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Barid Bel Medar
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from what I skimmed, Mat sent a medallion terangreal to Galad.  Was it the original or a copy?

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from what I skimmed, Mat sent a medallion terangreal to Galad.  Was it the original or a copy?

It was one of the copies.  Mat had his "pet fox" medallion "snuggled up" around his neck to prevent Graendal from tampering.

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From the aMoL Epilogue and Perrin's search for Faile...

 

 

Flowery soap. A hint of perfume in the air. Perrin dashed toward it, throwing his weight against the corpse of an enormous Trolloc, lying almost chest-high atop other bodies. Beneath it, he found the carcass of a horse. Unable to truly consider what he was doing, or of the strength it should have required, Perrin pulled the horse aside.

 

It seems to me that Perrin did something not unlike what Rand did in lighting the pipe. He pulls the horse aside, but doesn't use his strength to do it, or the passage would read "the strength it required" or somesuch. Since one thing Perrin had in common with Rand was his ability to bend reality in Tel'aran'rhiod, are we to assume that the waking world now has a watered-down version of the properties of T'a'R? And that that is why will now works on the waking world?

 

From Chapter 13, "What Must Be Done."

 

 

A gateway opened beside [Rand]. Something about it was different from ordinary ones.

"I see," Rand said. "The worlds are drawing together, compressing. What was once separate is no longer so. This gateway will take you into the dream."

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The TAR is the real world and the Waking World is a dreamshard of TAR maintained by the Creator. And it has been since the very beginning.

I've always believed this to be true since it makes too much sense to disregard and on top of that I simply like it; but moreover, I think it's a pretty extended and accepted theory.

 

That's how ta'veren, wolfbrothers, sniffers, Horn of Valere and other weird skills and events (such as entering the TAR in the flesh) happen. This includes lighting the pipe or pushing the horse, as well as jumping between TAR and WW.

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The Creator told Rand at the Eye that HE (the Creator) would not interfere; not sure if HE ever has.  maintaining world could be considered as interfering.

Wheel/Pattern might be more accurate than Creator.

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I think creating dreamshards aka worlds is not so much interfering as it is, well, creating. Being in his dreamshards he could make the dreamers do whatever he desired but he doesn't. He just creates a buffer between souls and "life" so that souls don't actually die and get to have infinite chances in life (unless they are killed in the TAR, being it the real world), but still get to live a mortal life in the dream (lifespan and mortality as driving forces of mankind is one of the themes in the series).

 

It's like saying that if souls were truly immortal, the world would end up falling into apathy, but having them live just one life is too restrictive, so this TAR-WW mechanism is created.

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my understanding of dreamshards is that their maker is in control of at least the scenery.

 

 

about taveren and Heroes; the books tell that the Wheel spins them out.

taveren abilities (and the abilities of other groups) are probably due to either the Wheel or the Pattern or both.

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my understanding of dreamshards is that their maker is in control of at least the scenery.

 

Hmm...that would then mean that Perrin can create them too, as evidenced by his actions in the ToM epilogue.

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about taveren and Heroes; the books tell that the Wheel spins them out.

taveren abilities (and the abilities of other groups) are probably due to either the Wheel or the Pattern or both.

The Wheel spins them, yes, I wasn't talking about that. I said that ta'veren's influence is possible because the WW is a dreamshard and TAR laws apply. Basically, a ta'veren is someone who the Wheel spins with the unconscious ability to affect the dreamshard, being able to affect the world around in a very diluted version of what a trained dreamer can do in TAR to others and the enviroment.

 

The fundamental workings of a dreamshard are: if you do not know that you're dreaming/in a dreamshard you can't possibly take control or affect it; if you do know you're in it it's still insanely hard to try and change things opposing the will of the shard's creator; the creator of the shard may allow others to take certain levels of control.

 

I've always thought of ta'veren as people that don't know they're in a dreamshard, but who are granted a minimum lvl of control. Also, when Rand gets to light the pipe, I see two explanations relative to this theory: 

 1) When he was fighting the DO outside the pattern he realized the true nature of the world, so know he is a dreamer (quite a powerful one) conscoius of being dreaming, so he is able to affect the shard.

 2) In addition to the above, the Creator granted him a free ticket for "do the hell u want here, u earned it". I'm not a fan of this one but some people are.

 

And if you remember, when Perrin is learning to leap from WW to TAR he sais more than once things along the lines of "it was like waking up from a dream you didn't know you were dreaming".

 

This are only some tidbits that add to the theory, but there are many many more. I'm speaking of this well, because it's what we're talking about xD

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not entirely sure, but a dreamshard might need its maker's presence in order to exist.

 

some scene speculates that the Creator did Creation then left the Wheel/Pattern in charge; some Rand POV at Tear (nation).  If that is true, not sure if leaving someone/something else in charge is possible with dreamshards.

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  • 2 months later...

Hello :) it's been a while since I last hung out around here! I just started my third (and first since AMoL) re-read, and as we see our heroes leaving the Two Rivers in EotW, I was suddenly struck by the thought that almost none of them actually makes it back. In fact, does any of them besides Perrin ever set foot in the TR again? I couldn't remember for sure, but I'm sure folks around here know the answer!

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Not unless you count the world of dreams as visiting.  I think Rand came the closest when  he dropped off Loial's parents.

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Like another poster told, Rand was there briefly; Lord of Chaos.

Egwene (and maybe Nynaeve) had been at the telaranrhiod version of Two Rivers several times; Egwene once on-screen (Winter's Heart).

and some of Nynaeve's White Tower tests depicted Two Rivers; Novice to Accepted (middle one) and Accepted to Aes Sedia (some middle weave).

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