The White Tower

[maradon]

I dont know if anyone has talked about it, but I hope Gawyn doesnt do anything bloody stupid with those three bloodknife rings....

[WhiskyJack]

I dont know if anyone has talked about it, but I hope Gawyn doesnt do anything bloody stupid with those three bloodknife rings....

 

 

Something stupid like using them in great need? Dream must end sometime.

[Kidicaris]

I dont know if anyone has talked about it, but I hope Gawyn doesnt do anything bloody stupid with those three bloodknife rings....

 

 

Something stupid like using them in great need? Dream must end sometime.

 

 

He'd have to figure out how to activate them, so unless he tries one on a finger that he happened to have a nasty paper cut, he should be safe. Maybe Wondergirl Elayne could copy them and make them safer? But this relies on a lot of if's. If, Gawyn takes them to Egwene. If Egwene allows Elayne to experiment on them. If Elayne doesn't bungle this and give another ter'angreal to the Shadow. If if if.

 

It occurs to me that (at least some of) the Seanchan damane know how to make ter'angreal. If only one of them had been freed and Elayne met this woman. All those a'dam and rings have to come from somewhere.

[Kidicaris]

By the end of ToM the White Tower is actually in a very good position to deal with the Seanchan, because Teslyn's group has arrived in Tar Valon.

 

Teslyn and Edesina know the damane kennels in Ebou Dar well enough to Travel their. Bethamin and Seta obviously no longer think leashing women is right, and feel it's their duty to deal with the problem. They would also likely know where the damane are kept in many other Seanchan held cities. Leilwin also thinks leashing women is wrong, and must have a reason to want to go to Tar Valon (it's now even more likely she's the Seanchan woman with a sword, the wavering face being her Egeanin/Leilwin conflict). Juilin wants to see the Seanchan squished for what they did to Thera, and he's very familiar with skulking about the palace in Ebou Dar.

 

Teslyn, Joline, Edesina, Bethamin and Seta, at least, know Tuon can be taught to channel.

 

The Aes Sedai know the Seanchan likely have Travelling by now, and some would certainly be working to mitigate that threat. I expect a second Seanchan raid of the Tower would be far less successful. Also, given that danger, I don't see the Tower twiddling their thumbs over the problem.

 

All this adds up to the Aes Sedai striking back at the Seanchan. A carefully planned attack to capture damane or sul'dam could easily cripple the Seanchan without much collateral damage to the empire's soldiers or political structure. Alternatively, getting Tuon to start channeling would force her to deal head-on with the damane problem herself.

 

-- dwn

 

 

this is really well thought out. things i hadn't even begun to put together. i truly hope this happens and egwene is given the opportunity to free suffa from the a'dam. i love to see how Brandon handles it.

 

 

cheers

 

Free Suffa? I wonder if RJ/BS intends for this to happen. Starting with Liandrin it seems RJ was comfortable with non-death demises. Then Galina followed with her permanent slavery, and most recently Elaida and Mesaana. I wonder if Elaida will be given/deserves redemption since the only scene we are given is her betraying Traveling to the Seanchan and offering to trick more Aes Sedai into a'dam for her release. It seems like this scene is supposed to make us feel (even more than we already did feel) that she deserves her horrible fate, bam, no pudding for Suffa, moving on.

 

Also, it gets messy for the story if Elaida is released, on the eve of TG we'd have to read through MORE Elaida vs. Egwene. Is there space for that in AMoL?

 

Yet, it doesn't sit well with me that the Seanchan have so many/ANY Aes Sedai captives, and I wonder if it would sit well with Rand--who is a softie for a damsel in distress. In some perfect future Rand would bargain the release of non-Seanchan damane, but I wonder if RJ/BS would be willing to allow this. That Aiel future was pretty bleak, as have been the ends of the very Aes Sedai mentioned above.

 

The only solace we have is that RJ introduced the dreamspike. If more were found and replicated this could provide some protection against first strike Traveling attacks from the Seanchan.

[Kidicaris]

I posted this in the Nyneave thread, but I think it belongs here instead.

 

My major concern/disappointment with Egwene and the White Tower has been the shocking lack of any indication that they understand what it means--for Aes Sedai, that TG is going to start...well...tomorrow.

 

Of course we can hope real practical preparation for the Last Battle is happening off screen, but we didn't get much from Egwene's povs that gave any sense that the Aes Sedai are dusting their weaves off. Most of Egwene's thoughts were about the immediate threat--Mesaana, and the alliance of channelers going forward via internships--after TG. But if she believes Rand really is going to Travel to SG and break the Seals--and thus begin the Last Battle, you'd think we'd get a glimpse of the preparations for a great mobilization of Aes Sedai for use during the war. However by the end of the book, Egwene is watching Gawyn reunite with his mother when Rand arrives at Perrin's camp. This is the day before Rand has told her he would Travel to SG and she hasn't spared us one thought about what the Aes Sedai are going to do in the Last Battle.

