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Guest Egwene

one word....Asmodean..... ;-)

spigots or caudrens  

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  1. 1. spigots or caudrens

    • spigots
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    • caudrens
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    • pie spoon
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    • washer woman. shaped washer.
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i believe samael or slayer or maybe even the gholam cauese sam found the stasis box in a nother book -had gholam-and slayer because he likes killing

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RJ said only one person got it right' date=' and I doubt only one person would suggest Graendal, so it can't be her.[/quote']

 

It's been so long since RJ said that and this topic has been beat to death since then, but I can't remember if Graendal was talked about very much as the killer at that point. For my personal opinion after just finishing listening to that book on tape I think it could have been Mazrim Taim. I know there is a dozen reasons for it not to be but I just have this gut feeling...

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She was not. That quote is what put her on the fan radar. Only a few mocked fanatics thought it was Graendal when he said that.

 

The popular choices at the time were Slayer and Lanfear- especially Lanfear, those fanatics only disappeared when she wasn't in the following books, then there was Cyndane.

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Guest Egwene

I have just re-read KoD and one exchange kind of jumped out at me...

 

page 64 KoD Hardback edition

Two sisters arguing about food spoilage:

 

They were arithmetists, of all things, as if logic could be reduced to numbers, and they seemed to be disagreeing on how those numbers were used.

"Calculating with Radun's Standard of Deviation, the rate is eleven times what it should be," Astrelle said in tight tones. "Furthermore, this must indicate the intervention of the Shadow -!

Tesan cut her off, beaded braids clicking as she shook her head. "The Shadow, yes, but Radun's Standard, it is outdated. You must use Covanen's First Rule of Medians, and calculate seperately for rotting meat or rotten. The correct answers, as I said, are thirteen and nine. I have not yet applied it to the flour or the beans and the lentils, but it seems intuitively obvious-"

Astrelle swelled up, and since she was a plump woman with a formidable bosom, she could swell impressivly."Covanen's First Rule?" she practically spluttered, breaking in. "That hasn't been properly proven yet. Correct and proven methods are always preferable to slipshod...."

 

This is very likely totally unconnected... but I could no help noticing that bit that has been quoted so often in the discussions about Asmo. Intuitively obvious... RJ's famous quote. So I wondered if maybe there is some clue hidden in this passage.

 

Any suggestions? :P

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Guest Egwene

:lol: *takes her medicine*

 

Robert Alex, you obviously feel that this could undermine Graendal *g*

 

Well, it may seem hysterical, but I think that 'it seems intuitively obvious' has become so synonymous with the Asmo question that I can't believe RJ using that phrase without himself being reminded of it.

 

The passage itself really serves no purpose and for both sisters involved, it is their only appearance in the books sofar... I think it is quite reasonable to consider whether RJ put a deliberate cryptic clue into the book, seeing as he has said for years how he is bemused by the Asmo question.

 

:D

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Assuming it's not a joke at our (fan) expense:

 

Forsaken:

 

Moridin

Sammael

Asmodean

Be'lal

Aginor

Balthamel

Graendal

Lanfear

Rahvin

Demandred

Mesaana

Semirhage

Moghedian

 

The ones who were definitely dead and unable to do the deed at the time:

 

Be'lal

Rahvin

Moridin

Lanfear

 

Might be a clue. There's only 13 capable and only nine active at the time. *shrug* Or not.

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I think it is quite reasonable to consider whether RJ put a deliberate cryptic clue into the book, seeing as he has said for years how he is bemused by the Asmo question.

 

I think it is quite reasonable to assume that, if he did think of the Asmo quote when he was writing this (which is not, in itself, an unreasonable assumption), that he chuckled to himself and said:

 

"Dance, puppets, dance!"

 

Because he knew someone, somewhere would end up with the theory:

 

"Math killed Asmodean!"

 

See, one of these sisters is actually immortal, and she used to be Asmodean's math teacher. Asmo hated math. So, when he saw here in the Palace at Caemlyn, with her calculus book in hand, he balefired himself.

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add to BrainFireBob's post/list

 

plus Mazrim Taim

 

If he did go pledge his soul to the Dark One then he had motive, means, and opportunity since no one knows where he was at when the event occurred.. (sorry, I've been watching to many CSI/NCIS type shows..)

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Guest Egwene

well, I think it is as likely to be a joke as a clue, BrainFireBob. I quite like the idea of RJ chuckling away to himself whilst writing it... or should I say throwing out the fishing line *g*

 

If it is meant to be a metaphor for the question about who killed Asmo, then I guess we ought to consider which side each sister represents.

 

Edit: Caramoore, he is listeng the forsaken... Mazrim has not been elevated to one of them as far as we know.

