Caemlyn is burning!

[idiostock]

If the Band do a great job and save much of the city/population they (and by extention Mat) will get absolutely no thanks or recognition from Elayne. Elayne will try to use their efforts as some sort of excuse to try cheat Mat out of his medallion.

 

If the shandowspawn prove too numerous/strong for the Band and take the city (with most of the Band dying as heroes to try save the populace) Elayne will completely and entirely blame the Band and only the Band (and by extention Mat) for the loss of the city, completely ignoring her own part in it's demise as she can do no wrong remember? Elayne will try to use their efforts as some sort of excuse to try cheat Mat out of his medallion.

 

Either way it'll be yet another time I'll wish Elayne died off about 10 books ago.

 

Almost but not quite.

Don't forget that appx. 60% of the blame will be heaped on Rand for forcing her to be in Cairhien/Field of Merillor by his general lummoxing instead of Camelyn where she would have saved the day singlehandedly.

 

 

And the other 40% of the time she'll be blaming Rand for getting her with child. Like he willed them in their when she wasn't looking...

Somewhere in that exchange one of the men will be called a "wool-headed idiot".

 

It may take the form of "wool-brained lummox".

[cgk84]

If the Band do a great job and save much of the city/population they (and by extention Mat) will get absolutely no thanks or recognition from Elayne. Elayne will try to use their efforts as some sort of excuse to try cheat Mat out of his medallion.

 

If the shandowspawn prove too numerous/strong for the Band and take the city (with most of the Band dying as heroes to try save the populace) Elayne will completely and entirely blame the Band and only the Band (and by extention Mat) for the loss of the city, completely ignoring her own part in it's demise as she can do no wrong remember? Elayne will try to use their efforts as some sort of excuse to try cheat Mat out of his medallion.

 

Either way it'll be yet another time I'll wish Elayne died off about 10 books ago.

 

Almost but not quite.

Don't forget that appx. 60% of the blame will be heaped on Rand for forcing her to be in Cairhien/Field of Merillor by his general lummoxing instead of Camelyn where she would have saved the day singlehandedly.

 

 

And the other 40% of the time she'll be blaming Rand for getting her with child. Like he willed them in their when she wasn't looking...

Somewhere in that exchange one of the men will be called a "wool-headed idiot".

 

It may take the form of "wool-brained lummox".

 

And she'll accuse him of only thinking with the hairs on his chest.

[idiostock]

If the Band do a great job and save much of the city/population they (and by extention Mat) will get absolutely no thanks or recognition from Elayne. Elayne will try to use their efforts as some sort of excuse to try cheat Mat out of his medallion.

 

If the shandowspawn prove too numerous/strong for the Band and take the city (with most of the Band dying as heroes to try save the populace) Elayne will completely and entirely blame the Band and only the Band (and by extention Mat) for the loss of the city, completely ignoring her own part in it's demise as she can do no wrong remember? Elayne will try to use their efforts as some sort of excuse to try cheat Mat out of his medallion.

 

Either way it'll be yet another time I'll wish Elayne died off about 10 books ago.

 

Almost but not quite.

Don't forget that appx. 60% of the blame will be heaped on Rand for forcing her to be in Cairhien/Field of Merillor by his general lummoxing instead of Camelyn where she would have saved the day singlehandedly.

 

 

And the other 40% of the time she'll be blaming Rand for getting her with child. Like he willed them in their when she wasn't looking...

Somewhere in that exchange one of the men will be called a "wool-headed idiot".

 

It may take the form of "wool-brained lummox".

 

And she'll accuse him of only thinking with the hairs on his chest.

 

Every few sentences, she will notice how pretty Rand is.

[ImNoBloodyHero]

A thought strikes me...yes, Shadowspawn are using a waygate to attack and burn Caemlyn.

 

 

So where else are they emerging via waygate?

 

 

The borderlands are all but overrrun even without waygates. The Two Rivers should be safe with its waygate locked...Moiraine cut the waygate "a few hours south of Fal Dara" open so what stops a dreadlord from doing the same?

 

Shadar Logoth is gone...but is its waygate destroyed as well? Manetheren's survived the destruction of the city.

 

 

Who's watching the Cairhein waygate?

[Guest PipetoNul]

I may be wrong, but didn't Avienda's vision of her children meeting "the queen" take place at the Sun Throne in Cairhien?

 

That would indicate that Caemlyn has been destroyed.

[bysomy]

no, it took place in Caemlyn

[FarShainMael]

A thought strikes me...yes, Shadowspawn are using a waygate to attack and burn Caemlyn.