 

There are many more ajahs than Green and Yellow, I only wish us readers were given a sense that the leadership in the White Tower were aware of their responsibilities and had some plans for the war. Does the normal Aes Sedai even know of any real weaves to fight with? Besides fireballs? When has a random Brown or White who has been buried in the Tower for 70 years last created the weave for lightning? I think we forget that not every Aes Sedai is even very strong in the Power. Many of our heroes are remarkable for their strength, but I suppose links can be created with weaker less battle savvy sisters but led by a Green or a Yellow in the Last Battle.

 

Oh thank the lord for Nynaeve, but she's not exactly preaching on a corner of Tar Valon. I wonder if the sisters at her testing will even admit she made sense and took to heart her quiet statement about Tarmon Gaidon.

[AutomatedTeller]

Well, the preparations for the war have been moved on to the Hall from Egwene. I do think it would have been easy to slip in some mention of passing "sisters on their way to battle-weave practice fields" - on the other hand, the rebels had prepared for attacks by forsaken, which they used to form links and battle the bubble of evil.

 

It may be that RJ/BS just thought that was obviously happening underneath everything, and it was much more important to show Child Byar foaming at the mouth more. Cause, you know, we might forget that he hates Perrin with every fiber of his being.

 

no, I think Egwene's PoV was correct - focus on Mesaana and how to deal with Rand first, then figure out Gawyn (cause heaven help anyone if they go to Tarman Gaidon not hooked up)

[TheAngryDruid]

Well, the preparations for the war have been moved on to the Hall from Egwene. I do think it would have been easy to slip in some mention of passing "sisters on their way to battle-weave practice fields" - on the other hand, the rebels had prepared for attacks by forsaken, which they used to form links and battle the bubble of evil.

 

It may be that RJ/BS just thought that was obviously happening underneath everything, and it was much more important to show Child Byar foaming at the mouth more. Cause, you know, we might forget that he hates Perrin with every fiber of his being.

 

no, I think Egwene's PoV was correct - focus on Mesaana and how to deal with Rand first, then figure out Gawyn (cause heaven help anyone if they go to Tarman Gaidon not hooked up)

 

While I think it was OK to focus on Mesaana, there are over 1,000 women in the Tower, they weren't all hunting for Mesaana. Heck, Siuan bemoans she is getting pushed aside, and that is only 3 days after VoG.

 

A month was more than enough time to:

 

1) Continue the Mesaana hunt

2) Get a satisfactory answer/word from both BT delegations (and get them re-sworn)

3) Contact the Borderlanders and their 13 AS (and get them re-sworn)

4) Get the Brown and White to start digging in about everything they can about the seals, the Bore, LTT, the War of Power, etc. Try to get some answers about how Rand can win, instead of just saying don't.

5) Think seriously about how AS can be more effective in combat situations. Adelorna and Egwene both have first hand experience. The Greens (and likely the Reds) should both be doing this in abundance.

6) Write some letters (which can be traveled there and back in a day). And utilize the Gray to do so.

7) Figure Gawyn out.

8) Find out what the Seanchan are up to.

 

Yes, it seems she only got 3 or 8 done, or even attempted them.

[CoonDawg]

My prediction (I believe it has been made before):

 

Seanchan will take over the White Tower while they're all meeting with Rand. Most of the other Aes Sedai should be outside of the tower, so it should be a pretty quick and easy victory. Rand will offer to help her with Logain's Asha'man (What about the Taim variable? I have no idea, I try not to think too far ahead), and they'll retake the tower together. Egwene will find a new respect for Rand, stop trying to be a pretentious fop and help him where she can. (Gawyn will realize he's an idiot after Rand saves his life over 9,000 times during the invasion.) They'll run hand-in-hand to Tarmon Gaidon, she'll help him with Callandor, with any luck she'll die a painful death, (And Gawyn is her Warder! PLOT CONVENIENCE,) cue Glossary.

[Kidicaris]

Well, the preparations for the war have been moved on to the Hall from Egwene. I do think it would have been easy to slip in some mention of passing "sisters on their way to battle-weave practice fields" - on the other hand, the rebels had prepared for attacks by forsaken, which they used to form links and battle the bubble of evil.

 

It may be that RJ/BS just thought that was obviously happening underneath everything, and it was much more important to show Child Byar foaming at the mouth more. Cause, you know, we might forget that he hates Perrin with every fiber of his being.

