Channeling oddity in tGS Chapter 7 - significant?

[tomfeltes]

I noted this the first time I read tGS (day of release, natch!), but figured surely someone else would spot it and raise a discussion and I could see what the community made of it without having to slink out of my shadowy, darkened, lurker's corner.  Just re-read the book, went on a search and still nothing out there that I can find, so here goes:

 

Chapter 7 "The Plan for Arad Doman" - Nynaeve POV.  From inside, Nyn sees Cads go by and wants to know what she's doing.  Nyn goes outside and looks around to see which way Cads went.  "She sensed channeling in the northeast."  She goes that way, soon finds a larger Aiel tent at the corner of the green.  Going in, she sees Rand and Bashere studying maps, Min in the corner.  After conversing with Rand, Nyn sits. "Suddenly, she sat upright.  Cadsuane.  The woman wasn't there; besides guards, the tent contained only Rand, Nynaeve, Min and Bashere.  Was she off planning something that Nynaeve-".  At that moment, Cads comes into the tent with Corele and the chapter proceeds.

 

So what channeling did Nyn sense that drew her to the tent?  I don't think it's Saidin by Rand, via her Terangreal - that would've been noted.  If Saidar, then who's channeling?  Where were Cads and Corele before they came in?  They had been ahead of Nyn, supposedly on their way to meet with Rand, so why did they show up *after* Nyn.  Were they channeling on the far side of the tent, listening in on Rand, Bashere and Min before coming in? 

 

Especially after re-reading this, it seems like there is a subtle emphasis made on the fact that Nyn was originally pursuing Cads, got distracted by Rand, suddenly starts to remember her purpose and how she got there, but then things shift away again. I especially noted the part that seems to emphasize “the tent contained only…”.  It’s enough to make me feel there might be some significance here – although I haven’t a clue what it could be about.  Thoughts, anyone?

 

[jemron]

Interesting.  Are you suggesting that Nynaeve may have been distracted because she was compelled at some point previously, similar to when she and the Super Girls were compelled by Moggy in TSR?  Or are you just suggesting that maybe Cads et al. were up to something fishy like spying on Rand and friends, but then when they discovered Nynaeve was in proximity, they stopped channeling and just decided to show up in the tent?

 

Either way, I don't remember the exact details of this, but I wonder if it has something to do with what happened to Rand later (Domination Band).

[DocBean]

Maybe they were linking before going in to meet Rand, as a precaution.

They could have inverted it before coming in to see Rand so he wouldn't know.

 

I wonder if he could sense an inverted weave...

 

 

I think I remember an oddity about that scene too, but it's been a while since I read it.

I assumed that she sensed Cadsuane channeling which told her where to go, but Cadsuane went and rounded up the other sister before coming in.

 

 

[Luckers]

This is a really good question.

 

I got nothing.

[Sharaman]

I thought twas Cad-Corele eavesdropping / guarding a conversation between themselves by warding.

But I'll read this again cause it's interesting that Brandon makes a point of it and it doesn't come up again.

But like Noal's unexplained absence in CoT, somehow.

 

[Charlz Guybon]

I assumed the traveling tent was in that direction and she felt the Aiel arrive.

[yoniy0]

First guess, before rereading that scene (which I'm going to do now that you brought this up), Nyneave's going into the tent and remembering Cadsuane only after several minutes have passed is an indication that it wasn't channeling that made her go into the tent (yes, she started on that direction because she felt channeling, but she later encountered the tent and decided to go in). If she would have felt channeling from inside the tent and then only find Rand, Min and Bashere inside - I would have expected her to notice the oddity. So, it's either something very mundane or very fishy indeed.

 

As a side note, you can't sense someone eavesdropping unless they themselves are very close to you. That's the reason you have to be warding against it to detect an attempt.

[Crael123]

This is a really good question.

 

I got nothing.

 

shit man me 2.. that is a really good point

[Sentinel78]

Good question.  The simplest explanation is that the channeling was further in the direction Nynaeve was headed when she got to the tent.  Rand would also have felt it if it was close, although he wouldn't be able to detect its location.  If he suddenly got goosebumps with no obvious female channelers around it would raise his suspicions. 

 

Follow-up question:  What does detecting channeling in the Northeast mean?  Specifically, does that mean (1) the female channeler is in the Northeast, or (2) that the female channeler could theoretically be anywhere and is simply directing weaves to a location Northeast of Nynaeve? 

[bobothebarbarian]

Cads might have opened a gateway to get Corele before going in  to the tent

[tomfeltes]

So, it's either something very mundane or very fishy indeed.

That was my sense as well.  I hadn't considered the possibility of Compulsion, which would imply BA/FS involvement, but I definitely could not say to what purpose.  There seemed to be no direct link drawn from this to the Domination Band scene.  In general, my thought is that there is an awful lot of care taken in the details of the series (by RJ/BS and all), so if this was something mundane - e.g. the Traveling tent was NE beyond Rand's tent, or there were sisters practicing weaves on the far side, or Cads fetching Corele via Gateway - it would have been clarified.  What got me was the lack of any such clarification, which makes me think something fishy was happening.  Maybe Cads trying to eavesdrop, but that seems relatively mundane to me at this point too (seems like many AS try it, so much so they regularly weave a ward against it for private conversations).  So if it's nothing, it feels like a (slight) mis-step.

