Towers of Midnight Speculation Thread (Spoilers for tGS)

[Anoxanmore]

Moridin probably mind trapped Cyndane because she is so powerful and thus is Lanfear. It just goes to show that Lanfear was burned out and by being healed even if by a woman she is STILL THAT POWERFUL.

 

Which means my theory on her being the second most powerful Forsaken has another notch on its belt. :)

[Durinax]

Moridin probably mind trapped Cyndane because she is so powerful and thus is Lanfear. It just goes to show that Lanfear was burned out and by being healed even if by a woman she is STILL THAT POWERFUL.

 

Which means my theory on her being the second most powerful Forsaken has another notch on its belt. :)

no, it just means that she cannot be trusted because of her feelings about rand, so Moridin got the mindtrap as a control mechanism. nothing to do with too powerful, itsj ust a punishment for failure

[Dida]

Dida, what I've read of the pieces of the Valan theory, it's at least plausible but no one including me will pay attention to it if you keep ignoring Cyndane's POV at the cleansing.

 

I have not omitted Cyndane's point of view and that particular scene, in regards to my hypothesis that "Cyndane is only Cyndane", and "Lanfear is Lanfear".

 

Yes, I acknowledge that this specific Cyndane point of view is the one that the majority of readers have gained the idea that Lanfear somehow became Cyndane.  A scene, in which I have found to be faulty as well, from Cyndane's own point of view. 

 

What seems to be the truth on the surface, is not the truth.

 

 

 

   I've posted almost all of my Valan Luca theory over time, but it was not within its own separate thread.  That can be remedied, shortly if you'd like.    

 

Please Do.  I haven't got the time or the effort to do it myself.  

 

  Yes, it is a major undertaking to dig up all the various quotes set across the series and to then contrast the various possibilities of "who" the 3rd man is, to go with Mat and Thom into the Tower of Ghenjei.

 

  I have been working on writing up this hypothesis "Valan Luca is the 3rd Man" over the past week.  I have been taking into account past criticism of this hypothesis, and have been refining it.  It will be done, when it's done. I apologize for the delay in publishing it.  However, I do stand by my theory that Valan Luca is the 3rd man.  No one other character can fit that story arc better, than Valan Luca can and does.

[water_seeker]

Yeah, I think we should see your theories in whole.  Unless...you're afraid they'd fall apart if you did it that way (I jest, I jest). ;D

[Anoxanmore]

Yeah, I think we should see your theories in whole.  Unless...you're afraid they'd fall apart if you did it that way (I jest, I jest). ;D

Don't tempt him please.

[water_seeker]

Yeah, I think we should see your theories in whole.  Unless...you're afraid they'd fall apart if you did it that way (I jest, I jest). ;D

Don't tempt him please.

 

But if he did, wouldn't it be easier for:

 

a)  Him to show off his whole theory, and

b)  For everyone else to shoot it down?

 

At the very least it could help contain said theories to a single thread...maybe.

[Phariah]

um.... Luca is gonna be the 3rd man to go w/ Mat?!? ???  ok he is gonna juggle fire also? since when? he has shown 2 skills that of an orator and that of being a prat. ::) Mat and Thom are both amazing jugglers why would they need / want a third? Luca is he a hero?! :o

 

Cyndane's own POV at the cleansing shows that she is Lanfear. nuff said :-X

 

well i believe it will be Noal goin to the ToG w/ Mat and Thom. he has his own  personal agenda imho. i think he wants to make a deal possibly or just for the glory.

 

Mat weighing 2 AS on a scale will mean when he gets to Caemlyn. he will want to go to ToG but still has his time limit he promised Verin. he will have to decide on that. weighing 2 AS on scales, his word to Verin and going to save Moiraine asap.

[Random Man]

um.... Luca is gonna be the 3rd man to go w/ Mat?!? ???  ok he is gonna juggle fire also? since when? he has shown 2 skills that of an orator and that of being a prat. ::) Mat and Thom are both amazing jugglers why would they need / want a third? Luca is he a hero?! :o

 

Cyndane's own POV at the cleansing shows that she is Lanfear. nuff said :-X

 

well i believe it will be Noal goin to the ToG w/ Mat and Thom. he has his own  personal agenda imho. i think he wants to make a deal possibly or just for the glory.

 

Mat weighing 2 AS on a scale will mean when he gets to Caemlyn. he will want to go to ToG but still has his time limit he promised Verin. he will have to decide on that. weighing 2 AS on scales, his word to Verin and going to save Moiraine asap.

