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A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

DocBean

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  1. DocBean

    Hand of Onyx

    Like Terez, i don't like the body swap theory. However, I do find this scenerio to be interesting. If Morridin and Rand Swap, and both have a powerful sword, then we get a nice showdown. If Rand/Lanfear/Moggie take out Moridin who has Nyaneve/Alivia, then Alivia could then take out Rand. Which fits the viewing of her helping him die. If Moridin as Rand dies, this then fits the Dark Prophecy that Terez believes to be Rand. Weeping, sorrow, yadda yadda... however, it's actually a good thing for the forces of Light. I'm still hoping the Dark Prophecy death is Perrin's body in the wolf dream, and his wolf body lives on, but slim chance that i'm right with that one. Anyway, if Rand and Moridin die, then you get the resurrection with Nyaneve pulling Rand back into reality. Thank you Moggie for showing her that trick. Everyone is happy, because everyone's theory is then correct.
  2. I like this theory, I like it a lot actually. I've always assumed the blank in the blight is actually a city. We've even seen a hint at a city in Towers of Midnight, when Perrin comes across the spot of blight with a strange looking tent or something that had switched places with normal land. I think that's also how Trollocs were randomly popping up too. Just like the hallway switches we've seen, I think spots of land are switching. However, back to your theory. It would work, and would make since that Alivia will kill Rand if she thinks he's actually Morridin. I hate the body swap theory, but it does work on a lot of levels. Rand as Moridin could kill his old body, making everyone weep which fulfulls black prophecy, then Alivia could kill Rand, which will allow them to switch back in T'A'R.
  3. My biggest dislike of the series is that I'm never really scared for any of the characters. I love how detailed the world is, and how Jordan thought so much through decades ago, but the story is WAY too Black and White. It's like a 1950s Western movie, the guys in the White hats vs the guys in the Black hats, and you know the good guys will be just fine when it's over. We all knew Moraine wasn't dead. We never fear for any of the main characters. I read the books because I have for a long time, it was my first Fantasy series that I stuck with (Dragonlance before that, but I didn't finish the 2nd or 3rd book). If I picked the first one up today, and hadn't read them, I doubt I'd finish them.
  4. At this point who cares? He's been the most underwhelming Forsaken in the entire series, and they're almost all pathetic. Moridin is the only one that's been exciting to watch, and Lanfear had/has some potential to be impressive. The rest are too cardboard – bad guys that can't do anything right. Even Taim and Slayer have been more threatening then the big bad Forsaken, and Fain is above those two. I'd say Asmodean isn't cardboard, if I didn't hear that Jordan said he was still evil when he died. I would have liked to see Rand turn one of them back to the light by now, and Asmodean would have been a perfect example of that.
  5. THIS TIMES 100000000000000000000000! This is truly the only thing that I just do not like at all about the past 2 books, way too many instances where this happens. It's really annoying because a lot of the time what they are explaining is pretty obvious so it's just a wasted few lines. I first noticed it when I was reading the Mistborn series, and had just finished reading all the Song of Ice and Fire books – It was a huge departure from Martin, so it bugged me right off the bat. When I read Gathering Storm I was really annoyed that Brandon did the same thing throughout the book, because Jordan never did that either. However, when I read the prologue to Gathering Storm I was immediately reminded that Jordan's series was just better then Sanderson's Mistborn, even though Sanderson was writing it, so I do think he's done a good job. I remember clearly when i read the prologue that I felt like I was putting on a pair of well worn in shoes that had been lost in a closet somewhere. They still felt like I remembered; but every now and then a pebble would dig in, to remind me they weren't exactly the same as I remembered. The over explanation he does, and the lack of humor, are really my only criticisms with any of his work. If I ever reread these latest two books I'll probably highlight one of the unnecessary lines and post it, so people understand what I'm talking about.
  6. I agree with most, Mat isn't the same in Gathering Storm or ToM; however, by the time I read ToM, it didn't bother me nearly as much as it had before. However, I remember reading the Gathering Storm and I actually preferred Sanderson's Aviendha. She seems more like the old Aviendha, a little more "savage." I actually didn't like her character much because she seems the same as any other wetlander. Which make the Aeil nothing special. I think Sanderson did a pretty good job of making her a little more Aeil and a little less Randlander; Jordan started writing her the same way as all the other women in the series. The biggest problem I have with Sanderson's writing is the fact that he always has the characters explain everything in their heads. Jordan was much better at giving the readers some credit for figuring out why a character did something they did. All the Sanderson books I've read so far are the same. The characters always spell everything out clearly; he never leaves the reader in the dark on anything. It really bothers me during his combat scenes where a character has a long inner dialog going on while fighting, it seems very unnatural.
  7. I agree we won't see the speech. Remember the Ogier write, and speak, and build things, better then any Human, so I don't think Sanderson should try to pull it off. Even with Loial's "Simply Put" style of speaking, it should be quite eloquent. I think we've already seen proof that not only does he convince them to join the humans, we know he'll survive the Last Battle and write his book about Rand.
