S3 Predictions

[Scarloc99]

14 hours ago, Elder_Haman said:

I think it will begin early and continue throughout. Remember that book Rand often clashes with the Aiel over his preference for the sword and he never adopts the spear. But I suspect Lan will start training him and that the Rand/Lan relationship will be the buffer between Rand and Moiraine, who he will begin to distrust as wanting to control him. Remember, he's not had any time to chat with Moiraine after Siuan did what she did and he is going mad.

 

The season could end with Rand fighting Couladin, sword to spear, and killing him with a sword. That would be a satisfying arc to make Rand into a competent swordsman by season's end and give him a nice payoff. 

Couladin will be in season 4, ad will die at the hands of Matt as per the books, season 3 will be a fight with Asmoden, my assumption was it would end as it does in the books with Asmo becoming Rands teacher, but, I also think there is a possibility that it ends with Rand sheathing the sword, this gives him his second wound and lets him achieve something with the sword fighting he will be learning. 

[Scarloc99]

13 hours ago, Mirefox said:

I don’t remember that but it would make sense.

Robert Jordan added it in because he realsied that Rand shouldn't have been good enough to beat Turok, Rand also learns to fight with his hands, and tries learning to fight with a spear as well. 

I can see Matt joining these training sessions, sparring with his "spear" bonding with Rand

[Scarloc99]

14 hours ago, Joe B said:

Again, it is more than semantics. He isn’t Car’a’carn until the clan chiefs say so. I don’t care how pedantic this for y’all…I will die on this hill…at this point in the story, ain’t no Aiel saying “that’s my Car’a’carn right there” especially without the dragon tats. 
Of course, the show may change adapt things with the Aiel, because “the stone that never falls will fall to announce his coming”.

I did not take it as Avi making a proclamation, but her identifying the potential. In terms of the titles, no, it really doesn't matter to the audience what title is used, it is far easier in a TV show to just keep to one name and stick with that all the way through, Rand still needs to go through the crystals, get the 2 dragons, break the Aiel with his announcement, he still has to do all of that to actually become Car’a’carn, but, if he has completed the prophecy then he has the chance to try, also, Avi saying it means nothing, I can absolutely as an alternative see her producing him to Amys, Amys taking one look at him and correcting Avi, telling her "no he isnt, not yet". The scene did what it needed to do, it told the viewer that there is a connection, something important between Rand and the Aiel, it is a title that can be said as one word to close a scene, that impacts far better then a phrase. It makes perfect sense from a writing perspective. 

I think it is also very clear we are not getting Tear, Rafe has stated that books 2 and 3 are all in season 2, so that whole piece of story now changes. 

[Skipp]

One of my few disappointments in season 2 was the lack of Padan Fain.  I am hoping they will increase his use in season 3.

 

I think they could have Fain go to the TR to try and tempt Mat to come home so he can try and get the dagger back.  If that is true it is probably for the best as his obsession with Rand really didn't go anywhere and having him more directly tied to either Mat or Perrin could open up some interesting story telling.

 

Beyond season 3 speculation

Spoiler

Maybe they combine him with the gholam to keep him in Mats orbit.

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Skipp

[Elder_Haman]

2 minutes ago, Skipp said:

One of my few disappointments in season 2 was the lack of Padan Fain.  I am hoping they will increase his use in season 3.

 

I think they could have Fain go to the TR to try and tempt Mat to come home so he can try and get the dagger back.  If that is true it is probably for the best as his obsession with Rand really didn't go anywhere and having him more directly tied to either Mat or Perrin could open up some interesting story telling.

 

Beyond season 3 speculation

  Reveal hidden contents

Maybe they combine him with the gholam to keep him in Mats orbit.

 

I think he worms his way in with the Whitecloaks and goes back to the Two Rivers. 

[Skipp]

1 hour ago, Elder_Haman said:

I think he worms his way in with the Whitecloaks and goes back to the Two Rivers. 

Oh I still think he will worm his way into the Whitecloaks, I just theorize that he will be trying to tempt Mat back to the TR rather than Rand.

[Mirefox]

30 minutes ago, Skipp said:

Oh I still think he will worm his way into the Whitecloaks, I just theorize that he will be trying to tempt Mat back to the TR rather than Rand.

I agree.  He basically has no connection at all with Rand in the show and it’s all about him and Mat.

[Elder_Haman]

5 minutes ago, Mirefox said:

I agree.  He basically has no connection at all with Rand in the show and it’s all about him and Mat.

There's beef with Perrin too. 

[Scarloc99]

16 hours ago, Skipp said:

One of my few disappointments in season 2 was the lack of Padan Fain.  I am hoping they will increase his use in season 3.

