Black Tower Mini Mafia

[Niniel]

Sorry for doubting you, Turin. This makes it really hard. Unless you make a quick move I will read the thread tomorrow. I don't want to be in the position to have the gun at lylo, or whatever it might be called in this game. I trust you to make a better decision than me. So if you want to make a quick decision I will advise you to shoot anyone but me. :D

[Niniel]

Will go to sleep now. Good night.

[Ironeyes]

 

targets, have your answers, arguments ready. I'll be on computer in 12 hours and digging thru the thread.

 

This could have been easier if you all had listened.

This.

Never in this game does scum!me give Nyn the ability to kill me. Never does scum!me consistently refer back to a game when I was scum with Dice when he's my partner again.

 

My activity had not been stellar, I admit. It's been about average for me, which is unfortunate because my average isn't great. If that's reason enough to shoot me, whatever. Ley dies the following day in that case and it's game over.

[Turin Turambar]

Ley. Nyn says so isn't a reason to not shoot. She defended one point. Show me how you are more town than the others.

 

 

I expect to see work out of everyone. Good night.

[Leyrann]

Sorry for doubting you, Turin. This makes it really hard. Unless you make a quick move I will read the thread tomorrow. I don't want to be in the position to have the gun at lylo, or whatever it might be called in this game. I trust you to make a better decision than me. So if you want to make a quick decision I will advise you to shoot anyone but me. :D

 

I don't think Turin should make a quick decision. Quick decisions lose games.

 

Ley. Nyn says so isn't a reason to not shoot. She defended one point. Show me how you are more town than the others.

 

 

I expect to see work out of everyone. Good night.

 

At this point I'm starting to think you're intentionally misreading me. I'm not saying "Nyn says so", I'm saying "I quote Nyn because she understood exactly what I was thinking and was better in putting it into words than me". Anyways, I think I've explained my point often enough. You can ISO me to find the many explanations and you can also use #401, which is basically the words I'd have used if I'd have been better at putting my thoughts into words.

 

For "Show me how you are more town than the others", I've done that already. I've given reasons why Nini and Marsh are less town than me, and I've defended the points where people say I am not town (which, again, all boils down to "you defended dice early omg you defended a mafia on page 5 you must be his teammate" when (lol) I wasn't even defending him). Until people come with (actual) reasons why I would be mafia, I am the most town player. There's no "point at this own post why you're town" like there is "point at this other person's post why he's mafia". You make a case for being town by making a case why others are not. After all, you type your own posts yourself. If mafia worked in a way where your posts could show you are town, then the game would revolve around one thing only: Write the posts that look most town. That's not the case however, which is why we're scumhunting, not townproving. In larger games, there is of course the leading trains, being a cop, etc, but we don't have all that luxery here.

[Leyrann]

Marsh? Nini? You still alive?

[Turin Turambar]

Looking thru all of your dirty laundry posts...

 

Anyone wanna confess??

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nyn, I think you should have shot Marsh. Not saying why yet.

[Niniel]

I´m here now. Will read Ley´s and Marsh´s posts again.

 

 

(Spelling question: Is it Marsh´s or just Marsh´?)

[Turin Turambar]

okay one last time...

 

reads on the other players in order from most likely mafia to least likely mafia. not too hard as it is only two people to order for each of you. Unless someone wants to confess. it is good for the soul after all. 

 

please provide some reasons. 

[BFG]

Good morning!

[Leyrann]

I´m here now. Will read Ley´s and Marsh´s posts again.

 

 

(Spelling question: Is it Marsh´s or just Marsh´?)

 

I'd go with Marsh's.

 

okay one last time...

 

reads on the other players in order from most likely mafia to least likely mafia. not too hard as it is only two people to order for each of you. Unless someone wants to confess. it is good for the soul after all. 

 

please provide some reasons. 

 

Least likely

 

Leyrann

Marsh

Niniel

 

Most likely.

[Leyrann]

Good morning!

 

Morning!

