Who Would YOU Want Commanding YOUR Army in One ''Last Battle'' ?!!

[The Fisher King]

I do not necessarily mean just THE ''Last Battle'' but you can consider as included ANY **Major*** Battle that you just HAD to win!

 

Please use - as what you use to consider your choice - what we know and mayve have seen in books 1 - 12.

 

I am leaning towards Rodel Itulrade with a SLIGHT edge over Mat Cauthon ... BUT, I also feel worthy candidates as a ''Great Captain'' of an army in one big really battle should also include:

 

Rand Al Thor

 

Perrin Aybara

 

Pedron Niall

 

Davram Bashere

 

and:

 

Jaged Algemar

 

Am I missing anybody?

 

Mat has not only his OWN natural military skill - and ''LUCK'' but also all those other guys experience in his head. His campaigns in TFOH and KOD were brilliant.

 

Rodel has been BADLY OUTNUMBERED for the last 3 books but still Kicking A$$.

 

Perrin is very solid as a practical tactician and Rand is no slouch militarily speaking either. Aglemar has a lifetime of fighting in The Blight...Pedron Niall and Davram are acknowledged as ''BRILLIANT'' though we THE READER have not been given any glimpse or examples of them in battle in the series so far (RIP Pedron).

 

But, I think Rodel and Mat are a cut above the rest, clearly.

 

 

Fish

[gambril]

Lol, that's easy, Matrim Cauthon hands down.  The Great Captains are good generals but Mat would destroy them.  In his campaign in Altara, we're told he lost 900 men in his raids and ambushes and aren't told how many he lost in Prince of the Ravens chapter but lets say 300-500 men tops. So he lost 1.5kish men and took out 25k-30k men.  I'm no military expert but to take out men with a 30/1 ratio pre-modern warfare weapons is devistating.  And when he gets those canons and a faster firing crossbow/possibly some form of gun it'll be lights out for Randland.  Aes Sedai what?

[Thorum]

Mat of course. He's like a thousand great generals in one.

[Fains nose]

Mat would obviously be the best general because he has hundreds of lifetimes of experiance, id choose him. Also i like Agelmar Jagad, so hed be number 2. Or that crazy genius general that bashere knew. The one who was mad and once ordered his troops to bury 30 oak trees, but never lost a battle

[Tollieman]

I would say Mat as obvious for a number of reasons - He's adaptable, innovative, and besides all his memories, he himself is amazingly quick-thinking and brilliant tactically.

 

Put all of those memories in my head and I reckon I'd still be pretty useless (if not mad).

 

Out of the 'regular' generals, I like Ituralde, because he we've actually seen him be brilliant, and I always favour those who are honourable and decent. Of course, as quiet and 'gentle' as he comes across, I reckon Agelmar Jagad would be a terror on the battlefield!

[Dero]

Mat would obviously be the best general because he has hundreds of lifetimes of experiance, id choose him. Also i like Agelmar Jagad, so hed be number 2. Or that crazy genius general that bashere knew. The one who was mad and once ordered his troops to bury 30 oak trees, but never lost a battle

Muad Cheade

[nolirion]

Mad Rand AL'thor with the Choedan Kal , who need a general when you can Balefire the whole place ?

Tought  Rand sane also because he would have Mat on is side plus Bashere and Lan

[Kal Logan]

You forgot to mention Gareth Bryne, he is also one of the " great captains "

[OptimusPrime]

*sigh*

 

I need to learn to read properly. Thought it was how would you divide you forces hahaha.

 

Mat all the way.

[FarShainMael]

Marshal flaming General First Prince of the bloody Ravens Matrim burning Cauthon. Of course. And airborne on a raken with supplies of rockets.

 

 

[Thor]

You'd be mistaken to think that Mat has any more than 50/50 chance against any of the great captains.

 

War is dynamic, using dead memories will get you nowhere against a living opponent who is acting properly.

[farthammer]

Weiramon

[Duskfire]

You'd be mistaken to think that Mat has any more than 50/50 chance against any of the great captains.

 

War is dynamic, using dead memories will get you nowhere against a living opponent who is acting properly.

 

I would have to disagree. Every tactic, every stragedy that any of those great captains thought of Mat would instantly be able to come up with his own to rebutt their one. Not to mention he has luck, is a quick innovative thinker himself, and his men absolutely adore him. When was the last time you heard of dissent in Mats army, at all? Then of course you factor in the grenades and the rapid firing crossbows which prove him with better weaponry then any of the others.

 

Mat proved in the Battle of Cairheren how quick a thinker he is. With no planning, no set up whatsoever, he took a group of men who had just lose their commander to defeating the Aiel time and time again. He basically won the war for them.

 

Great Captains would have no chance against Mat. They wouldn't be able to do anything that would surprise or shock him.

[Ataxia]

Are we giving each general the same army? If not id have to take Rand with his army of Ashaman, then probably Ituradle+ ashaman. If its equal armies I think everyone would take Mat.

[Tsunami]

Weiramon

Charge?

 

Yes, please.

[gambril]

You'd be mistaken to think that Mat has any more than 50/50 chance against any of the great captains.

 

War is dynamic, using dead memories will get you nowhere against a living opponent who is acting properly.

 

I have to disagree as well.  The Great Captains have one lifetime of battles, while Mat has hundreds if not thousands of memories of battles and war.  Lets not even mention Mat's superior weaponry.  Once cannon's come into the equation a force of 500 men with cannons and Mat leading will be able to rip apart any army, including channelers seeing how he'll be able to blow them to ashes from over 2 miles away.  Once Mat has all the tools he needs in place, it will be like an adult playing with children; it won't even be fair.

