The Seven Striped-Lass

[Terez]

The medallion is only a means of protection in the hands of someone who is skilled enough to use it.

What is your point? Mat has two choices: leave the medallion with her so that she has a chance in hell, or do nothing. It's clear from this chapter that he will not choose the latter. He might give it to Birgitte, even, but he will leave it for the purpose of protecting Elayne.

[Shard]

The medallion is only a means of protection in the hands of someone who is skilled enough to use it.

What is your point? Mat has two choices: leave the medallion with her so that she has a chance in hell, or do nothing. It's clear from this chapter that he will not choose the latter. He might give it to Birgitte, even, but he will leave it for the purpose of protecting Elayne.

 

Yeah even I had to admit that it looks like that is what will happen, unless he manages to kill it before leaving for ToG.

[Terez]

The medallion is only a means of protection in the hands of someone who is skilled enough to use it.

What is your point? Mat has two choices: leave the medallion with her so that she has a chance in hell, or do nothing. It's clear from this chapter that he will not choose the latter. He might give it to Birgitte, even, but he will leave it for the purpose of protecting Elayne.

 

Yeah even I had to admit that it looks like that is what will happen, unless he manages to kill it before leaving for ToG.

And from the prophecy about the two Aes Sedai on a balance scale, one against the other, it seems unlikely he will kill it. Also from the heavy importance placed on Mat learning that the gholam is in Caemlyn. Why is that knowledge so pivotal?

[Majsju]

The medallion is only a means of protection in the hands of someone who is skilled enough to use it.

What is your point? Mat has two choices: leave the medallion with her so that she has a chance in hell, or do nothing. It's clear from this chapter that he will not choose the latter. He might give it to Birgitte, even, but he will leave it for the purpose of protecting Elayne.

 

it does not matter if he gives the medallion to Elayne or not, she would not have a chance in hell anyway. She could have a dozen medallions, and still not have a chance in hell. In case you have forgotten, the medallion does not instantly kill the Gholam on contact, it only hurts it. And from the looks of it, it was mostly shock over having been hurts that made the Gholam run away, rather than any unbearable pain that would stop it from keep fighting. Only difference it would make is that Mat would lose his medallion, just when he has found out that the forsaken have started to take an interest in seeing him dead.

The smart thing to do (and Mat is a pretty bright lad, even if he likes to pretend he is not) would be for Mat to warn Elayne about the Gholam being in Caemlyn, then talk to Birgitte about it, convincing her to make sure there is always a channeler close to Elayne, ready to open a gateway at the first sign of trouble. Then Mat can take his medallion and head for the TOG, trying to lure the Gholam away from Caemlyn since it was him it followed in the first place.

 

 

Giving Elayne the medallion for protectoion against the Gholam would be about as useful as giving Min Callandor for protection against a forsaken.

[Terez]

The medallion is only a means of protection in the hands of someone who is skilled enough to use it.

What is your point? Mat has two choices: leave the medallion with her so that she has a chance in hell, or do nothing. It's clear from this chapter that he will not choose the latter. He might give it to Birgitte, even, but he will leave it for the purpose of protecting Elayne.

 

it does not matter if he gives the medallion to Elayne or not

It probably matters a great deal, actually.

 

Mat would lose his medallion, just when he has found out that the forsaken have started to take an interest in seeing him dead.

I think you sell Mat short, here. He has often shown in the past that he is willing to risk his own hide to save one of those girls from danger, and he knows that gholam wants Elayne dead. Warning her about the gholam wouldn't help in the slightest. There is only one thing that can hurt it.

[DottieGirl]

What if Mat used the medallion to make, I dunno, say... a soup? And what if he poured said soup onto the gholam? Maybe Mat carries the soup in a flask and does spit-takes when the baddies show up? Maybe the gholam melts. Maybe the gholam doesn't like Mat's cooking. These ideas have possibilities :)

 

Woof™.