 

no, I think Egwene's PoV was correct - focus on Mesaana and how to deal with Rand first, then figure out Gawyn (cause heaven help anyone if they go to Tarman Gaidon not hooked up)

 

 

Hahaha, yes. BS even felt it was necessary to explain Child Byar's mouth-foaming hatred--as if being a Child wasn't enough. Now we know Graendal probably imprinted assassination into him with Compulsion. I give the girl credit though, she threw everything at him including the kitchen sink. No other method would work when trying to kill a person the PATTERN itself is protecting.

 

She should have gone herself, using inverted weaves and crazy (ter)angreal. He has no foxhead medallion. Hell, she went in and took out Asmodean w/o using Mask and Mirrors and seemingly waited in a random closet to headshot him.

 

You know what we need. A short story that Tor releases between ToM and AMoL that ties some loose ToM strings, lol. Strike at Shayol Ghul style. One where we get into the head of a few characters that world build a little, fill in some blanks, give us some incite into the Aes Sedai preparations of the Last Battle.

 

Romanda ringing her hands over the thought of her small number of Yellows (seriously how many Yellow sisters exist?) trying to triage so many soldiers in so many places.

Yukiri Sedai fumbling with the weaves that erupt the earth, because she sucks with Earth and Fire.

Rand sending Alivia to teach the greens her weaves, in return the Aes Sedai teach her anything they may know etc etc.

[Bob T Dwarf]

Well, the preparations for the war have been moved on to the Hall from Egwene. I do think it would have been easy to slip in some mention of passing "sisters on their way to battle-weave practice fields" - on the other hand, the rebels had prepared for attacks by forsaken, which they used to form links and battle the bubble of evil.

 

It may be that RJ/BS just thought that was obviously happening underneath everything, and it was much more important to show Child Byar foaming at the mouth more. Cause, you know, we might forget that he hates Perrin with every fiber of his being.

 

no, I think Egwene's PoV was correct - focus on Mesaana and how to deal with Rand first, then figure out Gawyn (cause heaven help anyone if they go to Tarman Gaidon not hooked up)

 

 

Hahaha, yes. BS even felt it was necessary to explain Child Byar's mouth-foaming hatred--as if being a Child wasn't enough. Now we know Graendal probably imprinted assassination into him with Compulsion. I give the girl credit though, she threw everything at him including the kitchen sink. No other method would work when trying to kill a person the PATTERN itself is protecting.

 

She should have gone herself, using inverted weaves and crazy (ter)angreal. He has no foxhead medallion. Hell, she went in and took out Asmodean w/o using Mask and Mirrors and seemingly waited in a random closet to headshot him.

 

You know what we need. A short story that Tor releases between ToM and AMoL that ties some loose ToM strings, lol. Strike at Shayol Ghul style. One where we get into the head of a few characters that world build a little, fill in some blanks, give us some incite into the Aes Sedai preparations of the Last Battle.

 

Romanda ringing her hands over the thought of her small number of Yellows (seriously how many Yellow sisters exist?) trying to triage so many soldiers in so many places.

Yukiri Sedai fumbling with the weaves that erupt the earth, because she sucks with Earth and Fire.

Rand sending Alivia to teach the greens her weaves, in return the Aes Sedai teach her anything they may know etc etc.

 

Are you high???

 

Preparations for battle? Exchanges of information?

 

That would all make sense. When has anybody in this series done anything that made sense? It just isn't allowed.

 

Put down whatever you're smoking, RIGHT NOW! Go lie down. Place cool compresses on your forehead.

[PatsNats28]

Someone on here called that Mesaana was Danelle a few months ago... who was that? They deserve a fair amount of credit.

[Bob T Dwarf]

Someone on here called that Mesaana was Danelle a few months ago... who was that? They deserve a fair amount of credit.

 

Mesaana's identity has been a solved puzzle for a few years now. Many people deduced she was Danelle a long time ago.

[Kidicaris]

Does anyone here know the name of the BA that tried to kill Perrin and Egwene with balefire during the TAR battle? She is described as being tall, with a slender neck and having raven black hair. She is also wearing a sleek white dress--before Egwene pulled the ceiling down on her slender neck. She was strong enough to weave balefire, who was this?

 

I only ask because strength in the One Power has always obsessed me, and the initial ambush was said to have several woman who were very strong in the Power.

[Guest Spirus]

So I noticed that Carlinya was killed as a throwaway reference during the Big BA Battle, yet Min had a viewing of her at one point related to a Seanchan tattoo. Anyone have an interpretation of the viewing because I can't recall her ever having contact with the Seanchan?

