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one word....Asmodean..... ;-)


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if graendal could of did that to asmo surpried him that well with balefire don't u think she would of done the same with rand? as in picked a different target?

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in fact i think it might actually be more do able look at how many times lanfear just walked in his room. plus since he is always guarded by maidens just get a few darkfriends to do a bit of spying to see what room he is in and travel straight in and wait for him

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Graendal didn't know Rand's abilities the same way that Lanfear did. Also, from Graendal's perspective, Rand had probably just killed not only Rahvin but Lanfear too. She wouldn't have risked something that was that unknown.

 

Asmodean, on the other hand, she knew well, and would be confident that she could take him out.

 

You raise a good point though ... there are many cases in which the Forsaken could have just killed Rand, but chose not to. Graendal also went twice to Shayol Ghul that day ... when Demandred went he got orders to not kill Rand ... Graendal may have gotten them as well.

 

Graendal wouldn't worry about manipulating or controlling Asmodean though. She could afford to just kill him.

 

In either case, killing Asmodean is a less risky option, that still gives some benefit.

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Also since she had been at Shayol Ghul twice she could have been told to kill him since the "Great Lord" would have known that Asmodean had broken the bond to him and not the reason why. Course same reason could apply to Taim as well since I think he had been to Shayol Ghul as well and it was the results of his encounter there that made him look aged 10 years. (I'm reaching I know)

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Btw did u guys managed to solve how she knew which door to go to when she killed asmo.

 

because i just read ur theory and a few posts later but stopped because it went no where

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For eug33:

 

There are windows that look onto the courtyard (Rand looks through one to see Mat, Avi, and Asmo)... she could have seen him through one of them.

 

Also, for Caramoore:

 

Graendal did not get orders from Shai'tan to kill Asmo. RJ confirmed that the Dark One did not order Asmodean's death.

 

Source, 2004 Wotmania Interview, link here: http://www.wotmania.com/faqtopic.asp?ID=96

 

Its question 10.

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sorry, i wasnt intending any smartassery in my last post.

 

 

on the moiraine note: it just takes too much assumption to conclude that she was the murderer of asmo. at that point in the story it would not have been "intuitively obvious" to think moiraine was anything but dead. it was not until we met cyndane that we had any real hope on that front.

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and thats why he turned tothe shadow. cause he wasnt as good as he wanted to be and, with forver of practice, people can become better. but now hes dead. :( not really though.

 

sad i mean.

 

i still dont think it was graendal. it doesnt feel right. :?

 

i might be into the slayer theroy. unless if RAW has some quate to moot that... :roll:

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Ah, this topic comes around again. Wow, just reading thru this post and am more confused now. I just got through reading the first 5 again and still cant figure this out.

 

What had forgotten is that Asmo died in Rahvin's first attack and was resurrected by Rand's Balefire.

When he was killed the 2nd time for good, Asmo was pondering whether dying negated his promises to the dark one and his loss of immortality. I somehow think this is important.

 

Also, with all the debate on whether it as saidin/saidir and who would have felt it or not, there could be 2 explanations.

 

1) Maybe he was killed with a sword to the heart or an arrow thru the eye. Asmo was taken by surprise, was weak as a kitten with the power, and couldnt use a sword worth a damn. Nowhere did it say he was killed by the power. He just said "you? no!" and was toast. This leaves the door wide open for anybody with a grudge and knowledge of Asmo's passion for wine. He could have gone that way to the pantry often, so no elaborate setup needed. Just patience.

 

2) Noone can feel someone drawing the true source directly from the D.O. I know Moridin has been discounted as not being introduced yet, but maybe?

 

I swear I am going to ticked off it was some Aiel darkfriend dupe after all the brainteasing.

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i might be into the slayer theroy. unless if RAW has some quate to moot that...

 

It is not possible to thoroughly disqualify Slayer, although there are circumstantial indications working against him.

 

First is the quote from RJ saying that the Dark One did not order Asmodean's death. (Found here: http://www.wotmania.com/faqtopic.asp?ID=96 )

 

I'm not sure anyone but the Dark One could order Slayer to kill one of the Chosen.