I like this idea...except instead of a soup, Mat should mix the melted medallion in with a pool of fresh blood. Then, as it feeds, it gets poisoned/burned on the inside and dies from indigestion ;)

 

Seriously, I like the Mat kills the gholam theory. I wouldn't like Elayne's or even Avi's chances against it, maybe not even Birgitte. Mat has the most combat experience against the thing of anyone alive, he is uncommonly lucky, and he has an ax to grind with it. It has nearly killed him a couple of times and, more importantly, threatened and killed those he cares about. I think the role Elayne would play, if any, is to fashion a weapon with medallion-like qualities. I'd like to see if the gholam could take a spear or sword blow from a medallion like weapon without serious internal injuries (burning etc).

[algspkr]

What if Mat used the medallion to make, I dunno, say... a soup? And what if he poured said soup onto the gholam? Maybe Mat carries the soup in a flask and does spit-takes when the baddies show up? Maybe the gholam melts. Maybe the gholam doesn't like Mat's cooking. These ideas have possibilities :)

 

Woof™.

I like this idea...except instead of a soup, Mat should mix the melted medallion in with a pool of fresh blood. Then, as it feeds, it gets poisoned/burned on the inside and dies from indigestion ;)

 

Seriously, I like the Mat kills the gholam theory. I wouldn't like Elayne's or even Avi's chances against it, maybe not even Birgitte. Mat has the most combat experience against the thing of anyone alive, he is uncommonly lucky, and he has an ax to grind with it. It has nearly killed him a couple of times and, more importantly, threatened and killed those he cares about. I think the role Elayne would play, if any, is to fashion a weapon with medallion-like qualities. I'd like to see if the gholam could take a spear or sword blow from a medallion like weapon without serious internal injuries (burning etc).

 

I don't see that working as it is the medallion's ter'angreal properties that hurt the gholam and I would be surprised if the silver remained a ter'angreal after being melted down.

 

I also don't think Mat will leave the medallion behind. I do believe that he intends to deal the the gholam before leaving Caemlyn:

 

Mat removed a hand from his pocket, feeling at the foxhead medallion, resting—as always—against his chest. He was tired of running from that monster. A plan started to form in his mind, accompanied by the rattling of dice. He tried to banish the image of the Queen lying in bonds Mat himself had tied, her head ripped free. There would have been so much blood. The gholam lived on fresh blood.

[Slick Mongoose]

But Elayne has a talent for recreating ter'angreal, and surely that's building up to something bigger than just making those rings for Tel'aran'rhiod. I'm hoping she does manage to at least copy it.

[subwoofer]

And Elayne is supposed to be a good cook too! Ter'angreal soup!

 

Woof™.

[DottieGirl]

But Elayne has a talent for recreating ter'angreal, and surely that's building up to something bigger than just making those rings for Tel'aran'rhiod. I'm hoping she does manage to at least copy it.

Exactly what I think. I would count on Elayne's abilities to fashion a ter'angreal weapon or something of the sort by copying Mat's foxhead, not destroying it. Whether or not that bears on Mat's plans, I'm not sure. Maybe Mat's idea is to lead the gholam off after him as he goes to the Tower, as others have suggested. But I still think he intends to try and kill it.

[Majsju]

The medallion is only a means of protection in the hands of someone who is skilled enough to use it.

What is your point? Mat has two choices: leave the medallion with her so that she has a chance in hell, or do nothing. It's clear from this chapter that he will not choose the latter. He might give it to Birgitte, even, but he will leave it for the purpose of protecting Elayne.

 

it does not matter if he gives the medallion to Elayne or not

It probably matters a great deal, actually.

 

Oh right, when Elayne turns into a superninja who can easily spank the naughty Gholam into submission.

 

Mat would lose his medallion, just when he has found out that the forsaken have started to take an interest in seeing him dead.

I think you sell Mat short, here. He has often shown in the past that he is willing to risk his own hide to save one of those girls from danger, and he knows that gholam wants Elayne dead. Warning her about the gholam wouldn't help in the slightest. There is only one thing that can hurt it.

 

Willing to risk his life when there is a chance at success is one thing. Doing it when there is zero chance of success, that is just idiotic. And, Mat would not only risk his own life by giving Elayne the medallion, he would put her at greater risk, because she might very well try to put up a fight instead of opening a gateway and getting the hell out of there.

 

Keep in mind that RJ tried to keep things fairly realistic. can you honestly say that you really believe that someone like Elayne, a little girl with no training in hand-to hand combat, with no experience in fighting without using OP could destroy a Gholam, a creature stronger, faster and a lot harder to kill than any normal man?

