[Light Vs Shadow] - HEROES AND VILLIANS MAFIA

[Tiinker]

Did Leelou switch Wombat with someone else that no one targeted? That would give Des that result. Either way, it doesn´t look like the killer targeted Wombat and that indicates that Leelou is lying.

 

Because Meesh was the one who ended up dead. It seems like someone targeted Meesh which is why Des didn't get a reading on anyone visiting Wombat. If Leelou is telling the truth about swapping those two and her swap failed then there wouldn't have been a reading on Wombat at all because she wouldn't have been able to target him.

[Locke]

Somewhere in my read-through I thought of something incriminating and have since proceeded to completely forget what it was. >.<

 

So for as to who to lynch between Tina and BG, I'm still unsure. Both have acquired a good deal of incriminating evidence. Gonna go with Vote BG for now. Still, could go either way.

[hazelkrs1]

Tina comes off scummier than BG

 

Vote Tina

 

Reds voting process is pretty nonsensical and as I read it, it seems like she's confusing the situation more than helping.

 

This ^

 

As for my results, seeing how everything else is boiling down, I believe it's fairly easy to say I was blocked last night. My best guess is Turin jailed me (again) before dying. I'm not always going to get the same kind of message back from the mod with flavorful texting that helps me guess if I was blocked or not. Red is trying to metagame the mod by doing so. More often than not if someone's blocked they'll usually just get "no results" if they DO get a message back. The first night it was only hinted that I was blocked after I asked what happened, cause night had ended and had not gotten any results yet.

 

As far as others focusing on BG's targets and how they might have helped/hurt town, first of all you're all using the benefit of hindsight in knowing the alignment and role of those he blocked. He was going off the info he had at the time and all of his NA targets made sense imo.

 

Tina on the other hand, besides the fact that she could easily be lying, chose to RB BG last night instead of trying to RB someone else to help vet them which is what BG tried to do. Besides general pings I've gotten from Tina, here's the biggest mark against her imo: she's fighting way too hard just to survive instead of helping town win. BG already said he's willing to be sacrificed to help us find more scum/third party people. Tina is not even okay with this idea. King Solomon all over again people: pertinent link (how's that for mod godding people! Now I'm goin biblical on yall's heineys )

 

In other news, there's way too much WIFOM being thrown around that's not helping town in any matter. Just lynch one of the two (preferably Tina imo) and let the situation clear up more in future days. Incidentally, this vote is going to be very important in the next few days in helping us find more scum

[Aiel Heart]

In the middle of a reread but just thought I should show you guys this

 

 

My N2 result was Ley, not wombat. Which is why ley died, and not wombat.

 

Also I have been hinting at my character/role since night 1, so I would've had to be "faking" it since then. I don't see why you don't believe me, I was essential in taking Saky down. I understand doubting me, but flat out making up scenarios where I am helping a scum mate is a little far Red.

 

[took out list and some other stuff]

 

*shakes head* If you would actually read the game, instead of skim, you would know I targeted Kae nights 1 and two. That's the whole reason she got caught in her lie and had to make up two really bad role reveals. I caught her targeting wombat night 1, which was suspicious with his role reveal and no deaths N1, so I targeted her N2 and got her on Ley.

 

Also the vote on Leelou makes no sense. She would not switch her mafia killer to be on Ley who was also mafia. There's no way she's scum.

 

Got you.

[Aiel Heart]

Meh. Wrong button. The strikethrough should be bolded!!!

 

Back to rereading since last night....

 

Major FoS at Song, and if I don't decide someone else would give me more information, then my vote is on you for that.

[Aiel Heart]

I assume SK stands for “Snitch Killer”?

 

Lots of info from claimed roles.... Making a list that will be in a post in a bit.

 

Hopefully formatting is right this time....

 

I thought it was straight forward with the info from Desp:

 

Hoof hid with Wombat Leyrann and was killed for it, but Kae was a mafia "Killer" who targeted Wombat Leyrann effectively killing a teammate. Why would Leelou, a proposed mafia Bus Driver, knowingly submit a kill on Wombat Leyrann, a teammate?

Good support for Leelou--unless Wombat is really important for some reason and they want Leelou to look town. Seems a bit extreme to kill off allies two nights in a row though, so this seems an unlikely option

 

Note that the Mafia Killer role that Song had is transferrable--some other mafia could have caused Turin #1’s death

 

Red has a meltdown--check that--multiple meltdowns.