If she would have felt channeling from inside the tent and then only find Rand, Min and Bashere inside - I would have expected her to notice the oddity.

...it's interesting that Brandon makes a point of it and it doesn't come up again.

And I think she started to make note of the oddity, then Cads and Corele enter the tent and her attention (and the narrative) veers off from the thought.  Looking at it that way, it feels (to me) like an intentional [glow=red,2,300]"HEY! TAKE NOTE!"[/glow] from the author(s).

 

Or maybe I'm just looking for stuff  :D

[Owayn The Traveller]

Very interesting. Does sound bit bit like compulsion. I think the gathering storm is due a reread, again. Twice I have read it now and it looking like once more. Has anyone read it more than twice yet because I' presuming ye all have read it twice. Once to get to the end and twice to savour it.

[DocBean]

Very interesting. Does sound bit bit like compulsion. I think the gathering storm is due a reread, again. Twice I have read it now and it looking like once more. Has anyone read it more than twice yet because I' presuming ye all have read it twice. Once to get to the end and twice to savour it.

 

I did a different method.

I read it slowly to savour it.

 

but as I was reading it, I listened to each chapter I had already read on audio book the next day at work.

so I was doing a second read through while reading it the first time.

[Owayn The Traveller]

God I couldn't get away with that at work. I'd be shot. :D So I just called in a few sick days. Had an awful flu for three days  *winks* *elbow nudge* *gets carried away*

[yoniy0]

Has anyone read it more than twice yet because I' presuming ye all have read it twice.

I didn't read the whole thing a second time. The way I do my rereads, I pick favorite chapters and read them again. Then after a time I get bored, and my selections change. That way, in the end, I've read the entire book several times. Does screw a little bit with my perception of chronology, but what can you do?

[Owayn The Traveller]

I have been doing that lately with lord of chaos.

[nojnomad]

Ok so i see no satisfactory answers to this question.

 

I have two guesses.

1. Bashere is a female forsaken masquerading...

2. Cad used the light bending trick because she wanted to be the last to enter the tent and she know that Nynaeve was following her...

[Val Mickey]

Nynaeve's ter'angreal cannot differentiate betweeen saidar and saidin, can it?

[AnthonyJamesEnglish]

Well we know that there were BA in rands group and we also know that Grendal was in the area too so i wouldn't be surprised if it was either of the two trying to sneak a listen in though i would lean closer to the BA.

 

And i can't see Cads listening in, if she wanted to know what was said she would simply walk right in without issue.

[WhiskyJack]

Wise ones?

[NetSlider]

Yeah, this is interesting and it does look and sounds like a hint or foreshadowing.....Wise Ones might have something to do with it. I always wonder about Wise Ones though b/c it's one group that we see a lot of but not from their POV; I mean the ones that are with Rand (or at least I don't remember one of hand). All and all, Wise Ones deserve their name fully be it for the good or the bed - we never know what they are thinking.

[Sharaman]

Nynaeve's ter'angreal cannot differentiate betweeen saidar and saidin, can it?

It can - she feels different vibrations in KoD when saidin-saidar channelers are burning trolloc corpses.

[Val Mickey]

No, it doesn't.

 

Just before Rand gets his hand blasted by Semirhage, Nynaeve warns Rand one of the Seanchan is channeling, and Rand thinks to himself

"Her ter'angreal could not tell whether it was saidin or saidar being channeled, but it was unlikely to be a man.

 

By this time Rand has started warding against channelers, as a matter of routine, so she would've picked that up.

The point is moot anyways, since her ter'angreal doesn't show direction.

[Sharaman]

No, it doesn't.

 

Just before Rand gets his hand blasted by Semirhage, Nynaeve warns Rand one of the Seanchan is channeling, and Rand thinks to himself

"Her ter'angreal could not tell whether it was saidin or saidar being channeled, but it was unlikely to be a man.

 

By this time Rand has started warding against channelers, as a matter of routine, so she would've picked that up.

The point is moot anyways, since her ter'angreal doesn't show direction.

Maybe either an inconsistency in the writing, or Rand is in error.

I don't have KoD with me but it would be just after the trolloc attack when Logain and the AS are burning corpses.

I remember something like (paraphrasing): she (Nyn) could feel the different vibrations as saidin and saidar were channeled to create unnatrually hot fires. Then some thoughts about how saidar was being forced in links by Ashaman, etc. But although Cadsuane had said she should be able to judge direction, Nyn had never figured out how.

In this case, moot point anyway.

 

What did you mean by Rand warding against channelers? He was going through massive hassles with the puking during that period and all the way till TGS-VoG.

[nojnomad]

I don't believe this has anything to do with Nyn's ter'angreal...

I believe that it indicates that she felt channeling not that her ter'angreal tipped her off. This would seem to indicate that it was the femail half and she was sensing it naturally.