Ask A Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer (No AMoL Spoilers)

[HighWiredSith]

Were potatoes mentioned in WoT prior to the Sanderson entries?

 

I know that LOTR fans over the years have debated the merit of having not only potatoes but tomatoes and corn mentioned and consumed in Middle Earth when all three vegetables were discovered in the New World after the 15th century. In other words, if LOTR were truly intended to be a pre-history of England then there would be no po-ta-toes or lovely chips. I know WoT is not a prehistory or set in medieval times but it did seem like RJ took care to include food stuffs that were inherently medieval European - turnips, barley, porridge, etc. and not potatoes or corn.

[herid]

Were potatoes mentioned in WoT prior to the Sanderson entries?

 

I know that LOTR fans over the years have debated the merit of having not only potatoes but tomatoes and corn mentioned and consumed in Middle Earth when all three vegetables were discovered in the New World after the 15th century. In other words, if LOTR were truly intended to be a pre-history of England then there would be no po-ta-toes or lovely chips. I know WoT is not a prehistory or set in medieval times but it did seem like RJ took care to include food stuffs that were inherently medieval European - turnips, barley, porridge, etc. and not potatoes or corn.

This is an interesting observation but potatoes have been mentioned on numerous occasions starting with tEoTW. Presumably RJ did that intentionally. I don't know if he ever discussed his rationale anywhere.

[Hopebringer]

At the prologue for A Crown of Swords Elaida mentions that in the past 10 years 24 men have been stilled, but that most Aes Sedai believe it only to be 16.

 

Do we know more about this?

Edited April 19, 2011 by Hopebringer

[Hopebringer]

In Crown of Swords after Cadsuane appears the first time she leaves with some sisters after having "talked" to Rand.

She asks the Aes Sedai she "takes" from Rand if any of them had been involved in the "mess" shortly after the Aiel War, both Aes Sedai don't even know what she talks about - then Cadsuane changes the topic.

 

Do we know what she has been talking about?

[Dante282]

i just saw this quote from an RJ interview:

 

RJ: Access to the True Power is a matter of wanting it and the Dark One letting you. NOT black cords. In Prologue to The Eye of the World, we saw Ishamael use the True Power to Heal insanity. The One Power can not be used to Heal insanity. True Power used at Shayol Ghul will fry you instantly.

 

But didn't Nyneave heal the insanity from some of the asha'man?

[Graveyardhag]

At the prologue for A Crown of Swords Elaida mentions that in the past 10 years 24 men have been stilled, but that most Aes Sedai believe it only to be 16.

 

Do we know more about this?

 

 

In Crown of Swords after Cadsuane appears the first time she leaves with some sisters after having "talked" to Rand.

She asks the Aes Sedai she "takes" from Rand if any of them had been involved in the "mess" shortly after the Aiel War, both Aes Sedai don't even know what she talks about - then Cadsuane changes the topic.

 

Do we know what she has been talking about?

 

 

The answer to your second question is your first one.

Male channelers were being gentled when and where they were found instead of being taken back to the the White Tower. It's also referred to as "The Vileness"

The 3 red sitters at the time Toveine Gazal, Lirene and Tsutama were all sent into exile.

 

The Black Ajah were also murdering men they thought might be channelers (lucky men, mainly) at the same time.

 

i just saw this quote from an RJ interview:

 

RJ: Access to the True Power is a matter of wanting it and the Dark One letting you. NOT black cords. In Prologue to The Eye of the World, we saw Ishamael use the True Power to Heal insanity. The One Power can not be used to Heal insanity. True Power used at Shayol Ghul will fry you instantly.

 

But didn't Nyneave heal the insanity from some of the asha'man?

 

What Nyneave did wasn't really healing insanity. It was more removing the taint from their minds, which had the same symptoms of madness.

She Delved them, and saw the taint, then removed the taint bit by bit, Healing the holes left in the brain (but not the madness) then she used another weave that isn't actually described to get rid of the taint. It could possibly have been a counter-compulsion weave like she originally tried.

 

I don't personally believe that Nyneave could heal insanity from someone who wasn't a male channeler affected by the taint. Or at least not in the same way she healed the Asha'man anyways.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Graveyardhag

[Barid Bel Medar]

At the prologue for A Crown of Swords Elaida mentions that in the past 10 years 24 men have been stilled, but that most Aes Sedai believe it only to be 16.

 

Do we know more about this?

 

 

In Crown of Swords after Cadsuane appears the first time she leaves with some sisters after having "talked" to Rand.

