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All right, so I'm about a 1/3 of the way through The Dragon Reborn. My first reread of the series in easily over 5 years. Here's some thoughts:

 

1. "he...shall slay his people with the sword of peace, and destroy them with the leaf."

 

Sword of peace can mean the Dragon's Peace - as per Aviendha's terangeal vision. Either way, I think "destroy them with the leaf' probably refers to the fact that the Aiel once followed the way of the leaf. I think that whatever, magic, ceremony, whatever that used to be used to make the land fertile will be found again. I think their blood is connected to it and I think it's a possibility that they will have to take up the way of the leaf again, thus destroying present day aiel culture.

 

2. Perrin's going to speak in high chant - that's foreshadowed by Leane (I believe) saying at her first meeting with Perrin in book two something along the lines of "Next, he'll wear a crown and speak in high chant." Min sees the crown in her vision and trees in book one. I think Perrin's somehow connected with making the land fertile again and the song that the Tinkers have been looking for. He's been connected with Tinkers and Wolves from book one. He's struggled with being a ferocious warrior and someone who mends and creates since book one. I think his big deal will be to heal the land.

 

Thoughts, comments, snacks, hor dourves?

 

Honestly I think that the 'Sword of Peace' is a figurative thing, literally meaning the discovery that they were and were always meant to be a peaceful people, that the realization of such a fundamental truth would cut them figuratively like a sword would literally and 'slay them' as a people by robbing them of their cultural identity.

 

I personally believe that Perrin's purpose in this book will largely manifest itself as handling the dream world side of the battle. Now whether that's just a means of protecting Rand's flank or if it in turn offers a way to outflank the DO who knows, but I don't think he's going to have any direct involvement with the discovery of the Song or anything like that.

 

Of course, my opinions are no better than anyone else's - and more often than not, end up being worse.

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All right, so I'm about a 1/3 of the way through The Dragon Reborn. My first reread of the series in easily over 5 years. Here's some thoughts:

 

1. "he...shall slay his people with the sword of peace, and destroy them with the leaf."

 

Sword of peace can mean the Dragon's Peace - as per Aviendha's terangeal vision. Either way, I think "destroy them with the leaf' probably refers to the fact that the Aiel once followed the way of the leaf. I think that whatever, magic, ceremony, whatever that used to be used to make the land fertile will be found again. I think their blood is connected to it and I think it's a possibility that they will have to take up the way of the leaf again, thus destroying present day aiel culture.

 

2. Perrin's going to speak in high chant - that's foreshadowed by Leane (I believe) saying at her first meeting with Perrin in book two something along the lines of "Next, he'll wear a crown and speak in high chant." Min sees the crown in her vision and trees in book one. I think Perrin's somehow connected with making the land fertile again and the song that the Tinkers have been looking for. He's been connected with Tinkers and Wolves from book one. He's struggled with being a ferocious warrior and someone who mends and creates since book one. I think his big deal will be to heal the land.

 

Thoughts, comments, snacks, hor dourves?

 

Honestly I think that the 'Sword of Peace' is a figurative thing, literally meaning the discovery that they were and were always meant to be a peaceful people, that the realization of such a fundamental truth would cut them figuratively like a sword would literally and 'slay them' as a people by robbing them of their cultural identity.

 

I personally believe that Perrin's purpose in this book will largely manifest itself as handling the dream world side of the battle. Now whether that's just a means of protecting Rand's flank or if it in turn offers a way to outflank the DO who knows, but I don't think he's going to have any direct involvement with the discovery of the Song or anything like that.

 

Of course, my opinions are no better than anyone else's - and more often than not, end up being worse.

 

Hahaha! Yeah, I think the dreamworld is definitely his deal. He's stronger than Egwene there and she's stonger than the Wise Ones, so he's the dream master for the good guys. I wonder if he'll lead the wolves in the dream?????????

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That's all we know, certainly, but there is speculation that they may be Calian and Shivan, the heralds of a New Age:

 

http://encyclopaedia..._of_valere.html

 

And down the clouds they rode.. the dead heroes of legend.. Artur Hawkwing himself.. Shivan the Hunter behind his black mask.. said to herald the end of Ages, the destruction of what had been and the birth of what was to be, he and his sister Calian, called the Chooser, who rode red-masked at his side..

