White Tower Reunification Plotline (spoilers for the entire book)

[Ninkharsag]

I think Egwene learned a lot about Rand while stuffed in her tiny cell.  I think the point of showing her putting herself in his shoes will make their meeting go well.  She has an inkling what Rand has been through at the hands of the tower, and Rand is no longer insane.

 

Egwene was great.  I am not surprised that the tower did not know what to do when attacked.  They had believed themselves superior for so long they couldn't imagine anyone daring.  Now that they have had a taste of there own vulnerability I hope that they pull it together and start to really train for war.  Since men and women were the most effective and powerful when working together I think it is a good thing that some Asha'men and Aes Sedai are bonded.  It will give them the trust they need to really perform on the battle field. 

 

Do you think that a bonded Asha'man can use his Aes Sedai's strength in battle allowing for the sister to get around the oaths about using the power as a weapon or making weapons?

 

The tower now has days of celebrating and dancing, they have raised a new Amyrlin.  While daning in the streets Egween is wisked away by a tall one handed man in beggers clothing. 

 

"Hello mother" he says, "and to you my son" is the reply.  "Just think" says the man "if our lives had played out as expected you would be the mother to my sons.  Instead we are the two most influential strangers in this land."

 

 

I think Egween would trip in the shock.  All joking aside I think the Amyrlin may be mad at Rand and his men, but the newly incarcerated Egween will have missed him and be understanding. 

[Clone Warder]

When Teslyn and Edesina (the Aes Sedai with Mat) reach the will Egwene arange a counter strike against the Damane training camps.

Both Teslyn and Edesina were regularly taken to these camps so would be able to open gateways straight to them.

They are at this time with Elayne, Verin opened a gateway for Mat and the Band of the Red Hand to be taken to Caemlyn so they must now know the weave to create gateways.

They will return to Tar Valon (unless they are Black Ajah) and retake their oath's and speak of their experiences to their Ajah heads.

The raid needs to be approximately 11 to 12 days after the Seanchan attack to allow the Seanchan strike force to return to Ebou Dar.

The question would be how many Aes Sedai, Wind finders, Wise Ones and Seanchan damane would be gathered in the raid.

Only one raid (maybe to multiple training grounds) would be a surprise after that the Seanchan would guard these training grounds more heavily against attacks.

[coteaz]

As of yet, we dont know if the seanchan have traveling, even if they have elaida, they have to get her to show them first, by all appearances they will break her fast, but after that they would have to pass the traveling amongst their damane that can learn it. Only then can they make use of it, and even then all their enemies are more proficient using traveling for war than they are, so it will take some time. Also i vaguely remember a quote of RJ talking about the AOL, in this quote he described the war and how both sides used traveling, and there was a way to interfere with said traveling. Whether that be in a whole area, or just sensing an opening and blocking it. If this is a weave i wonder if rand will now know it, or once traveling becomes a common thing in warfare, someone will think of a way to prevent it.

[wumpus]

I really favor the theory of a counter attack by the Aes Sedai. There's a major loophole for this in the oaths:

Under the Light, I vow not to use the One Power as a weapon, except against Shadowspawn, or in the last defence of my life, the life of my Warder, or that of another Sister

 

If you accept being leashed will put the sister's life in danger e.g. in battle, or that being leashed effectively ends the life of the sister, e.g. loss of free will and even your name, then the sister would be able to use the OP in full circles to free every leashed sister. And since some of them now have bonded male channelers they can potentially form a mega > 13 circle and pimp slap the lot of them.

[Haggis]

I don't know.  It didn't sound like they had any plans. Especially with how close the last battle is. I supect the tower will focus on mending fences with rand and the black tower.

 

In a unrelated matter

 

Is it just me or is Gawyn shaping into the top swordsman in the series.

 

I mean in the battle against the seanchan he took out two with ease that surprised Bryne (who's a blademaster) And he won at least one spar vs two warders, one a  blademaster who can hold his own against Lan.