 

BG and Tina fight it out

 

I used my role on Meesh and Wombat last night.

 

Interesting. I protected myself last night so Meesh shouldn't have died. I guess either BG managed to block you or someone blocked me. Or both. Right now I'm thinking Tina blocked me. It doesn't make sense for her to have blocked BG and then there being yet another blocking role out there to block me.

 

Vote: Tina

 

Does anyone want to claim killing Meesh?

This one is special :P Wombat must have been role blocked or he is lying about his role (again).

Would his protection also have saved him from being driven?

This is the key I think. Neither of those who claimed to be RB targeted him, so our four options are:

Tina is lying about role or target

BG is lying about role or target

Wombat is lying about role or target

There is a different RBer who has yet to claim

Ok I guess that’s 7 but you get the idea

 

Red suspects Song of teaming up with Tina whom she believes is scum...

 

I used my role on Meesh and Wombat last night.

 

Interesting. I protected myself last night so Meesh shouldn't have died. I guess either BG managed to block you or someone blocked me. Or both. Right now I'm thinking Tina blocked me. It doesn't make sense for her to have blocked BG and then there being yet another blocking role out there to block me.

 

Vote: Tina

 

Does anyone want to claim killing Meesh?

 

actually this only supports BG's claim more imo. Leelou claimed to have bussed you and Meesh, but BG says he blocked her; which means the BG's block must have worked since you healed yourself and Meesh still died

 

Once again I ask: how many killing roles are normal for a game this size? (sorry if someone answered that and I didn’t see it)

 

Unless someone NKs whichever we don't lynch.

 

I'm not sure who seems more scummy right now--BG or Tina. But it seems very unlikely that we'd have three people with a similar role, even in a game this big.

 

Ok, so Wombat says he protected himself, which apparently got blocked or didn't transfer, so when whoever tried to kill him got bussed to Meesh, Meesh died.

 

This is still assuming that Wombat actually is the Doc. It's possible he didn't get blocked at all.

 

How exactly did Turin die?

 

well the easiest way to examine this is from the aspects of either BG is lieing or TIna is lieing. first we state the knowns

 

Meesh died. Turin died

 

then we state the assumed variables

 

Wombat protected Wombat

BG blocked Leelou

Leelolu bussed Wombat & Meesh

Song claims BG targeted no one

Tina blocked BG

 

 

now we fit it together and pick the equation which makes the most sense and fits with the knowns

 

 

Aspect #1 - BG is lieing, and assuming everyone else is telling the truth

 

this means he didn't block leelou.

 

there fore Leelou's bussing shoudl have succeeded and Wombats self protection shoud have stopped Meesh from being killed.

 

 

as Meesh is dead, this Aspect proves itself false (going on the assumption only BG is lieing)

 

 

Aspect #2 - Tina is lieing and assuming everyone else is telling the truth.

 

this means she didn't block BG

 

there fore BG's block on Leelou was succesful and prevented her. meaning Wombys self protect stayed on him and the SK took out Meesh (again with the assumption the only Tina is lieing)

 

 

this aspect also implicates Song, as her results directly controdict the results from this aspect.

Keeping these thoughts in mind...

 

BG suspects Red of teaming up with Tina

 

Song starts really pinging...

 

 

@AH Yeah, but the plus side to the Killer role for town is exactly what we see here: We know what Kae was doing visiting Wombat Leyrann. Killing. Most games don't have a designated killer and then we wouldn't know what Kae was doing for sure or who caused Ley's death.

Is there any way we can know whether Kae’s role was hers the whole game or transferrable?

 

INSERT CATCHING SONG IN THE MIDDLE OF A LIE HERE

 

Ok, was going back looking for Ama’s claimed role because I seem to remember her claiming but it’s on no one’s lists and saw this

1322191333[/url]' post='2050634']

Pants:

Is finally serious. Took long enough. Still wondering why he was so silly for so long

 

Pants is a quirky young man.....

FirePants is a very quirky young man who is very good at making me smile. Thank you :)P

That is my contribution to the spam gods in this thread today. See my picture trains in the 100,000 thread for my better work (my pic train starting on page 911 if you have 20 posts per page is my favorite thus far... though my snowflake one yesterday was nice too.... Anyways back to my search)

...Did my brain just make that up? Can’t find it.... Not even on my own list from last night... and I know that post was screwed up as far as formatting goes but the text wouldn’t have changed

 

That's a lot of info to digest after a very long day at work LOL

 

So at the moment i am unsure of which direction to go, Tina, BG and Leelou are the strongest seeming leads, though Song, Red and Des still feel pingy. I'm not convinced on Des, but he is safe from my vote at the moment, despite the mafia god attitude - you are not going to get an apology - move on.