 

 

So where else are they emerging via waygate?

 

 

The borderlands are all but overrrun even without waygates. The Two Rivers should be safe with its waygate locked...Moiraine cut the waygate "a few hours south of Fal Dara" open so what stops a dreadlord from doing the same?

 

Shadar Logoth is gone...but is its waygate destroyed as well? Manetheren's survived the destruction of the city.

 

Who's watching the Cairhein waygate?

 

Hmm.. And there's a Waygate at Maradon - which was under the control of a DF, Torkumen.

 

Actually, I'm puzzled about the exact situation at Caemlyn. Where is the Band? We know it's moved closer to the walls though not inside them. Someone mentioned a 'ten-minute ride', is that right? Where in the camp is Talmanes? As Mat's second, he should be in the centre of the camp; but he's looking after Olver, so Mat may have wanted him to be somewhere less obvious. Either way, is he close enough to Caemlyn to get a clear view? If Caemlyn is actually burning, he would see more than just a 'reddish haze on the horizon', surely - he should see smoke, and flames.

 

Edit: A horse can canter at about 15mph; in 10 minutes that would be 15/6 = 2.5 miles.

[ineedfourberfs]

I can see the city burning. This is The Last Battle remember, some things will be lost to pave the way for a new age. Clear the rubble... how old is Caemlyn now? :P

 

I'd almost put money on the city being destroyed, or really, really chewed up.

[FarShainMael]

I can see the city burning.

 

What, from here??

 

(sorry.. couldn't resist! )

[garion]

Remember as Mat was going to meet Elayne that he noticed that the palace could hold its own in a siege and the only problem was that the guard had to camp outside the palace gates. I think that the band will battle into the New City then the palace to hold it until help arrives.

[Mats Spare Hat]

I can see the city burning.

 

What, from here??

 

(sorry.. couldn't resist! )

 

 

From my house! *palin-voice

[RelentlessAttack]

I think if the band and the other mercenary groups will have to fight on their own until mat gets there, and it'll be resolved with the band using the dragons in combat for the first time. RJ needed an opportunity to show their efficacy and here it is, the shadowspawn walk into a city full of newly cast dragons

[Simo]

What do you think will happen to Andor's capital??

 

I think Mat will call on the Seanchan, they'll cleanse Andor or Trollics & Darkfriends.

[FarShainMael]

I think if the band and the other mercenary groups will have to fight on their own until mat gets there, and it'll be resolved with the band using the dragons in combat for the first time. RJ needed an opportunity to show their efficacy and here it is, the shadowspawn walk into a city full of newly cast dragons

 

This!!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Muad Cheade]

I think if the band and the other mercenary groups will have to fight on their own until mat gets there, and it'll be resolved with the band using the dragons in combat for the first time. RJ needed an opportunity to show their efficacy and here it is, the shadowspawn walk into a city full of newly cast dragons

True, yet the Shadowspawn are already in the city and the Band and the other mercenaries are a few miles away. Not to mention, Mat, Thom, and Moiraine are going to be at the ToG until the following day at noon atleast.

[Annia]

 

As to the Band, the question is, how much damage has already been done. If they see the whole city burning, it seems like the trollocs are already well through a good portion of the city, so how much good are they going to be able to do, how much can they save, especially with Elayne gone and the Dragons vulnerable. Even if they have gateways available. I can't believe Mat didn't cave and open Verin's letter before, I'm impressed by his willpower.

 

So you suppose that noone in the city noticed when a trollock army walked the streets and handily set all the buildings in fire? I don't think trollocks have the dicipline to stay quiet and unnoticed that long. There would have been enough noise to raise the dead if the trollicks had been in Caemlyn in any lenght of time. By the time Talmanes and Olver noticed the flames, there were probably only a few buildings on fire. The trollocks would not be able to come in overwhelming numbers at first, they are coming from a waygate! The doorway is only so wide and they had to walk to the doorway in a line because the way only has bridges. I can't really imagine trollocks as patient queuers... The exit might not be as organised as we would see if it was a human army.

 

I think it is likely that it would take some time for all of them to come to Caemlyn. The number trollocks depends on how long it will take to mount a defence. If they can get to the gateway speedily and either close or destroy it (which I doubt), they would not have to fight a huge army of trollocks. Most likely the slow arrival of trollocks will simply help the defenders from being immediately overwhelmed, at least until they can get organised and figure out a plan.

