tv show spoilers S1E7: The Dark Along the Ways

[Elder_Haman]

58 minutes ago, flinn said:

Really lowers Perrins character,

How so?

[Sabio]

In the Borderlands the Aes Sedai are well respected.  In the book Kiruna Sedai was even sister to the King of Arafel. 

[Deviations]

33 minutes ago, TheDreadReader said:

For Algemar... they have to find a way to show how the general population of the westlands mistrust the Aes Sedai.   Adding in a little mistrust and antagonism from the Borderlanders is pretty easy way to show it.

Borderlanders hold the Aes Sedai in very high esteem.

[DigificWriter]

Agelmar, like Nynaeve did with Rand, Perrin, and Egwene, misread what Moiraine's presence in Fal Dara meant and hastily jumped to a false conclusion.

[Deviations]

13 minutes ago, Elder_Haman said:

The tv relationship feels 1000% more organic than the one from the books.

Sometimes what we want isn't 1000% organic.  Every girl I know love's "The Sound of Music" How organic is that?  I enjoy the sharp tension between the two in the books much more than what I see in the series.

[bringbackthomsmoustache]

1 minute ago, Deviations said:

35 minutes ago, TheDreadReader said:

For Algemar... they have to find a way to show how the general population of the westlands mistrust the Aes Sedai.   Adding in a little mistrust and antagonism from the Borderlanders is pretty easy way to show it.

Borderlanders hold the Aes Sedai in very high esteem.

Agelmar is one of the top 5 military leaders known and lord of this fortress - its is reasonable for him to dislike having his judgement questioned by anyone other than his king (especially in public).  Think of him as the Duke of Wellington disliking political interferance in how he runs his campaign - it shows no particular disrespect of Aes Sedai, it is impatience with any interferance.

[Elder_Haman]

Just now, Deviations said:

I enjoy the sharp tension between the two in the books

This is the first book. The extent of their romance at this point was - they are now in love. Which is pretty much where we're at in the show.

[Reader]

On Mat and the Reds, my first thought was that it was for the show to tell Liandrin where the group had gone to, to explain her getting there (if she does).  But maybe they're also using it to set up a Mat / Teslyn introduction.  Although the way season 1 has gone I don't think Teslyn's characater is important enough to make it into the show.  Probably it's just to show Moiraine's ruthless side.

[Gothic Flame]

40 minutes ago, TheDreadReader said:

Adding in a little mistrust and antagonism from the Borderlanders is pretty easy way to show it.

Of course that's not how it is in the books where the Borderlands are gracious and grateful towards Aes Sedai.

[qlorin]

2 hours ago, Jaysen Gore said:

Predictions to come later, but my quick take on this is Mat goes with the WG and Liandrin straight to Falme after PF steals the <<spoiler, and desperate hope>>

My prediction Mat story directly goes to book 3... His "part" at the end of book 2 and that story line will totaly get rid of... We didnt hear anything about "legendary item"...

At this point why bother with the story in the books...
-Maybe whole party will be going to "Stone" instaed of Falme... 
-Maybe Mat finds "the grey fox" at the "Stone"
-Maybe Girls never goes to Tower no test no education directly "Stone"
-Elayne maybe engaged with Lord Samon in this story not a Forsaken but simple dark friend...
-Maybe Lan has a secret child...
-Maybe there is no Avihandre because no Galad or Gawyn we need 3 woman soooo Egwene back on the board...
-Maybe Galad story added to Perrin... thats a twist...
-Maybe Egwene-Galad-Gawyn becames Egwene-Rand-Perrin...
-Maybe no Faile of course... We added extra wife we can substract one...

Really can anybody say this changes are more drastic then what they did so far...

Edited December 17, 2021 by qlorin

[bringbackthomsmoustache]

The two large scars on Lan's back in this episode appear to be missing from the bath scene in E1?

[flinn]

30 minutes ago, Elder_Haman said:

How so?

 Marrying someone you dont really love because you were shot down by the girl you did want is low character. Let it happen to your sister or daughter and I bet you will hate the guy that took advantage of them because he was too much of a coward to face his feelings.

[WhiteVeils]

1 hour ago, flinn said:

Makes perfect sense to me.. When you go back and watch there are a lot of tells that Perrin is into Egwene. Then he has to go home to 2nd choice and pretend. Really lowers Perrins character, but I am getting used to all the men being lessened.

How does this lower Perrin's character at all? To me, this makes him even more magnificent.  He knows Egwene loves Rand. He knows Rand loves Egwene.  Rather than get between them, imposing on them with his own personal feelings, feelings they don't share, he maturely gets himself over himself and moves on with his life, finding another love and setting up a family with her.
 

The only person whose character is lowered is Nynaeve, who dredges it all up at the worst moment because she's feeling angry.

[flinn]

1 minute ago, bringbackthomsmoustache said:

The two large scars on Lan's back in this episode appear to be missing from the bath scene in E1?

 They would have been healed but Aes Sedai don't waste their channeling on incompetent errand boys who are terrible at their jobs.