 

Try to ignore your little pet theory about gawyn killing rand, and look at this again. Might be a revelation for you ;)

[DottieGirl]

But surely Elayne would be safe because her unborn children will be born healthy, right? Seriously, Elayne would be dead meat. She didn't really put up a fight against it in Ebou Dar, even when she could channel regularly. Yes, I know that you can't channel directly against the gholam, but now she couldn't even necessarily muster defensive/delaying weaves to escape. Now that she's knocked up, boy oh boy, she'd be in trouble. Maybe she could mood swing the gholam to death, or send it out for a craving she suddenly had.

[Shard]

The medallion is only a means of protection in the hands of someone who is skilled enough to use it.

What is your point? Mat has two choices: leave the medallion with her so that she has a chance in hell, or do nothing. It's clear from this chapter that he will not choose the latter. He might give it to Birgitte, even, but he will leave it for the purpose of protecting Elayne.

 

it does not matter if he gives the medallion to Elayne or not

It probably matters a great deal, actually.

 

Oh right, when Elayne turns into a superninja who can easily spank the naughty Gholam into submission.

 

Mat would lose his medallion, just when he has found out that the forsaken have started to take an interest in seeing him dead.

I think you sell Mat short, here. He has often shown in the past that he is willing to risk his own hide to save one of those girls from danger, and he knows that gholam wants Elayne dead. Warning her about the gholam wouldn't help in the slightest. There is only one thing that can hurt it.

 

Willing to risk his life when there is a chance at success is one thing. Doing it when there is zero chance of success, that is just idiotic. And, Mat would not only risk his own life by giving Elayne the medallion, he would put her at greater risk, because she might very well try to put up a fight instead of opening a gateway and getting the hell out of there.

 

Keep in mind that RJ tried to keep things fairly realistic. can you honestly say that you really believe that someone like Elayne, a little girl with no training in hand-to hand combat, with no experience in fighting without using OP could destroy a Gholam, a creature stronger, faster and a lot harder to kill than any normal man?

 

Try to ignore your little pet theory about gawyn killing rand, and look at this again. Might be a revelation for you ;)

 

The Problem Majsju is that Mat is willing to rush into a burning building to save people, the Gholam isn't after him it's after Elyane. He doesn't need the Medallion she does, I also think that tFoH showed us that the Forsaken would be able to work around the Medallion since Mat was wearing it when he was blasted by lighting and killed. Please pay attention to that last sentence Terez and why it's ludicrus for Rand to lose.

 

It is in Mat's character to take risks especially ones that risk his own skin, none of the Forsaken know that he is going to ToG soon, they are gunning for him but it seems Elayne is the higher priority.

 

The Madallion will do little good against Channlers that can bring down lighting, fling stone and earth. Also as Terez pointed out Brigitte can wield the Madallion. It may even be possible for Elayne to copy the Madallion as well.

[Terez]

Please pay attention to that last sentence Terez and why it's ludicrus for Rand to lose.

Apparently, you are the one not paying attention.

[Sid]

I still believe the theory on 13th Depository about Perrin's wolf dream with the windows in the sky, which says that Mat will be naked and bound with his ashandarei behind his arms and wearing only his foxhead medallion around his neck, and meaning it will occur while he's in Finn-land. This is due to the fact that they are both direct gifts from them and they will not go back on their word and steal them back from him, though they might take everything else he has with him (even his hat!). actually I'd love to see an Indiana Jones type scene where Mat reaches back for his hat while he's making some terrific escape.

 

If he does in fact bring the medallion with him to Ghenji, then either he or someone else kills the Gholam before he leaves, he gets the Gholam to follow him somehow, or he lets Elayne study and copy it. He may offer it to her, and in exchange for letting her study it Elayne starts making some of the Dragon materials available to him and Aludra. Or, in thanks for him saving her life (again) she gets the Dragon project rolling. This may prompt Norry to actually pull multiple sheets of paper from his folder that he carries around. (faint in disbelief)

[Terez]

Pretty sure that one was fulfilled when Mat was hanged. He wasn't naked, but Perrin's visions are rarely all that literal.