 

There is also a good chance that Machin Chin snacked on some of the trollocks on the way, so it is up to anybody's guess how many of them is roaming around the city wreaking havok. I seriesly doubt the numbers sent will match the numbers arriving, but I'm sure there is a good sized army trying to squeeze out of the waygate.

[Muad Cheade]

So you suppose that noone in the city noticed when a trollock army walked the streets and handily set all the buildings in fire? I don't think trollocks have the dicipline to stay quiet and unnoticed that long. There would have been enough noise to raise the dead if the trollicks had been in Caemlyn in any lenght of time. By the time Talmanes and Olver noticed the flames, there were probably only a few buildings on fire. The trollocks would not be able to come in overwhelming numbers at first, they are coming from a waygate! The doorway is only so wide and they had to walk to the doorway in a line because the way only has bridges. I can't really imagine trollocks as patient queuers... The exit might not be as organised as we would see if it was a human army.

It is likely that some came through the Waygate in Caemlyn itself. The Waygate inside Caemlyn would give the Trollocs the element of surprise and coming through the Waygate outside Caemlyn gives them the space to deploy tactically. Trollocs organized by Myrdraal who are used by human commanders are lethal. Also, by the phrasing and tone that Talmanes used, it is very unlikely just a few buildings are on fire. And look at the example of the attack on Algarin's Manor in Tear for proof Trollocs can be sneaky when they wish to.

 

I think it is likely that it would take some time for all of them to come to Caemlyn. The number trollocks depends on how long it will take to mount a defence. If they can get to the gateway speedily and either close or destroy it (which I doubt), they would not have to fight a huge army of trollocks. Most likely the slow arrival of trollocks will simply help the defenders from being immediately overwhelmed, at least until they can get organised and figure out a plan.

The entire Shadowspawn foce that is attacking Caemyln is already fully through the Waygate, unless more are coming through the one inside the City.

 

There is also a good chance that Machin Chin snacked on some of the trollocks on the way, so it is up to anybody's guess how many of them is roaming around the city wreaking havok. I seriesly doubt the numbers sent will match the numbers arriving, but I'm sure there is a good sized army trying to squeeze out of the waygate.

That is unlikey as ever since Machin Shin interacted with Fain it has been acting irregularly. For example in KoD, 100,000 Shadowspawn are unmolested and attack Rand in Tear while in TSR small groups are being found by it. As we have seen in every major engagement of Tarmon Gai'din so far, the Shadow goes for overkill. There's 100,000 Trollocs at the very least.

[Entreri]

The force attacking is probably closer to 1/2 million, like the one Rand defeated in Maradon.

 

 

The Shadow would not send in a tiny force of 100,000 to take on a great city. If they have plans to take the city and move there to Tar Valon...Then the force could be a 1 million.

[htarcan]

I lost the track, where is the horn of valere? in tar valon or with the band? maybe mat blows it and saves what is left of caemlyn. You know, he didn't use it much.

[Muad Cheade]

I lost the track, where is the horn of valere? in tar valon or with the band? maybe mat blows it and saves what is left of caemlyn. You know, he didn't use it much.

It's in Tar Valon. He tells Edesina (I think) that he means to come and claim it soon.

[GrandpaG]

Brandon Sanderson did a good job of setting up a lot of possibilities without really giving anything away. Either that, or this plot was hatched by RJ himself. Whoever created it, the outcome will be worth waiting for.

 

I mentioned in another post that when I think about the Caemlyn situation it somehow takes me to the scene in either Egwene's or Nynaeve's Accepted trial where Rand is laying on a pile of rubble that used to be a city. I don't know why. It just does.

[Sleeper]

I lost the track, where is the horn of valere? in tar valon or with the band? maybe mat blows it and saves what is left of caemlyn. You know, he didn't use it much.

It's in Tar Valon. He tells Edesina (I think) that he means to come and claim it soon.

Knowing Aes Sedai they'll probably refuse him, saying that it's the property of the Tower .

[animals]

Am I the only one who got the Clash's "London's Burning" stuck in their head upon reading this?

[Razor]

where is the waygate? In a basement i the new city or old city?

[Guest RedSarg99]

Well the city is already burning - so most of the Old City will be up in flames.

The old Ogier Grove would have been in the Old City, my guess. The New City was built by humans?

Can't believe how silly Elayne would be to take her entire army - She travelled from Cairhien, so did she take her entire Andor force or just those who travelled with her to Cairhien, along with Cairhien's full force?

If that's the case there will be all out war raging inside the Old City.

 

Serves them all for trying to oppose Rand :-)