 

I think they could have Fain go to the TR to try and tempt Mat to come home so he can try and get the dagger back.  If that is true it is probably for the best as his obsession with Rand really didn't go anywhere and having him more directly tied to either Mat or Perrin could open up some interesting story telling.

 

Beyond season 3 speculation

  Reveal hidden contents

Maybe they combine him with the gholam to keep him in Mats orbit.

 

I hope they show why he filled the fade, and how he either hid it from Ishy, or Ishy just let it happen. That whole scene in the farm has been left unresolved and unexplained. 

[Ralph]

5 minutes ago, Scarloc99 said:

I hope they show why he filled the fade, and how he either hid it from Ishy, or Ishy just let it happen. That whole scene in the farm has been left unresolved and unexplained. 

 

I think they will still get to PF being the other evil. the whispering voices started when Ishy told him to give it to Mat. 

[Guire]

How is Emonds Field going to be handled?  We know they rebuilt set for EF in mine pit.  Will we get 3 villages in Two Rivers plus mostly destroyed Taren Ferry?  Where is battle going to take place if at all.  The village from season 1 is almost undefendable without some Rings of Power level cringe.  If only one Two Rivers village who saves them? What chatacters will be present in show? Perrin has good reason not to want to go home while Mat has lots of reason.  Will Avhienda take Gauls place or go to waste with Rand? Tinkers? Slayer? Will Faile play any role if Perrin goes back? If Mat goes back does he have a giant orgy with drunken Coplins and Congars to celebrate his light saber spear🙂

[Scarloc99]

5 minutes ago, Guire said:

How is Emonds Field going to be handled?  We know they rebuilt set for EF in mine pit.  Will we get 3 villages in Two Rivers plus mostly destroyed Taren Ferry?  Where is battle going to take place if at all.  The village from season 1 is almost undefendable without some Rings of Power level cringe.  If only one Two Rivers village who saves them? What chatacters will be present in show? Perrin has good reason not to want to go home while Mat has lots of reason.  Will Avhienda take Gauls place or go to waste with Rand? Tinkers? Slayer? Will Faile play any role if Perrin goes back? If Mat goes back does he have a giant orgy with drunken Coplins and Congars to celebrate his light saber spear🙂

WAFO

[Pandemonium]

1.  The whole Tanchico plotline is going to get cut.  That means Moghedien will have a different role, plus the Nynaeve and Elayne will have a different role.  I like Caemlyn to replace much of Tanchico.  I also think Juilan Sandar will be cut from the show.  they don't want men protecting women here, and Juilan didn't end up doing much anyway towards the end of the books.

 

2.  This show desperately needs more interactions between Rand and Matt and Perrin.  For this reason, I think Matt still goes to Rhuidean.  We did see an image of Matt hanging in Ishamael hallucination scene.  I'm still hoping they keep the red stone doorway for Matt in Rhuidean, even if they significantly change some details.  Matt will still need an impetus to go to Rhuidean, and I doubt they will do the 3 question doorway from Tear at this point.  Matt will hang at some point... although they could change everything around.  But I still think they will build on Mat's memories and I think he may still feel like his memories are disjointed after remembering he was a hero of the horn.  So Matt will be exploring all the holes in his memories in season 3.  

 

3.  Lanfear will definitely be in this show and she might be planting seeds and pushing some of the characters to the Aiel waste.  Her role will have to be different as I don't think they will use mask of mirrors and take away from her acting abilities.  

 

4.  We will get a meeting of Forsaken, but it will only be 3 or 4 of them as the show isn't ready to introduce all of them yet.  Asmodean, Moghedien, Lanfear, and maybe Sammael will meet.  It's quite possible Sammael becomes the new Rahvin and takes residence in Caemlyn instead of Ilian.  Moghedien is a spider so she will be laying traps, but won't be as directly visible.  I think Moghedien will be installed in the White Tower so she can move the tower coup forward.  Mesaana is not going to be in this show as there will be 4 female forsaken and the other 2 will be Semirhage and Graendal who will show up in later seasons.

 

5.  White Tower civil war will be set up.  Elaida and Siuan heavy drama will proceed.  Gawyn and Galad  and Elaida and Morgase will be shown in Caemlyn in the beginning of the show absolutely pissed that Elayne disappeared.  They will travel to Tar Valon after the first couple episodes.  Not sure if Tar Valon civil war will conclude at end of season.  

 

6.  Two Rivers will feature Padan Fain as a whitecloak.  The showdown will be set.  Lord Luc could also be there, setting up all kinds of showdowns for Perrin.  Not to mention Dain Bornhald being there grumbling under Fain's command.  Two Rivers should be epic.  I don't predict Verin will be in Two Rivers though, but probably Alana and her warders.

