness and stuborness does not = Strength.

 

Aviendha's strong. Cadsuane is strong. I can see someone's earlier point about Egwene being strong (to a point). Tuon is strong. Siuan is strong. Faile is strong (although a bit silly).

 

Nynave is a jerk. She's a young, loud-mouthed, pushy jerk. The only purpose she serves is to make Lan happy.

 

I certainly consider strong women a plus in any way. Who cares about the sex of someone?

 

A strong character is a strong character.

 

And a jerk is a jerk. Whether or not they make water standing up or sitting down.

[Xeonicus]

Actually I agree with you OP. I think the relationship just kinda came out of nowhere. Sure there were little hints dropped along the way, a smile here, a blush there, something you could MAYBE... ALMOST... call flirting. But not quite.

 

But then at the end of TEotW Lan was all like "OMG I luv u so much Nynaeve, u r teh 1 4 me!" It seemed really out of character for him and very abrupt. They were already married in almost all but name at that point. Not to mention that marriage to LAN was one of the big factors in Nynaeve's accepted test in Book 2.

 

I dunno... maybe it was the 3 ta'veren in one place working their magic. Hmm?

[liatildina]

Nope, I don't buy the entire Nynaeve is just a plaything of Lan's. Granted, I'm sure she doesn't mind, but when Rand needed someone to share in cleaning Saidin look who got the nod. she is incredibly strong with the source, and has backed up Rand many times, as a good Wisdom does.

 

I just don't find her annoying, I like the character. I also agree it doesn't matter what sex the character is, strong is strong, it's just that RJ writes great women and I appreciate that because many don't.

 

So what will Lan's reaction be when they meet up again?

[Guest cwestervelt]

As much as I have disliked Nynaeve as a character, her behaviour is understandable and a result of her situation.

 

She was placed in a position of authority at a very young age. One that made her the most important person in her village and the surrounding area. Probably one that she wasn't ready for mentally. Then, the people that put her in that possition did nothing but question her decisions. Deliberately or not, the Women's Circle undermined her authority.

[OzzieAlThor]

As much as I have disliked Nynaeve as a character' date=' her behaviour is understandable and a result of her situation.

 

She was placed in a position of authority at a very young age. One that made her the most important person in her village and the surrounding area. Probably one that she wasn't ready for mentally. Then, the people that put her in that possition did nothing but question her decisions. Deliberately or not, the Women's Circle undermined her authority.[/quote']

 

I agree. Her behavior can be understood and her situation could allow for it.

 

That doesn't make her mature. That explains why she isn't.

[aznprince001]

I notice alot of women of today who act alot like Nynaeve these days. People hate it when men talk to women aggressively like they're talking to their friends at a bar of something, and then there are the people who get mad just because a man opens the door for a women. -WHAT THE HELL!!!-

[Taishar Manetheren]

I think that a lot of Nynaeve changed attitude is not only being married to Lan, its also Lan giving her tips about commanding and acting like a real aes sedai that he got from experience being around Moiraine all there years.

But i think that being around a man she couldnt or wouldnt boss around all the time helps too.

 

(or maybe its the love making)

[OzzieAlThor]

(or maybe its the love making)

 

Fixed and emhpasized.

 

That man needed Nynave to stay alive. She need him to call the *bleep* down.

[liatildina]

Okay so even though I don't think Nynaeve is a jerk, or that she isn't mature, I agree that together Lan and Nynaeve bring out the best in each other (or help hide the worst). I still like their story line.

 

Yea, because I'm a sappy girl.

 

Maybe Lan was attracted to all the power that Nynaeve can throw around. Isn't she one of the most strong in the source?

 

I still want to know what Lan's going to say the first time he sees her after she left him on the edge of the world.

 

Maybe he'll take his ring back.

[Wonga]

Actually I agree with you OP. I think the relationship just kinda came out of nowhere. Sure there were little hints dropped along the way, a smile here, a blush there, something you could MAYBE... ALMOST... call flirting. But not quite.