 

Second, RJ has stated that, in succeeding books, he has given other clues about the killing. However, nothing about Slayer in any succeeding book indicates at all that he got to kill Asmodean. In WH chapter 22 he reminisces about kills past. He thinks of Joiya and Amico in Tear, a Gray Man in the Tower ... but Asmodean is conspicuously absent.

 

Third, since it is unlikely that he was ordered to do it, Slayer has no motive to kill Asmodean.

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Is there any reason why it's not Shaidar Haran? Personally I've always thought it was him. A wine cellar's a nice shadowy place that he can hide/materialise in. Just because he wasn't mentioned before this doesn't mean he wasn't around either. That a number of the Forsaken don't recognise him initially doesn't mean that Asmo's never met him before.

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Is there any reason why it's not Shaidar Haran? Personally I've always thought it was him. A wine cellar's a nice shadowy place that he can hide/materialise in. Just because he wasn't mentioned before this doesn't mean he wasn't around either. That a number of the Forsaken don't recognise him initially doesn't mean that Asmo's never met him before.

 

I think the biggest reason he's not one of the top suspects is that Shaidar Haran never appeared in the books so far when Asmodean was killed. And RJ said something about ASMOS killer being obvious. A characater that hadn't appeared in the books yet is hardly obvious. And as to Asmodean meeting SH prior to his murder, that would mean the other forsaken would almost have to have met him as well. Asmodean wasn't exactly high on the DO buddy list, not was he the strongest or most talented Forsaken, quite the contrary, so why would he and not the others know of SH's existence?

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RAW, maybe hes given cluses by not gining cluses? your wondering," what happend to luc?"

 

:roll: maybe a sort of thing to make you go, he hassent been here. is he hiding? whats he hiding from?

 

maybe. not likely.

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Is there any reason why it's not Shaidar Haran?

 

Asha'man Kovan is correct; RJ explicitly stated that the mystery could be solved using only the information provided up to and including TFoH. (Reference here: http://www.wotmania.com/faqtopic.asp?ID=101 )

 

Shaidar Haran is not introduced until LoC.

 

This same statement also disqualifies Moridin, Aran'gar, and Osan'gar.

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RJ has repeatedly said that we can figure it out from the first 5 books alone. Ive now read them 3 times and still cant figure it out. The last time around, I made sure I paid attention to all the Asmo plot lines and still nothing. I think this is a big joke and that RJ still hasnt made up his mind either. Same thing with the Taim/ Demandred thing.

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The modus operandi does not fit a Grey Man. They consistenly leave their victims' bodies behind.

 

Not to mention if a Grey Man did it, the question would then just be "Who sent the Grey Man". A Grey Man is just a weapon.

 

Also, some random Grey Man would not evoke the "You? No!" line from Asmodean.

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The problem with this thread is that it has become so huge, no one really reads it anymore.

 

MyHatJaime: balefire is the most favored method in many theories, including my own. It solves alot of problems, and fits with the "everything revolves around balefire" theme of The Fires of Heaven.

 

So yes, it very well could have been balefire.

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well this post won't exactly help solving the mystery but won't u think it would be someone less obvious RJ must of hidden his killer for some reason. ie so i won't reck what he plans to write. so i thnk it is someone close to him and is pretending to be his ally but takes out his teacher so he won't learn as quick with the power.

 

 

since most of us is convinved balefire was used to kill him then who is an ally that can channel strong enough to create balefire?

 

maybe a dark Wise One?

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well this post won't exactly help solving the mystery but won't u think it would be someone less obvious RJ must of hidden his killer for some reason. ie so i won't reck what he plans to write. so i thnk it is someone close to him and is pretending to be his ally but takes out his teacher so he won't learn as quick with the power.

 

 

since most of us is convinved balefire was used to kill him then who is an ally that can channel strong enough to create balefire?

 

maybe a dark Wise One?

 

Robert Jordan himself said that he couldn't undertand how people haven't all come to a conclusion on the killer because it should be obvious. (Loosely quoted, I don't think those are exact words)

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