[DPR Mafia] Call-Your-Shot Mafia- Points being posted...

[LilyElizabeth]

Kiv, I often get really confused, and I hate it when people think I'm playing them. I don't call people out for that, myself. Of course, with me, I never get called on my lies, only my true statements......lol.

 

 

[Liathiana]

I suppose I will give Pandy a benefit of a doubt for now.

 

[glow=red,2,300]unvote Pandy[/glow]

 

I really have no idea who to vote for now though :/

[Tigraine]

Ugh!  We need some kind of game plan or I will be 83 years old and still posting in the Day 1 column! 

 

[glow=red,2,300]unvote Kivam[/glow]

 

 

At least until something gets going!

[LilyElizabeth]

Tigs, I don't think Wes is going to let us get QUITE that old! But I hear you on that.

 

 

[ed2funy]

Kiv, I often get really confused, and I hate it when people think I'm playing them. I don't call people out for that, myself. Of course, with me, I never get called on my lies, only my true statements......lol.

 

::)

 

 

Also....I don't know who my vote is on...but for now...like Tigs says...we need something.

[DPR]

Tigs, I don't think Wes is going to let us get QUITE that old! But I hear you on that.

 

No, I won't let anyone reach 83...

 

The weekends are always slow, so wait until tomorrow and things should pick-up again.

[Hybrid]

First off, sorry for being inactive lately.  I got slammed by schoolwork last week.  Midterm, research paper, and computer science project all due within days of each other, then I had a scrimmage on Saturday. I'm catching up now though and will post my thoughts shortly.

[Hybrid]

OK. 

 

- Glad to see we scrapped the mass reveal plan.  One thing that I noticed that is very interesting is that the points system keeps getting emphasized.  Putting points first is antitown behavior.  Innocents care first and foremost about catching the scum.  Points are the secondary objective.  If we get distracted by personal glory, we will lose as a team.

 

- There is also way too much of pointing out personal mafia habits going on ("Everyone always thinks I'm guilty when I'm innocent" for example).  Enough with the WIFOM, already.  For example:

 

If I truly was mafia with Barm I wouldn't respond to the suspicion of it by calling more suspicion down on my head by sarcastically telling Rey that he found us out.  I'd likely have just ignored the comment and carried on.  I'd like to think I'm a smart enough mafia player that I wouldn't call attention to the very suspicion that would get not only me, but also a teammate killed right off the bat.

 

And this in a game where the mafia are motivated to pull off gambits.

 

[glow=red,2,300]Unvote and vote Nae[/glow]

[Far Dareis Mai]

And to anyone saying "maybe the real evangelist is keeping quiet" . . . well, unless the evangelist has some critical power for the town, if the "real evangelist" is keeping quiet, I'll kill them myself.  At this point in the game, our advantage is numbers.  If there's a counterclaim, at worst we're looking at a one for one scum for townie trade, which I hope you all understand we'd jump on laughing and cheering if it was offered.  Seriously, at that point we'd lynch Pandy, and if he flipped innocent we'd lynch the counterclaimant, and be happy to have killed 1 scum in 2 days.

 

In other words - Pandy is the "real evangelist".  There's no other reasonable explanation.  The only other options are: 1) the "real evangelist" doesn't understand numbers and is keeping silent; 2) Pandy is mafia who got very, very lucky in picking a role nobody else had; or 3) the "real evangelist" knows the town is dead if they die, and a one for one trade isn't actually in our favor.

 

Anyone think 1, 2 or 3 is likely?  'Cause I don't.  Only question in my mind is whether "evangelist" is a town role.

 

The other alternative is that Pandy is mafia, and the person who actually has this role is mafia, and they are allowing Pandy to claim the role because they won't counterclaim it, and hence allowing all of us to believe that Pandy is innocent.

 

I hate not having Day 1 limits. This always happens, and it's ridiculous. We aren't going to get much more information, because we keep saying the same things over and over. Slap a time limit on it already, DPR.  >:(

 

And no, I'm honestly not looking forward to night, but I have the attention span of a three year old, and this is now officially boring for me.  :-\

[Daetirion]

You've ignored my post, Dae.  Why?

