Ask A Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer (No AMoL Spoilers)

[yoniy0]

I am re-reading CoT and I can't remember - do we know why Aran'gar killed the the two Blues in the rebel camp?

 

Cabrianna Mercendes (If I spelt that correctly) and her warder were tortured and killed by Semirhage earlier in the series. Halima arrived in Salidar claiming to be sent by Cabrianna, and that she died in a fall from her horse (or something like that). The two blues in the camp, Kairen and Anaiya (I think) were Cabrianna's best friends from Novice right through to Aes Sedai. So guessing they were killed by Halima in case Cabriannas death was questioned too closely, or was already being questioned by the two.

 

Apologies about spelling, not read those books for a few months and dont have them near me to reference chapters etc

That's the most likely possibility (I believe Egwene thinks to herself that the only strong connection between Anaiya and Kairen was Cabriana).

 

However, one amendment I'd make is that Halima was not just worried about the circumstances of Cabriana's death being questioned. She was worried that she'd be suspected of never having known Cabriana in the first place.

Also, Egwene might be right in suspecting that someone was trying to foil her plans to block Northharbor and Southharbor. Those two were her best cuendillar makers.

 

Romanda works it out exactly that way - thereby proving that she's actually a smarter cookie than most.

Hmm. She had a lot of help. What stopped others from putting it together was the use of sai'din. Romanda was told about the connection not 30 minutes before Jahar told her of a sai'din weilding female Forsaken.

 

Any thoughts on the second question in my post regarding the 'darkfriend social' and why its not until the KoD that the forsaken get to see what the darkfriends know way back when?

Well, that's just the way things are, apparently. Semirhage tells Moridin that he should've shared their appearances earlier - indicating that he hasn't, until then.

[Durinax]

do we know why the ogier couldnt reach Manetheren in time to help? I am doing a reread of EotW and loial says to rand

 

"...Your pain sings in my heart, Rand Al'thor. We could not come in time."

[Sharaman]

Also, Egwene might be right in suspecting that someone was trying to foil her plans to block Northharbor and Southharbor. Those two were her best cuendillar makers.

Romanda works it out exactly that way - thereby proving that she's actually a smarter cookie than most.

Hmm. She had a lot of help. What stopped others from putting it together was the use of sai'din. Romanda was told about the connection not 30 minutes before Jahar told her of a sai'din weilding female Forsaken.

True but she does realise that the two AS killed with saidin were friends of Cabriana and makes the connection to Halima.

[Hybrid]

I am re-reading CoT and I can't remember - do we know why Aran'gar killed the the two Blues in the rebel camp?

 

Cabrianna Mercendes (If I spelt that correctly) and her warder were tortured and killed by Semirhage earlier in the series. Halima arrived in Salidar claiming to be sent by Cabrianna, and that she died in a fall from her horse (or something like that). The two blues in the camp, Kairen and Anaiya (I think) were Cabrianna's best friends from Novice right through to Aes Sedai. So guessing they were killed by Halima in case Cabriannas death was questioned too closely, or was already being questioned by the two.

 

Apologies about spelling, not read those books for a few months and dont have them near me to reference chapters etc

That's the most likely possibility (I believe Egwene thinks to herself that the only strong connection between Anaiya and Kairen was Cabriana).

 

However, one amendment I'd make is that Halima was not just worried about the circumstances of Cabriana's death being questioned. She was worried that she'd be suspected of never having known Cabriana in the first place.

Also, Egwene might be right in suspecting that someone was trying to foil her plans to block Northharbor and Southharbor. Those two were her best cuendillar makers.

I remember that Kairen was. But I don't think that it was ever mentioned for Anaiya. (A quick check of encyclopaedia-wot shows that Egwene, Leane, Kairen, and Bodewhin are mentioned as the top cuendillar makers in Ch 17, COT.)

 

Also, wasn't Anaiya murdered before Egwene came up with her plan?