 

Red's playstyle feels a little different from normal, i'm not saying that make her scum, but i am still watching. Song has a little of the mafia god going on too, i really dislike the "I was responsible for outing such and such" type responses, again not saying she is scum but those who loudly take credit for a lynch ping loudly on my scumdar.

 

As for the BG/Tina scenario both are touting the ills of the other fairly loudly and i am unconvinced by both.

 

Leelou has admitted to being a Bus Driver - a town bus driver - a very uncommon role. I feel that Leelou may have driven her scum team mate with wombat in an attempt to clear him if viewed, and some other killing role was aimed at wombat and she inadvertently re-directed that kill to her team mate. I seem to remember one of my early games doing something similar by accident to a scum team mate, and then being coached by the remaining team members to use that as springboard to be assumed innocent. Can't help but think the same may be going on here :/

 

Just got a text to go have a coffee with my best friend so i will get back in here later tonight and make a decision on who to vote for.

Noted

 

After that you rose your eyebrow when Leelou had your name under the no claimed roles list and Tina’s post idk if you would have raised your eyebrow at--am I not crazy (at least in regards to remembering that)?

 

Red - you are right - Leelou should have been seen with Wombat too. I have seen at least one game where the doc has been seen targeting himself but that might be different here. But I can´t believe you are choosing to ignore the rest of my post. Why would I bring anything up that would make me look more scummy? Des should have seen Leelou and the killer (and maybe Wombat) but he didn´t see any of them. Why not? That is an important question that you just ignore. Turin does it too.

 

Either no one targeted Wombat and in that case Leelou is lying. (And maybe Wombat too.) Otherwise Des is lying. Des could have been blocked too. Not by me, because I blocked BG, and not by BG, since I blocked him. Did Leelou switch Wombat with someone else that no one targeted? That would give Des that result. Either way, it doesn´t look like the killer targeted Wombat and that indicates that Leelou is lying.

Keeping that in mind as well

 

Blah blah blah I revealed I targeted Wombat

Hold up a sec AH. That means whatever you did, actually was done to Meesh.

This one’s a smart cookie (assuming Leelou is the bus driver.... seems VERY likely now)

 

Red after that says

if he was RB'd he would have gotten the same results as N1 which was nothing. but Des claims to have gottena report back which indicates he wasn't blocked.

Thank you.

 

Ok now to sort through all of this....

 

When I get sick I’m blaming this game >.>

[Aiel Heart]

In the middle of a reread but just thought I should show you guys this

 

 

My N2 result was Ley, not wombat. Which is why ley died, and not wombat.

 

Also I have been hinting at my character/role since night 1, so I would've had to be "faking" it since then. I don't see why you don't believe me, I was essential in taking Saky down. I understand doubting me, but flat out making up scenarios where I am helping a scum mate is a little far Red.

 

[took out list and some other stuff]

 

*shakes head* If you would actually read the game, instead of skim, you would know I targeted Kae nights 1 and two. That's the whole reason she got caught in her lie and had to make up two really bad role reveals. I caught her targeting wombat night 1, which was suspicious with his role reveal and no deaths N1, so I targeted her N2 and got her on Ley.

 

Also the vote on Leelou makes no sense. She would not switch her mafia killer to be on Ley who was also mafia. There's no way she's scum.

 

Got you.

 

Wait.... Nevermind my bad. You saw Kae target Ley (because Kae was driven to him instead of wombat). Could've said that a little clearer :P

[Pantsonfire]

As it stands I think BG has 6 votes....... One more person could end this messy day. Though with how turbulent the votes seem to have been they may change at any moment.

 

 

 

 

Not pushing a deathblow on him, just commenting in passing.

[Aiel Heart]

Dead Mafia Dead Town Claimed a role (Red plus green totally equals purple!!!)

 

1) Des--Watcher

N1--blocked

N2--Wombat(--Ley) --> Blackhoof, Tina, Turin #1, Sakaea, BG, Leelou.

