[Advanced] French Revolution Mafia - Day 3

[Hallia]

You're right about one thing Nervo, Ishy hasn't been the most active scum hunter like he normally is, but he could just be busy.  Anyone FoS'ing me for riding coattails is kinda silly.  I do that all the time, I'm not the best town leader in the world by any means.  But if he truly thought Mish was town, I feel the Ishy I know would not've voted her in any circumstance.

[nervositee]

I know it's only start of day 2, even though it seems like day 18, but omg there is alot of self-meta-defense here. The most common used sentence in this game is "I do this all the time". Come on! And Hally, not just you, still leaning slight town on you, but in general. Hiding your ass in D1, just to claim you "always do that" is still scummy, especially in a game like this.

 

That's also my biggest gripe with Lily at this point. Might not be enough to warrant a vote, but I'm hoping to see alot of players pick it up now that we are at D2 and got a town-flip. Now there isn't any excuse to hide around behind self-meta and "oh, it's only day 1 so I am completely unable to do anything, by default"

 

[LilyElizabeth]

This is the first game in memory that I've jumped in like this on day 2. I'm pretty proud of that, actually. 

[Pralaya]

I am not comfortable with Alanna's post.

 

The last time she had an opinion of Turin and Ishy, she did not feel strongly on either of them.

 

Okay, finished reading through the second half of the thread, though I honestly skimmed a lot of the big Yates-Despo-AJ stuff about Despo being distracting or whatever. I don't think much of that is super helpful anyway.

 

To recap, right now I'm still good with a lynch on Mish. I could go with Lily if the majority wants to swing that way, but I don't like it as much as a Mish lynch. I think we're more likely to hit scum with Mish. I think her case on Lily is weak, and I would feel better about it if she would just admit that it's weak, instead of acting like it's a very clear case.

 

I did kind of check out Turin/GE since Mish brought their names up, but I found myself going back and forth a lot on GE as I read through it all. Nothing conclusive there. My other possible scum read is Ishy right now, though I don't feel super strongly about that either.

 

 

However, now she is having both of them as their top suspects. Which is fine as the game progresses, however her entire case on Ishy is based on his Day 1 posts. If his Day 1 posts did not give her a strong feel that he is scum at that time,how did Mish flipping town convert those same posts into a strong scum feeling?

 

I personally feel Ishy is town and also had a town feeling on GE when he played. Same with Turin. 

[nervositee]

Hah! Done with the re-read! Thought I'd never get there. 

 

Now, to everyone who advocated Mish as an info-lynch, just to sit there afterwards fumbling for info, just to realize that oh, we can't find it, great job! Case-post coming right up. 

[nervositee]

Reads so far.

 

01. Mish - Vanilla Town lynched D1

02. Peace - Town Cop Killed N1

03. Despo Modkilled D1 - townfeel

04. Ishy - Unsure. Alanna's case on his befriending with Mish, without doing anything else makes a lot of sense. Also since I'm guessing if he is scum, he'll be so frustrated he won't bring his A game. On the other hand, if he is town, I can sympathize with his posts, as Town has done a very poor job at anything Day 1. I'm sure there is a party in the QT.  My gut actually says town, but my brain says null. 

05. Lily - Been very silent. Dodging the accusations by saying she is never very active on day one. Which is a bit wierd because in this day one, there has actually been quite a lot to go on, even though it's all guesswork without a flip. Cheap vote on Mish after the reset, because she "seemed to remember there was a lot of votes on her before...". Then claiming she was "trying too hard" when casing her, without defending herself at all. 

06. Thorum (out) - null. Hoping a replacement can pick it up. 

07. Elf/Nerv - he looks like a decent bloke!

 

08. Hally - Townish fact that (scummy, IMO) AJ did a cheap buddying to her early game,  and did a BS job wiggling out of it. Now we'll never(ish) know, but giving Hally the benefit of the doubt. Her reply to it also sounded very town. 

 

09. Krak - null

 

10. Pral - town lean, if nothing else then a good and concise read right after D2 had started. 

 

11. Yates Modkilled D1 - townfeel

 

12. AJ Modkilled D1- scumscumscum. can't belive he wasn't hammered into oblivion before the modkills. first, his posts are scummy, then his posts are cornered-defensive-aggro-scum. 