 

I'd like to get you on record:

 

1) Do you believe that Lavinya's "Mafia would be afraid of mass reveals, therefore I vote Kivam" post made sense?

 

2) Would you agree that overplaying the "I'm confused" card is a typical scum tell?

 

3) Would you agree that Nae and Barm were overly defensive in their reactions to Reyoru's post?

 

Please explain why or why not, for each of these.

 

Sorry it was a somewhat hurried response at both. Been at the GF's all weekend and snatched net access when i could.

 

Answer to all 3 is, yes, that action was suspicious and i will keep it in mind (as should everyone). Admittedly i believe Nae/Barm thing was a storm in a teacup, but that may just be due to the fact i'm used to their posting styles. However Barm's aggressive opening and Nae's enthusiastic self defence are both reasons for suspicion, regardless of that incident.

 

Ultimately Kiv, you can add to your list of three Pandy's relatively unprompted reveal and your strategy since the start. It's all useful information, but a little hard to place on the mental map so early in. The primary reason for pushing a vote on you Kiv, was that at the time you had the most votes, and the vast majority of players were suspicious of "Kivam and ????" with the ??? being anyone from DS through to Pandy. Honestly, i think the top three possibilities for a lynch from general opinion were you, Pandy and Nae. A vote on Pandy is highly unlikely to go through today due to his reveal, and there was a split between those for and those against Nae that i thought would be difficult to overcome.

 

Which realistically leaves you as the most likely to be lynched. Ultimately, i placed myself in the position that had a deadline been set, what would my logic have been. We shall see if that is followed when the dead line is announced.

 

Essentially, im echoing FDM's statement. Enough is enough, we have evidence we can match to the results of night 1, lets get this done.

 

(ps any chance of a vote count DPR?)

[Kivam]

And to anyone saying "maybe the real evangelist is keeping quiet" . . . well, unless the evangelist has some critical power for the town, if the "real evangelist" is keeping quiet, I'll kill them myself.  At this point in the game, our advantage is numbers.  If there's a counterclaim, at worst we're looking at a one for one scum for townie trade, which I hope you all understand we'd jump on laughing and cheering if it was offered.  Seriously, at that point we'd lynch Pandy, and if he flipped innocent we'd lynch the counterclaimant, and be happy to have killed 1 scum in 2 days.

 

In other words - Pandy is the "real evangelist".  There's no other reasonable explanation.  The only other options are: 1) the "real evangelist" doesn't understand numbers and is keeping silent; 2) Pandy is mafia who got very, very lucky in picking a role nobody else had; or 3) the "real evangelist" knows the town is dead if they die, and a one for one trade isn't actually in our favor.

 

Anyone think 1, 2 or 3 is likely?  'Cause I don't.  Only question in my mind is whether "evangelist" is a town role.

 

The other alternative is that Pandy is mafia, and the person who actually has this role is mafia, and they are allowing Pandy to claim the role because they won't counterclaim it, and hence allowing all of us to believe that Pandy is innocent.

 

True.  I'm reluctant to believe "evangelist" is a mafia role.  It fits as a potential cult leader, but mafia?  Just doesn't sit right.

[Far Dareis Mai]

I dunno. If Evangelists are those creepy religious dudes on TV who are always turning red from their rampant screaming, I'd say they are probably closer to mafia. ;)

[Barmacral]

I'm with Kiv on this one, Evangelists tend to have cult like behavior and cult like followings.

[Kivam]

I dunno. If Evangelists are those creepy religious dudes on TV who are always turning red from their rampant screaming, I'd say they are probably closer to mafia. ;)

 

Don't make me move this thread to D&D  ;D

[Alys Kinch]

I'm back and reading through as I get the chance. My responses are through page 35.

 

Nae vote is…awkward. It’s like a gut feeling that people are convincing other people to have. I see little either way.

 

The evidence is there. Sort of.