N3--got no results

2) Turin #1- General Maximus Decimus Meridus - Town - Jailkeep - Died Night 3[/b]

N1-- (didn’t have info on this and didn’t go back to look, but Des at 12:11 am today said that he thought Turin #1 had jailed him “again” so sticking with believing Des then Turin must have targeted Des here)

N2(accoding to Des)-- Wombat --> Ley

N3--Des believes he was targeted

3) Maw - BATMAN Town- Mason - Lynched Day 1

4) Tina--Roleblocker

N1--No one

N2--Wombat -->Ley

N3--BG

5) Meesh - Voldemort - Mafia - Died night 3

6) Leelou-Bus driver

N1-- Red/NolLey

N2--Wombat/Ley

N3--Wombat/Meesh

7) Sakaea - SAURON - Mafia - Killer - Died Night 2

(according to Song):

N1--Wombat

N2--Wombat -->Ley

8) Blackhoof HAN SOLO - Town - Hider - Died Night 2

N1--we have no clue

N2--Wombat --> Ley

9) ReyTurin #2

10) Tiink

11) Amadine

12) Wombat--InventorDoc

N1: Wombat

N2: Amadine

N3: Wombat

13) Aiel Heart (targeted Wombat N3)

14) Locke

15) Poet - INDIAN JONES - Town - Finder--Lynched Day 2

16) Firepants

17) Song-Tracker

N1: Kae-->Wombat

N2: Kae-->Wombat

N3: BG--> Targeted no one

18) Nolder Leyrann - CRUELLA DE VILLE - Mafia - Goon--Died Night 2

19) Red

20) BG -Role blocker

N1--Des

N2--Wombat--> Ley

N3--Leelou

[Aiel Heart]

Bad things happen when I format at 2 am.

 

Well about to try to do it again. One minute.

[Aiel Heart]

Added blue for those who haven't died or claimed

 

Night 1 claims

*Des was blocked

*Turin #1 blocked him?

*Tina Targeted no one

*Leelou drove Red and Nol/Ley

*Song targeted Kae

*according to Song, Kae targeted Wombat (unknown whether she was killer at the time or not)

*we have no clue who Hoof hid with

*Wombat protected himself

*BG blocked Des

*I targeted no one

 

Night 2 claims

*Des spied on who targeted Wombat and actually got Ley and saw Hoof, Tina, Turin #1, Sakaea, BG, Leelou.

*Turin #1 (according to ^) jailed Wombat-->Ley

*Tina blocked Wombat --> Ley

*Leelou drove Wombat and Ley

*Kae tried to kill Wombat --> Ley

*Hoof hid with Wombat --> Ley

*Song tracked Kae and saw her target (Wombat-->)Ley

*Wombat protected Amadine

*BG targeted Wombat --> Ley

*I targeted no one

 

Night 3 claims

*Des got no results

*Des believes he was jailed by Turin #1 before death

*Tina blocked BG

*Leelou drives Wombat and Meesh

*Wombat protected himself

*Song tracked BG and saw that he targeted no one

*BG blocked Leelou

*I targeted Wombat --> Meesh

 

Leelou drove Wombat and Meesh, Meesh died so apparently Wombat’s self protect didn’t work. Tina claimed to RB BG who claimed to RB Wombat.

I ask again just in case it wasn’t seen above: would Wombat’s protection had transferred from being driven or protected whoever driven to?

No that it matters at this point though....

Once again:

1) Tina is lying about role or target

2) BG is lying about role or target

3) Wombat is lying about role or target (wouldn’t be the first time...)

There is a different RBer who has yet to claim (if there’s three there might as well be four--two on each team)

 

Deciding what to do here is difficult. Wombat’s been causing trouble this whole game, and his coroner’s report might clear a few things up. Leelou’s alignment still isn’t clear. But

a) Killing Tina or BG would reveal more right now

b) people aren’t likely to vote anyone but Tina or BG

 

Tina’s been pinging me more out of the two, so vote Tina

[Aiel Heart]

1) Wombat should be purple not green those two times

2) Totally didn't see what Firepants said.... Hmmm...... Might be better to just end this....

3) sorry guys--I think in colors

[Aiel Heart]

*Wombat was also not supposed to be red that one time.

refer to my color guide for any more possible mistakes

 

I'm keeping my vote where it is for now because it is past 2 am and I've been staring at this game too long

[Talya]

DAY 4 Vote

 

 

BG (6): Song, Pants,Tina, Leelou, Red, Locke

 

Tina (6): BG, Wombat, Red, Des, Turin, Tiinks, AH

 

Leelou (0): Red

 

 

[Turin Turambar]

[...]