 

7.  Lots of Telaranrhiod scenes will happen, and that will help push Egwene to Rhuidean.  I'm not sure what will push Rand there, but something will be setup.  I predict they use the portal stone this time to get there, but the waygate is an option too.  Perrin will also start showing up in Telaranrhiod and spirit hopper will be there guiding Perrin.

 

8.  One detail from Season 2 was how Elyas told Perrin that his wife was not part of his tribe.  I'm not sure what that means yet... could it be darkfriend?  That will likely get explored in season 3.  

 

9.  Tom Merrellin.  He is going to return, but where will his role be?  if Matt doesn't go to Rhuidean, then it will be with Matt, but I still can't place him yet.  

 

10.  Rand going to Rhuidean and experiencing his Aiel lineage.  this will be a whole episode-- maybe episode 3 or 4, much like the focus on Nyaneve in season 2. This  will definitely be in the show or I will rage quit this show.

 

11.  We will get Couladin set up as an imposter.  And I do think the Aiel showdown in the echo canyon will happen.  This will lead to rain and then the whole showdown with Asmodean which will be the conclusion of season 3.  Will the Choedan Kal still appear?  I think so because they still need a plot device to clear the taint on saidin.  

 

12.  What will Nyaneve and Elayne do all season?  I don't know but I suspect they may be at the White Tower and then doing a little black ajah hunting along with Verin to nudge them.  They will probably encounter Liandrin and maybe we even get a Nyaneve showdown with Moghedien.  

 

 

 

 

Edited October 12, 2023 by Pandemonium

[Jaysen Gore]

2 hours ago, Pandemonium said:

1.  The whole Tanchico plotline is going to get cut.  That means Moghedien will have a different role, plus the Nynaeve and Elayne will have a different role.  I like Caemlyn to replace much of Tanchico.  I also think Juilan Sandar will be cut from the show.  they don't want men protecting women here, and Juilan didn't end up doing much anyway towards the end of the books.

 

2.  This show desperately needs more interactions between Rand and Matt and Perrin.  For this reason, I think Matt still goes to Rhuidean.  We did see an image of Matt hanging in Ishamael hallucination scene.  I'm still hoping they keep the red stone doorway for Matt in Rhuidean, even if they significantly change some details.  Matt will still need an impetus to go to Rhuidean, and I doubt they will do the 3 question doorway from Tear at this point.  Matt will hang at some point... although they could change everything around.  But I still think they will build on Mat's memories and I think he may still feel like his memories are disjointed after remembering he was a hero of the horn.  So they will have someone of building that theme.

Really good post and I agree with most of it; just a couple of pushbacks...

 

I don't think they can use Camelyn to replace Tanchico; if nothing else, the Tanchico plot is needed for Mat and Tuon. And and has been discussed elsewhere, we're speculating that the Bowl of the Winds / Male A'dam / Callandor get conflated into it somewhere. Plus the Tanchico story arc is critical in getting the girls out of the Tower before the collapse.  I don't see them moving right to the Camelyn civil war story arc when Nyn and Elayne leave the tower since that's the end of Elayne's arc, so they need something to do in the middle.

 

And I don't know if we get Mat in Rhuidean. I want him confronting the boys, but aside from escorting the girls back to Tar Valon while Rand goes with the Aiel, I don't know how that happens.  I think we get Mat building to Couladin, since that's the formation of the Band, but I don't know the order

[Elder_Haman]

3 minutes ago, Jaysen Gore said:

And I don't know if we get Mat in Rhuidean. I want him confronting the boys, but aside from escorting the girls back to Tar Valon while Rand goes with the Aiel, I don't know how that happens.  I think we get Mat building to Couladin, since that's the formation of the Band, but I don't know the order

I think Mat will get to Rhuidean via the Finn and independently of, but fortuitously at the same time as, Rand. 

[Pandemonium]

16 minutes ago, Elder_Haman said:

I think Mat will get to Rhuidean via the Finn and independently of, but fortuitously at the same time as, Rand. 

That is a possibility.  Nobody can really predict everything as this show changes too many things around, adds new characters, etc.  Matt will have to have a reason to go Rhuidean and I'm not sure what that would be if he doesn't first go into the 3 questions Finn ter'angreal.  But it is quite possible that he has a conflict with the Finn there and they throw him out a different exit.... with a rope around his neck.  And I 100% agree that we need a build up between Matt and Couladin.

 

 

[Pandemonium]

26 minutes ago, Jaysen Gore said:

Really good post and I agree with most of it; just a couple of pushbacks...