That’s my point.

 

Metagaming a bit?

People hate metagaming, but if you know someone, it is a very legitimate and helpful tool. I’ve won games based off of only this. Ask Barms who gave very little evil indication in a previous game… But was still pegged by lil’ old me.

 

I am not above using a tool that works. When it does not, however, I’ll cry foul.

 

Alys, you've been analysing very well. I've never played with you before, but are you always this helpful, no matter your alignment?

I do try. But if you ask Far, I can be wrong. Really wrong.

 

Hey, Alys, remember how you and Far were the only two people who were seriously rolefishing?

Hey, remember how you are full of it? I mean… you know… I figured the whole don’t tell about the role just why you were revealing thing kind of outlined it. But I’ve been called crazy many times before. Even called psycho on occasion…

 

What do you think of Far's not voting?

That I haven’t seen her post for a few days up to this point. Is that legit?

 

I would suggest no one use their actions on him, we don't want to risk anything bad happening.

Agreed.

 

[DPR]

 

I'll do a full post count in a minute - I just got a call - but I believe Kiv is back down to 4 and Nae is back up to 2 - not many changes.

 

No time limit has been imposed yet. You can't move forward if you don't lynch someone. heh

[Barmacral]

Ok, for now I'm going to [glow=red,2,300]unvote[/glow]. When that vote was made, DS contradicting himself once was the most I had to go on for anyone, except for Far's fishy joke.

 

Since then, a lot has happened and DS is a wasted vote. He hasn't done anything further to make him more suspicious.

 

Also, Pandy annoys me. I'm tempted to vote for him just to make him go away, because he's not helping the game for anyone.

 

More later, once I'm done cleaning this place up from the weekend.

[Alys Kinch]

If I wasn't the evangelist, I would have been counterclaimed since that would be a sure sign of me being a nasty lying liar who lies.

Again, not necessarily. Bad to claim on day one. He said; she said… You never know if the first is the real deal and I’ve seen it go both ways. And that’s leaving out that we know nothing at all about the role.

 

And there’s the déjà vu again. Hmm…

 

As to whether you believe the evangelist to be scum or otherwise, please decide that on factors other than my trying to maximise the effect of my role. I promise, tomorrow I shall tell all.

Makes me want to disbelieve you out of hand because you can’t quit telling us to just trust you. It’s… silly.

 

Lavinya because of

Yeah, I went back and found and posted that. :S

 

See, now this is a lie.  I actually said I had no idea why he revealed that he had a role so early, and he shouldn't have done that

I went back to Kivam’s last posted posts and don’t remember seeing you said he shouldn’t have anywhere…

 

Also, Pandy annoys me. I'm tempted to vote for him just to make him go away, because he's not helping the game for anyone.

At the risk of a pun… AMEN.

 

Not that I'm doing it, but my gut keeps telling me that my head is wrong. It's stinky for someone to do what he's done.

[DPR]

 

Current Vote Count

 

 

Kivam (5) - Verbal, Lavinya, Pete, Dae, Lily,

Nae (2) - Rey, Hybrid

Lavinya (2) - Kivam, Pandy

Pete (1) - Pale

Pandy (1) - Lia

Rey (0) -

Dae (0) -

Talya (0) -

Lily (0) -

Barms (0) -

FDM (0) -

Alys (0) -

 

With 21 players, it takes 11 to lynch.

 

Out of 21 players, 11 have voted. 10 players have not. This game is moving in the wrong direction. So this is what I'm going to do:

 

I will not set a time limit for Day 1. Period.

 

This is mafia. If you want something done, you ought to be able to make it happen.  8)  No one gets any information from the mod telling peope what to do...

 

On that same note, drag your ass getting a night action in, and you're liable to forfeit it. heh

 

 

 

 

 

[Alys Kinch]

Nope. Checked again, Kivam. It's not there; you never disagreed with Panda's move. You said you weren't sure why he did it, but that is far from disagreeing. I have the quote endorsing it... BTW, I'm voting for you, [glow=red,2,300]Kivam[/glow]. Saying I'm lying when... well, there's evidence I am not... Plus the other slip up with the reveals and making a bigger deal of things than should have been made. I KNOW something is up, even if I don't know what. Plus votes need to go somewhere.