[coteaz]

Sleete won 2 of 7, so thats not really holding his own.

[Crossroad]

Gee Egwene was a bully before she got to the WT, now she's added a bit of arrogance to her already huge ego. Poor Gawyn man won't be a man but a little lap dog.

[Declan]

Im pretty sure Lan is still regarded as the best. I really hope RJ had planned to bring Gawyn's character back from being a prick because i liked him before.

 

This book made me like Egwene. Alot. Still think all AS are too stuck up, but they might become a little more down to earth once they realize they really aren't the most powerful thing ever.

 

Egwene may know what Rand has been through with her tiny cell and all, but she and the WT still frustrate me because they STILL WANT TO LEAD HIM. They act as if he doesnt have a brain. frustrating. There seems to be a huge lack of humility going around lately in the books. Moiraine needs to get back soon.

 

I am hoping that they unify the White Tower and Black Tower (after the Black Tower's cleansing). This would make them both much more powerful. and much more like the AOL.

[Haggis]

Sleete won 2 of 7, so thats not really holding his own.

 

How many can say they won that any vs lan? He may not be at lan's level, but he clearly right below it.

[coteaz]

It would be interesting to see a Gawyn vs Lan sword fight. 

[Bob T Dwarf]

Two things.

 

1.  Jordan rated Rand as second to Lan as a swordsman.  If Gawyn ever does challenge Rand, even a one-handed Rand, he won't fare well.

 

2.  How did Egwene get her *angreal?

 

Way back in the Prologue to Loc, at the Forsaken Kaffe Klatsch, Jordan had Mesaana explain why none of the Forsaken had any *angreal.  There were only two known stashes.  One in the WT and the other in Tear.  Rand had trapped the one in Tear with a "nasty thing" that was doom for anyone who tried to get past it.  The WT had their stash warded as well and counted everything four times a day, besides.

 

Yet, when the attack happens, and Egwene forms her first small circle, she just gates into that storeroom, takes what she can identify and gates out again.  How'd she do dat?

[fikkie77]

The wards were failing (shown by rats in the White Tower). And maybe Egwene had help? Saerin had to be there as well to get the oath rod every now and then. It's not impossible that Egwene had herself prepared in some way for the Seanchan attack.

[Luckers]

The wards were failing (shown by rats in the White Tower). And maybe Egwene had help? Saerin had to be there as well to get the oath rod every now and then. It's not impossible that Egwene had herself prepared in some way for the Seanchan attack.

 

Actually the wards did not fail. The Dark One's influence simply occurred in spite of them. This was proven by the corruption of food. Romanda herself commented on it.

 

Way back in the Prologue to Loc, at the Forsaken Kaffe Klatsch, Jordan had Mesaana explain why none of the Forsaken had any *angreal.  There were only two known stashes.  One in the WT and the other in Tear.  Rand had trapped the one in Tear with a "nasty thing" that was doom for anyone who tried to get past it.  The WT had their stash warded as well and counted everything four times a day, besides.

 

Yet, when the attack happens, and Egwene forms her first small circle, she just gates into that storeroom, takes what she can identify and gates out again.  How'd she do dat?

 

Egwene gated in. She opened her gateway within the wards, therefore they were not disturbed. Why Mesaana did not do this escapes me--yet it is her failure which is weird, not Egwene's success. Logic supports Egwene's actions, not Mesaana's failure.

 

Perhaps she simply didn't think of it. Mesaana has been stated to be somewhat ineffective. Perhaps coming from an Age which would have worked wardings to protect against Travelling (and through RJ we know such things existed) she simply did not think that it might be possible to travel into a warded area.

 

I dunno. It IS wierd.

[coteaz]

I'm also surprised that none of the forsaken have angreal, maybe none of them took any into the bore with them? seeing it as pointless due to the no channeling policy around the bore? And, to Luckers, how do we know that she didn't set off the ward, she was basically in and out, she didn't linger, and there was an attack going on at the time, so i dont think many Aes Sedai would have gone to check what happened.