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Edit: Caramoore' date=' he is listeng the forsaken... Mazrim has not been elevated to one of them as far as we know.[/quote']

 

Sorry, I was under the impression that he was listing the all of the people that had means and motive to kill Asmodean at the time which would mostly be Forsaken

 

Quote from BrainFireBob = Might be a clue. There's only 13 capable and only nine active at the time.

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Guest Egwene

no worries... you missed the small word 'Forsaken' at the top of his list... though if it is any consolation, so did I when I first glanced at it.

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no problem, I guess I should add that I did see the "Forsaken" I was just trying to say that we shouldn't be limiting our discussion to Forsaken only. I should have clarified. What got me to post the Plus Mazrim Taim was because at the bottom of the Forsaken list he said "Might be a clue. There's only 13 capable and only nine active at the time."

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I'm still a Greandel did it person, but I wanted to throw an idea out, see what you guys think. What if it was a Bubble of Evil? The strange effect has been introduced and shown to us just how bizzare a thing it can be. From turning innocent playing cards and mirrored reflections into deadly weapons.

 

Asmodean was thinking of Lanfear at the time, if a small Bubble came up and he was thinking of her would that conjur up a momentary Lanfear to Balefire him?

 

I know stretching but I thought it would be a fun one to talk about.

 

STill I think Grendal was in the right place at the right time, anyone read the essay about the "Two Mysterious Servants"? It basically says that while Rand was chasing Rahvin, there were two servants there when it is later revealed that all servants had fled the place before that battle had occured.

 

The Essay then went on to say those two Servants were most likely Sammeal and Grendal.

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wow, i never thought of it that way...

 

and i just remembered! Mazrim had been mentioned earlier in the books! everyone just knew him as the false dragon who could chanel alongside Logain. :D

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aginor and balthamel were....indisposed at that point, so that takes it to seven.......was moridan introduced yet? make that six.

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wow' date=' i never thought of it that way...

 

and i just remembered! Mazrim had been mentioned earlier in the books! everyone just knew him as the false dragon who could chanel alongside Logain. :D[/quote']

 

How would Asmodean know Taim?

 

Lou -

We don't know Moridin yet.

 

Shard -

I've read the mysterious servants theory. It was very compelling up to a point. I felt the reaction of the male servant was a little too realistic. There's something about his eyes rolling back in his head when he sees the dragons on Rands wrists. It doesn't seem to me that's a touch Sammael would have added. I think they're just a couple of stragglers.

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wow' date=' i never thought of it that way...

 

and i just remembered! Mazrim had been mentioned earlier in the books! everyone just knew him as the false dragon who could chanel alongside Logain. :D[/quote']

 

That's what I've been saying...

 

How would Asmodean know Taim?

 

Well what do we know of what Asmodean was doing before Lanfear brought him to Rand? He could have been the one who broke Mazrim Tiam away from the Sisters. Or been there when Tiam swore to the dark... There is to much we don't know. IMHO

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Asmodean has not gone one bit crazy in, what, 15 years of channeling. There is every possibility that he has been over the shadow during that time. It is likely.

 

If so, Amso may well know him.

 

What I wonder is how RJ is going to inform us of his death, what, in Memory of Light, is going to give it away? Just a character thinking about doing it? Maybe a character coming back and revealing it (cough). I dunno how it will work, but will be interesting to see.

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there is nothing in any of the books to indicate taim knew asmo or viseversa. the straggler servants probably got the heck out of dodge as soon as they were conscious. the palace was empty except for rand and a few maidens.it is a suprise that none of the maidens noticed bashere until he was in the throne room with rand, given the extremes they went through to make sure he was never bothered by anyone he didnt call for (or a wise one)

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Mazrim Taim arrived in Caemlyn almost a month after Asmodean's death (as evidenced by the fact that Mat is already in Maerone, where Rand visits him when Taim arrives, LoC ch 5). Also, Taim had been travelling so hard, that Rand thought he was about ten years older than he actually was (per RJ quote cited here: http://www.wotmania.com/faqtopic.asp?ID=84 ). So, in order to kill Asmodean, Taim would have had to come to Caemlyn on the day Rand declared the amnesty, but, rather than take advantage of it, he would then subsequently leave Caemlyn again and run through the countryside so hard that it makes him appear 10 years older than he actually is, then come back.

 

Highly, highly unlikely, especially given the tenuous nature of the connection to start with.

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Highly' date=' highly unlikely, especially given the tenuous nature of the connection to start with.[/quote']

 

The voice in my head is telling me that you are a spoil sport... HAHA

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The voice in my head is telling me that you are a spoil sport... HAHA

 

That why, growing up, my mom always told me, in a disgusted tone of voice, that I should go run for Congress or something.

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Guest Egwene

Well, if you are right about Graendal, and should I ever move to the US, I'll vote for you, Robert Alex :wink:

 

Fun idea about the bubble, Shard, though I can't really see it myself. Other than the Ta'veren themselves, the bubbles have not targeted any individuals that I can think of. Why should Asmo be a target?

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