 

13. Golden/Turin - Golden spent the entire game tunneling Mish (now a confirmed townie), without giving any (good) reasons, and dodging/ignoring any prodding. No other scum-hunting. All his "defence" for the tunnel was pure fluff and made no deeper sense. Also interesting to see how he pursued Mish for meta-defense when almost every single player has used it this game in one form or another, without that being pointed out at all. Agreement to push for a Mish-lynch in the QT, Turin?

 

I also looove this:

 

 

 

I temporarily vote based partially on my read that the self vote is early.

 

 

"temporarily vote"? Wow. How convenient a way to make people jump on the train most likely to avoid random, while you yourself could jump over on a weak vote on Ishy. You already had the info that Mish was town, and driving forward her lynch, knowing it was an info lynch, then jumping off in the last turn. Convinient, non?

 

And also based on your read that the self vote was early, when you in THE SAME POST... actually in the sentence right before write

 

 

 

but with timezones I guess it is reasonable. 

 

Especially when she specifically claimed in her self-vote that she was going to bed... so she gave a reason, you agree with it, but still, despite what you think, you use... the opposite of what you think to base a "temp vote"   This reeks. 

 

14. Basel/Alanna - Hard to read basel, but scum-gut-feel, especially his Thorum-to-AJ-vote-flip. Alanna: Seems resistant to do any proper scum-hunting day one, rather going with an easy info-lynch because "that's all you can hope for on D1", when the thread was 28 pages long. Hardly impossible to do scum-hunting over 28 pages? Gets a bit more active further in towards deadline though, even though I still think she is being overly lazy about her case. But again, not enough to go on for now. 

 

15. Graendals Fav - fluff fluffety mcFluff. Even d2. 

 

Gonna hold on to my vote, as we still got like 36 hours left and scarce on bread, so we should scum-hunt to the max while we still have bread, but for now turin is the safest bet. I'm guessing Turin, AJ, Lily and probably the last one is some of the players that have kept their head low and not posted more than they had to D1. 

[Alanna]

 

 

However, now she is having both of them as their top suspects. Which is fine as the game progresses, however her entire case on Ishy is based on his Day 1 posts. If his Day 1 posts did not give her a strong feel that he is scum at that time,how did Mish flipping town convert those same posts into a strong scum feeling?

 

First of all, I don't think I have yet said that I now have a "strong scum feeling" about Ishy. He is my top suspect at this point, though.

 

At the time of the post you quoted - I didn't feel as strongly about Ishy at that point for a couple of reasons. One, I hadn't looked at him and his posts as closely as I now have. I hadn't specifically cased him yet. My not-super-strong feelings about him being scummy were just based from the overall reads I had done.

 

When Mish flipped town, I went back to look more closely at the posting activity surrounding her initial train (that's where the info comes from, btw, and that's how Mish flipping town can make me look at other people again, to answer your question). Ishy again stood out to me, so I cased him.

 

Secondly - my biggest pinges on Ishy actually came from his posts at the very end of Day 1. After that post of mine you quoted. So you're technically right when you say my casing was from his Day 1 posts (he's barely posted Day 2 so far), but you're wrong in that some of them were from after that post of mine you quoted (the one where I said I didn't feel to strongly about Ishy and Turin). So your point there doesn't hold up because I said I don't feel super strongly before some posts from him that racheted him up on my scum list.

 

As for Turin, I still don't feel too strongly about him being scum and have not said that I do. I mostly didn't understand his actions at the end of Day 1, which he has since explained. I am moderately satisfied with his explanation.

[Alanna]

Also, @ vos and pral - both of you have made comments now essentially complaining that those of us who said lynching Mish could give us more info have yet to do anything. Really? My case on Ishy came from looking back at the early activity surrounding Mish, as well as her final lynch train. Lily also looked at those who voted Mish and broke those votes down with analysis. That's what we meant by info lynch. No one ever promised that if we lynched Mish we would know for sure who the scum are now. We are not "fumbling" for info. I don't know what you expected, but I am reasonably satisfied with the clues we've gotten from her lynch. I am especially annoyed to hear this from pral, who never stepped up to give another candidate for scum on Day 1. If he did, I don't remember it.