 

(I'm also reminded of this:

"Twice dawns the day when his blood is shed.

Once for mourning, once for birth.")

 

While it is true that Elayne is only an estimated 5 months into her pregnancy, Terez has drawn our attention to this little slice of mythology:

 

http://www.lifeasmyt...BoannDagda.html

 

All night long Dagda and Boann played at lovemaking and by sunrise, she carried the promise of a child inside her. Fearing the retaliation of Nuada, Dagda found a way to conceal the pregnancy. He took out his magic harp and played. His music so bewitched Time and Space that they refused to move forward, choosing instead to remain with the lovers and spiral around them unceasingly. In this way, nine months expired in the Otherworld, while in the mortal world, only one day actually passed.

 

Perhaps we may see Elayne completing her pregnancy in T'a'R, and the twins growing up there!

 

Sorry to quote myself, but this came up in another thread:

 

I wonder if human Blight dwellers will be as physically corrupted by the Blight as ever other living thing is.

 

I recall someone once mentioning it is taboo for pregnant women to enter the Blight. Interesting to wonder what form the corruption might take after 150 generations.

 

I'm expecting Hanlon/Mellar to have another go at Elayne. Maybe this might be why. She'd have to be rescued via T'A'R, but before she actually arrives in the Blight, since there's no direct connection.

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The subject of 'rifts in the Pattern' came up in another thread:

 

http://www.oocities.org/area51/stargate/8513/creator-horn.htm

 

Q: "Then what happens if the Dragon and the banner are on opposite sides of the conflict from whoever sounds the horn?"

A:  "Then we get a [rift] in the Pattern."  [1] (This elicited a _pronounced_ Startled Moment from Harriet, which I took at the time to express the same reaction as me--"A *WHAT*?!?"--but which Kevin told me later he interpreted to be more along the lines of "I can't believe you're telling them that!" It could, of course, mean

something entirely different.) At this point, part of my mind was running wild down paths about the Dark One and potential entrances into the Pattern..

 

So I started wondering about vacuoles. From EncWoT:

 

A vacuole is a bubble of space and time that is separate from the Pattern. Time can run much faster or slower than normal in a vacuole. Vacuoles were studied during the Age of Legends, but were never fully understood. If a vacuole breaks loose, something which can happen randomly, it and its contents are lost forever. (ACoS,Ch25)

 

Lost, perhaps, but destroyed? Maybe not.

 

Perhaps (if RJ was actually being serious) the situation given would indeed cause a rift and create a vacuole surrounding the participants - Dragon, Heroes, and all. Possibly this vacuole would give rise to a linear timestream detached from the Wheel..

 

..just freewheeling here....

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I've read every post in this thread now and I love what a lot of you guys are saying but noone has mentioned the red veiled aiel that were seen in ToM and what part of AMoL they might have

Edited by Drawwod

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Question: Does anybody know if what happens in a vacuole affects the threads of the pattern? On one hand it would seem not to but on the other how wouldn't it?

Example: If you take someone into a vacuole and balefire them does it affect the threads?

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Hi all!

 

New to this forum however was a member on 'the old forum'. Coming back to see the end of the series - it's been a couple of years now...

 

What Mat's up to? Let me guess:

 

He puts on his hat and walk through the city towards the palace - knowing he will be recognized....

Probably not long before he will have an escort of soldiers, at the end probably by Deathwatch Guards.

He will seak out Galgan challenging him to explain why he is hiring assassins. (Though Tuon already knows this - this is just part of the 'Seanchan game of house' I think..?).

There has been quite a few talks about the organized duels in this chapter so my bet is a duel between Galgan and Mat. I wonder who wins...?

However I do not think Galgan will die. I am more convinced that Galgan at the end will agree on Mat being overall commander of all troups against the Shadow. Mat needs Galgan, a competent general, to lead Seanchan troups but under his command as he will have to be Rands Grand Commander for all forces against the Shadow in the Last Battle.

 

That is IF Tuon/Fortuona will agree on Mat's plans, and even more if she will be talked in to letting Mat go again now when she has him in her grasp. Maybe with a 'suitable' number of Deathwatch Guards (with Kadere..?) to come with him as protection..?

 

Anyway - we'll see the end of it in a couple of months. It's been a loooong ride....