 

[Luckers]

That's actually a good point. That being said why would the Aes Sedai ward movement inside the room, as opposed to simply entering the room. Every other situation of Aes Sedai warding something against entrance has been specifically that--against entrance.

 

That being said--the Forsaken did not expect to be sealed in the bore, and as such did not prepare. That being said Graendal found herself an angreal.

[coteaz]

Alot of good it did her :P

[Bob T Dwarf]

Oh, I agree it's weird, Luckers.

 

Just another example of the Fearsome Forsaken being dumb as stumps I guess.  My assumption would be that Mesaana was at least smart enough to have verified that gating into the storeroom was impossible. 

 

Apparently not.  Why not just makes for such a clumsy plot device.

[coteaz]

Well, if she needed one she could quite easily go and get one, but up until this point she probably hasn't needed one seeing as she is currently undercover, but you can bet she knows exactly where they are and how they are protected.

[sheikh chilli]

truth of the matter is the forsaken are just a bunch of clowns bumbling and messana's blunder is not suprise.

 

by the way i don't think a one handed rand can beat gawyn. gawyn as much as i hate him is a freak with the sword. i hope someone out there schools him though

[coteaz]

In rand's current state, i think gawyn would win, but if he had his other hand, he would probably beat him, but then again he has the OP, so he can win easily 1v1 or even 1v100.

[Swigaro]

If it were Darth Rand, he would have smoked Gawyn with the CK as soon as he drew his sword.  I would like to hope that Post-Veins of Gold Rand would talk him down, or at the very least not let it come to blows...  Rand is not that foolish...

[Lambada]

Well, if she needed one she could quite easily go and get one, but up until this point she probably hasn't needed one seeing as she is currently undercover, but you can bet she knows exactly where they are and how they are protected.

 

Of course, depending on how high up she is in the Aes Sedai rankings, say an influential Sitter / Ajah head she could quite easily have an angreal or two that she has permission to have. Thus not needing to break in, and thus all angreal being accounted for.

[Bob T Dwarf]

Well, if she needed one she could quite easily go and get one, but up until this point she probably hasn't needed one seeing as she is currently undercover, but you can bet she knows exactly where they are and how they are protected.

 

Of course, depending on how high up she is in the Aes Sedai rankings, say an influential Sitter / Ajah head she could quite easily have an angreal or two that she has permission to have. Thus not needing to break in, and thus all angreal being accounted for.

 

OK, but what does that have to do with Egwene's ability to gate into a warded storeroom?

[Lambada]

OK, but what does that have to do with Egwene's ability to gate into a warded storeroom?

It shows that Messana may well have not needed to check whether the room was warded against Traveling. Meaning that the room may not have been warded against Traveling into a place and thus there is no contradiction in her being able to Travel into there. In addition Aes Sedai generally would probably not know how to Ward against Traveling as they forgot how to Travel. Thus there is no problem, as some have attempted to show there is, with Egwene Traveling into it.

[Thorn]

 

Actually the wards did not fail. The Dark One's influence simply occurred in spite of them. This was proven by the corruption of food. Romanda herself commented on it.

. . .

I dunno. It IS wierd.

 

I can think of five possible explanations:

 

1) Siuan taught Egwene how to bypass the wards, in tel'aran'rhiod

 

2)Egwene found the room herself in tel'aran'rhiod and studied the wards and figured out how to bypass them.

 

3) The wards failed due to the Dark One's touch, conveniently for Egwene.

 

4) The wards were *alarm* wards, and nobody responded to the alarm due to all the craziness going down.

 

5) The doorway was warded but not the storeroom itself, and Mesaana is an idiot (not unlikely). Perhaps Mesaana didn't want the risk of being found carrying a stolen angreal.