 

But then at the end of TEotW Lan was all like "OMG I luv u so much Nynaeve, u r teh 1 4 me!" It seemed really out of character for him and very abrupt. They were already married in almost all but name at that point. Not to mention that marriage to LAN was one of the big factors in Nynaeve's accepted test in Book 2.

 

I dunno... maybe it was the 3 ta'veren in one place working their magic. Hmm?

 

Thankyou Xeonicus, you put it much more clearly than I have been.

 

Perhaps Nynaeve's little annoyances and flushes etc could be attributed to pride. Once you reach the end of TEotW it is clear that it isn't but until then...

 

I'm only halfway through GH so I won't comment on the rest.

[RobertAlexWillis]

Actually I agree with you OP. I think the relationship just kinda came out of nowhere. Sure there were little hints dropped along the way, a smile here, a blush there, something you could MAYBE... ALMOST... call flirting. But not quite.

 

But then at the end of TEotW Lan was all like "OMG I luv u so much Nynaeve, u r teh 1 4 me!" It seemed really out of character for him and very abrupt. They were already married in almost all but name at that point. Not to mention that marriage to LAN was one of the big factors in Nynaeve's accepted test in Book 2.

 

I dunno... maybe it was the 3 ta'veren in one place working their magic. Hmm?

 

For all the detail he includes, it is impossible for RJ to really convey the sense of how much time these people spend together. Lan and Nynaeve are together, travelling for months just in The Eye of the World. Plenty of time for lots of little things to happen, glances given, arms brushed, favors quietly done, all the little bonding things (no, not Warder bonding) that people do when they're getting and developing love for each other. Its not unrealistic at all, and it only seems abrupt because it has to be condensed into a book as one of many storylines.

[liatildina]

I agree that Lan and Nynaeve had plenty of time and opportunity to fall in love. It doesn't feel unrealistic or forced, and I don't believe it pops out of nowhere. The way Lan is, perhaps there is a presumption that someone like this would never fall for any one woman, and of course not Nynaeve. People can surprise you all the time about their choice in a partner. That's why the relationship is realistic. Lan just went for what he wanted, stretched his envelope to breaking no doubt, but I believe this relationship is what saved him after Moraine died, okay pretended to die.

[krislee]

They have a word for the "first love" in Malkier but I don't have New Spring with me here. She ended up dying in New Spring so she couldn't give the "leash" to Nynaeve. Oh and by the way the leash is symbolic (the hair cut on the day they are given the hadori is braided and given to their "first love" which is symbolic of their ownership of the person), and no it's not necessarily controlled like a dog, but it does denote ownership, and usually an older woman is given the braid. So really there is no way that they could be married under Malkier law, but I'm sure that they would be married under it considering that stuff happens, and if another man's first love had died before passing on the braid to the man's wife there would have been some contingency.

 

*** Spoilers for New Spring ***

 

The word is something like canieria. In New Spring Lan's first love didn't die. She (can't remember her name! Began with an E I think...) was going to give the braid/hair/'leash' to her daughter Ishelle iirc so that Lan would marry Ishelle and become the Queen of Malkier. Merean (BA) killed Ishelle, and the Prince Consort and his son Dyirk.

 

Lan then burnt his braid/hair/'leash' after he left the city just before Moiraine caught up with him and bonded him - something about '... thought the fire had the smell of burnt hair...'

 

Regards,

 

Kris.

[UrsulaLV]

Edeyn ti Gemallen Arrel, Lan's carniera (literally, "First"), his first lover - from http://www.ugcs.caltech.edu/~karlh/newspring/legends/alphafirst.html#E

[lelikaleli]

In what book (part 1 or 2?) they got married? I need to know as soon as possible, thanks in advance

[Jaglover]

7 hours ago, lelikaleli said:

In what book (part 1 or 2?) they got married? I need to know as soon as possible, thanks in advance

they got married in A Crown of Swords but the actual ceremony isn't on the page. 

[solarz]

On 9/26/2006 at 10:08 PM, Wonga said:

Perhaps I should have been clearer, I meant in the first book.

 

I first noticed the affection after Shadar Logoth, when Nynaeve was pissed about being noticed.

 

I saw Nynaeve being annoyed at being spotted, then Lan hesitating when they freed Perrin and Egwene. The next I know they're in the blight and announcing how much they love each other.