The only thing that makes me doubt Noal is the third guy is the recently-released cover for ToM, showing someone who doesn't look all that old with Mat and Thom. That makes me start thinking that other theories, such as Valan Luca being the third guy, are much more credible. Honestly, we didn't have any real reason to expect Noal to be the guy except for him offering himself, being with Mat and Thom, and possibly being Jain Farstrider. He could easily be a red herring.

[Anoxanmore]

Yeah, I think we should see your theories in whole.  Unless...you're afraid they'd fall apart if you did it that way (I jest, I jest). ;D

Don't tempt him please.

 

But if he did, wouldn't it be easier for:

 

a)  Him to show off his whole theory, and

b)  For everyone else to shoot it down?

 

At the very least it could help contain said theories to a single thread...maybe.

I'm a firm believer in out of sight out of mind. :P

[Lacanos]

um.... Luca is gonna be the 3rd man to go w/ Mat?!? ???  ok he is gonna juggle fire also? since when? he has shown 2 skills that of an orator and that of being a prat. ::) Mat and Thom are both amazing jugglers why would they need / want a third? Luca is he a hero?! :o

 

Cyndane's own POV at the cleansing shows that she is Lanfear. nuff said :-X

 

well i believe it will be Noal goin to the ToG w/ Mat and Thom. he has his own  personal agenda imho. i think he wants to make a deal possibly or just for the glory.

 

Mat weighing 2 AS on a scale will mean when he gets to Caemlyn. he will want to go to ToG but still has his time limit he promised Verin. he will have to decide on that. weighing 2 AS on scales, his word to Verin and going to save Moiraine asap.

The only thing that makes me doubt Noal is the third guy is the recently-released cover for ToM, showing someone who doesn't look all that old with Mat and Thom. That makes me start thinking that other theories, such as Valan Luca being the third guy, are much more credible. Honestly, we didn't have any real reason to expect Noal to be the guy except for him offering himself, being with Mat and Thom, and possibly being Jain Farstrider. He could easily be a red herring.

Didn't BS say at the latest WoT event thing that that was not the cover they'd be using, and that it was wrong?

[Luckers]

Indeed. He stated there were several mistakes and that this cover was not the final product.

[FarShainMael]

The triangle's upside down for a start - it's supposed to indicate a fox's head, as the wavy line indicates a snake.

 

[Anoxanmore]

Indeed. He stated there were several mistakes and that this cover was not the final product.

Egads luckers you really want to call the unseen watchers as the "big thing?"

 

 

[Knobs Mahoney]

Oh, and Dida, Cyndane is Lanfear. It was confirmed to me by the voice in my head. Sorry.

 

Impeccable logic as always.  :P

 

 

Oh, didn't you know I hear Brandon's voice in my head? The memory transfer is cool, but it just sucks when he seizes saidin away from me.

 

Dida once offered to post his full theory, along with the Valan Luca one I think, but I never saw his post.  Maybe I just missed it.

 

No! You fool!

 

 

What have you done...

 

 

[Knobs Mahoney]

Once ToM comes out, and all of these inane Cyndane and Valan Luca theories are put to rest like the sick, crippled dead-horses they are...I'm going to get myself banned on every messageboard Dida has membership to by mercilessly administering ad hominem attacks.

 

You've all been warned  ;D

[Knobs Mahoney]

 

Not from this discussion, but I thought it related:

 

Alivia doesn't know how to reverse and hide weaves.

Cyndane does.

From WH At the Choedan Kal

"Cyndane prepared a small present for her, a reversed web she would not even see until it was too late."

Again from Cyndan's PoV a para or two down the same chapter.

"Shock lasted only the time it took her to slice the other woman's flows. She (Alivia) did not know how to reverse them. Maybe that would be enough advantage. She (Cyndane) would see Lews Therin die!"

 

According to Dida's thesis, Lews Therin obviously specialised in many psycho ex-girlfriends, who were all monstrously strong channelers that got captured at some time or another by the Finns, and all offered to help him wield the CK access keys and fight the Creator and the Dark One.

Perfectly plausible. 