She asks the Aes Sedai she "takes" from Rand if any of them had been involved in the "mess" shortly after the Aiel War, both Aes Sedai don't even know what she talks about - then Cadsuane changes the topic.

 

Do we know what she has been talking about?

 

 

The answer to your second question is your first one.

Male channelers were being gentled when and where they were found instead of being taken back to the the White Tower. It's also referred to as "The Vileness"

The 3 red sitters at the time Toveine Gazal, Lirene and Tsutama were all sent into exile.

 

The Black Ajah were also murdering men they thought might be channelers (lucky men, mainly) at the same time.

 

i just saw this quote from an RJ interview:

 

RJ: Access to the True Power is a matter of wanting it and the Dark One letting you. NOT black cords. In Prologue to The Eye of the World, we saw Ishamael use the True Power to Heal insanity. The One Power can not be used to Heal insanity. True Power used at Shayol Ghul will fry you instantly.

 

But didn't Nyneave heal the insanity from some of the asha'man?

 

What Nyneave did wasn't really healing insanity. It was more removing the taint from their minds, which had the same symptoms of madness.

She Delved them, and saw the taint, then removed the taint bit by bit, Healing the holes left in the brain (but not the madness) then she used another weave that isn't actually described to get rid of the taint. It could possibly have been a counter-compulsion weave like she originally tried.

 

I don't personally believe that Nyneave could heal insanity from someone who wasn't a male channeler affected by the taint. Or at least not in the same way she healed the Asha'man anyways.

 

Yes, the "Vileness" was after Gitara's fortelling saying the Dragon is Reborn. The red ajah started stilling men without the consent of the Hall.

 

2. You are correct. It is a subtle distinction, but an important one i think. Insanity in itself is incurable. But the taint induced maddness is something else. It is a forced maddness. You remove the abnormality of the taint from the persons mind, like Nynaeve did, you cure it. It was unnatural. The DO caused this. Natural insanity is something different. It is a problem of the mind, a deeper thing.

 

Sorry, it is very difficult to put into words, I am not sure if I got the point across. Basically, the taint caused an unnatrual maddness. Like a thorn in someones foot. Nynaeve pulled it out. Natural maddness there is something wrong with that proverbial foot. Much harder to cure. ,

[Grig]

2. You are correct. It is a subtle distinction, but an important one i think. Insanity in itself is incurable. But the taint induced maddness is something else. It is a forced maddness. You remove the abnormality of the taint from the persons mind, like Nynaeve did, you cure it. It was unnatural. The DO caused this. Natural insanity is something different. It is a problem of the mind, a deeper thing.

 

Sorry, it is very difficult to put into words, I am not sure if I got the point across. Basically, the taint caused an unnatrual maddness. Like a thorn in someones foot. Nynaeve pulled it out. Natural maddness there is something wrong with that proverbial foot. Much harder to cure. ,

 

The problem with this explanation is, as I recall the "insanity is incurable" statement from RJ was given in response to Lews Therin's madness. Lews Therin's madness was caused by the DO, so according to your explanation it should fall into the same curable category as Naeff's. One could postulate that LTT was in a different category since he was part of the Hundred Companions who were driven immediately insane, which I suppose could drive it into "natural insanity" in a Lovecraftian way (or simply being directly attacked by the DO is different than being slowly affected by only the taint). It would be interesting to find out if the Notes say anything about this inconsistency.

[Mrs. Cindy Gill]

Were potatoes mentioned in WoT prior to the Sanderson entries?

 

I know that LOTR fans over the years have debated the merit of having not only potatoes but tomatoes and corn mentioned and consumed in Middle Earth when all three vegetables were discovered in the New World after the 15th century. In other words, if LOTR were truly intended to be a pre-history of England then there would be no po-ta-toes or lovely chips. I know WoT is not a prehistory or set in medieval times but it did seem like RJ took care to include food stuffs that were inherently medieval European - turnips, barley, porridge, etc. and not potatoes or corn.

 

as herid notes, potato is mentioned 11 times before the sanderson entries per ideal seek.

 

other new world origin foods mentioned include zemai (maize/corn) and t’mat (tomtato).

 

it's not an issue for the WOT, which which is not a pre-history. just more evidence that it's a history of the future, to me.

 

it was a kind of glaring issue for LotR. but JRR seems to have written those books as much for his own enjoyment as anything, and i don't think it bothered him.

 

'k, sorry to topic break.