 

I find the idea I read in some post on here that Mat will trade the crossbow designs and cannons to Tuon for an agreement to release damane and suldam as weapons.  I think Tuon is going to get a 'taste' of these cannons when next she attacks and will be devistated by them all the while seeing Mat and his red hand symbol smashing her army to pieces.  This revelation to Tuon and all the Seanchan will allow everyone (WT, Rand, Seanchan) to actually come to some form of agreement with everyone moderately appeased with their gains.  Sorry for the unrelated tangent, but yeah.

[farthammer]

Mat is better with a smaller force and more of a free hand, whatever ingenuity he has would be stifled if he had to manage a large campaign like we see the 'great captains' being involved with.  They are a lot more political and I think it's pointless trying to compare them, as I think Mat would be more valuable if he was under the command of someone like Bryne.

[Impressive Bosom]

Matt. With Itulrade as 2nd in command.

 

I'd have Perrin and Balwer (sp) managing the supply lines and logistics, Chel Vanin in charge of the scouts, Rhuarc and Lan as front-line commanders and Gawyn and Galad leading the vanguard.

 

And while we're at it, Egwene in charge of the fighting channelers, Nynaeve in charge of the wounded, Alivia as a personal bodyguard and Berelain back at the tents keeping the bedroll warm.  ;D

[gambril]

Mat is better with a smaller force and more of a free hand, whatever ingenuity he has would be stifled if he had to manage a large campaign like we see the 'great captains' being involved with.  They are a lot more political and I think it's pointless trying to compare them, as I think Mat would be more valuable if he was under the command of someone like Bryne.

 

I have to disagree with this as well. I think you're missing the point that Mat is a great general and argurably the greatest general possible in Randland, which by definition implies he's a master of battles regardless if it's a force of 5k or a force of 100k+.  His observations of the battle plan in TFOH proves this. It can also be argued that the reason Mat is more effective is because he disregards anything political.  And in war, when push comes to shove, it's kill or be killed...politics aside.  'The Lion can have no mercy' :)  

 

Another reason Mat is great is because he hasn't been hampered or impeded by others like Byrne is.  Byrne is all tied up in politics with the Aes Sedai and can only act when he is 'allowed' to.  Byrne can be a great asset to Mat so long as Mat has the final say in how everything goes down, but Byrne in charge with Mat under his thumb would effectively weaken the Light's forces.

 

*Disclaimer - I'm very biased towards Mat seeing how is he the coolest character ever so take what I say with a grain of salt

[farthammer]

It's just the nature of military structures and war, the higher up you go the more political the position.  It's not taking anything away from Mat saying he is not best suited for the highest ranking positions, his talents are just best used elsewhere.  Any of the other great captains could take the organizational and logistical burden away from Mat and let him be good at what he's good at.  Like at Cairhien, he was not running the entire war, there's no reason for him to.

[gambril]

Yes I agree with this but what I mean is as far as the execution of how the tactics are applied should be Mat's final decision.

[farthammer]

I think even Mat disagrees:

 

“Everything always changes. The best plan lasts until the first arrow leaves the bow.”

[gambril]

I think even Mat disagrees:

 

“Everything always changes. The best plan lasts until the first arrow leaves the bow.”

 

That isn't Mat disagreeing.  That's just Mat, being the master of war, knowing that in war plans always change and tactics have to adapt to the changes otherwise you'll be smothered.  Who better to adapt and change their plans accordingly than Mat?  He did this in Cairhen and during his campaign in Altara in almost every battle.

[Thor]

You'd be mistaken to think that Mat has any more than 50/50 chance against any of the great captains.

 

War is dynamic, using dead memories will get you nowhere against a living opponent who is acting properly.

 

I would have to disagree. Every tactic, every stragedy that any of those great captains thought of Mat would instantly be able to come up with his own to rebutt their one. Not to mention he has luck, is a quick innovative thinker himself, and his men absolutely adore him. When was the last time you heard of dissent in Mats army, at all? Then of course you factor in the grenades and the rapid firing crossbows which prove him with better weaponry then any of the others.

 

Mat proved in the Battle of Cairheren how quick a thinker he is. With no planning, no set up whatsoever, he took a group of men who had just lose their commander to defeating the Aiel time and time again. He basically won the war for them.

 

Great Captains would have no chance against Mat. They wouldn't be able to do anything that would surprise or shock him.

 

Assuming that all of the great captains are loyal to the light, if Mat were to fight any of them, he would instantly lose his luck due to perverting his purpose in the pattern. So luck will not save him, at all.

 

And bashere wasn't even at the battle of cairhien therefore your second point is totally invalid.

[farthammer]

That isn't Mat disagreeing.  That's just Mat, being the master of war, knowing that in war plans always change and tactics have to adapt to the changes otherwise you'll be smothered.  Who better to adapt and change their plans accordingly than Mat?  He did this in Cairhen and during his campaign in Altara in almost every battle.

 

His ability to do that is limited the larger and larger his command becomes.  He has his successes when he is with his Band, and not in a tent somewhere looking at a map.  He's fun to read because he's always right there mixing it up and moving quickly.  Putting him in charge of everything makes that impossible for him and his scenes will become as boring as Bryne's, or Rand's during Cairhien.  Big armies move real slow.