IIRC, Egwene thinks in Ch 17 about how two novices accidentally fuse two cups into one object, but she hasn't connected that idea to the harbor chains yet. Three chapters worth of Egwene POVs -- and no mention of cuendillar or an inkling of her plan -- later, Anaiya is murdered and Egwene does not have any idea why. Finally, in Ch 30, the next Egwene POV, we get Kairen's murder and this time Egwene thinks about having to replace her in her plan.

[dovien]

do we know why the ogier couldnt reach Manetheren in time to help? I am doing a reread of EotW and loial says to rand

"...Your pain sings in my heart, Rand Al'thor. We could not come in time."

I love that line. I don't think a reason is explicitly given but I think it's likely they couldn't make it either due to logistical reasons, due to being engaged in battle or blocked by enemy units or due to being too slow to make a decision.

[yoniy0]

True but she does realise that the two AS killed with saidin were friends of Cabriana and makes the connection to Halima.

Nisao tells her that they were friends of Cabriana's. At first she doesn't remember where she last heard of Cabriana (you would think sisters die all the time, the way no one remembers that connection), but then Jahar's remark makes it come together in her mind. That she infers that Halima is a Forsaken is commendable. But that she (or anyone else) doesn't think of speaking with her regarding Cabriana's death after the third in that group turns up dead in a matter of months is pretty dense, I think.

 

Also, Egwene might be right in suspecting that someone was trying to foil her plans to block Northharbor and Southharbor. Those two were her best cuendillar makers.

I remember that Kairen was. But I don't think that it was ever mentioned for Anaiya. (A quick check of encyclopaedia-wot shows that Egwene, Leane, Kairen, and Bodewhin are mentioned as the top cuendillar makers in Ch 17, COT.)

 

Also, wasn't Anaiya murdered before Egwene came up with her plan?

IIRC, Egwene thinks in Ch 17 about how two novices accidentally fuse two cups into one object, but she hasn't connected that idea to the harbor chains yet. Three chapters worth of Egwene POVs -- and no mention of cuendillar or an inkling of her plan -- later, Anaiya is murdered and Egwene does not have any idea why. Finally, in Ch 30, the next Egwene POV, we get Kairen's murder and this time Egwene thinks about having to replace her in her plan.

You know, I never considered that those two novices were what gave her the idea. It seems clear now that you mention it, though.

As to Anaiya, I admit I may have been mistaken. I've searched the relevant parts of CoT again, and I can indeed find no clue that Anaiya had a Talent for making cuandillar. I suppose the thing that got me thinking this way was the following line:

Egwene set her spoon down on the tiny table and leaned back. Suddenly, her chair did not feel comfortable anymore. Now the next best after Leane was Bode Cauthon.

I was probably reading too much into it, but the use of the word 'now' smelled of frustration, to me. Like, this isn't the first time that her plans were disturbed.

By the way, have you noticed that both times Nisao break the news to Egwene, the first thought on her mind is how uncomfortable her chair was? Funny, that.

[Durinax]

do the red ajah borrow warders from somewhere? during my reread of EotW Moraine says that there are 20 AS in the city and all are red but her, but during the description of the parade there are warders mentioned

[Sid]

do the red ajah borrow warders from somewhere? during my reread of EotW Moraine says that there are 20 AS in the city and all are red but her, but during the description of the parade there are warders mentioned

 

(From the old version of the FAQ)

What about those Warders in Caemlyn around Logain in TEOTW? [TEOTW: 42, Remembrance of Dreams, 535] Didn't Moiraine say that they were all Red sisters? Reds don't have Warders! RJ's answer, as reported by Tony Z: Moiraine never mentioned the sisters escorting Logain (not all of whom were Red). The ones with Logain weren't in Caemlyn at the time (evidently they stayed with the army, which stayed outside the city). Moiraine was referring to those that were in Caemlyn.