Edited April 19, 2011 by cindy

[seanzor]

2. You are correct. It is a subtle distinction, but an important one i think. Insanity in itself is incurable. But the taint induced maddness is something else. It is a forced maddness. You remove the abnormality of the taint from the persons mind, like Nynaeve did, you cure it. It was unnatural. The DO caused this. Natural insanity is something different. It is a problem of the mind, a deeper thing.

 

Sorry, it is very difficult to put into words, I am not sure if I got the point across. Basically, the taint caused an unnatrual maddness. Like a thorn in someones foot. Nynaeve pulled it out. Natural maddness there is something wrong with that proverbial foot. Much harder to cure. ,

 

The problem with this explanation is, as I recall the "insanity is incurable" statement from RJ was given in response to Lews Therin's madness. Lews Therin's madness was caused by the DO, so according to your explanation it should fall into the same curable category as Naeff's. One could postulate that LTT was in a different category since he was part of the Hundred Companions who were driven immediately insane, which I suppose could drive it into "natural insanity" in a Lovecraftian way (or simply being directly attacked by the DO is different than being slowly affected by only the taint). It would be interesting to find out if the Notes say anything about this inconsistency.

 

Yeah but if I remember correctly the madness in Rand had spread so far and so deep, that it was in effect incurable without killing Rand. So that could be a simpler explanation for wy Lews Therin's madness could not be cured.

[Grig]

Yeah but if I remember correctly the madness in Rand had spread so far and so deep, that it was in effect incurable without killing Rand. So that could be a simpler explanation for wy Lews Therin's madness could not be cured.

 

To give a quote so we can have a discussion:

 

Q: New Dreadlords? Via True Power? What are limits of True Power? When did we see it used before?

 

RJ: Access to the True Power is a matter of wanting it and the Dark One letting you. NOT black cords. In Prologue to The Eye of the World, we saw Ishamael use the True Power to Heal insanity. The One Power can not be used to Heal insanity. True Power used at Shayol Ghul will fry you instantly.

 

The answer wasn't "LTT's insanity was too extensive to be healed by the OP". It was "the One Power cannot be used to Heal insanity", full stop. So either the example he picked did not fit the point he was making, or there was in principle a difference between LTT's and 3rd Agers affected by the taint, since he implies that LTT's taint madness could not be healed whereas Naeff's was cleared right up (and Rand's wasn't in principle incurable, it would simply require such a great amount of effort that it would destroy his mind much like removing Graendal's Compulsion when she's serious).

[Terez]

I should mention that this signing report is obviously a heavily-paraphrased recap of a much longer conversation. There have been issues from this report in particular because of that paraphrasing. For one thing, it contradicts what RJ said in Budapest about the black cords, and we have an audio recording of that. The Else/Lanfear connection is another problem, for various reasons.

[Grig]

Yeah, thanks for the note...I knew the part about the black cord controversy, but I didn't think to apply it out with regard to the insanity question.

[Tiinker]

So I've just been re reading tDR and somethings popped into my head which hopefully someone can answer:

 

1. What was the point of Else Grinwell re-appearing? Does she have some sort of future role which I've missed?

 

2. Who's Silvie? The woman who Egwene finds in the dream world - I'm making strange connections to her and Laras of the kitchens.

 

3. Is it compulsion that Lanfear uses on Mat when she visits him in the tower? Does it have any affect later on?

[Terez]

So I've just been re reading tDR and somethings popped into my head which hopefully someone can answer:

 

1. What was the point of Else Grinwell re-appearing? Does she have some sort of future role which I've missed?

It wasn't actually Else. It was either Lanfear or Mesaana; there is some confusion on that.

 

2. Who's Silvie? The woman who Egwene finds in the dream world - I'm making strange connections to her and Laras of the kitchens.

This was almost certainly Lanfear.

 

3. Is it compulsion that Lanfear uses on Mat when she visits him in the tower? Does it have any affect later on?

RJ said she was only checking his health.

[Guest PiotrekS]

I was wondering: does the Dark One know of Moridin's link to Rand?

[Durinax]

why do the ogier dead appear outside of the stedding? is it because the stedding is technically not of the world? or some such

[yoniy0]

I was wondering: does the Dark One know of Moridin's link to Rand?

No idea, but I believe those two don't keep much from each other.

 

why do the ogier dead appear outside of the stedding? is it because the stedding is technically not of the world? or some such

It's protected in some ways (OP, for example, and also Shadowspawn don't like entering it). It seems the dead can't enter it as well.

[Guest PiotrekS]

I was wondering: does the Dark One know of Moridin's link to Rand?