  8. I always interpreted it as his understanding of the Wheel. He's not threatened by a circle anymore because he knows the Wheel will watch out for him, and let him do what needs to be done. It's like he is so connected he can almost predict the future. It seemed clear to me when he was willing to travel to meet with the Borderlanders that he doesn't feel threatened by mortals anymore. Then again, maybe it's because he knows he can grasp the True Source, in each of those situations we don't know that a shield would stop him from doing that.
  9. I disagree completely about WOT having a lot of character development. I'd actually say most characters have developed very little, they are all either black or white, good guys or bad guys and never change course. Each one serves a specific purpose. After reading the first book, you can say this about each character: Moiraine - Teacher, Yoda type. Lan - Super swordsman who put his Honor above all else, and will always sacrifice himself for the greater good. Rand - Sheepherder/nobody/orphan boy with ambiguous past, turned savior of mankind. Mat - Rogue gambler, comedic character, who looks out for number 1, but somehow always saves everyone else. Perrin - Blacksmith-muscle-man who can communicate with wild animals, but is really quite gentle and caring. Nyaneve is the typical "Medic/super strong magician" character. "Oh no, this character is going to die! Wait, here comes Nyaneve, she'll save him!" After reading the last book, they're all still the same characters they started out like, I wouldn't say Nyaneve is any more or less likable then the rest. They're all quite bland individually, but make a nice dish when mixed together.
  10. Sanderson isn't as good at writing funny characters, and being forced to write a character you didn't create is probably pretty hard to do. I'm currently reading "Way of Kings" and Sanderson goes out of his way to make some characters funny - Wit for example, but it just comes off as really forced, and not funny at all. I'm guessing Sanderson wasn't a class-clown type and just isn't really that funny; and there's nothing wrong with that. The Mistborn series was the same way, none of the characters were funny. I think Sanderson is more clever then he is funny, when it comes to his writing style. I think he's got a creative imagination, and is a good writer, but he's not witty.
  11. I think voting for a favorite author on a Wheel of Time Community Forum is pointless. With that said, I'll say what I've said before about Martin and Jordan: They're different. Some people like the struggles of good vs evil, a clear cut right vs wrong - Jordan. Some people like their world a little more gray, and political - Martin. I think the backstory of Marin's world, and his inclusion of Religion, and foreign language makes his world much more believable, but this is fantasy we're talking about. If you like prophecy, magic, and monsters, you'll prefer Jordan. If you like Middle Earth - Jordan. If you like Middle Earth mixed with the Sopranos - Martin. They are just different. Get over it.
  12. Could we also discuss the merits of Stephenie Meyer and where she stands when compared to these other writers? Because in my opinion she's right up there. Wow, there is a sarcasm font.
  13. ...and there you have it folks. I think we've figured out the real problem with Lan's storyline. Jordan created a world where the characters KNEW they were going to live again. He's even said that's why there is no organized religion in his world, because everyone knows there is a Creator and Dark One. so in Lan's case, he's saying "Crap, I got the short straw. Well, I better end this so I can start again." I thought Lan's storyline would basically echo the 300 Spartans holding off the Persian Empire. Especially since Jordan wants all his storylines to be similar to stories from our world. After all it's one wheel, the same painting over and over again. Instead he decided to have Lan do some foolish charge. What the hell man?! Maybe he's supposed to be General Custer.
  14. Tolkein basically wrote the instruction books on Dwarves and Elves and Orcs and "High-Fantasy," that alone puts him on top of the mountain. Personally I don't care much for his books now, but historically they were needed, for authors these days to do what they do.
  15. I have to agree with randsc on his breakdown of the two series. However, I will say they are both masters of this genre; lower then Tolkien, but still masters. I still say you all need to realize they're different. Some people like the struggles of good vs evil, a clear cut right vs wrong - Jordan. Some people like their world a little more gray, and political - Martin. I think the backstory of Marin's world, and his inclusion of Religion, and foreign language makes his world much more believable, but this is fantasy we're talking about. If you like prophecy, magic, and monsters, you'll prefer Jordan. If you like Middle Earth - Jordan. If you like Middle Earth mixed with the Sopranos - Martin. They are just different. Get over it.
  16. I could not agree more. I've always hated Lan as a character, and can't for the life of me understand why so many people think he's so amazing. There is absolutely no depth to his role at all, and the sad thing is Jordan/Sanderson will probably save him in the end.
  17. oh god please don't start throwing out other authors' names. We don't want those Goodkind idiots showing up. haha
  18. I think we can stop comparing ASOIAF and Wheel of Time. basically you're comparing something that's Rated R, to something that's rated PG13. they can both be entertaining, they're just different. Jordan's world is suited for a younger audience, and there isn't anything wrong with that. Martin's world is for Adults. I think the real discussion was about if Jordan got off track form his original idea or not.