Edited October 22, 2010 by Sid

[Durinax]

thanks sid

[FrankNeumann]

Have we figured out what "Must give up half the light of the world to save the world" is supposed to mean?

[Val Mickey]

It's his eye.

99.99%

[Durinax]

I dont know, I could see it being something like mat having to call a retreat from the field of battle to save rand or something, thus effectively giving up the 'light' for half the world

[waffle]

"Must give up half the light of the world to save the world". The bolded part makes me think that it´s something more than just losing his eye (not that if i lost an eye i would think: oh no worries, it´s just an eye). Since he met up with Aludra again i´ve wondered if maybe at some point his cannons and other explosive goodies will turn the tide at some decisive battle during Tarmon Gaidon (saves the world). Yay, victory for the Light side. Woopee. However, after the Last Battle is won and the victory parties are over, these new technologies will be used in further conflicts and the results will be quite horrible (give up half the light of the world).

 

Not quite sure if the difference in slaughter-effectiveness between arrows/swords and gunpowder is enough to lend credibility to this theory though.

[mb]

Have we figured out what "Must give up half the light of the world to save the world" is supposed to mean?

There seems to be these two possibilities::

-going blind in one eye

-literally loosing one eye

Currently there seems equal chance for either.

[Sid]

Could be half the forces of the Light in the Last Battle. If he ends up being in charge and the only strategy that has a chance of winning is one that half the forces of the Light aren't going to survive, then he might very well make that decision when he's faced with such a horrible choice. And since the Band of the Red Hand is always where the fighting is hottest, they very well might end up with a very low survival rate.

 

Mat would do it, and hate himself for it, but as a last or only resort, he'd do it, Light help him.

[Tom Sawyer]

Speaking of Mat's Finnland prophecies, one that's always seemed odd to me is the "dying and living again as part of what was" (forget the exact line) one.

 

Marrying the Daughter of the Nine Moons is a significant event in his life. Giving up half the light of the world will apparently be a significant event in his life. Getting killed and then balefired back to life seems to be pretty irrelevant. It really plays no part in the story at all. It just seems to be totally unrelated to the other two in terms of being relevant enough to include.

[didymos]

Speaking of Mat's Finnland prophecies, one that's always seemed odd to me is the "dying and living again as part of what was" (forget the exact line) one.

 

Marrying the Daughter of the Nine Moons is a significant event in his life. Giving up half the light of the world will apparently be a significant event in his life. Getting killed and then balefired back to life seems to be pretty irrelevant. It really plays no part in the story at all. It just seems to be totally unrelated to the other two in terms of being relevant enough to include.

 

It was "To die and live again, and live once more a part of what was!" The first bit's got two options: when the Foxes hung him from Avendesora and Rand had to CPR him, or, as you've interpreted it, when Rahvin nailed him with lightning and killed him, after which Rand resurrected him via balefire. The second bit refers to the memories ("part of what was") he receives which he then often finds himself suddenly reliving as if he were truly there ("live once more"). The way the two are tied together in one answer suggests that it was actually the hanging incident that fulfilled "To die and live again" and not the balefire deal.

Edited October 23, 2010 by didymos

[Duskfire]

Speaking of Mat's Finnland prophecies, one that's always seemed odd to me is the "dying and living again as part of what was" (forget the exact line) one.

 

Marrying the Daughter of the Nine Moons is a significant event in his life. Giving up half the light of the world will apparently be a significant event in his life. Getting killed and then balefired back to life seems to be pretty irrelevant. It really plays no part in the story at all. It just seems to be totally unrelated to the other two in terms of being relevant enough to include.

 

It was "To die and live again, and live once more a part of what was!" The first bit's got two options: when the Foxes hung him from Avendesora and Rand had to CPR him, or, as you've interpreted it, when Rahvin nailed him with lightning and killed him, after which Rand resurrected him via balefire. The second bit refers to the memories ("part of what was") he receives which he then often finds himself suddenly reliving as if he were truly there ("live once more"). The way the two are tied together in one answer suggests that it was actually the hanging incident that fulfilled "To die and live again" and not the balefire deal.