[LilyElizabeth]

I'm not sure whether to be grateful or suspicious of your defense of me, Alanna. 

[keyholder21]

Official Vote Count:

 

GF (1) - Ishy

Hallia (2) - Pral, Lily

Alanna (1) - GF

Ishy (2) - Turin, Alanna

 

Not Voting (4) -Thorum, Vos, Hallia, Krak

 

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

 

Deadline: http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?p0=70&iso=20140114T21

[nervositee]

Vote Turin

 

I guess now is as good as any time. I doubt this will go faster than it must anyway...

 

edit: color went away, fixd

[Alanna]

I'm not sure whether to be grateful or suspicious of your defense of me, Alanna. 

 

To be honest, I didn't really mean it as a defense - at least, not as a defense against you being scum. More in defense of you actively participating. I'm just getting a little annoyed at the implications that some of us have been wavering around not doing anything when we clearly have been.

[LilyElizabeth]

I agree with you on that. It is annoying. 

[Pralaya]

Also, @ vos and pral - both of you have made comments now essentially complaining that those of us who said lynching Mish could give us more info have yet to do anything. Really? My case on Ishy came from looking back at the early activity surrounding Mish, as well as her final lynch train. Lily also looked at those who voted Mish and broke those votes down with analysis. That's what we meant by info lynch. No one ever promised that if we lynched Mish we would know for sure who the scum are now. We are not "fumbling" for info. I don't know what you expected, but I am reasonably satisfied with the clues we've gotten from her lynch. I am especially annoyed to hear this from pral, who never stepped up to give another candidate for scum on Day 1. If he did, I don't remember it.

 

Frankly, I don't see Lily gain anything from Mish's lynch. She herself admitted that. Looking at votes is one thing but getting something out of it is something else. That you using her example to substantiate yourself throws a big suspicion on you.

 

Also, I had a vote on D1 and also my reasons. Seems like you skimmed over it.

[Krakalakachkn]

 

Wow. Abit more work than I thought to re-read this thread. I'm working my way through it now though.

I've kinda read both ends though, the beginning and the end, and if I were to throw my 2 cents out there, my gut says Turin is behaving scummy. This isn't a "case" nor do I have any list to back it up with, but it's a feeling ;) Especially his analysis after the lynch, and especially his evasive reply to the tunneling-accusation. 

 

But again, just a hunch, thought I'd throw it out there. Now, back to re-read >_<

Excellent use of the "player X is scummy" line. What did you find scummy about me in the beginning?

 

What about my analysis leads you to think I am mafia?

 

How was I being evasive about Ishy claiming I am tunneling on him? He said it. I disagreed and asked what he thought about two other players I think could well be mafia based on my thoughts and from looking at how the vote went yesterday. The fact that I had already stated I was willing to vote any of the three but thought Ishy the best choice kinda disproves the entire tunneling argument.

 

He hasn't replied although he has posted in another game since I asked. Maybe the question should be why hasn't he responded to that query? 

 

But he has been mostly on the sidelines this game.  

 

That was a pretty intense post reacting to a random, easy-to-brush-off gut feeling.

[John E. Kelley]

Vote Turin.

 

For tunneling.

[John E. Kelley]

Crap.

 

Unvote. Vote Turin.

 

Still for tunneling.

[Turin Turambar]

Ishy, Who am I tunneling? I have more than one suspect. I made a case for you to be mafia. I asked some questions to find out if your reasoning made any sense. All you did was say that I was tunneling you. dismissive behavior pings like crazy. You have been sitting on the sidelines most of the game. Where is the  

Greatest. Scumhunter. ever...?

 

Why do you refuse to answer any questions? 

 

Why did Lily go from definite mafia that you were voting to a stinky train?

 

What do you currently think of the chances that Lily could be mafia?

 

What about Lily's vote analysis made you say that GF was clearly mafia? 

[Turin Turambar]

 

 

Wow. Abit more work than I thought to re-read this thread. I'm working my way through it now though.