 

Cheers!

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I've read every post in this thread now and I love what a lot of you guys are saying but noone has mentioned the red veiled aiel that were seen in ToM and what part of AMoL they might have

 

There are a couple of threads about those. Here's one:

 

http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/53312-the-aiel-thing-in-the-epilogue/

 

Though perhaps that should now be moved to this board!

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2. Perrin's going to speak in high chant - that's foreshadowed by Leane (I believe) saying at her first meeting with Perrin in book two something along the lines of "Next, he'll wear a crown and speak in high chant." Min sees the crown in her vision and trees in book one. I think Perrin's somehow connected with making the land fertile again and the song that the Tinkers have been looking for. He's been connected with Tinkers and Wolves from book one. He's struggled with being a ferocious warrior and someone who mends and creates since book one. I think his big deal will be to heal the land.

 

Thoughts, comments, snacks, hor dourves?

I seem to remmember Min having a viewing of Perrin about trees blooming/growing. It might be all the way back to where Rand first meets her in Baerlon though. If not, maybe its in the Dragon Camp at the start of tDR before Rand leaves for Tear.

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2. Perrin's going to speak in high chant - that's foreshadowed by Leane (I believe) saying at her first meeting with Perrin in book two something along the lines of "Next, he'll wear a crown and speak in high chant." Min sees the crown in her vision and trees in book one. I think Perrin's somehow connected with making the land fertile again and the song that the Tinkers have been looking for. He's been connected with Tinkers and Wolves from book one. He's struggled with being a ferocious warrior and someone who mends and creates since book one. I think his big deal will be to heal the land.

 

Thoughts, comments, snacks, hor dourves?

I seem to remmember Min having a viewing of Perrin about trees blooming/growing. It might be all the way back to where Rand first meets her in Baerlon though. If not, maybe its in the Dragon Camp at the start of tDR before Rand leaves for Tear.

 

It was indeed - in EotW15, Rand talking to Min in the 'Stag and Lion' in Baerlon.

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Said it before but might as well throw it in here.

 

The Dark One can possess True Power users, Rand will instigate this and plan to die while possessed, thus weakening the Dark One enough to ensure he wont strike again while the the Pattern is fixed. Narishma, Alivia and Nynaeve will link with Callandor, with Alivia in control, and they will kill Rand while he is possessed. Then Nynaeve will take over the circle and do the Hundred Weaves augmented by Callandor, thus mending the thinness of the Pattern at Shayol Ghul. The end.

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Said it before but might as well throw it in here.

 

The Dark One can possess True Power users, Rand will instigate this and plan to die while possessed, thus weakening the Dark One enough to ensure he wont strike again while the the Pattern is fixed. Narishma, Alivia and Nynaeve will link with Callandor, with Alivia in control, and they will kill Rand while he is possessed. Then Nynaeve will take over the circle and do the Hundred Weaves augmented by Callandor, thus mending the thinness of the Pattern at Shayol Ghul. The end.

 

Nice!

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Min is the Pattern, more precisely it's direct avatar. She is of course completely unaware of it, but whenever the Pattern needs something to happen, she's the one that ends up on the scene - saving Rand's life long enough for Lanfear to show up in TGH, breaking the Tower then rescuing Siuan and Logain in TSR, and then keeping Rand sane. Her visions are a side effect of being the Pattern.

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Min is the Pattern, more precisely it's direct avatar. She is of course completely unaware of it, but whenever the Pattern needs something to happen, she's the one that ends up on the scene - saving Rand's life long enough for Lanfear to show up in TGH, breaking the Tower then rescuing Siuan and Logain in TSR, and then keeping Rand sane. Her visions are a side effect of being the Pattern.

 

I have no idea what the implications of that would be, or if it even works story wise, but that would be unbelievably awesome. Maybe a little late in the series for such a revelation, but still, would be fun.

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Did  RJ ever say for certain Mat was Aemon?

 

No but he didn't have to.

The evidence from his vision/memory upon waking up from his cleansing in tDR is pretty leading.

BS confirmed that Mat is either Aemon reborn or at the very least, a direct descendant of his.

And only being a direct descendant doesn't jive with Mat having so specific a memory and from what we know, that is much more of a reborn thing than a passed on through relatives thing.

Edited by Finnssss

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