 

RJ confirmed it was the balefire incident. Mat wasnt dead when he was hung, just very close to it.

 

I was thinking the same thing the other day Tom; Mat being killed and then coming back via balefire seems to serve no purpose. In fact, he basically did nothing in that fight as far as I can tell. He could have not even gone which was the original plan and nothing would have changed. Even during the Moiraine/Lanfear fight prior to that Mat didn't do anything.

[didymos]

RJ confirmed it was the balefire incident.

 

Oh, that's right. I forgot about that. As to it not being important enough: it was to Rand, and it was to Mat, even if he only suspected the truth. Not every prophecy has to be hugely important in terms of causing a big change. That's even more true of the Snake answers, which are just about stuff that'll happen to you and are always grandiloquent. They could probably make eating cookies sound really awesome and significant.

Edited October 23, 2010 by didymos

[Val Mickey]

I fail to see how losing half the world's troops could qualify as losing half the light of the world. To me that sounds like losing most of it.

 

Q: If Finnland is folded in mysterious ways, could it be that Rand's interpreter was... Moirane herself?

 

Q2: (More speculation) If Rand were severed, how would that affect the Rand - Moridin bond?

[Barid Bel Medar]

I fail to see how losing half the world's troops could qualify as losing half the light of the world. To me that sounds like losing most of it.

 

Q: If Finnland is folded in mysterious ways, could it be that Rand's interpreter was... Moirane herself?

 

Q2: (More speculation) If Rand were severed, how would that affect the Rand - Moridin bond?

 

1. Interesting. But I dont htink it is possible. While there is a lot of time-distortion in WoT, I think RJ has pretty solid logic of physics. There is no way to go back into the past. It is only a "Time passes faster or slower in this place" not a "this place travels back in time"

 

Also, Rand would have mentioned/noticed Moiraine being the interpreter. In at least 1 of his PoV it would come up. Also, I think the interpreter is described anyway.

 

2. That is a very interesting point. I am not sure. THe origin of the link was definitely Power related. but now Rand sees Moridin without channeling and are connected physically (Moridins hand tGS) and mentally (pulled into Moridins "Dream") So if i had to guess, my answer would be the bond would still remain. But we dont have enough information to say, i dont think.

[didymos]

Have we figured out what "Must give up half the light of the world to save the world" is supposed to mean?

 

Consider how Mat shares so much with Odin:

 

Many of Odin's epithets include the word "battle (e.g. "God of Battles"). Mat is called "son of battles" by the Snakes.

 

Odin was seen as the bringer of victory (another of his titles, for instance, was Sigtryggr or "Sure of Victory"). So is Mat by those who follow him.

 

Odin's primary weapon is the magical spear Gungnir. Mat gains the One Power-wrought ashandarei from the Foxes.

 

The name "Gungnir" means "Swaying One" and refers to the fact that Odin once hung himself from a tree to gain knowledge of runes:

 

I know that I hung on a windy tree nine long nights,

wounded with a spear, dedicated to Odin,

myself to myself,

on that tree of which no man knows

from where its roots run.

 

Mat later quips in LoC: "You could say I was hanged for knowledge." Amongst other things, Mat gained from that ordeal full knowledge of the Old Tongue, including the ability to read it.

 

Odin has a pair of ravens, Hugin and Munin, and their names mean "Thought" and "Memory". Mat's ashandarei has two ravens engraved upon it and the inscription says in part "Thought is the arrow of time; memory never fades."

 

Odin has a number of epithets involving ravens. Mat recently gained a new title, "Prince of the Ravens".

 

Odin has a magical gold ring, Draupnir. Every ninth night, it creates eight more gold rings of equal weight. Mat effortlessly "conjures" up gold on regular basis.

 

Odin has a fondness for tricks and deceptions. So does Mat.