 

I don't think they can use Camelyn to replace Tanchico; if nothing else, the Tanchico plot is needed for Mat and Tuon. And and has been discussed elsewhere, we're speculating that the Bowl of the Winds / Male A'dam / Callandor get conflated into it somewhere. Plus the Tanchico story arc is critical in getting the girls out of the Tower before the collapse.  I don't see them moving right to the Camelyn civil war story arc when Nyn and Elayne leave the tower since that's the end of Elayne's arc, so they need something to do in the middle.

 

And I don't know if we get Mat in Rhuidean. I want him confronting the boys, but aside from escorting the girls back to Tar Valon while Rand goes with the Aiel, I don't know how that happens.  I think we get Mat building to Couladin, since that's the formation of the Band, but I don't know the order

Everything is possible, but how many sets does the show use per season?  Season 1 had Two Rivers, Tar Valon, Shadar Logoth, Tarwin's gap, and some small towns between.  Season 2 had 3 main sets:  Cairhien, Falme, Tar Valon and some travel between.  Season 3 is already set to have Two Rivers, Caemlyn, Tar Valon, Aiel Waste, and who knows what else.  Will they really have enough time to split the characters that much and have that many different sets?  

[Elder_Haman]

I also wonder whether the Prophecies become a bigger part of S3. Having been instrumental in raising the Dragon Banner over Toman Head, will Moiraine become obsessed with Rand fulfilling prophecies? 

[mogi68]

On 10/9/2023 at 2:58 PM, Scarloc99 said:

Who then teaches Egwene? There is no sense to Siuan dying, she acts as the power behind the throne and then hands that power willingly over when she sees egwene is powerful enough.

 

What does she need to learn?

[Yamezt]

7 minutes ago, mogi68 said:

 

What does she need to learn?

 

How to be an Amyrlin - namely Tower Law and understanding politics in the Hall. I guess the role could be also given to Leane if they decide to only keep 1 actress, but Siuan would be the better option

Edited October 12, 2023 by Yamezt

[Scarloc99]

10 hours ago, Yamezt said:

 

How to be an Amyrlin - namely Tower Law and understanding politics in the Hall. I guess the role could be also given to Leane if they decide to only keep 1 actress, but Siuan would be the better option

plus, Rafe has said that the White Tower is his fav bit of the books, and, (tongue firmly in cheek here), he apparently loves to make women the centre of the universe, so how is he going to resist the story of the Amyrlin who is stilled and still helps to bring down the tower. It makes no sense to remove her story now the "Moraine will be Siuan" theorists have been proven wrong. 

[Jaysen Gore]

17 hours ago, Elder_Haman said:

I also wonder whether the Prophecies become a bigger part of S3. Having been instrumental in raising the Dragon Banner over Toman Head, will Moiraine become obsessed with Rand fulfilling prophecies? 

I have to bet no at this point. If and until Amazon commits to the 8 season run, I have to think the showrunners will continue to downplay Min's visions and the various Prophecies of the Dragon / Rhuidean / Finns.  Since the showrunners do not know how they are going to get from A to B yet in later seasons, they can't include prophecies that they aren't going to be able to meet later. 

[Elder_Haman]

1 minute ago, Jaysen Gore said:

I have to bet no at this point. If and until Amazon commits to the 8 season run, I have to think the showrunners will continue to downplay Min's visions and the various Prophecies of the Dragon / Rhuidean / Finns.  Since the showrunners do not know how they are going to get from A to B yet in later seasons, they can't include prophecies that they aren't going to be able to meet later. 

I think we get Rhuidean and the Finns in S3. 

[Scarloc99]

On 10/13/2023 at 4:21 PM, Jaysen Gore said:

I have to bet no at this point. If and until Amazon commits to the 8 season run, I have to think the showrunners will continue to downplay Min's visions and the various Prophecies of the Dragon / Rhuidean / Finns.  Since the showrunners do not know how they are going to get from A to B yet in later seasons, they can't include prophecies that they aren't going to be able to meet later. 

Rafe has planned out an 8 season arc and has not changed that, season 3 is being made with the intention that the 8 seasons arc remains. So at this point in time I don’t see that changing. 

[Jaysen Gore]

21 hours ago, Scarloc99 said:

Rafe has planned out an 8 season arc and has not changed that, season 3 is being made with the intention that the 8 seasons arc remains. So at this point in time I don’t see that changing. 

I think there's a big difference between laying out the arcs and overall structure, and having the individual scenes identified.  So I expect what we'll continue to get is visions that payoff in the season itself, but few if any specifics that go across seasons that aren't really freaking obvious. So we may get the Finn's speech to Mat about Tuon and his eye, and Min's panicked ones at the Tower or Cairhien, but few others.