I've kinda read both ends though, the beginning and the end, and if I were to throw my 2 cents out there, my gut says Turin is behaving scummy. This isn't a "case" nor do I have any list to back it up with, but it's a feeling ;) Especially his analysis after the lynch, and especially his evasive reply to the tunneling-accusation. 

 

But again, just a hunch, thought I'd throw it out there. Now, back to re-read >_<

Excellent use of the "player X is scummy" line. What did you find scummy about me in the beginning?

 

What about my analysis leads you to think I am mafia?

 

How was I being evasive about Ishy claiming I am tunneling on him? He said it. I disagreed and asked what he thought about two other players I think could well be mafia based on my thoughts and from looking at how the vote went yesterday. The fact that I had already stated I was willing to vote any of the three but thought Ishy the best choice kinda disproves the entire tunneling argument.

 

He hasn't replied although he has posted in another game since I asked. Maybe the question should be why hasn't he responded to that query? 

 

But he has been mostly on the sidelines this game.  

 

That was a pretty intense post reacting to a random, easy-to-brush-off gut feeling.

 

Intense? how so? Your post seems like a vague but inflammatory statement. implying something without actually saying anything. 

 

As to Vos' original statement, I found it oss that he felt the need to

 

1.) throw out a FOS without a "real" reason but then try to cite reasons for his "gut" feeling( complete with smiley wink)

2.) restate that it is a"hunch" so he can backtrack from it later.  the post is just weird to me.

[dapianoplay3r]

Official Vote Count: 

Hallia (2) - Pral, Lily

Alanna (1) - GF

Ishy (2) - Turin, Alanna 

Turin (2) - Vos, Ishy

 

Not Voting (3) -Thorum, Hallia, Krak 

 

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Deadline: http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?p0=70&iso=20140114T21

14 hours away (thorum is meant to be getting replaced but I can't find anyone ATM. Sorry guys but you can't rely on that vote)

[nervositee]

14 hours away (thorum is meant to be getting replaced but I can't find anyone ATM. Sorry guys but you can't rely on that vote)

 

No worries. Appreciate the perseverance you already have for keeping this game going! Good job :) 

[nervositee]

 

 

Wow. Abit more work than I thought to re-read this thread. I'm working my way through it now though.

I've kinda read both ends though, the beginning and the end, and if I were to throw my 2 cents out there, my gut says Turin is behaving scummy. This isn't a "case" nor do I have any list to back it up with, but it's a feeling ;) Especially his analysis after the lynch, and especially his evasive reply to the tunneling-accusation. 

 

But again, just a hunch, thought I'd throw it out there. Now, back to re-read >_<

Excellent use of the "player X is scummy" line. What did you find scummy about me in the beginning?

 

What about my analysis leads you to think I am mafia?

 

How was I being evasive about Ishy claiming I am tunneling on him? He said it. I disagreed and asked what he thought about two other players I think could well be mafia based on my thoughts and from looking at how the vote went yesterday. The fact that I had already stated I was willing to vote any of the three but thought Ishy the best choice kinda disproves the entire tunneling argument.

 

He hasn't replied although he has posted in another game since I asked. Maybe the question should be why hasn't he responded to that query? 

 

But he has been mostly on the sidelines this game.  

 

That was a pretty intense post reacting to a random, easy-to-brush-off gut feeling.

 

 

 

Especially interesting that when I posted my gut-feel, he got super-intense and aggro-defensive. When I actually cased him, he just plain out ignored it. 

[Turin Turambar]

Vos, we must have different ideas about what constitutes agro and defensive. I ask specific questions.

What did I ignore? State any questions you have for me and o will address them.

 

Or would it be better if I just said you were tunneling me and ignored your questions, lol.

 

BTW Ishy, still waiting for answers why your stance on Lily changed so dramatically and how her case made it clear gf was Clearly the vote for today?

[Krakalakachkn]

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you got scum vibes of AJ, then why are you voting me? You think we were mafia together and my whole voting him for linking with Hallia was just one giant distancing move even tho it was guaranteed to land us both in hot water? Doesn't make sense to me. FoS at this.