[Sharaman]

Does anyone here know the name of the BA that tried to kill Perrin and Egwene with balefire during the TAR battle? She is described as being tall, with a slender neck and having raven black hair. She is also wearing a sleek white dress--before Egwene pulled the ceiling down on her slender neck. She was strong enough to weave balefire, who was this?

 

I only ask because strength in the One Power has always obsessed me, and the initial ambush was said to have several woman who were very strong in the Power.

The neck sounded like Alviarin but it's not since Alviarin was alive later and presumably escaped.

[knutz]

So I noticed that Carlinya was killed as a throwaway reference during the Big BA Battle, yet Min had a viewing of her at one point related to a Seanchan tattoo. Anyone have an interpretation of the viewing because I can't recall her ever having contact with the Seanchan?

 

Ravens are also the DO's birds. Maybe she got one herself?

[Jeangray]

Raven is a symbol of the Shadow - and that says a lot about the Seanchan and why they were the way they were before the Conquest. Maybe the raven "tatoo" just meant that Carlinya would be killed by servants of the Shadow.

[Charlz Guybon]

With the exception of Nynaeve, the Aes Sedai in the tower have reached new heights of idiocy. Despite knowing that the Borderlands are being overrun by Shadowspawn they do nothing about it. The Hall has control of the armies, but rather then do something like send Gareth Bryne, 50,000 men and 50 sisters to Shienar they just go along with Egwene's plan to meet Rand on the field of Merrilor. WTF?

[AutomatedTeller]

We don't know that they did nothing about it.

I mean, based on this book, Rand went to the Field of Merrilor without dealing in any way with the Black Tower or the Seanchan.

For all we know, 1/2 the White Tower is in the borderlands right now

[Bob T Dwarf]

We don't know that they did nothing about it.

I mean, based on this book, Rand went to the Field of Merrilor without dealing in any way with the Black Tower or the Seanchan.

For all we know, 1/2 the White Tower is in the borderlands right now

 

Yeah. I suspect that as much as the first 1/3 or even 1/2 of A Memory of Light will overlap Towers of MIdnight.

 

The Borderlanders are not at Merrilor as far as I know, and Rand certainly didn't leave them in Far Madding. Rand himself has a lot of unaccounted time. So does Egwene.

 

There's still an awful lot about the situation we don't know yet.

[Sharaman]

Raven is a symbol of the Shadow - and that says a lot about the Seanchan and why they were the way they were before the Conquest. Maybe the raven "tatoo" just meant that Carlinya would be killed by servants of the Shadow.

It's been RAFO-ed in a signing by Brandon and confirmed that this is a deliberate kill (on his part).

The Borderlanders are at Merrilor I think.

[Tom Sawyer]

I still think that one of the BA used her Dreamland abilities to make a raven tattoo shuriken and threw it at Carlinya's head to kill her.

[Sharaman]

I still think that one of the BA used her Dreamland abilities to make a raven tattoo shuriken and threw it at Carlinya's head to kill her.

Maybe they turned her into a raven and did a Monty Python - "It is an ex-raven, it's a former raven"?

[DemandredFO]

It's good to see Egwene is still Egwene. She makes me like Gawyn, and she would've been dead if they hadn't come to get her in tGS. I think she realizes this and is punishing Gawyn for being right; also I think she loves Gawyn but knows 3rd age Aes Sedai don't do such. As someone said no help for the borderlands. Unlike the Trollocs wars and Malkiers fall they have traveling; why the bloody hell is the green called the Battle Ajah if they don't battle. Rand, the Arad doman Great Captain and some AM had to destroy Trollocs. As misguided as Letra was, at least she had a plan; it was a bad one but she did have one.

Nyneave is probably the first true AS is 3000 yrs; Rand doesn't count because he somewhat cheated to get there. I like that Nyneave healed madness, after all she is a healer. Elayne is more of an AS than Egwene is. Not saying Elayne is anywhere close to Nyneave but she at least and started to implement I think free healing and paid Travelling. While the Travelling idea isn't ideal, at least its more than Egwene is doing. Andor is a government and it must be close to as complex as the WT; if Elayne can multi-task why not Egwene.

Finally, to the people belittling the writing or saying this or that isn't realistic. PAY ATTENTION to current events or read some history. You'll see that WoT is not so unrealistic as you think it is.

[Kaznen]

This is concerning the outrage of AM bonding AS.

 

I am waiting for one of the AM (Rand is an AM) to speak up about this in a matter like:

 

"Well, they had a company of the Tower Guard with them unlawfully operating on foreign soil. They had orders to gentle and hang every male channeler they found on the spot, Tower Law says they must be brought back to Tar Valon to be gentled. And the Tower guard had orders to kill everyone else at the Black Tower, women and children, the Asha'mans' families.

 

We could have just killed them, it was well within our right."