[Niniel]

 

I mean sure, I get the rationale of making me the gunbearer and I sorta saw it coming.... in the sense that I was kinda consensus town anyhow and confirming anyone else would reduce the PoE... with that said Tina or Marsh making me the gunbearer is close to suicide.... so I'm pretty sure whoever chose me made it cause I miscleared them. That means Ley or Turin. And I'm leaning towards it being Turin. 

 

Why? I think dice was mad at him and it feels like it could be beyond just what was going on ITT. Also I'll be rereading dice to see his mentions of Turin and Ley... what I was talking about previously irt Tina was dice's weird 180. Only the 180 was on both Tina AND Turin. But yeah... I'll look into it tomorrow... kinda late right now.

 

Would be really sweet if I get to shoot Turin AND win the game. But 1/2 wouldn't be too bad either. 

I mean, if I were scum and a mafia genius I could have done what looks like suicide in order to WIFOM my way into being cleared... but I'm neither scum nor a mafia genius. Also I'm not that bold. Neither is Niniel in my estimation. I think your reasoning in this post is solid. 

 

Marsh, why do I see you reading the thread and not posting?

I keep the game perpetually up in a tab on my laptop, so it often looks like I'm reading the game when I'm actually doing something else. Usually homework. 

 

 

Just quoting this again. Nyn didn´t think me or Marsh were mafia since she had us as her top suspects. Of course Marsh likes this thought. I wonder if Nyn is right or not.

[Niniel]

 

 

targets, have your answers, arguments ready. I'll be on computer in 12 hours and digging thru the thread.

 

This could have been easier if you all had listened.

This.

Never in this game does scum!me give Nyn the ability to kill me. Never does scum!me consistently refer back to a game when I was scum with Dice when he's my partner again.

 

My activity had not been stellar, I admit. It's been about average for me, which is unfortunate because my average isn't great. If that's reason enough to shoot me, whatever. Ley dies the following day in that case and it's game over.

 

 

These are basically the reasons for why it´s not Marsh. 

[BFG]

I´m here now. Will read Ley´s and Marsh´s posts again.

 

 

(Spelling question: Is it Marsh´s or just Marsh´?)

Or Marshes

 

Yes, I'm mean :(

[BFG]

Just over a day and a half left :)

[Niniel]

 

 

Leyrann, might I ask as to where you hail from?

 

224, 225, 233, 235

 

does rum stop you from being able to count?

Hang on a moment, now, I thought it was Turin you were mad at. Now you're being grumpy at DPR? This anger feels fake--it's too vehement and too sustained, like an overeager parody of your normal bad attitude when sussed. 

 

I'm going to add that this is not a normal game where player's have to convince one another, so pushing a particular case is less valuable than stating where you stand on each player.

 

I'm finding that the most helpful posts are the lists detailing what you think about every player - these should be revealing in a couple of days from now.  

 

And vote. Go ahead, even if yer shy, and put yourself on record. For the town. 

 

How about: 

Vote Dice

 

Marsh... sup?

Marsh. Where are you?

Marsh!!! It's not Sunday yet. Please join in.

Oh hai. I slept in cause 3 day weekend (Boston Marathon)

 

 

Although his reason for voting Dice isn´t great. He was the last one to vote Dice, right.

 

And we have the fact (that DPR pointed out) that he has played very cautious. 

[Niniel]

So to sum up my Marsh read:

 

+ Nyn had him as a top suspect. It would be very brave to give her the gun. (On the other hand it could be reversed psykology.)

+ Talk about how Dice behave as mafia, which he knows because he just was mafia with him in another game.

 

- Not been overly active. Could say cautious in his reads.

- Was the last one to vote Dice with a weak reason.

 

 

Now to Ley...

[Niniel]

BTW. I don´t know how to defend myself in a game like this. I have just done what I have thought was right at the moment. If you want to shoot me then please give me your best reads on Ley and Marsh because I hate being at lylo. I´ve lost the game twice when I had to decide between two people at end game. Ask AH, she was the winner in one of those games. Can´t remember the other. 