 

 

Talk about life-long bad choices in women...jeez!  :D

 

Oh--I know! Maybe Cyndane and Lanfear crossed their balefire streams in an attempt to assassinate the Sharan royal family and sew chaos, and as a result are the first hard evidence for the Body Swap theory. Lanfear must have exited the Tower of Ghenjei through an Ayyadi broom-closet at just the same time that Cyndane decided to rise up against the Ayyad who enslaved her family when they tried to hunt water buffalo outside the gates of the main trading port in Shara. She learned balefire from a set of golden plates that she found while digging in the muck (coz that's what peasants do, dig in the muck, just watch Monty Python).

[water_seeker]

Yeah, I think we should see your theories in whole.  Unless...you're afraid they'd fall apart if you did it that way (I jest, I jest). ;D

Don't tempt him please.

 

But if he did, wouldn't it be easier for:

 

a)  Him to show off his whole theory, and

b)  For everyone else to shoot it down?

 

At the very least it could help contain said theories to a single thread...maybe.

I'm a firm believer in out of sight out of mind. :P

 

True :D

[shadowkiller_001]

I think this is the thread that people were talking about the cover for AMoL?

I just saw a newer version on Wikipedia, just thought I'd let everyone know.

I don't think either look like Thom, but there is no way that any are Valan Luca. Unless Luca aged about 50 years since we last saw him.

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/2/22/20100602110005%21Towers_of_Midnight_hardcover.jpg

 

Who carries a staff like 'blue-coat-on-the-left' guy anyway?

 

I think it's supposed to be Thom drawing the triangle with a bronze knife and then Noal with the staff. Although it's so unlike what I pictured any of them to look like....

 

thoughts?

Has this already been seen/discussed and I'm posting something that everyone besides me has seen?

[Ashaman Kovan]

Pretty sure there's a thread about it somewhere already.

[shadowkiller_001]

Pretty sure there's a thread about it somewhere already.

I thought so too, but I had a look through in the TGS forum and there was nothing there. Although, the Wiki article says the pics were added on May 31 and June 2, but they may have been out for a long time before that. I don't know. I hadn't seen them before...

[DemandredFO]

There are around 4 TOM speculation threads but this is the original.

as for disproving the stupid Lanfear theory I don't you can get any more proof then With the Cheodan Kal.  I doubt Dida would take the fact that only Moraine is in the ToG seriously, though I might like to see the twisted logic that explains why that doesn't matter any more than WtCK.  I want the Prologue

[TheBeerPatriot]

I want the Prologue

Yes! Hopefully sometime this summer!

[Ashaman Kovan]

There are around 4 TOM speculation threads but this is the original.

 

We were talking about the cover art specifically.

[WolfDragonFox]

Been awhile since i posted but let me ask all my DM friends, does everyone agree yet what most of us i think were believing all along that Noal Charin is the 3rd man Moiraine doesn't know that is going to Ghenji...based on Sweet's cover art I can see Mat there and it looks like Thom is carving the fox symbol(upside down triangle) in the tower and I gotta think that the old man w/ the staff is Noal...only thing is we never see Noal w/ a staff but i still think it seems to confirm him as the 3rd.  BTW i love the dust cover description telling us all the things that will be covered plus i'm sure theres more it doesn't...i'm excited!

[Dida]

Been awhile since i posted but let me ask all my DM friends, does everyone agree yet what most of us i think were believing all along that Noal Charin is the 3rd man Moiraine doesn't know that is going to Ghenji

 

That answer is going to depends who you are asking, but my own answer remains that Valan Luca is the 3rd man predicted to enter the Tower of Ghenjei with Mat & Thom. 

 

Other individuals are going to argue violently in support of Noal to be the 3rd man to go ToG ... and the Dark One to win the Last Battle.  :-[   

 

 

...based on Sweet's cover art I can see Mat there and it looks like Thom is carving the fox symbol(upside down triangle) in the tower and I gotta think that the old man w/ the staff is Noal...only thing is we never see Noal w/ a staff but i still think it seems to confirm him as the 3rd.  BTW i love the dust cover description telling us all the things that will be covered plus i'm sure theres more it doesn't...i'm excited!

 

  Yes, Tor Inc changed the artwork radically.... Thom doesn't even wear clothes as Thom has in the past, in the new artwork.  Seems as if the publisher has attempted to kill the Valan Luca theory with artwork.  Shrug.  Yet to the textual evidence suggest otherwise, for Valan Luca's future role.

 

  Noal has acted like a man given an order under compulsion to protect Mat's life by a Chosen previously.  So what will occur when Noal receives Moridin's order to kill Mat, from another darkfriend?