 

Maybe I'm just dense, there just seemed to be nothing before that. It seemed like RJ has thought 'oh, I need a relationship! Those two will do!'

 

I'll take your word for it about her growing on me...

 

(Bolds are edits.)

 

Sounds like you missed a lot of subtle hints about their growing attraction to each other.

 

My advice is to just take it in stride and keep reading. The Wheel of Time is not meant to be read just once. The Eye of the World, especially, is a pleasure to read the second time around. You will certainly pick up all the subtle hints then (and not just about Lan and Nynaeve!).

[Cheyboygan]

On 9/27/2006 at 5:12 AM, RJJT86 said:

Wow, hold on one second. Nobody "tamed" Lan. He is untamable. He's a lion who restrains himself, and if anyone, I repeat anyone tried to restrain him, they'd find their neck ripped out. That's who he is.

 

He may have willingly married Nynaeve, but don't think for a second that makes him tame. Not to mention that even after he married her, always longed to return to his fight. Even after he married her, even after he pledged his love, after he gave her his signet, after everything between them, his first love was his war against the shadow.

 

So what if she dropped him off at the edge of the world. That doesn't make her smart and in fact I thought it was rather childish of her, granted I liked her next idea to go and get him an army to fight for him. I'm pretty sure he thought he was going to hold Tarwin's Gap on his own, but that's just his stubborn pride and stubborn guilt (admirable qualities in thier own right).

 

Anyways end of the story is, yes in book one the development of thier relationship was a bit pushed. But I think at the same time it flowed well. I seriously doubt that RJ sat down and said I need a relationship. I'm pretty sure he just needed the mutual feelings established before the second book. And while I don't have my books with me I will say that I don't remember undying love being pledged up in the blight or the borderlands. I do remember the scene in Tear where he says, he'll be there to save her anytime. That would be the undying love pledge scene if ever there was one. Anywho I think it does take a long time to develop their relationship over several books worth of literature, so I'd say it's a decent one as stories go.

Childish of HER?  The man she loves is planning to run off to a completely pointless death and she is the childish one?  She accepted that she couldn't deny him his quest, but she transformed it from a suicide to something worthwhile.  I didn't like Nynaeve in the early books, but she developed into perhaps the most admirable person in the story. Her love and loyalty, not just to Lan but to Rand was inspiring.  

[Sabio]

Don't forget he is also her warder, it was rather childish of him to want to run off and die alone knowing the effect it would have on her.  Like Gawyn he was selfish with his thinking he had to do something grand all alone without regards to who it might hurt.

[Kelsey]

I think something to keep in mind with the entire series is this: for hundreds of years the strongest united power (under the light) has been the white tower. Women. They have spent all that time with the responsibilities of the world. Weather they were wisdoms, unknowingly channelers or queens, nearly the whole culture was woman with authority. Their equals in the power (male channelers)  were extremely dangerous so they (the woman channelers) delt with them in the best way they could think of. The entire culture of the world was women pulling strings, woman passing judgment and woman in authority. It’s evident from the very beginning with the woman’s circle in Emond’s Field. Nearly every single woman in that series was feisty. So yes, most woman were used to that authority. It annoyed me at first before I thought of this. And later in the books they all vastly improve. But that is probably why they kept complaining about the boys their own age being wool headed fools. 

[Kelsey]

I think something to keep in mind with the entire series is this: for hundreds of years the strongest united power (under the light) has been the white tower. Women. They have spent all that time with the responsibilities of the world. Weather they were wisdoms, unknowingly channelers or queens, nearly the whole culture was woman with authority. Their equals in the power (male channelers)  were extremely dangerous so they (the woman channelers) delt with them in the best way they could think of. The entire culture of the world was women pulling strings, woman passing judgment and woman in authority. It’s evident from the very beginning with the woman’s circle in Emond’s Field. Nearly every single woman in that series was feisty. So yes, most woman were used to that authority. It annoyed me at first before I thought of this. And later in the books they all vastly improve. But that is probably why they kept complaining about the boys their own age being wool headed fools.