 

In some tales and visual depictions, Odin wears a broad-brimmed hat. Mat is very fond of a certain hat.

 

Odin gathers the valiant slain to fight in Ragnarok. Mat has been gathering forces for Tarmon Gai'don. What's more, he has and will almost certainly again summon actual, valiant dead people to fight.

 

Odin often travelled with a walking-staff, typically while in disguise. When Mat was recovering in Ebou Dar, he used a walking-staff and played to the perception that he was just "Tylin's Toy".

 

Finally, Odin once went to Mimir's Well:

 

But under the second root, which extends to the frost-giants, is the well of Mimir, wherein knowledge and wisdom are concealed. The owner of the well hight Mimir. He is full of wisdom, for he drinks from the well with the Gjallar-horn. Allfather [Odin] once came there and asked for a drink from the well, but he did not get it before he left one of his eyes as a pledge.

 

Mat...still has two eyes.

 

So, count on Mat losing an eye Real Soon Now. Very likely, this will happen while saving Moiraine. Why? Because of one of Min's viewings about her, which we learn about in aCoS: "What good to tell him he would almost certainly fail without a woman who was dead and gone?" I.e., Rand basically needs her to win, and if Rand fails the world is lost. Immediately thereafter, Caraline Damodred appears, and Min is disappointed to realize she isn't Moiraine and notes that "Moiraine was the only viewing of hers that had ever failed." Now, if Mat successfully retrieves Moiraine from the Finn, things are looking up. You might even say it's a case of "Save the cheerleader other, tinier Damodred chick, save the world."

Edited October 23, 2010 by didymos

[Sharaman]

Speaking of Mat's Finnland prophecies, one that's always seemed odd to me is the "dying and living again as part of what was" (forget the exact line) one.

 

Marrying the Daughter of the Nine Moons is a significant event in his life. Giving up half the light of the world will apparently be a significant event in his life. Getting killed and then balefired back to life seems to be pretty irrelevant. It really plays no part in the story at all. It just seems to be totally unrelated to the other two in terms of being relevant enough to include.

 

It was "To die and live again, and live once more a part of what was!" The first bit's got two options: when the Foxes hung him from Avendesora and Rand had to CPR him, or, as you've interpreted it, when Rahvin nailed him with lightning and killed him, after which Rand resurrected him via balefire. The second bit refers to the memories ("part of what was") he receives which he then often finds himself suddenly reliving as if he were truly there ("live once more"). The way the two are tied together in one answer suggests that it was actually the hanging incident that fulfilled "To die and live again" and not the balefire deal.

 

RJ confirmed it was the balefire incident. Mat wasnt dead when he was hung, just very close to it.

 

I was thinking the same thing the other day Tom; Mat being killed and then coming back via balefire seems to serve no purpose. In fact, he basically did nothing in that fight as far as I can tell. He could have not even gone which was the original plan and nothing would have changed. Even during the Moiraine/Lanfear fight prior to that Mat didn't do anything.

The impact of dying and living again could be on his status as the Hornblower.

Is he still tied to the Horn of Valere or not?

[Lynander]

What does Elayne actually say to Rand in her two letters when they seperate at Tear?

[Val Mickey]

Letter 1 : I will miss you. I will miss the kissy kissy. Do not ever lie to me.

 

Letter 2 : I will never miss you, you mule-head. If you even think of me, I will turn you into stone, you wool-head. You couldn't say you'll miss me, despite the fact that I demanded that you never lie.

 

@BBM - True, but if the Finns live in a perpendicular world, then the our past and future would be at the same point for them, so it is possible for Moirane to go back in our time, without breaking the laws of physics. Rand wouldn't recognise Moirane, because she's been starved by the Finns to become an old hag (it sounds insane to me), and the bells started ringing because there were two Moiranes in close proximity ( even more crazy ). It would also explain how the Finns have an interpreter who talks Randish (the new tongue).