 

I was pretty sure that wombat's inventor claim was false and looked to confirm a suspicion last night.

 

Okay what? I can't expect that there are 2 finders in this game so this looks to me like a scum slip.

 

Vote Turin

I never claimed finder, I never claimed role cop, I never claimed inventor. I did believe Wombat's inventor claim was false as I targeted him both N1 and N2. The reason I targeted him again N2 was due to the lack of a NK on N1. Make of it what you will. The more this goes along the more I think the mafia are pushing for this reveal to out the town power roles.

 

I have a question: if someone is jailed can they then be bussed? Kae claims to have jailed Wombat last night but Leelou claims to have bussed him with Ley. Is that a Mod call as to which would happen or does the actions that would have gone to Wombat go to Ley but the actions that would have gone to Ley not go to Wombat?

bolded for emphasis.

 

I cannot comment on this but I was told I could show this for information purposes.

 

I cannot comment on Maximus the Jailer's actions on N3.

[Pantsonfire]

So it comes down to Amadine......

 

 

 

 

I am near certain that Tina is town..... I implore some of those voting for her to switch to BG

[Turin Turambar]

With 12 hours until deadline and 2 people at L-1 we can take another look. I admit I am not sure who to believe. I would like to hear from some that are certain of their votes. Pants, You are saying your nearly certain Tina is Town. Will you tell me your reasoning?

[Amadine]

Nice catch on Song AH, I would be fine with a lynch on her after that lie being found - but do we have time for that?

 

Who else is around at the moment? I will vote song if it turns out that it's viable. Especially as i am still undecided between BG and Tina, leaning slightly towards voting Tina though, of the 2 her posts ping more.

 

The raised eyebrow was in response Leelou's scumtastic "stop targeting me" post.

[Pantsonfire]

1322721272[/url]' post='2060183']

1322717878[/url]' post='2060118']

In the middle of a reread but just thought I should show you guys this

 

 

1322595401[/url]' post='2057714']

My N2 result was Ley, not wombat. Which is why ley died, and not wombat.

 

Also I have been hinting at my character/role since night 1, so I would've had to be "faking" it since then. I don't see why you don't believe me, I was essential in taking Saky down. I understand doubting me, but flat out making up scenarios where I am helping a scum mate is a little far Red.

 

1322518301[/url]' post='2056307']

[took out list and some other stuff]

 

*shakes head* If you would actually read the game, instead of skim, you would know I targeted Kae nights 1 and two. That's the whole reason she got caught in her lie and had to make up two really bad role reveals. I caught her targeting wombat night 1, which was suspicious with his role reveal and no deaths N1, so I targeted her N2 and got her on Ley.

 

Also the vote on Leelou makes no sense. She would not switch her mafia killer to be on Ley who was also mafia. There's no way she's scum.

 

Got you.

 

Wait.... Nevermind my bad. You saw Kae target Ley (because Kae was driven to him instead of wombat). Could've said that a little clearer :P

 

 

1322730202[/url]' post='2060259']

Nice catch on Song AH, I would be fine with a lynch on her after that lie being found - but do we have time for that?

 

Who else is around at the moment? I will vote song if it turns out that it's viable. Especially as i am still undecided between BG and Tina, leaning slightly towards voting Tina though, of the 2 her posts ping more.

 

The raised eyebrow was in response Leelou's scumtastic "stop targeting me" post.

 

 

Heart corrected herself on that accusation.

 

Turin I'll get back to you after I've finished my cheat sheet (in the next hour or so) need to finish that before I go quote digging

 

 

[Amadine]

ARGH! Never post whilst exhausted - re-tracts statement on Song :/, my apologies.

 

Back to the original problem i guess :/

 

 

Let's get this over with VOTE TINA

[Pantsonfire]

Well Turin, looks like I won't go quote searching after all....

[Niniel]

Did I just die? Grrr... This is the funniest game I have been in and now I'm out. :(

Go heroes! You will find the villains and kill them all!

[bgrishinko]

Did I just die? Grrr... This is the funniest game I have been in and now I'm out. :(

Go heroes! You will find the villains and kill them all!

 

That can't be right. If you are town, I'll eat my hat.

[Niniel]

I hope you have a really big hat.

 

*hands BG salt and pepper*

[Aiel Heart]

Well Turin, looks like I won't go quote searching after all....

 

Eh can still just so no matter how this ends up you're prepared :P

 

Tina, it's been a pleasure playing with you. *Waits for coroner's report*