No idea, but I believe those two don't keep much from each other.

 

Thanks!

 

Yes, those two have quite a strong and loving relationship, based on mutual trust. It is quite ironic that the DO and Moridin probably have less secrets between themselves then our Light side characters

[Barid Bel Medar]

I was wondering: does the Dark One know of Moridin's link to Rand?

No idea, but I believe those two don't keep much from each other.

 

Thanks!

 

Yes, those two have quite a strong and loving relationship, based on mutual trust. It is quite ironic that the DO and Moridin probably have less secrets between themselves then our Light side characters

 

 

hahaha, i jsut had this image of the DO bonding Moridin, the way Moridin seems to be able to hear the DO in his head and Graendal thinks he is kind of DOish.

 

Super DO bond.

[Mrs. Cindy Gill]

perhaps moridin has ascended. . . no, i guess it would be descended. . . i.e., by understanding the mind of the dark one, and acting, as much as possible, as the dark one acts (with complete selfishness), he essentially becomes the embodiment of the dark one. his champion. his avatar. his body, as it were.

 

it's a process generally understood to bring people closer to G-d, but in a universe with a real dark one, i guess it would work both ways.

[Guest Emu on the Loose]

Simple Question: What is the literal meaning of the components of the word "Tel'aran'rhiod"? I know that "tel" means "world," and I seem to recall that "Unseen World" is the Common translation of "Tel'aran'rhiod," but "aran" means "right" (i.e., the opposite of left) and I'm not sure I have ever seen a translation for "rhiod." Does anyone know what these two words literally mean?

[Ferdawoon]

2. You are correct. It is a subtle distinction, but an important one i think. Insanity in itself is incurable. But the taint induced maddness is something else. It is a forced maddness. You remove the abnormality of the taint from the persons mind, like Nynaeve did, you cure it. It was unnatural. The DO caused this. Natural insanity is something different. It is a problem of the mind, a deeper thing.

 

Sorry, it is very difficult to put into words, I am not sure if I got the point across. Basically, the taint caused an unnatrual maddness. Like a thorn in someones foot. Nynaeve pulled it out. Natural maddness there is something wrong with that proverbial foot. Much harder to cure. ,

 

The problem with this explanation is, as I recall the "insanity is incurable" statement from RJ was given in response to Lews Therin's madness. Lews Therin's madness was caused by the DO, so according to your explanation it should fall into the same curable category as Naeff's. One could postulate that LTT was in a different category since he was part of the Hundred Companions who were driven immediately insane, which I suppose could drive it into "natural insanity" in a Lovecraftian way (or simply being directly attacked by the DO is different than being slowly affected by only the taint). It would be interesting to find out if the Notes say anything about this inconsistency.

 

If I can for a moment choose to ignore the mention that the quote from RJ that started this debate probably is flawed and I can assume that both the "It can't be healed with the OP" and Nyn just healed it with the OP" are legit points of view:

I see it a bit like HIV and AIDS. HIV lead to AIDS. The Taint slowly inducing madness is HIV and when you are then finally pushed over the edge (and I know there is probably not a fine line here when that happens) then you go Mad and "get AIDS". Nyn can heal HIV, but not AIDS.

 

Other than that, she did not cure the madness. She only removed the "Compulsion", the taint, from his mind. Any permanent damage to his mind would still have lingered but the effects of the Taint was removed.

[Grig]

Other than that, she did not cure the madness. She only removed the "Compulsion", the taint, from his mind. Any permanent damage to his mind would still have lingered but the effects of the Taint was removed.

 

This doesn't line up well with what we saw with Naeff. He didn't just "stop getting madder", the previous symptoms of his madness (that is, seeing Fades everywhere, paranoia, etc) were cured. To line it up with what you said, that would strongly imply that there is no "madness" in a mental health capacity attributed with the taint -- it's all an ongoing compulsion to see and experience things that are not really there. I can't really otherwise buy that after several months of seeing Fades around every corner, Naeff instantaneously recognizes how silly he is and is "all better". If "madness" was still there, he wouldn't be thinking "that was silly", he'd be wondering how the Fades became invisible and be even more scared now that he can no longer see them.

[Mats Spare Hat]

Pretty dumb question, admittedly:

 

End of ToM, dude finds a pot by the riverbank - remarks that you know will have tea afterall...

 

...Did they still have cups/mugs/canteens? I had thought they'd ended up dropping all their supplies & such when they were escaping?

 

Or can I resume laughing at the idea of them having to drink from what I envision as a kitchen pot.