[Niniel]

I would also say, don´t give the gun to someone who want to shoot me but they could be lying about that. 

[Niniel]

You're at the bottom because you posted that reads list without any argumentation for it. And I understand that you have commented on what you think of those people before and that gave you your reads list, but I can't remember 6 people's posts on 6 other people.

 

Dice is second lowest because I'm not ready to put him lowest yet. The first (real life) day was mostly fluff in my opinion, which seems mafia Dice, the second (real life) day was kinda mixed, so I'm not sure yet.

 

Marsh next because I read his post wrong and thought he didn't remember his reads, but he was talking about the wording that he didn't remember.

 

--

 

It certainly wasn't my intention to defend Dice at any point. I was just arguing that, if people considered him agressive, then that should be a town tell. My own read on Dice is what I wrote above in this post.

 

--

 

I kinda dislike what you mentioned in above post regarding the Skype, by the way. First of all, it would be a very bad excuse - if you know the QT is up, then by definition do you know the game has started, and it's not hard to make a "hello everyone, joke vote Ithi" post. Secondly, you're saying that Nyn looks better now, yet to me, it reads as if you still think it looks scummy on Dice. Either you believe it was a QT convo and you consider them both scum, or you don't believe it was a QT convo and you consider it irrelevant.

 

Just to be clear, I disagree with your reasoning, not necissarily* your conclusion.

 

(*how do I spell that word?)

 

We have this. I´m okay with you not defending Dice, but you still have two posts where you say that Dice is a suspect but you want to give him another day. You say his second day was "mixed". I never got a good vibe from him at all.

[Niniel]

 

 

Dice... considering we haven't played together for ages I'm surprised you're so turned off this game. Not to mention your #1 teen crush is also in the game.

 

michelle Pfeiffer is here!!???

 

 

looks around

 

 

Why is this the only thing you're replying to when so many people think you're mafia?

 

 

This is a good question though.

[Niniel]

Type what you want to say, don't press post, come back ten minutes later and remove everything that breaks the coc. Or just punch a wall, play a shooter, whatever you do to cool down.

 

This is Ley being himself. I don´t know if he would say it in this thread if they were teammates.

[Leyrann]

 

You're at the bottom because you posted that reads list without any argumentation for it. And I understand that you have commented on what you think of those people before and that gave you your reads list, but I can't remember 6 people's posts on 6 other people.

 

Dice is second lowest because I'm not ready to put him lowest yet. The first (real life) day was mostly fluff in my opinion, which seems mafia Dice, the second (real life) day was kinda mixed, so I'm not sure yet.

 

Marsh next because I read his post wrong and thought he didn't remember his reads, but he was talking about the wording that he didn't remember.

 

--

 

It certainly wasn't my intention to defend Dice at any point. I was just arguing that, if people considered him agressive, then that should be a town tell. My own read on Dice is what I wrote above in this post.

 

--

 

I kinda dislike what you mentioned in above post regarding the Skype, by the way. First of all, it would be a very bad excuse - if you know the QT is up, then by definition do you know the game has started, and it's not hard to make a "hello everyone, joke vote Ithi" post. Secondly, you're saying that Nyn looks better now, yet to me, it reads as if you still think it looks scummy on Dice. Either you believe it was a QT convo and you consider them both scum, or you don't believe it was a QT convo and you consider it irrelevant.

 

Just to be clear, I disagree with your reasoning, not necissarily* your conclusion.

 

(*how do I spell that word?)

 

We have this. I´m okay with you not defending Dice, but you still have two posts where you say that Dice is a suspect but you want to give him another day. You say his second day was "mixed". I never got a good vibe from him at all.

 

 

As I've said before, I can read Dice well, but I can't read him instantly. What I mean by another day was another RL day, not another game day. For his second day, I felt he was mixed because it appeared he was actually pursuing people, which is something he normally does almost exclusively as town. However, when he really started to get pressured he basically retreated into his shell and never came out again except to explain why people were wrong about them, so one day later I knew he had to be mafia.