  19. I think there are multiple ways you can look at That Champion of Light's soul going to the Dark Side, and still not destroying the world. 1. The champion of the Dark side goes light. – Look at them as two sides of the same coin, always opposing each other, and always connected. Therefor, balancing each other out. 2. The Light side channelers make up the difference - If all the forces of good were to work together, then they could overpower CoL and the bad guys. 3. The Dark wins because of the COL switching sides, but the wheel isn't destroyed - therefore leaving the wheel to keep spinning. RJ confirmed the third option to be possible. He said the bad guys have won before, but the result was a draw. I personally look at that as strong evidence that the Dark One needs to die for him to get his way. If the bad guys have taken over, and the wheel keeps on spinning, (which allows the good guys to work their way up from behind in a future age) then the Dark One still didn't get what he wanted. If he won, and had complete control and freedom, why wouldn't he have destroyed the Wheel? I don't think he has the power to do it. I think Rand is the only one with the power to destroy everything. The only way I can see the Dark Forces winning, but the Dark One not getting his freedom, is if he was sealed up in such a way that they didn't know he existed, or if they refused to let him out and chose to rule without his interference.
  20. This is always such a cheap shot. Why assume some kind of monetary motivation? By the time those later books rolled around he was already a bestseller and presumably pretty well setup. I think he just started too many side plots and wasn't concise enough. The plot got away from him a bit but that doesn't mean that he was trying to milk extra money out of it. That's true, it probably did get away from him, and I probably shouldn't blame Harriet and Jordan as much as I should blame TOR. However, he's the author she's the wife and editor, the buck stops with them. It probably wasn't a money thing as much as it was an opportunity for him to live a life writing the series he loved, and have a job he enjoyed. I would have done the same thing, we should all be so lucky.
  21. The difference between George RR Martin's world and Robert Jordan's is – GRRM shows you a world after the valiant Knight wins the throne and marries the beautiful Maiden. He shows that there isn't such a thing as Happily ever after. Jordan shows how each time the story happens, it changes, although it's still basically the same story. I don't like comparing the two, but in this case I will. Martin's world is WAY more realistic then Jordan's, and his storylines also develop and change way more then Jordan's in half the amount of paper. Which are the two things that everyone seems to bring up when saying Jordan's books are as long as they need to be to tell the story. With that said, Martin isn't done yet so we'll see what he does, and I put them on the same level – they are my two favorite authors. I'm not saying I think Martin is a better writer, I actually think Jordan has a way with words that paints a prettier picture in your head.
  22. I started these books in the late 90s, by that time the first half of the series had been written. When I read them, I read them back to back, and I was constantly annoyed during the first few books when things (like channeling) were reexplained over and over again. It's basically like watching a TV series on DVD where the episodes are butted up to each other, but they don't take out the "Previously On" If you read them back to back there is tons of "Previously On" style of writing. Once Jordan got the the later half of the series he dropped that, but started really developing the secondary storylines. In my opinion, that's where he got out of hand describing everything in detail. I loved the detail of his world; however, I truly believe that Harriet and RJ were getting a bit money hungry and stretched it further then it needed to go towards the end. He was a great world builder, but that wasn't enough to dampen the disappointment I felt when I finished Crossroads of Twilight (best title in the series, but by far the worst book). I have reread the series a couple times, and most likely I won't do it again. I love the story, I just don't need take that much more time out of my life to relive it. If the series was just 10 books long, I'd probably give it another read, but I've reached an age where the time I have to devote to reading let's me read new stuff and not much else. If you consider that each audio book takes about 30-40 hours of listening time, then 14 books would take about 475-500 hours to listen to. If you listen to them nonstop 16 hours a day, that will take 1 month of your life. Granted most people read faster then voice-actors do on audio books, but I think that gives you a good idea of how big this series really is.
  23. I've always wondered where Alivia would fall in the lineup of powerful channelers. Above Nynaeve, roughly equal to Cyndane Didn't Cyndane say Alivia was more powerful then she was before the aelfinn and eelfinn held her? ...or was that because she was using a Ter'Angreal? I always thought that it seemed odd that Cyndane would be so shocked that a channeler working with Rand would have access to an 'Angreal, so I assumed she meant Alivia was stronger even without it.
  24. Wow. I don't have $100+ to drop on an EReader. I do have $10 to drop on a paperback book that can withstand being thrown, sat or dropped on. I can't go to the author if I have a Kindle or fill in the blank ereader and say, "Please sign my kindle...er...nevermind" That's very naive of you to say. /switch topic I wonder how much it would be to bind it this way I was just saying that they could have released it all as one book. The problem is we'd still be waiting for it. As for the eReaders, if you read a lot, the cost more then evens out, and there are tons of free books available for downloading. However, if the cost is an issue, I understand. You can also check them out with any book you want at most if not all local libraries. That's a good idea for someone that wants to give them a try. The cost will also come down in time. It is the future, try not to fight it too much. In a matter of years most of the bookstores you love won't be in business, which I admit is sad, but who's still crying for the Milkmen and Encyclopedia salesmen? As for collectors of things like Signatures and Leather bound books for room ornamentation, maybe books are the better way to go. For people that like hobbies, that's as good a hobby as any. For me, I've never cared for signatures of any sort, and I'd rather read then sit in a room starring at books on a shelf.
  25. I've always wondered where Alivia would fall in the lineup of powerful channelers.
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