[DemandredFO]

How can anyone expect Elayne to copy the Medallion when she's pregnant and didn't even copy the sleep weavers exactly right. With the help of Setalle Anan(healed) and demane that make adam, she might be able to figure out what she's doing but not alone. Probably only Mat(Taveren and memories) Rand and the Foresaken(AoL channelers could survive an encounter with the Gholam. I doubt Birgitte could.

[Sid]

Pretty sure that one was fulfilled when Mat was hanged. He wasn't naked, but Perrin's visions are rarely all that literal.

I guess I was under the impression that his vision was about the future, not what already happened in the past.

[Ataxia]

Pretty sure that one was fulfilled when Mat was hanged. He wasn't naked, but Perrin's visions are rarely all that literal.

 

Mat stood naked and bound, snarling; an odd spear with a black shaft had been thrust across his back behind his elbows, and a silver medallion, a foxhead, hung on his chest.

 

Is that the one you were talking about? He wasnt standing, he was hanging. He had clothes on and wasnt snarling. He was dying. This one implies that he is captured. Maybe his dreams arent that literal, but I dont its going to be that different. Also, Egwene dreamed of the hanging. Have they had overlapping dreams before?

Anyways, back on topic...

 

I like the idea of Tomas arriving. When Lan was doing his march to Myrell; he didnt try to kill himself, but he didnt avoid a fight either. I almost feel thats how Tomas is now. He knows he has a mission to accomplish but cant be bothered by things like bandits or pestering guards. I just really hope it isn't Olver.

[Wrane Latrobe]

The Annoying One has the dagger that hides you from shadowspawn's eyes. because of this I feel the golum has to be hunting Mat.

[algspkr]

Pretty sure that one was fulfilled when Mat was hanged. He wasn't naked, but Perrin's visions are rarely all that literal.

 

Mat stood naked and bound, snarling; an odd spear with a black shaft had been thrust across his back behind his elbows, and a silver medallion, a foxhead, hung on his chest.

 

Is that the one you were talking about? He wasnt standing, he was hanging. He had clothes on and wasnt snarling. He was dying. This one implies that he is captured. Maybe his dreams arent that literal, but I dont its going to be that different. Also, Egwene dreamed of the hanging. Have they had overlapping dreams before?

Anyways, back on topic...

 

I like the idea of Tomas arriving. When Lan was doing his march to Myrell; he didnt try to kill himself, but he didnt avoid a fight either. I almost feel thats how Tomas is now. He knows he has a mission to accomplish but cant be bothered by things like bandits or pestering guards. I just really hope it isn't Olver.

 

I'm pretty sure that was just Mat being reluctant to follow the path the wheel has decided that he should follow.

[Terez]

Pretty sure that one was fulfilled when Mat was hanged. He wasn't naked, but Perrin's visions are rarely all that literal.

I guess I was under the impression that his vision was about the future, not what already happened in the past.

Mat entered the doorway on day 442 of the series. Perrin had his dream on day 443. Mat was hanging on the tree from the time he came out (whenever that was) until day 448.

[Sid]

Pretty sure that one was fulfilled when Mat was hanged. He wasn't naked, but Perrin's visions are rarely all that literal.

I guess I was under the impression that his vision was about the future, not what already happened in the past.

Mat entered the doorway on day 442 of the series. Perrin had his dream on day 443. Mat was hanging on the tree from the time he came out (whenever that was) until day 448.

I'm afraid you've mixed up Perrin's "Mat flips a coin, chooses a fork in the road and suddenly has his hat and ashandarei" dream that occurs on day 443 with his "Naked and bound" dream I was referring to which he has on day 463.

[Terez]

Indeed. It could refer to Tylin. ;)

[Sid]

Indeed. It could refer to Tylin. ;)

You know, I thought that too on my first readthrough. But when I read it again later, the vision's description doesn't match any of the Mat and Tylin scenes we either saw outright or were eluded to later. I know for sure the ashandarei wasn't ever mentioned, and if he was bound he probably wasn't standing either. IIRC he still had a scarf on too. I do remember him thinking something like 'fat lot of good the medallion had done for him' in that situation though :lol:

 

regardless, I still think he's taking the medallion with him to the tower