[flinn]

Just now, WhiteVeils said:

How does this lower Perrin's character at all? To me, this makes him even more magnificent.  He knows Egwene loves Rand. He knows Rand loves Egwene.  Rather than get between them, imposing on them with his own personal feelings, feelings they don't share, he maturely gets himself over himself and moves on with his life, finding another love and setting up a family with her.
 

The only person whose character is lowered is Nynaeve, who dredges it all up at the worst moment because she's feeling angry.

 yeah then why is he side eyeing Egwene every chance he gets from episode 1.. he didnt move on, he just took advantage of the girl who did love him to ease his pain. he is a coward.

 

[WhiteVeils]

2 minutes ago, flinn said:

 Marrying someone you dont really love because you were shot down by the girl you did want is low character. Let it happen to your sister or daughter and I bet you will hate the guy that took advantage of them because he was too much of a coward to face his feelings.

He loves Laila. He says he does, she believes he does, and he does absolutely nothing to indicate he doesn't.  A person can fall in love again after losing out on an old flame.  That doesn't make the old love disappear.  Just everyone acknowledges that it is in the past.

[Elder_Haman]

5 minutes ago, flinn said:

 Marrying someone you dont really love because you were shot down by the girl you did want is low character. Let it happen to your sister or daughter and I bet you will hate the guy that took advantage of them because he was too much of a coward to face his feelings.

But that isn't what we know. Perrin says he did love Laila. There is no indication Egwene ever 'shot him down'. He has never shared any feelings for Egwene. The only reason we have to believe that he has feelings for Egwene is because Machin Shin said so - and Machin Shin lies. 

[DigificWriter]

Audiences and characters can grossly misread a situation; that doesn't make the misread true.

 

The show didn't invent a love triangle between Rand, Perrin, and Egwene. It presented a scenario in which Nynaeve wrongly interjected herself into a conflict she didn't really understand and in turn prompted Rand to likewise misread the situation and overreact.

[Sabio]

1 hour ago, Deviations said:

He should have been shooting at a much greater distance.  He should have been better even before he achieved the flame and void.  He should have had to explain what he was doing with the flame and void, maybe in front of Lan

But that was consistent with the book, Rand is a good archer but when he used the void he was dead on.  I agree there should have been some explanation as to why he suddenly went from really good to great.

[TheSmurf]

A question about Moraine setting the Red Ajah on Mat... If I remember correctly (hectic day) she didn't know if Mat was the Dragon Reborn or not at that point..? 

 

So that means she was taking a chance with one of the remaining four being the DR. 

 

But she knows it's a 80% chance, and that it might still be Mat. 

 

So basically, if he had turned out to be the DR, she believes 100%, stone cold guaranteed he'll join the Dark One... Because if he can channel, gentling is a death sentence, whether he commits suicide or not. 

[WhiteVeils]

40 minutes ago, Elder_Haman said:

Are you arguing that the Nynaeve/Lan romance was a 'slow burn of feelings'? That somehow there was a build up to a "will they/won't they"? RJ was a great writer of many things - romance was not one of those things. The tv relationship feels 1000% more organic than the one from the books. And this from someone who is generally not thrilled with the changes to Lan.

I think people forget that Nynaeve's accepted test (with her full-hearted moment of commitment (at least internally) to Lan is no more than midway through book 2.  Slow burn, there isn't. The only reason it feels like a slow burn is that it is happening outside of Rand's eyesight.

Now, Lan committing...him thinking of marriage...THAT's a very slow burn. 

[WhiteVeils]

1 minute ago, TheSmurf said:

A question about Moraine setting the Red Ajah on Mat... If I remember correctly (hectic day) she didn't know if Mat was the Dragon Reborn or not at that point..? 

 

So that means she was taking a chance with one of the remaining four being the DR. 

 

But she knows it's a 80% chance, and that it might still be Mat. 

 

So basically, if he had turned out to be the DR, she believes 100%, stone cold guaranteed he'll join the Dark One... Because if he can channel, gentling is a death sentence, whether he commits suicide or not. 

She says if they will join the Dark One, she will kill them herself.  When he chooses not to go, she decides that means he would join the Dark One, and needs to be killed.  The Red are good at it.

[Reader]

I just think Perrin needs to murder a few Whitecloaks early on in season 2 to get him back on track.

[notpropaganda73]

Perrin needs Elyas in S2. 

[notpropaganda73]

2 minutes ago, WhiteVeils said:

She says if they will join the Dark One, she will kill them herself.  When he chooses not to go, she decides that means he would join the Dark One, and needs to be killed.  The Red are good at it.

I also think people need to stop taking everything so literally from the show. They have been pretty consistent in trying to tell us that the Aes Sedai are not omnipotent and in fact, are mistaken about a lot of things. 

 

Moiraine is human. Her stating these things about Mat doesn't mean that Mat *is* evil. In fact I would take Rand's defence of him much more to heart than anything the others say, and I think Rand's characterisation of Mat is what we will see in his "redemption" going forward