[Niniel]

Marsh: #115 he gives thoughts about Nini and Nyn, a few posts after he defends that. Next interesting post from him is #377, where he votes me saying he has good reason to town read everyone else. What happened to your read on Nini? And then in #409 you list me, then Turin, then Nini. In 377, however, you said that you doubted Turin was mafia together with Dice, and nowhere have you explained why you like Nini more now and me less. In general very little content by the way, I want to see more activity. Maybe you are scum with Dice again, but he got heat early and couldn't be saved anymore, so you decided to flip it around and try to keep you out of the fire as much as possible?

 

Niniel: Still dislike how she considered an "opposite of cautious" Dice scummy. Feels kinda like the idea might've been that she'd scum read Dice (in #318 she actually says she considers herself bad at reading Dice), but then messed up (because she's bad at reading him) and said this, while that, for other people, points to Dice being town. In #129 she actually disagrees with herself, now saying she doesn't consider him active or agressive. As far as I'm aware, active and agressive is the opposite of cautious. In #138 she votes Dice but reminds DPR that he can shoot who he wants - kinda feels like she doesn't really want Dice to get shot. In the end she votes Turin while still kind of saying she thinks he's town. Feels to me like she accidentally read too many people as town and had no one left to paint mafia. Also, Nini keeps coming back to my early comment about Dice (I think she mentioned it some four or five times after we had already stopped discussing the point), while I feel like I have explained quite clearly that I wasn't questioning her read on Dice (I explicitly said I had no idea about him at that point), but her means of getting to that read.

 

Turin: Noticed he actually made two seperate comments in his first five or so posts "joking" that Dice should be shot. #128 isn't a bad post in itself, but there's no reasoning in Turin's posts before or after to make him come to those (changes in) reads. Marsh, he says, is sliding down and is, two posts later, in the pool of people who would be good hits. However, he hasn't mentioned Marsh anywhere at this point except for his reads, where he mentioned everyone. I feel like, if Marsh is one of the top three suspects, then Turin should've disliked at least something he did. And Turin isn't one to not mention things he dislikes. And, I already mentioned this before, I really, really don't like that he just doens't believe Dice saying he hadn't realized the game had started. Just, get off of people's real life things. Insinuating people lie about that kind of things is not in the spirit of the game (nor is lying about it, for that matter). Lying and calling people liars should remain confined to gameplay. I guess this isn't as much thinking Turin is mafia as well as very heavily disagreeing with his methods though... Anyways just wanted to get that out of the way.  #334 he again mentions he's allright with Marsh getting shot. In between (I took quite a leap because few things to reply to) he barely mentioned Marsh, only saying once that he wnated him to be more active. Considering how Dice looked by now (this was still D1) I don't see how "shoot the inactive" holds up to that in any way, and yet Turin would be allright with a shot on Marsh. Just after he actually lists me above Dice in likelyhood to be mafia. Even ignoring that Turin, despite saying I was linked with Dice earlier, has not voted me today. In fact, in #404 (the post, not the error), he says that I'm looking more town because of Dice. Also, Turin too seems to have as only reason for disliking me the comment I made on reading Dice. Which I was right about, I woud like to mention. Dice barely contributed this game and disappeared about a day before the end. What - kind of - redeems Turin for me is that he and Dice had that argument, and even that wasn't as big as it was in my memory. It only lasted some 5-10 posts from both sides, not the 20+ that it had become in my memory.

 

Nyn: Very happy I don't need to ISO her because she made so many posts. Thanks mafia.

 

At the moment... Well everyone's looking scummier after a closer look, I have to be honest. I think I like Nini the least, so I'm going to Vote: Nini.

 

Turin, for my progression on Dice: He had a good start for one of his mafia games, being more active than I'd expect, though not contributing as much as town Dice would, so he started out null. Once you started pressuring him however, it didn't take long before all he was doing was defending or not even that, which is typical mafia Dice.

 

Shows that he put down a lot of work.