 

BTW, I don't care who calls it OMGUS because OMG he's sucking. (Still love you though, KIVY.)

 

BTW, I don't know how to link back to specific posts when using the last posts function, so I just copy pasted them.

 

Quote from: Reyoru on January 27, 2010, 08:23:20 AM

Ok, I'll start by saying I don't trust any of you. Remotely. That goes without saying.

 

I can understand the "jolly banter" etc. from the older members of the group reminiscing about the good old days etc., but its ideal cover for faint gambits. Pandy's reveal makes me slightly uneasy - I'm trying to think why he would reveal that early, and am clearly missing something. Kivam's claiming that everybody saw Pandy role before he stated means he's either making it up or is a lot sharper than me for one (probably the case, but not necessarily).

 

Go on Kivam, what prompted you to think Pandy had a role?

 

For one thing, I think DPR said in the signup thread that everyone would have a role.   

 

Secondarily . . . lets see.

 

He says "I need someone to agree with me, can't say why"

 

Wombat does it.

 

And that's the end of it.  No further discussion, no joke about the agreement, no "gotcha, now you're my slave for a week."  Just "what I needed to happen happened, lets move on"

 

That screams "I have a role".  And what I meant by saying "I don't understand why he didn't cover it better" - he should have done something, anything, to create an explanation other than "I needed that to happen for my role."

 

BTW, it's pretty clear to me that Pandy is not mafia (he may or may not be scum, but he's definitely not mafia).  If his role requires someone else to trigger an ability (which it apparently does), and he was on a team to start with, he'd just have a teammate slip in "I agree" if nobody else happened to say it during the day.  No reason not to, really - take your chances on someone naturally agreeing with you, and if it doesn't happen, then the teammate steps up.

 

That said, it also seems as though Pandy has a recruiting role.  That makes him very useful if he's a townie, and very dangerous if he isn't.  People with the appropriate roles can weigh what to do with that uncertainty.

 

 

Yes, FDM, I must 

 

Btw, I happen to agree with pandy on this one.  He obviously had a role (though I have no idea why he made it so obvious without a cover); putting a name to it didn't tell the mafia anything they shouldn't have already figured out.  Role details, on the other hand . . . No, now's not the time for that.

 

[Reyoru]

Ok, in the interests of getting the game moving, I'm gonna reveal.

 

I'm the fortune teller.

 

I can view people with a 50% accuracy. But I can only view people who have said the word "lynch" in a post.

 

[Talya]

:o

 

And what on earth was that for Rey. Are you on a bet to get lynched day 1, because there was no need to reveal. We had already talked about the problem it caused with Pandy. Are you in this together, just to cause disruption.

 

[glow=red,2,300]Rey[/glow]

[Naeann]

If you say so Rey.  You'd be crazy to try to LYNCH me for being a mafia teammate with Barm.  I'm not mafia nor am I on a team with him.  Go to town. :-*

[Talya]

I don't think he is the Fortune Teller, or if he is, it's a mafia role. Why on earth would you reveal that on day one.

 

Unless he thought he would get the Fortune Teller to reveal. either way looks like scum to me!

[Reyoru]

I don't think he is the Fortune Teller, or if he is, it's a mafia role. Why on earth would you reveal that on day one.

 

Unless he thought he would get the Fortune Teller to reveal. either way looks like scum to me!

 

You're being a bit irrational aren't you Talya? Overreacting a tad?

 

The difference between my and Pandy's reveal is that my role is for the benefit of the town. There's no ambiguity. I've told you all exactly what my role is an does.

 

The advantage of me getting this out is to see who panics, who doesn't panic, and to let the town know exactly what is in it's arsenal.

 

You just panicked, rather massively.

[glow=red,2,300]

Unvote

Talya[/glow]