 

Well, I'm going back to look through the thread now to see why I thought AJ was scum. Honestly, I'm getting so confused now. The Yates-Despo-AJ back and forth is something I've read through twice now and I'm still confused. This is why I think being concise is actually HELPFUL in a mafia game (if you're town, anyway). I mean, AJ's whole case against Despo, about his being a distraction - it became such a big tl;dr that it BECAME a distraction, whether he intended it to be or not. I've never played with him before (or Yates), so I don't know if that's just his playstyle or what, but. I find it confusing..

 

Anyway, going to read through again, be back in a few with my thoughts.

 

 

This stands out to me, overselling the confused part.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Both these trains stink.

 

you think so? what else you think? 

 

UNVOTE

 

VOTE ISHY

  

 

Jumps on Ishy more or less out of nowhere, neatly removing himself from the Mish train. Offers no reason for doing so.

 

 

I don't like that Ishy and GF both came in at about the 5 hour mark and failed to vote anyone. That is one of the reasons I voted Ishy. I doubt that he is viable at this time tho.

 

Is there anyone else out there with a vote so this doesn't go random? I have about 30 minutes before I need to sleep.

Complains about people not voting, states he's worried about it going to random, which only makes sense if he is voting Mish.

 

FoSs GF and Ishy yet singles out Ishy for reason(s) [plural], yet we only see one. Then he states Ishy probably isn't viable, like he doesn't know there's a .001% chance of that happening.

 

All this post achieves is a back-hand explanation for why he jumped off the Mish lynch so close to the deadline. And it's not even a good explanation.

 

  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[

 

Mish, you're trying too hard. I did give my thoughts on you. I don't like the way you keep trying to turn nothing into something. It looks like you are saying "lynch anybody but me" or in other words, flailing. 

 

And I don't go around being a bitch (didn't call you one, by the way, so don't go there) in mafia. I speak gently for the most part. Haven't you ever noticed that about me? I find that hard to believe.

 

 

I've asked you twice what's the case on me, Lily. The first time you didn't respond, and I have yet to see you respond this time either. You went from calling me scum to calling me an info lynch. That pings. It seems like you are just sticking to a vote on me without any good reason.

Are you deliberately being obtuse, Mish? I stated it in the very post you quoted. Here, I'll bold it for you and make it green. And I still think you're scum AND a good info lynch.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but she's only found 3 people scummy/worthy of voting - You, AJ, and Golden. AJ is dead and she hasn't advocated anyone else and she's explained her reads/reasons, so how is that flailing?

To be fair though all three of her mafia reads were pushing her lynch at some point in the day at which time they became her leads(anyone voting me is mafia?). So is it really looking for mafia or just pushing back at the people that voted her?

 

We need to lynch someone. which would be easier if there were more than 3 people on the thread presently.

Defends Lily, offering more explanation as to why he should be voting Mish, and yet he isn't. Despite once again complaining about the lack of lynch. Here's a tip, it would have been easier to archive a lynch if you hadn't changed your vote.

 

 

  

Vote Alanna, just because of a possible excuse. My chicken is in the oven, and I have beers, and albums to listen to!

  

 

Possible excuse? I'm interested.

 

Turin, I had forgotten that you weren't on the train at the end. I like your points on Hallia. I shouldn't just dismiss her because she agreed with me. I should actually have seen that as suspicious. 

 

Unvote

Vote Hallia

It's because he isn't on the train that is suspicious!

 

And you're doing the exact thing Hallia did when she followed you onto Mish!

[nervositee]

Vos, we must have different ideas about what constitutes agro and defensive. I ask specific questions.

What did I ignore? State any questions you have for me and o will address them.

 

Or would it be better if I just said you were tunneling me and ignored your questions, lol.

 

 

 

 

"specific questions"? I said "I cant quote anything but I got a hunch". you said "WHEREWHEREWHERE!?" 

 

Then I gave you several points and quotes, and you haven't touched the post at all. 

 

As for the second point, this is my elaborate reply: 

 

We are 7 hours away from deadline, with three trains of two votes... In a game where we are on a time limit... whats up people!?